Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

On 31/03/13 10:12, Tim Streater wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

Vote ukip, get Labour (or LibDem).

Vote UKIP in 2015, you'll certainly get Wallace aka Millibroon.


But if you see the influence the Liberals have had in the coalition,
even a few UKIP MPs could make a real difference. Anyway, it's time for
a change in the way our democracy works. Limiting population growth is
the only genuine green policy, whilst in practice they tax us for
consumption whilst also using our taxes to finance an ever burgeoning
population. It had nothing whatsoever to do with racism but just good
old fashioned common sense.

Andy C

On 31/03/13 08:38, harry wrote:
Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

only ones I want to kick out are the ones in parliament.

yo do realise that UKIP have a policy of getting rid of all FITS don't
you harry? your SPIV business will fold.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 10:12, Tim Streater wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

Vote ukip, get Labour (or LibDem).

Vote UKIP in 2015, you'll certainly get Wallace aka Millibroon.

you should spend a little time analysing the polls.

UKIP is not juts commuter belt tories. In fact quite the reverse.

They are eating into all three parties share of the vote, and more
interestingly, attracting people who dont usually vote at all.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

In article
,
harry wrote:
Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

It would certainly be interesting to see which other 'hate' policies they
have come out of the woodwork.

--
*Change is inevitable ... except from vending machines *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 31/03/13 10:36, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

It would certainly be interesting to see which other 'hate' policies they
have come out of the woodwork.


Which hate policy would that be exactly? If I go to another country, I'd
expect to have a job and be able to support myself. I wouldn't expect to
be taken care of, which is the approach in most countries. What's the
problem? We are not the world's Social Security or Health Care service,
nor should we be.

Andy C

In article ,
Andy Cap wrote:
On 31/03/13 10:36, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Vote UKIP at next council elections. Give the *******s a kicking!

It would certainly be interesting to see which other 'hate' policies
they have come out of the woodwork.


Which hate policy would that be exactly? If I go to another country, I'd
expect to have a job and be able to support myself. I wouldn't expect
to be taken care of, which is the approach in most countries. What's
the problem? We are not the world's Social Security or Health Care
service, nor should we be.

Which is exactly the same attitude of the vast majority of the immigrants
to this country.

--
*I just got lost in thought. It was unfamiliar territory*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 31/03/13 11:23, Owain wrote:
On Mar 31, 8:38 am, harry wrote:
Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/
Vote UKIP at next council elections.

Why?

Immigration isn't a local authority matter,


Housing them certainly is.


Owain




--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 10:36, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:
Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

It would certainly be interesting to see which other 'hate' policies they
have come out of the woodwork.

Well none really since it isn't a hate policy.

Its a *mathematical* policy.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 12:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Which hate policy would that be exactly? If I go to another country, I'd
expect to have a job and be able to support myself. I wouldn't expect
to be taken care of, which is the approach in most countries. What's
the problem? We are not the world's Social Security or Health Care
service, nor should we be.

Which is exactly the same attitude of the vast majority of the immigrants
to this country.


Which is exactly why it ISN'T a hate policy.

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.

On 31/03/13 12:53, Andy Cap wrote:


Which is exactly why it ISN'T a hate policy.

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.


I just want to add that I thought the Scottish vicar who has offered the
use of his church to the local Muslims because their small mosque was
full to bursting, was just fantastic. It would be great if some of the
other half-empty establishments could be used in that way and it could
do wonders for community integration and harmony.

In article ,
Andy Cap wrote:
On 31/03/13 12:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Which hate policy would that be exactly? If I go to another country,
I'd expect to have a job and be able to support myself. I wouldn't
expect to be taken care of, which is the approach in most countries.
What's the problem? We are not the world's Social Security or Health
Care service, nor should we be.

Which is exactly the same attitude of the vast majority of the
immigrants to this country.


Which is exactly why it ISN'T a hate policy.

Have you actually read any of harry's posts? He is quite typical of UKIP
supporters. Seeking a simple 'cure' to a complex situation.

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.

A cap on population would suggest some form of enforced birth control.
Leaving the country with an ever aging population. What is really needed
is a change in the ratio between those in work and those not - for
whatever reason. A much more difficult thing to sort.

--
*I did a theatrical performance about puns. It was a play on words.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 31/03/13 13:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Andy Cap wrote:
On 31/03/13 12:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Which hate policy would that be exactly? If I go to another country,
I'd expect to have a job and be able to support myself. I wouldn't
expect to be taken care of, which is the approach in most countries.
What's the problem? We are not the world's Social Security or Health
Care service, nor should we be.

Which is exactly the same attitude of the vast majority of the
immigrants to this country.


Which is exactly why it ISN'T a hate policy.

Have you actually read any of harry's posts? He is quite typical of UKIP
supporters. Seeking a simple 'cure' to a complex situation.

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.

A cap on population would suggest some form of enforced birth control.
Leaving the country with an ever aging population. What is really needed
is a change in the ratio between those in work and those not - for
whatever reason. A much more difficult thing to sort.



mots of my friends - experienced people in IT and manmagement - are
unemployed. They are perfectly able to work, and highly qualified to do
so. They are simply thought of as too old and experienced to do the ****
work the kids will do fir a pittance, and fatter bottoms are sitting in
the places they might better occupy.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
A cap on population would suggest some form of enforced birth control.
Leaving the country with an ever aging population. What is really needed
is a change in the ratio between those in work and those not - for
whatever reason. A much more difficult thing to sort.



mots of my friends - experienced people in IT and manmagement - are
unemployed.

Far too many people qualified in this field. Rather the same as the meja.

They are perfectly able to work, and highly qualified to do
so. They are simply thought of as too old and experienced to do the ****
work the kids will do fir a pittance, and fatter bottoms are sitting in
the places they might better occupy.

Plenty of migrants qualified as doctors etc seem happy to take other jobs
here.

--
*i souport publik edekashun.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 31/03/13 13:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.

A cap on population would suggest some form of enforced birth control.
Leaving the country with an ever aging population. What is really needed
is a change in the ratio between those in work and those not - for
whatever reason. A much more difficult thing to sort.


And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR. It's has to stop some time and
naturally slows in developed economies. The increase is entirely
artificial. When does it stop, when all the towns are joined together ?

On 31/03/13 15:39, Tim Streater wrote:


But if you see the influence the Liberals have had in the coalition,
even a few UKIP MPs could make a real difference.

UKIP in coalition with whom, then, eh?


Anyone who will support their policies, just like the Liberals demand.
Already the three main parties are adapting to the new reality, that a
growing number of voters want change. That's how it's meant to be !

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 15:28:29 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from the
EU?

On 31/03/13 15:38, Tim Streater wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 31/03/13 10:12, Tim Streater wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

Vote ukip, get Labour (or LibDem).

Vote UKIP in 2015, you'll certainly get Wallace aka Millibroon.

you should spend a little time analysing the polls.

UKIP is not juts commuter belt tories. In fact quite the reverse.

They are eating into all three parties share of the vote, and more
interestingly, attracting people who dont usually vote at all.

I stand by my analysis. Who does UKIP have other than Our Nige?

Roger Helmer. Stuart Agnew. Bloom..and a LOT of other people you haven't
heard of that actually have real world experience and - gasp - a career
outside politics BEHIND them..

And potentially a LOT of soon to be ex Tory MPs...the defection rate is
starting to accelerate at local and MEP level..


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 15:39, Tim Streater wrote:
In article ,
Andy Cap wrote:

On 31/03/13 10:12, Tim Streater wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

Vote ukip, get Labour (or LibDem).

Vote UKIP in 2015, you'll certainly get Wallace aka Millibroon.


But if you see the influence the Liberals have had in the coalition,
even a few UKIP MPs could make a real difference.

UKIP in coalition with whom, then, eh?

More likely to be 'confidence and supply' with the tories.

If current trends in polling continue, it would likely be labour with
the most seats, liberals with almost none, and tories +UKIP running as
the majority bloc.

That would mean that no policy that UKIP opposed and Labour opposed (out
of sheer bloody mindedness) could be passed.

Tories would have to rustle up labour support or a coalition of enough
of the nationalist parties to get anything done. Or make policy
acceptable to UKIP.

UKIP are polling between 13% and 17% according to which polls you look
at - ahead of the liberal and by all the signs, taking potential votes
off labour as much as anyone else. Remember while UKIP have Lisa Duffy,
Labour had 'Mrs Duffy'.



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 15:50, Adrian wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 15:28:29 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from the
EU?

about 15% and about half from the EU.

But the real figures should be online to see. Mind you, there's a lot of
people living here illegally, and who knows how many?


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 17:16, Tim Streater wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

And potentially a LOT of soon to be ex Tory MPs...the defection rate
is starting to accelerate at local and MEP level..

MEPs? Like Marta, you mean?

No, like roger helmer.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:16:14 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

about 15% and about half from the EU.

And there goes the whole "UKIP will save you from the population
increase" argument. Shot straight down. By those numbers, even if the UK
had barred all EU migration a decade ago - EVERY SINGLE PERSON. Even the
Irish, the French, the Germans, the Swedes - 92.5% of the population
increase would still have happened.

Mind you, there's a lot of people living here illegally,

There should be a law against it!

On Mar 31, 9:39*am, Andy Cap wrote:
On 31/03/13 10:12, Tim Streater wrote:

In article
,
harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/

Vote UKIP at next council elections.
Give the *******s a kicking!

Vote ukip, get Labour (or LibDem).

Vote UKIP in 2015, you'll certainly get Wallace aka Millibroon.

But if you see the influence the Liberals have had in the coalition,
even a few UKIP MPs could make a real difference. Anyway, it's time for
a change in the way our democracy works. Limiting population growth is
the only genuine green policy, whilst in practice they tax us for
consumption whilst also using our taxes to finance an ever burgeoning
population. It had nothing whatsoever to do with racism but just good
old fashioned common sense.

Andy C

Quite right.

On Mar 31, 11:23*am, Owain wrote:
On Mar 31, 8:38*am, harry wrote:

Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/
Vote UKIP at next council elections.

Why?

Immigration isn't a local authority matter,

Owain

It will focus the Liblabcons' attention. Get them to take notice of us
instead of feeding us with lies.

On Mar 31, 12:29*pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 31/03/13 11:23, Owain wrote:

On Mar 31, 8:38 am, harry wrote:
Ugov poll. (There's a surprise).http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/03/26/...d-immigration/
Vote UKIP at next council elections.

Why?

Immigration isn't a local authority matter,

Housing them certainly is.

And educating them. And certain benefits.

On Mar 31, 1:00*pm, Andy Cap wrote:
On 31/03/13 12:53, Andy Cap wrote:



Which is exactly why it ISN'T a hate policy.

I want a cap on population. I don't care what ethnicity those people are
and the ONLY reason immigration has appeared on the agenda is because
people are using their democratic right to express an opinion. I very
much doubt if we had a sensible policy in place, UKIP would have made
the progress they have.

I just want to add that I thought the Scottish vicar who has offered the
use of his church to the local Muslims because their small mosque was
full to bursting, was just fantastic. It would be great if some of the
other half-empty establishments could be used in that way and it could
do wonders for community integration and harmony.

Setting off bombs is as far as they're prepared to go for harmony.

On 31/03/13 15:50, Adrian wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 15:28:29 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from the
EU?


What difference does it make where they come from ? An extra 250,000
Primary places this year! As for the EU, free movement was an insane
idea in the first place. How can any country plan on that basis? The
poorer countries were bribed to join, pure and simple. If it was such a
great club to join, there should have been a subscription. And finally,
there was no democratic mandate for singing up to all this. That's me
done ! ;-)

On 31/03/13 16:32, harry wrote:

I just want to add that I thought the Scottish vicar who has offered the
use of his church to the local Muslims because their small mosque was
full to bursting, was just fantastic. It would be great if some of the
other half-empty establishments could be used in that way and it could
do wonders for community integration and harmony.

Setting off bombs is as far as they're prepared to go for harmony.


No, there are many living in harmony with the locals. I do agree however
that their leadership aren't vociferous enough in condemning the
trouble-makers, which is somewhat disturbing.

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:35:10 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

What difference does it make where they come from ?

Ask UKIP, whose entire raison d'etre is to argue that EU membership means
unfettered EU migration means swampage.

Leaving the EU will do nothing about migration from outside the EU,
because non-EU migration is entirely in the UK government's remit.

An extra 250,000 Primary places this year!

Apart from the ongoing utter avoidance of the question, I thought the UK
was facing a serious demographic timebomb due to the aging population...?

B'sides, do you have any breakdown of how many of those kids are migrants
(and how many of those are EU), and how many were UK born?

As for the EU, free movement was an insane idea in the first place.

How can you have free movement of goods without free movement of labour?

And finally, there was no democratic mandate for singing up to all
this.

Well, apart from this one...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
United_Kingdom_European_Communities_membership_ref erendum,_1975
or
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...tories/june/6/
newsid_2499000/2499297.stm

That's me done ! ;-)

Facts - they're so inconvenient to an argument, eh?

On 31/03/13 16:26, Adrian wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:16:14 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

about 15% and about half from the EU.

And there goes the whole "UKIP will save you from the population
increase" argument. Shot straight down. By those numbers, even if the UK
had barred all EU migration a decade ago - EVERY SINGLE PERSON. Even the
Irish, the French, the Germans, the Swedes - 92.5% of the population
increase would still have happened.


sorry. I misread the question.

15% of our TOTAL population is first generation immigrants, Probably
something like 90% of the increase since replacement birthrate is
indicative of a FALLING population, except amongst certain immigrant groups.

Mind you, there's a lot of people living here illegally,

There should be a law against it!

not much point is there?



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 16:43, Adrian wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:35:10 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

And a burgeoning population would suggest shortages of EVERYTHING with
ever increasing prices and eventual WAR.

Can we just pause one second here...

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

What difference does it make where they come from ?

Ask UKIP, whose entire raison d'etre is to argue that EU membership means
unfettered EU migration means swampage.


that's a very very small part of UKIPS overall policy.

I don't mind valid criticism, but I do object to blatant lies, and I
fail to see why you would.


Leaving the EU will do nothing about migration from outside the EU,
because non-EU migration is entirely in the UK government's remit.


Indeed. And that's why immigration is a separate issue from EU membership.

An extra 250,000 Primary places this year!

Apart from the ongoing utter avoidance of the question, I thought the UK
was facing a serious demographic timebomb due to the aging population...?


Depends on how uou look at it. If you are going to manage populations
down there's always going to be an overshoot where there's a lot of old
people and less young.

it isn't a huge issue, because people are working far past retirement
age these days.

B'sides, do you have any breakdown of how many of those kids are migrants
(and how many of those are EU), and how many were UK born?

As for the EU, free movement was an insane idea in the first place.

How can you have free movement of goods without free movement of labour?


extremely easily.




And finally, there was no democratic mandate for singing up to all
this.

Well, apart from this one...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
United_Kingdom_European_Communities_membership_ref erendum,_1975
or
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...tories/june/6/
newsid_2499000/2499297.stm

That's me done ! ;-)

Facts - they're so inconvenient to an argument, eh?



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 16:43, Adrian wrote:

Leaving the EU will do nothing about migration from outside the EU,
because non-EU migration is entirely in the UK government's remit.

So what if they do nothing to control it ?

An extra 250,000 Primary places this year!

Clearly not a problem in your eye then !

Apart from the ongoing utter avoidance of the question, I thought the UK
was facing a serious demographic timebomb due to the aging population...?

The age make no difference. WE HAVE to adjust to that. Simply increasing
the population is not the answer. Whatever the age, they make demands on
the planet !

B'sides, do you have any breakdown of how many of those kids are migrants
(and how many of those are EU), and how many were UK born?

As I said. I don't care.

As for the EU, free movement was an insane idea in the first place.

How can you have free movement of goods without free movement of labour?

The same way as we traded with the entire world before the EU existed
and indeed our trade with the EU is falling, whilst to the rest of the
world grows.

And finally, there was no democratic mandate for singing up to all
this.

Well, apart from this one...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
United_Kingdom_European_Communities_membership_ref erendum,_1975
or
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...tories/june/6/
newsid_2499000/2499297.stm

We voted to REMAIN IN the COMMON MARKET and were blatantly lied to by
Heath over sovereingty. That is the truth.

That's me done ! ;-)

Facts - they're so inconvenient to an argument, eh?

The facts are an ever burgeoning population that none of the traditional
parties were prepared to address, UNTIL people began voting UKIP. You
know, independence or self-determination, which so many countries spent
fighting for, throughout the 20th century but we have meekly surrendered.

There's an interesting piece in the local Trade mag, regularly written
by a Police inspector (I'm surprised he's allowed to be so critical)
highlighting the problems poses by foreign criminal gangs, firstly
because they come from afar and they can't pin-point their residence and
secondly because they either can't or claim not ot be able to speak the
language. The cost of translators in both custody suites and courts is
astronomic.

We need an effective Border Agency for anyone who wants to come and live
and work here and the other parties have done NOTHING to address this
serious issue.

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:47:06 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

Probably something like

OK, so you're going by some really authoritative figures here...

90% of the increase

Would you be surprised to learn it's about half that, according to an
Oxford Uni study?
http://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk...-migration-uk-
population-growth

since replacement birthrate is indicative of a FALLING population,
except amongst certain immigrant groups.

Please feel free to explain how an immigrant can be born in the UK.

Mind you, there's a lot of people living here illegally,

There should be a law against it!

not much point is there?

*whoosh*

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 17:05:27 +0100, Andy Cap wrote:

Leaving the EU will do nothing about migration from outside the EU,
because non-EU migration is entirely in the UK government's remit.

So what if they do nothing to control it ?

Care to explain exactly how "nothing's being done"?

Here's a clue. Pick a non-EU country. Then have a run through here and
see if _you_ would qualify to come and work in the UK...

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/vi...ation/working/

Apart from the ongoing utter avoidance of the question, I thought the
UK was facing a serious demographic timebomb due to the aging
population...?

The age make no difference. WE HAVE to adjust to that.

Please feel free to explain how you can "adjust" somebody in their
seventies to be in their twenties or thirties again, and instead of
facing decades of drawing from the state contribute to it.

Simply increasing the population is not the answer.

So how do you suggest we address the ever-increasing number of pensioners?

B'sides, do you have any breakdown of how many of those kids are
migrants (and how many of those are EU), and how many were UK born?

As I said. I don't care.

UKIP do. It's their whole raison d'etre, and they're not afraid to
grossly distort the facts to help you believe it.

As for the EU, free movement was an insane idea in the first place.

How can you have free movement of goods without free movement of
labour?

The same way as we traded with the entire world before the EU existed
and indeed our trade with the EU is falling, whilst to the rest of the
world grows.

Clue: "FREE" trade.

And finally, there was no democratic mandate for singing up to all
this.

Well, apart from this one...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
United_Kingdom_European_Communities_membership_ref erendum,_1975 or
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...tories/june/6/
newsid_2499000/2499297.stm

We voted to REMAIN IN the COMMON MARKET

Exactly. Then WE were heavily involved in the change of direction of the
group.

That's me done ! ;-)

Facts - they're so inconvenient to an argument, eh?

The facts are an ever burgeoning population

Most of which is not due to migration, and even most of that is not EU
migration.

UNTIL people began voting UKIP.

The same people who believe the Daily Mail.

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:51:28 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

What difference does it make where they come from ?

Ask UKIP, whose entire raison d'etre is to argue that EU membership
means unfettered EU migration means swampage.

that's a very very small part of UKIPS overall policy.

cough Hardly.

An extra 250,000 Primary places this year!

Apart from the ongoing utter avoidance of the question, I thought the
UK was facing a serious demographic timebomb due to the aging
population...?

Depends on how uou look at it. If you are going to manage populations
down there's always going to be an overshoot where there's a lot of old
people and less young.

So how is an increase in young people - the workforce of a decade's time
- a problem? The only other solution is fewer old people.

As for the EU, free movement was an insane idea in the first place.

How can you have free movement of goods without free movement of
labour?

extremely easily.

waits

In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
A cap on population would suggest some form of enforced birth
control. Leaving the country with an ever aging population. What is
really needed is a change in the ratio between those in work and
those not - for whatever reason. A much more difficult thing to sort.



mots of my friends - experienced people in IT and manmagement - are
unemployed.

Far too many people qualified in this field. Rather the same as the meja.

They are perfectly able to work, and highly qualified to do so. They
are simply thought of as too old and experienced to do the **** work
the kids will do fir a pittance, and fatter bottoms are sitting in the
places they might better occupy.

Plenty of migrants qualified as doctors etc seem happy to take other jobs
here.

the dental nurse at my dentist's surgery is qualified as a dentist in her
home country.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

In article , Andy Cap
wrote:
On 31/03/13 16:32, harry wrote:

I just want to add that I thought the Scottish vicar who has offered
the use of his church to the local Muslims because their small mosque
was full to bursting, was just fantastic. It would be great if some of
the other half-empty establishments could be used in that way and it
could do wonders for community integration and harmony.

Setting off bombs is as far as they're prepared to go for harmony.


No, there are many living in harmony with the locals. I do agree however
that their leadership aren't vociferous enough in condemning the
trouble-makers, which is somewhat disturbing.

is it "their leadership". If I went to live in a foreign country, how would
I elect my leadership?
We have at least 4 shops and 4 restaurants/takeaways in our village run by
Asians from various countries. They are hard working and a benefit to the
community.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

In article ,
Andy Cap wrote:
The age make no difference. WE HAVE to adjust to that. Simply increasing
the population is not the answer. Whatever the age, they make demands on
the planet !

So immigration makes no difference to the demands on the planet?

--
*Husband and cat lost -- reward for cat

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 31/03/13 17:57, Adrian wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:47:06 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

What %age of the population increase in the UK over the last - say -
decade would you say was due to migration, and what %age of that from
the EU?

Probably something like

OK, so you're going by some really authoritative figures here...

90% of the increase

Would you be surprised to learn it's about half that, according to an
Oxford Uni study?
http://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk...-migration-uk-
population-growth

since replacement birthrate is indicative of a FALLING population,
except amongst certain immigrant groups.

Please feel free to explain how an immigrant can be born in the UK.


please learn to speak english.

Immigrants are not sterilised when they cross the barrier at heathrow


Mind you, there's a lot of people living here illegally,

There should be a law against it!

not much point is there?

*whoosh*



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 31/03/13 18:03, Adrian wrote:

So how do you suggest we address the ever-increasing number of pensioners?

One hopes netter than 'care pathways', an NHS boss that's looking more
like Eichmann every day and deliberately driving energy prices up so
they die of cold.

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.