Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so, does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that helps.

Cheers
J^n

You may well find there is enough slack in the pipe work below the floor just to widen the holes the pipes come up and move the pipes over to the required position. Did that myself recently by drilling a 16mm hole carefully where I wanted the pipe to be and simply using a Stanley knife to pare away any residual wood between the original hole and the new position until the pipe was able to move over. Of course you need to take care when drilling not to damage the pipe so an inspection beneath the floor boards is required..

Richard

On 01/05/2014 20:11, The Night Tripper wrote:
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so, does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that helps.

Cheers
J^n


Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

I'd never seen it before but have followed the pattern on those I have
subsequently replaced myself because a) it looks a good deal better,
with clear floor/skirting beneath, and b) the radiators can be taken off
the walls for decorating behind them.

This approach is much more feasible when doing a radical job on a room,
of course, but it may be worth giving it some thought if, for example,
you're thinking of a new carpet soon.

On 01/05/2014 20:11, The Night Tripper wrote:
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so, does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that helps.

Two choices really... you might get away with just enlarging the hole in
the floor the pipes come through to allow them to move to the new
position. This can work well where there is a long ish pipe run and the
pipes are not fixed too rigidly to other pipework.

If you don't want to (or can't) move the entry point, then a small
offset bend is the other choice. Its the one I went for when redoing
rads a little while back, and once they are painted up etc, you don't
notice.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"The Night Tripper" wrote in message
...
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted radiators
for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about the
best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so, does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and put
a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that
helps.

Cheers


If you have to make up a pipe with a "wiggle" to offset, consider installing
the new radiator a little higher to give more space.

On 01/05/2014 23:41, GMM wrote:
On 01/05/2014 20:11, The Night Tripper wrote:
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted
radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely
to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about
the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so,
does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and
put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing
tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that
helps.

Cheers
J^n


Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

I'd never seen it before but have followed the pattern on those I have
subsequently replaced myself because a) it looks a good deal better,
with clear floor/skirting beneath, and b) the radiators can be taken off
the walls for decorating behind them.

This approach is much more feasible when doing a radical job on a room,
of course, but it may be worth giving it some thought if, for example,
you're thinking of a new carpet soon.

Could you tell me where you got the tube/elbows please? Thinking of
doing the same.

--
Cheers, Rob

In article ,
The Night Tripper wrote:
Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so,
does the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are,
and put a small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the
existing tees round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other
solution?

Assuming they can't just be moved slightly, the easiest way would be to
cut them below floor level and extend from that point to suit. The problem
may be getting all the water out of them to allow soldering. If this isn't
possible you could use a compression fitting to join the new to the old.
I'd not try unsoldering the original Ts for that reason.

--
*The problem with the world is that everyone is a few drinks behind *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
GMM GlMiMa-AT-yahoo.co.uk wrote:
Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

A bit like this?

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q...Olympus072.jpg

--
*Filthy stinking rich -- well, two out of three ain't bad

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
The Night Tripper writes:
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so, does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that helps.

Mounting brackets can usually be fitted either way around to give two
different mounting offsets from the wall. Using the closest might work
if the previous rad was spaced further away.

I did this a year back for my brother. After disconnecting the old rad,
there was lots of vertical play in the tails, and I just forced them to
bend out a little to meet the new rad. There's a risk you'll break the
pipe when forcing it, so you might then end up having to do a larger
job.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 02/05/2014 08:29, RJH wrote:
On 01/05/2014 23:41, GMM wrote:
On 01/05/2014 20:11, The Night Tripper wrote:
Hi All
I am looking at replacing one of our existing wall-mounted
radiators for
a newer one, for aesthetic reasons mainly. The replacement is likely
to be
the same size (HxW) as the current one, but 'single convector plus
fins',
instead of 'single convector, no fines' as per the original.

This will have the effect of the radiator tails needing to be farther
out
from the wall than currently, by some 15mm or so if memory serves.

The tails come from under the floorboards, and I am wondering about
the best
way to remake them. If it was only a matter of a couple of mm I'd have
little compunction in trying to bend them to suit, but I don't think
this
will work for 15mm.

Am I going to have to desolder the tails and fit new ones? and if so,
does
the team advise that I try to leave the existing tees as they are, and
put a
small dogleg in the new tails; or try to desolder/rotate the existing
tees
round a bit, if you see what I mean... or some other solution?

Thanks for any thoughts. I have a reasonably decent blowtorch if that
helps.

Cheers
J^n


Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

I'd never seen it before but have followed the pattern on those I have
subsequently replaced myself because a) it looks a good deal better,
with clear floor/skirting beneath, and b) the radiators can be taken off
the walls for decorating behind them.

This approach is much more feasible when doing a radical job on a room,
of course, but it may be worth giving it some thought if, for example,
you're thinking of a new carpet soon.

Could you tell me where you got the tube/elbows please? Thinking of
doing the same.


I've used these ones from Sfx:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/pegler-pus...bow-10mm/28509

I wasn't sure about the push fit aspect but they seem to work fine and
look good. So far I had one incidence of failing to tighten up
sufficiently around the stem, as it takes a bit to 'bite' into chrome,
but easily fixed the small weep with a spanner.

I suspect a real PM would be a better/cheaper source but I always seem
to need these things at the weekend.

On Friday, May 2, 2014 11:09:22 AM UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,

Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

A bit like this?

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q...Olympus072.jpg

or you can use 10mm flexible copper tube and bring it as a 'tail' out of the wall above the skirting and hidden behind the rad. then its easy to modify later if the rad-type is changed.

On 02/05/2014 11:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
GMM GlMiMa-AT-yahoo.co.uk wrote:
Of course if you can find a way to wangle the connections as you imply,
it will probably be the easiest way but, when I had some radiators
replaced by a pro a little while ago, he brought the connections up
behind the skirting and out through the plaster behind the radiators,
using flexible plastic pipes. The plastic terminates in an
'inward-facing' chrome push fit elbow, so you have to look under the
radiator to see the pipe.

A bit like this?

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q...Olympus072.jpg


Well, a bit, except that link shows a nice tidy job that's on show. In
my case, both pipes exit the wall side by side approximately in the
middle of the radiator about 1/3 of the way up its height. That height
gives plenty of room to secure them to the wall so they don't break out
the plaster, if necessary. Guest make a plate for this, but I didn't
use the one I bought, because I couldn't work out how to mount it.
(Admittedly, most I have done so far have come through the wall from the
other side or have come through plasterboard with a cavity behind.)
Then they take an arc to each tail (more accurately a sigmoid), most of
arc being behind the rad so the pipe just dips down below the level of
the radiator bottom to meet the elbow fitting, which is angled backwards
at about 45 degrees (ie pointing halfway between wall and the middle of
the rad).

Unless you get down pretty much to floor level, you can't see the
pipework, just the stems of the elbows coming out of the valves.
Instead you can see a clear run of skirting and (unperforated) carpet,
the radiator sort of 'floating' on its brackets, which I think looks
much better than the traditional system.

The practical benefit is that you can easily take a rad off the wall
without disconnecting, so it should be easy to re-decorate behind them.
Not that I'm planning on doing that for a while!

My biggest gripe was finding that the chrome elbows never match the
chrome on the lockshields and TRVs (the elbows are chrome and the others
are often a bit bronze-tinged), but in reality you never look at them
again once they're fitted.

On 02/05/2014 06:34, John Rumm wrote:

If you don't want to (or can't) move the entry point, then a small
offset bend is the other choice. Its the one I went for when redoing
rads a little while back, and once they are painted up etc, you don't
notice.


The offset bend could be made using 45 degree elbows. Soldering is
possible so long as the pipe is completely clear of water.


--
Michael Chare