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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired,
we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? |
#2
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On Thu, 10 May 2012 12:56:14 -0400, S Viemeister wrote:
Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04? pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? There often is (but not always). When I buy things like that, I Google them first with the keyword 'hack' or similar to find out if it's possible to enable multi-region. -- Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org *lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor |
#3
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On Thu, 10 May 2012 18:14:53 +0000, Bob Eager wrote:
Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? There often is (but not always). When I buy things like that, I Google them first with the keyword 'hack' or similar to find out if it's possible to enable multi-region. Related question; UK PAL is what, 625 lines @ 50fps, and US NTSC is 525 lines @ 60fps - so as well as being unlocked, does the DVD player also have to be capable of scaling and compensating for different frame sizes and rates on the fly? Or is the number of lines and frame rate constant on the DVD regardless of region (i.e. there's a global standard), and so all the player ever has to worry about is converting between "DVD lines/fps" standard to whatever its native format is (e.g. PAL, NTSC) for the region where it was sold, regardless of what region the DVD being played is for? (I bought a DVD player in the UK circa 1998 - that one required soldering a surface-mount IC along with a few bridge wires in order to defeat the region encoding; soon after that, entering a code via the remote became more common) cheers Jules |
#4
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In message , S Viemeister
writes Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B...gw_d2_g23_ir04 ?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf _rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? Bear in mind the people who key in this information are totally clueless. -- hugh |
#5
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On 10/05/12 21:19, Jules Richardson wrote:
On Thu, 10 May 2012 18:14:53 +0000, Bob Eager wrote: Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? There often is (but not always). When I buy things like that, I Google them first with the keyword 'hack' or similar to find out if it's possible to enable multi-region. Related question; UK PAL is what, 625 lines @ 50fps, and US NTSC is 525 lines @ 60fps - so as well as being unlocked, does the DVD player also have to be capable of scaling and compensating for different frame sizes and rates on the fly? Or is the number of lines and frame rate constant on the DVD regardless of region (i.e. there's a global standard), and so all the player ever has to worry about is converting between "DVD lines/fps" standard to whatever its native format is (e.g. PAL, NTSC) for the region where it was sold, regardless of what region the DVD being played is for? (I bought a DVD player in the UK circa 1998 - that one required soldering a surface-mount IC along with a few bridge wires in order to defeat the region encoding; soon after that, entering a code via the remote became more common) cheers Jules Frames/lines are not constant. Some DVD players do frame conversion, but IME it's crap. You need a TV which will do PAL 60 and a player that will output NTSC as PAL60, or a NTSC compatible TV. Most TVs now will handle PAL60 ok. Back in 1998, I had a TV that wouldn't, and the first R1 DVD I bought looked terrible- The frame rate conversion just dropped some frames. |
#6
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S Viemeister wrote:
Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? If you can be arsed, a linux machine will (when equipped with the correct library) strip the region out of any DVD and give you an image to burn that is region free :-) -- To people who know nothing, anything is possible. To people who know too much, it is a sad fact that they know how little is really possible - and how hard it is to achieve it. |
#7
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On 10/05/12 21:44, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
S Viemeister wrote: Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? If you can be arsed, a linux machine will (when equipped with the correct library) strip the region out of any DVD and give you an image to burn that is region free :-) Or DVDShrink on Windoze. |
#8
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On 10/05/2012 17:56, S Viemeister wrote:
Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. The note is a generic one amazon plasters on all of them I expect. The reviews make it clear its a proper multiregion drive out of the box without needing hacks/codes etc. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? On some players you need a code or weird button combination in a service menu to get into region 0. Note that region zero is not quite multiregion in the sense that while in that mode the player will play discs from any region, the menu on the disc may make an explicit check for its particular reason (sometimes called region coded enhanced (RCE) discs) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#9
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On 10/05/2012 21:19, Jules Richardson wrote:
On Thu, 10 May 2012 18:14:53 +0000, Bob Eager wrote: Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? There often is (but not always). When I buy things like that, I Google them first with the keyword 'hack' or similar to find out if it's possible to enable multi-region. Related question; UK PAL is what, 625 lines @ 50fps, and US NTSC is 525 lines @ 60fps - so as well as being unlocked, does the DVD player also have to be capable of scaling and compensating for different frame sizes and rates on the fly? Not usually - most modern TVs will happily display either scan rate and format. There are some that can also do slightly odd modes like PAL 60 - so pal colour encoding but typical NTSC frame rate. Or is the number of lines and frame rate constant on the DVD regardless of region (i.e. there's a global standard), and so all the player ever No a region 1 disk will have a slightly lower vertical resolution. has to worry about is converting between "DVD lines/fps" standard to whatever its native format is (e.g. PAL, NTSC) for the region where it was sold, regardless of what region the DVD being played is for? (I bought a DVD player in the UK circa 1998 - that one required soldering a surface-mount IC along with a few bridge wires in order to defeat the region encoding; soon after that, entering a code via the remote became more common) Indeed same here... (although I bought mine pre-modded) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#10
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On 10/05/2012 21:59, Chris Bartram wrote:
On 10/05/12 21:44, The Natural Philosopher wrote: S Viemeister wrote: Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? If you can be arsed, a linux machine will (when equipped with the correct library) strip the region out of any DVD and give you an image to burn that is region free :-) Or DVDShrink on Windoze. The ultimate tool on windows is AnyDVD... makes all the pain go away on normal and HD content. Makes any disc look like its region free, has away all the other dodgy stuff as well like enforced watching of trailers, copy protected audio CDs, and other "PC Only" autorun stuff. Also stops HD stuff being dowscaled to SD resolution when the HDCP copy protection chain is for whatever reason not in place. I resisted it for some time on the grounds they wanted paying for it, but I confess to being a convert now ;-) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#11
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In article , John
Rumm writes The ultimate tool on windows is AnyDVD... makes all the pain go away on normal and HD content. Makes any disc look like its region free, has away all the other dodgy stuff as well like enforced watching of trailers, copy protected audio CDs, and other "PC Only" autorun stuff. Also stops HD stuff being dowscaled to SD resolution when the HDCP copy protection chain is for whatever reason not in place. I resisted it for some time on the grounds they wanted paying for it, but I confess to being a convert now ;-) Registered in St. John's, Antigua and Barbuda for a very good reason ;-) -- fred it's a ba-na-na . . . . |
#12
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On 10/05/2012 23:20, fred wrote:
In article , John Rumm writes The ultimate tool on windows is AnyDVD... makes all the pain go away on normal and HD content. Makes any disc look like its region free, has away all the other dodgy stuff as well like enforced watching of trailers, copy protected audio CDs, and other "PC Only" autorun stuff. Also stops HD stuff being dowscaled to SD resolution when the HDCP copy protection chain is for whatever reason not in place. I resisted it for some time on the grounds they wanted paying for it, but I confess to being a convert now ;-) Registered in St. John's, Antigua and Barbuda for a very good reason ;-) Indeed. The roll out rate of patches to make sure that anti circumvention techniques don't work for long is quite impressive as well! -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#13
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![]() "Chris Bartram" wrote in message ... Frames/lines are not constant. Some DVD players do frame conversion, but IME it's crap. You need a TV which will do PAL 60 and a player that will output NTSC as PAL60, or a NTSC compatible TV. Most TVs now will handle PAL60 ok. Back in 1998, I had a TV that wouldn't, and the first R1 DVD I bought looked terrible- The frame rate conversion just dropped some frames. What you want is a player that does 50 hz progressive scan (50p) and 60p and a TV that does the same over hdmi. 50Hz interlaced (50i) and 60i will do if you cant manage progressive. You don't want or need anything to do with PAL or NTSC in the digital world. |
#14
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On 10/05/2012 22:49, John Rumm wrote:
On 10/05/2012 17:56, S Viemeister wrote: Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. The note is a generic one amazon plasters on all of them I expect. The reviews make it clear its a proper multiregion drive out of the box without needing hacks/codes etc. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? On some players you need a code or weird button combination in a service menu to get into region 0. Note that region zero is not quite multiregion in the sense that while in that mode the player will play discs from any region, the menu on the disc may make an explicit check for its particular reason (sometimes called region coded enhanced (RCE) discs) It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) David |
#15
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On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote:
It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. |
#16
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On 10/05/2012 23:50, Lobster wrote:
On 10/05/2012 22:49, John Rumm wrote: On 10/05/2012 17:56, S Viemeister wrote: Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0041CE7AW/ref=s9_bbs_gw_d2_g23_ir04?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&p f_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p =467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. The note is a generic one amazon plasters on all of them I expect. The reviews make it clear its a proper multiregion drive out of the box without needing hacks/codes etc. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? On some players you need a code or weird button combination in a service menu to get into region 0. Note that region zero is not quite multiregion in the sense that while in that mode the player will play discs from any region, the menu on the disc may make an explicit check for its particular reason (sometimes called region coded enhanced (RCE) discs) It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) Indeed, and if its not even got the official DVD logo on it, its almost guaranteed ;-) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#17
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In message , S Viemeister
writes Now that digital tv has arrived, and our ancient vcr has been retired, we've been looking into buying a dvd player - multi-region, because we want to be able to play both US and UK discs. I looked at Amazon where this item http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B...gw_d2_g23_ir04 ?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=0TRQSSP0QY0GQY5HH8GT&pf _rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=467128473&pf_rd_i=468294 is described as multi-region, but there is a note to the effect that it only plays region 2. I've seen the same thing for a number of other units. I'm confused. Can someone explain this to me? Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions? For region hack, see he http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 I would say that the description 'plays all regions' is simply wrong. I guess it means it plays all TV standards - but only Region 2 discs. -- Ian |
#18
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On 11/05/2012 00:20, S Viemeister wrote:
On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. You lot seem to have got in a bit of a tizzy. The OP asked if the link was a region free player. it says it is and the reviewers say it is. Amazon are only guaranteeing that it will play region 2. As for the bigger question of can all region free players play all region DVDs, the answer is not so clear cut. Region 2 is PAL and NTSC. ALL region 2 players MUST play NTSC. Japan is region 2 and NTSC, but as has been discussed, some players do real NTSC, some do pseudo PAL, some do converted to real PAL. Region 1 is exclusively NTSC. There are some region 1 machines that can be made region free but cannot handle PAL, they cannot read it or if they can they cannot output it, as there is no PAL circuitry. And some will output PAL only as PAL and that is a way that a lot of American TVs can't display it. A lot of even expensive American TVs can only display real NTSC. The latest region 2 machines do give a quite good conversion to PAL, BUT if total picture quality is required than you are better off getting a Blu-ray player. The output on HDMI is compatible with HDTV and the conversions are really top notch. You still need to get the DVD section and the Blu-ray section made region free ( they are independent ) but the pictures are fantastic. Remember the Blu-ray regions don't correspond to the DVD regions. for example ; Blu-ray Australian disks play on a UK region machine but Australian region 4 DVDs won't. Gary |
#19
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On Thu, 10 May 2012 23:25:41 +0100, dennis@home wrote:
You don't want or need anything to do with PAL or NTSC in the digital world. Quite, they are only relevant to composite video as well. I'd expect a DVD to be connected via RGB ina SCART or component. I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. -- Cheers Dave. |
#20
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On 11/05/2012 11:06, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 10 May 2012 23:25:41 +0100, dennis@home wrote: You don't want or need anything to do with PAL or NTSC in the digital world. Quite, they are only relevant to composite video as well. I'd expect a DVD to be connected via RGB ina SCART or component. I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! |
#21
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On 2012-05-11, John Rumm wrote:
On 10/05/2012 23:50, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) Indeed, and if its not even got the official DVD logo on it, its almost guaranteed ;-) That's a useful tip. (Just out of curiosity, I checked the multi-region player I got from SCAN about 10 or 12 years ago, & it does have the logo. It still works quite well, although the vibrations through the feet resonated in the cabinet it's in now --- until I put a square cut from an old inner tube under each one.) |
#22
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On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, Fredxx wrote:
On 11/05/2012 11:06, Dave Liquorice wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012 23:25:41 +0100, dennis@home wrote: You don't want or need anything to do with PAL or NTSC in the digital world. Quite, they are only relevant to composite video as well. I'd expect a DVD to be connected via RGB ina SCART or component. I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Presumably the former is PAL-M as used in Brazil, but where is (was?) NTSC 625 / 50Hz ? -- |
#23
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On 11/05/2012 12:21, The Other Mike wrote:
On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, wrote: Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Presumably the former is PAL-M as used in Brazil, Or the similar mode sometimes called 'NTSC 4.43' - i.e. a hybrid of 525/60 scan rate and PAL subcarrier frequency - used on VCRs (and possibly DVD players?) to allow viewing of North American recordings in Europe, when using composite video or modulated RF output. but where is (was?) NTSC 625 / 50Hz ? The converse of the above, presumably? A lot of confusion arises because people use 'NTSC' and 'PAL' to refer to the most commonly associated scan rates, rather than the colo(u)r standard. You do have to unpack what is being said sometimes, to be clear about what is meant. -- Andy |
#24
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On May 11, 9:36*am, Gary wrote:
On 11/05/2012 00:20, S Viemeister wrote: On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. You lot seem to have got in a bit of a tizzy. The OP asked if the link was a region free player. it says it is and the reviewers say it is. Amazon are only guaranteeing that it will play region 2. As for the bigger question of can all region free players play all region DVDs, the answer is not so clear cut. Region 2 is PAL and NTSC. ALL region 2 players MUST play NTSC. Japan is region 2 and NTSC, but as has been discussed, some players *do real NTSC, some do pseudo PAL, *some do converted to real PAL. Region 1 is exclusively NTSC. There are some region 1 machines that can be made region free but cannot handle PAL, they cannot read it or if Where do you think they "read" "PAL" from? You need to read up about the difference between colour encoding and frame size/frame rate. MBQ |
#25
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On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, Fredxx wrote:
I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Exactly... PAL or NTSC are means of coding colour information into a composite video signal they don't say *anything* about line or frame rates. -- Cheers Dave. |
#26
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On 11/05/2012 13:40, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, Fredxx wrote: I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Exactly... PAL or NTSC are means of coding colour information into a composite video signal they don't say *anything* about line or frame rates. that's not true. it tells you what to expect. there is no such thing as 405 50 NTSC. As in' all small boys are children but not all small children are boys'. But it did annoy me on another NG they were referring to BW CCTV as PAL because of the frame/line. It was an American Group |
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In article ,
Gary wrote: On 11/05/2012 13:40, Dave Liquorice wrote: On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, Fredxx wrote: I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Exactly... PAL or NTSC are means of coding colour information into a composite video signal they don't say *anything* about line or frame rates. that's not true. it tells you what to expect. there is no such thing as 405 50 NTSC. Not now - but there was. Just as I joined the BBC (1962) the tests came to an end. -- From KT24 Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18 |
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On 11/05/2012 13:40, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 11 May 2012 11:15:18 +0100, Fredxx wrote: I'd suspect some posters are incorrectly using "PAL" or "NTSC" to mean certain line and frame rates. Yet you can have PAL 525 lines/60Hz as well as NTSC 625lines/50Hz!! Exactly... PAL or NTSC are means of coding colour information into a composite video signal they don't say *anything* about line or frame rates. Well if you have an NTSC region 1 DVD it does tell you that you are going to get less vertical resolution out of it than you would from a PAL one... They have only encoded it in 512 lines (of which fewer are visible), and the pull down ratio from the original cinema version will be different from the PAL one. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
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On 11 May,
Gary wrote: that's not true. it tells you what to expect. there is no such thing as 405 50 NTSC. The first colour TV I saw was 405 50 NTSC (an experimental setup some years ago.) -- B Thumbs Change lycos to yahoo to reply |
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On Fri, 11 May 2012 13:40:29 +0100, Dave Liquorice
wrote: Exactly... PAL or NTSC are means of coding colour information into a composite video signal they don't say *anything* about line or frame rates. If you're going to be pedantic you should at least get your facts right. Indeed PAL is a method of colour encoding, and strictly speaking says nothing about line or frame rates (although in practice we all know what it usually means). However NTSC is *not* just a method of colour encoding, it specifies all aspects of the analogue TV system as defined by the National Television Standards Committee. Therefore NTSC *does* imply certain line and frame rates. The trouble is that there's no term available specifically to describe the colour encoding method that NTSC uses, so colloquially we use phrases like '405-line NTSC', which is strictly meaningless, in such situations. Richard. http://www.rtrussell.co.uk/ |
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On 11/05/2012 13:35, Man at B&Q wrote:
On May 11, 9:36 am, wrote: On 11/05/2012 00:20, S Viemeister wrote: On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. You lot seem to have got in a bit of a tizzy. The OP asked if the link was a region free player. it says it is and the reviewers say it is. Amazon are only guaranteeing that it will play region 2. As for the bigger question of can all region free players play all region DVDs, the answer is not so clear cut. Region 2 is PAL and NTSC. ALL region 2 players MUST play NTSC. Japan is region 2 and NTSC, but as has been discussed, some players do real NTSC, some do pseudo PAL, some do converted to real PAL. Region 1 is exclusively NTSC. There are some region 1 machines that can be made region free but cannot handle PAL, they cannot read it or if Where do you think they "read" "PAL" from? You need to read up about the difference between colour encoding and frame size/frame rate. MBQ Some NTSC DVD players will not do anything with a PAL file. therefore in laymans terms they cannot 'read it' Who would think anything other was meant. ??? |
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In message , Gary
writes On 11/05/2012 13:35, Man at B&Q wrote: On May 11, 9:36 am, wrote: On 11/05/2012 00:20, S Viemeister wrote: On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. You lot seem to have got in a bit of a tizzy. The OP asked if the link was a region free player. it says it is and the reviewers say it is. Amazon are only guaranteeing that it will play region 2. As for the bigger question of can all region free players play all region DVDs, the answer is not so clear cut. Region 2 is PAL and NTSC. ALL region 2 players MUST play NTSC. Japan is region 2 and NTSC, but as has been discussed, some players do real NTSC, some do pseudo PAL, some do converted to real PAL. Region 1 is exclusively NTSC. There are some region 1 machines that can be made region free but cannot handle PAL, they cannot read it or if Where do you think they "read" "PAL" from? You need to read up about the difference between colour encoding and frame size/frame rate. MBQ Some NTSC DVD players will not do anything with a PAL file. therefore in laymans terms they cannot 'read it' Who would think anything other was meant. ??? This thread seems to have disintegrated into an esoteric discussion about what is PAL and NTSC. However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 It would appear to work, as several reviewers state that they are pleased with it. http://reviews.argos.co.uk/1493-en_g...25/reviews.htm "good price for an excellent product . Loved the ability to change to multi region!" "DVD player does exactly what was required. The codes to set up region free is very simple and works. I can play DVD from region 1, 2 and 4. The only negative is the quality of the remote control is a bit poor." "Purchased this one so I could make it region free so daughter could play usa dvd's and it fine for that. Not complicated just a basic player which is all I wanted." Finally, it seems hard to find anything that specifically states that it will play both PAL and NTSC discs, but here is one site which does. [I would have thought that most non-purely-American DVD players will play both. I have three recorders and one player, and all of them do.] http://www.saverstore.com/product/20...-SD-3010-DVD-P layer-720p-1080i-1080p-Upscaling-Hi-resolution-pal-progressive-HDMI-MP3-J PEG-Viewer-Play -- Ian |
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On 5/15/2012 11:21 AM, Ian Jackson wrote:
However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 OP here - thank you! It would appear to work, as several reviewers state that they are pleased with it. http://reviews.argos.co.uk/1493-en_g...25/reviews.htm "good price for an excellent product . Loved the ability to change to multi region!" "DVD player does exactly what was required. The codes to set up region free is very simple and works. I can play DVD from region 1, 2 and 4. The only negative is the quality of the remote control is a bit poor." "Purchased this one so I could make it region free so daughter could play usa dvd's and it fine for that. Not complicated just a basic player which is all I wanted." Finally, it seems hard to find anything that specifically states that it will play both PAL and NTSC discs, but here is one site which does. [I would have thought that most non-purely-American DVD players will play both. I have three recorders and one player, and all of them do.] http://www.saverstore.com/product/20...-SD-3010-DVD-P layer-720p-1080i-1080p-Upscaling-Hi-resolution-pal-progressive-HDMI-MP3-J PEG-Viewer-Play |
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On 15/05/2012 16:21, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , Gary writes On 11/05/2012 13:35, Man at B&Q wrote: On May 11, 9:36 am, wrote: On 11/05/2012 00:20, S Viemeister wrote: On 5/10/2012 6:50 PM, Lobster wrote: It's been my experience that the less cash you pay for a DVD player, the more likely it is to be multi-region or at least hackable (eg my kids' £20 Aldi job versus my high-end Sony model) That appeals to my penny-pinching preferences. You lot seem to have got in a bit of a tizzy. The OP asked if the link was a region free player. it says it is and the reviewers say it is. Amazon are only guaranteeing that it will play region 2. As for the bigger question of can all region free players play all region DVDs, the answer is not so clear cut. Region 2 is PAL and NTSC. ALL region 2 players MUST play NTSC. Japan is region 2 and NTSC, but as has been discussed, some players do real NTSC, some do pseudo PAL, some do converted to real PAL. Region 1 is exclusively NTSC. There are some region 1 machines that can be made region free but cannot handle PAL, they cannot read it or if Where do you think they "read" "PAL" from? You need to read up about the difference between colour encoding and frame size/frame rate. MBQ Some NTSC DVD players will not do anything with a PAL file. therefore in laymans terms they cannot 'read it' Who would think anything other was meant. ??? This thread seems to have disintegrated into an esoteric discussion about what is PAL and NTSC. However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 It would appear to work, as several reviewers state that they are pleased with it. http://reviews.argos.co.uk/1493-en_g...25/reviews.htm "good price for an excellent product . Loved the ability to change to multi region!" "DVD player does exactly what was required. The codes to set up region free is very simple and works. I can play DVD from region 1, 2 and 4. The only negative is the quality of the remote control is a bit poor." "Purchased this one so I could make it region free so daughter could play usa dvd's and it fine for that. Not complicated just a basic player which is all I wanted." Finally, it seems hard to find anything that specifically states that it will play both PAL and NTSC discs, but here is one site which does. [I would have thought that most non-purely-American DVD players will play both. I have three recorders and one player, and all of them do.] http://www.saverstore.com/product/20...-SD-3010-DVD-P layer-720p-1080i-1080p-Upscaling-Hi-resolution-pal-progressive-HDMI-MP3-J PEG-Viewer-Play If people are insisting on being awkward about it. The issue is not if it will play PAL and NTSC but will it play Multi-region. This is why that is more important . http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_region_code http://countrycode.org/tv-standards And below is a list of what the different country s in these regions use. WORLD TELEVISION SIGNAL GUIDE The table below lists broadcast standards by country. There are three main television standards used throughout the world. *NTSC - National Television Standards Committee* Developed in the US and first used in 1954, NTSC is the oldest existing broadcast standard. It consists of 525 horizontal lines of display and 60 vertical lines. Only one type exists, known as NTSC M. It is sometimes irreverently referred to as "Never Twice the Same Color." *SECAM - Système Électronique pour Couleur avec Mèmoire.* Developed in France and first used in 1967. It uses a 625-line vertical, 50-line horizontal display. Different types use different video bandwidth and audio carrier specifications. Types B and D are usually used for VHF. Types G, H, and K are used for UHF. Types I, N, M, K1 and L are used for both VHF and UHF. These different types are generally not compatible with one another. SECAM is sometimes irreverently referred to as "Something Essentially Contrary to the American Method" or "SEcond Color Always Magenta." *PAL - Phase Alternating Line* Developed in Germany and first used in 1967. A variant of NTSC, PAL uses a 625/50-line display. Different types use different video bandwidth and audio carrier specifications. Common types are B, G, and H. Less common types include D, I, K, N, and M. These different types are generally not compatible with one another. Proponents of PAL irreverently call it "Perfection At Last," while critics of its enormous circuit complexity call it "Pay A Lot" or "Picture Always Lousy." Television Standards by Country Country Signal Type Afghanistan PAL B, SECAM B Albania PAL B/G Algeria PAL B/G Angola PAL I Antarctica NTSC M Antigua & Barbuda NTSC M Argentina PAL N Armenia SECAM D/K Aruba NTSC M Australia PAL B/G Austria PAL B/G Azerbaijan SECAM D/K Azores PAL B Bahamas NTSC M Bahrain PAL B/G Bangladesh PAL B Barbados NTSC M Belarus SECAM D/K Belgium PAL B/H Belgium (Armed Forces Network) NTSC M Belize NTSC M Benin SECAM K Bermuda NTSC M Bolivia NTSC M Bosnia/Herzegovina PAL B/H Botswana SECAM K, PAL I Brazil PAL M British Indian Ocean Territory NTSC M Brunei Darussalam PAL B Bulgaria PAL Burkina Faso SECAM K Burundi SECAM K Cambodia PAL B/G, NTSC M Cameroon PAL B/G Canada NTSC M Canary Islands PAL B/G Central African Republic SECAM K Chad SECAM D Chile NTSC M China (People'S Republic) PAL D Colombia NTSC M Congo (People'S Republic) SECAM K Congo, Dem. Rep. (Zaire) SECAM K Cook Islands PAL B Costa Rica NTSC M Cote D'Ivoire (Ivory Coast) SECAM K/D Croatia PAL B/H Cuba NTSC M Cyprus PAL B/G Czech Republic PAL B/G (cable), PAL D/K (broadcast) Denmark PAL B/G Diego Garcia NTSC M Djibouti SECAM K Dominica NTSC M Dominican Republic NTSC M East Timor PAL B Easter Island PAL B Ecuador NTSC M Egypt PAL B/G, SECAM B/G El Salvador NTSC M Equitorial Guinea SECAM B Estonia PAL B/G Ethiopia PAL B Falkland Islands (Las Malvinas) PAL I Fiji NTSC M Finland PAL B/G France SECAM L France (French Forces Tv) SECAM G Gabon SECAM K Galapagos Islands NTSC M Gambia PAL B Georgia SECAM D/K Germany PAL B/G Germany (Armed Forces Tv Germany) NTSC M Ghana PAL B/G Gibraltar PAL B/G Greece PAL B/G Greenland PAL B Grenada NTSC M Guam NTSC M Guadeloupe SECAM K Guatemala NTSC M Guiana (French) SECAM K Guinea PAL K Guyana NTSC M Haiti SECAM Honduras NTSC M Hong Kong PAL I Hungary PAL K/K Iceland PAL B/G India PAL B Indonesia PAL B Iran PAL B/G Iraq PAL Ireland, Republic Of PAL I Isle Of Man PAL Israel PAL B/G Italy PAL B/G Jamaica NTSC M Japan NTSC M Johnstone Island NTSC M Jordan PAL B/G Kazakhstan SECAM D/K Kenya PAL B/G Korea (North) SECAM D, PAL D/K Korea (South) NTSC M Kuwait PAL B/G Kyrgyz Republic SECAM D/K Laos PAL B Latvia PAL B/G Lebanon PAL B/G Lesotho PAL K Liberia PAL B/H Libya PAL B/G Liechtenstein PAL B/G Lithuania PAL B/G, SECAM D/K Luxembourg PAL B/G, SECAM L Macau PAL I Macedonia PAL B/H Madagascar SECAM K Madeira PAL B Malaysia PAL B Maldives PAL B Mali SECAM K Malta PAL B Marshall Islands NTSC M Martinique SECAM K Mauritania SECAM B Mauritius SECAM B Mayotte SECAM K Mexico NTSC M Micronesia NTSC M Midway Island NTSC M Moldova (Moldavia) SECAM D/K Monaco SECAM L, PAL G Mongolia SECAM D Montenegro PAL B/G Montserrat NTSC M Morocco SECAM B Mozambique PAL B Myanmar (Burma) NTSC M Namibia PAL I Nepal B Netherlands PAL B/G Netherlands (Armed Forces Network) NTSC M Netherlands Antilles NTSC M New Caledonia SECAM K New Zealand PAL B/G Nicaragua NTSC M Niger SECAM K Nigeria PAL B/G Norfolk Island PAL B North Mariana Islands NTSC M Norway PAL B/G Oman PAL B/G Pakistan PAL B Palau NTSC M Panama NTSC M Papua New Guinea PAL B/G Paraguay PAL N Peru NTSC M Philippines NTSC M Poland PAL D/K Polynesia (French) SECAM K Portugal PAL B/G Puerto Rico NTSC M Qatar PAL B Reunion SECAM K Romania PAL D/G Russia SECAM D/K St. Kitts & Nevis NTSC M St. Lucia NTSC M St. Pierre Et Miquelon SECAM K St. Vincent NTSC M Sao Tomé E Principe PAL B/G Samoa, American NTSC Saudi Arabia SECAM B/G, PAL B Samoa NTSC M Senegal SECAM K Serbia PAL B/G Seychelles PAL B/G Sierra Leone PAL B/G Singapore PAL B/G Slovakia PAL B/G Slovenia PAL B/H Somalia PAL B/G South Africa PAL I Spain PAL B/G Sri Lanka PAL Sudan PAL B Suriname NTSC M Swaziland PAL B/G Sweden PAL B/G Switzerland PAL B/G (GERMAN ZONE, SECAM L (FRENCH ZONE Syria SECAM B, PAL G Tahiti SECAM Taiwan NTSC Tajikistan SECAM D/K Tanzania PAL B Thailand PAL B/M Togo SECAM K Trinidad & Tobago NTSC M Tunisia SECAM B/G Turkey PAL B Turkmenistan SECAM D/K Turks & Caicos Islands NTSC M Uganda PAL B/G Ukraine SECAM D/K Uruguay PAL N United Arab Emirates PAL B/G United States NTSC M United Kingdom PAL I Uzbekistan SECAM D/K Venezuela NTSC M Vietnam NTSC M, SECAM D Virgin Islands (Us & British) NTSC M Wallis & Futuna SECAM K Yemen PAL B/NTSC M Zambia PAL B/G Zimbabwe PAL B/G |
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On 16/05/2012 11:05, Frank Kelly wrote:
In message , writes On 11 May, Gary wrote: that's not true. it tells you what to expect. there is no such thing as 405 50 NTSC. The first colour TV I saw was 405 50 NTSC (an experimental setup some years ago.) My mind wanders back to 1964 when I used to come home from school to watch the colour test transmissions at 4:00 PM every weekday on the BBC. They were 20 minutes long and comprised, IIRC, She Wore A Yellow Ribbon with John Wayne split into 20 minute segments and a series of very interesting documentary films which included the moving of the temple at Aswan and building an oil rig in the jungle. I am one of those that used to watch the colour test transmissions. including the one that was all about setting up the colour set and why. I remember they used to say that the white referred to was different now. and gave it a different letter. It was exciting stuff in those days. Anyone remember the BBC quadrophonic test they did using BBC radio 2 and radio 3. I remember as part of it was a play with a crowd scene . I remember the feeling that they should have left a gap for the listener to stand in. The transmision was Late at night, after the normal shutdown time of said radio stations. We had to put 2 sterio radio HiFi setups in the same room. Easier said than done. |
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In message , S Viemeister
writes On 5/15/2012 11:21 AM, Ian Jackson wrote: However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 OP here - thank you! You're welcome!! Are you going to get one? -- Ian |
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On 5/16/2012 8:22 AM, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , S Viemeister writes On 5/15/2012 11:21 AM, Ian Jackson wrote: However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 OP here - thank you! You're welcome!! Are you going to get one? In a month or so. I'm out of the country at the moment, and would like to buy a few DVDs to take back with me. |
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On 16/05/2012 14:20, S Viemeister wrote:
On 5/16/2012 8:22 AM, Ian Jackson wrote: In message , S Viemeister writes On 5/15/2012 11:21 AM, Ian Jackson wrote: However, did the OP get my link which answered his original question, ie "Is there a code to enter to allow the machine to play other regions?"? http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks/toshiba-sd3010/11132 OP here - thank you! You're welcome!! Are you going to get one? In a month or so. I'm out of the country at the moment, and would like to buy a few DVDs to take back with me. What country are you in to buy these dvds. |
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