http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

--
Adam

ARWadsworth wrote:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there
are dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

Was bitten while entering a customer's garden while carrying triple
extension ladders, I kicked it in the head and the owner said, ' you can
pack that in'....I still don't know whether he was talking to me or the dog.
Only that once in 25 years of working at people's houses - most normal folk
who have uncontrollable mutts keep them locked up when you are there - it
takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take place.

On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 20:56:02 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

Microchips are all well and good provided you can catch the damn dog
in the first place. Why not compulsory muzzles when outside the home,
regardles of size or breed? Job done.

"Phil L" wrote in message
...

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take
place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..
it was well behaved with everyone..
well everyone until my brother visited for the first time..
as soon as the dog saw him it went barking mad and does so every time he
went there.
It never did that with anyone else.

dennis@home wrote:
"Phil L" wrote in message
...

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to
take place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..

Was it a standard poodle?

It is well know that the minature and toy poodles are also called fanny
lickers.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...fanny%20licker



--
Adam

In message , ARWadsworth
wrote
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

And does anyone believe it will make any difference? How many postal
workers have been bitten whilst walking in the street. I suspect that if
they are bitten/attacked it will when delivering to a property

--
Alan
news2009 {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

Owain wrote:
On Apr 22, 8:56 pm, "ARWadsworth" wrote:
OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where
there are dogs.
Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?
I have been bitten twice.

Dogs I don't mind.

It's being bitten by customers I seriously object to.

And if the customer is a bit of a dog?

--
Adam

ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

Nope, not ever.

I have been bitten twice.

Dogs have one hell of a capacity to only bite those who fear being bitten by
dogs.

They operate on 'front' much more than any other domesticated species.

'front' isnt quite the right word but cant think of anything better.

Its all about aura with dogs.

Those that get bitten don’t even realise how dogs operate.

ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

We've had compulsory microchipping for years now and its made
no difference what so ever to those who get bitten as part of their
job, essentially because the worst of the dog owners don’t bother
regardless of what the law requires.

And we have had a number of small children killed
by dogs too and a rather smaller number of adults.

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

Rod Speed wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where
there are dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

Nope, not ever.

I have been bitten twice.

Dogs have one hell of a capacity to only bite those who fear being
bitten by dogs.

They operate on 'front' much more than any other domesticated species.

'front' isnt quite the right word but cant think of anything better.

Its all about aura with dogs.

Those that get bitten don’t even realise how dogs operate.

So I wasted all my time by not getting bitten when I do my animal charity
work?

I can handle a dog.

--
Adam

dennis@home wrote
Phil L wrote

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take
place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..
it was well behaved with everyone..
well everyone until my brother visited for the first time..
as soon as the dog saw him it went barking mad and does so every time he
went there.
It never did that with anyone else.

Yeah, some dogs can be weird like that.

Mine took a particular dislike to just one individual.

Mine was an inside dog, ****ing huge great alsatian.

He used to spend most of his time just inside the big
armoured glass patio door that's the front door, facing
onto the park next to the house that's the walk way thru
for the high school that at the end of that park.

All that individual had to do was to be visible around
the corner of the park 100 feet away for the dog to go
bananas. Never did that with anyone else, with hordes
of the school kids going past every day.

Owain wrote:
On Apr 22, 10:25 pm, "ARWadsworth" wrote:
It's being bitten by customers I seriously object to.
And if the customer is a bit of a dog?

Time to check the inoculations are up to date.


Mine or hers?


--
Adam

ARWadsworth wrote
Rod Speed wrote
ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

Nope, not ever.

I have been bitten twice.

Dogs have one hell of a capacity to only bite those who fear being bitten
by dogs.

They operate on 'front' much more than any other domesticated species.

'front' isnt quite the right word but cant think of anything better.

Its all about aura with dogs.

Those that get bitten don’t even realise how dogs operate.

So I wasted all my time by not getting bitten when I do my animal charity
work?

Dog don’t bite for the fun of it.

I can handle a dog.

If you really did understand dogs, you wouldn’t have ever got bitten.

Rod Speed wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote
Rod Speed wrote
ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where
there are dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

Nope, not ever.

I have been bitten twice.

Dogs have one hell of a capacity to only bite those who fear
being bitten by dogs.

They operate on 'front' much more than any other domesticated
species.

'front' isnt quite the right word but cant think of anything
better.

Its all about aura with dogs.

Those that get bitten don’t even realise how dogs operate.

So I wasted all my time by not getting bitten when I do my animal
charity work?

Dog don’t bite for the fun of it.

I can handle a dog.

If you really did understand dogs, you wouldn’t have ever got bitten.

Let's just say the first one that bit me had a owner that was a ******. And
it is possible for a dog to travel down the stairs "faster" than suggested
by Newtons laws of gravity.


--
Adam

ARWadsworth wrote
Rod Speed wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote
Rod Speed wrote
ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there
are dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

Nope, not ever.

I have been bitten twice.

Dogs have one hell of a capacity to only bite those who fear being
bitten by dogs.

They operate on 'front' much more than any other domesticated species.

'front' isnt quite the right word but cant think of anything better.

Its all about aura with dogs.

Those that get bitten don’t even realise how dogs operate.

So I wasted all my time by not getting bitten when I do my animal
charity work?

Dog don’t bite for the fun of it.

I can handle a dog.

If you really did understand dogs, you wouldn’t have ever got bitten.

Let's just say the first one that bit me had a owner that was a ******.

If you did understand dogs, you wouldn’t have got bitten by that one.

And it is possible for a dog to travel down the stairs "faster" than
suggested by Newtons laws of gravity.

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesn’t get bitten except in a situation where he doesn’t care
about that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesar_Millan

John wrote:
On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 20:56:02 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

Microchips are all well and good provided you can catch the damn dog
in the first place. Why not compulsory muzzles when outside the home,
regardles of size or breed? Job done.

The main advantage of compulsory microchipping is to identify the owner
for the various fines the powers that be can think up

F Murtz wrote
John wrote
ARWadsworth wrote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you
must visit houses where there are dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

Microchips are all well and good provided you can catch
the damn dog in the first place. Why not compulsory muzzles
when outside the home, regardles of size or breed? Job done.

The main advantage of compulsory microchipping is to identify
the owner for the various fines the powers that be can think up

The main advantage is to be able to find the owners when
they are strays so they can be returned to the owners.

Whether its actually worth the immense cost of
microchipping all dogs tho is another matter entirely.

On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesn’t get bitten except in a situation where he doesn’t
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.

Most educational video that puts the message across in a few minutes is
Cesar "dog whispering" Cartman of southpark fame.
http://tinyurl.com/797grvp
http://www.cesarsway.com/newsandeven...lan-vs-cartman

:¬)

--
http://www.gymratz.co.uk/rapid-fatloss-book
Not for weight watchers or food junkies.

www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote
Rod Speed wrote

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesn’t get bitten except in a situation where he doesn’t
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant.

Yeah, never seen anything like it, particularly with the nuttiest dogs.

Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour.

Its rather more complicated than that, particularly with dogs
biting visitors as was originally being discussed, particularly
when the owner isnt around when the vistor shows up.

Most dog owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work"

They are indeed.

even the rescue homes and animal shelters
etc go about things the wrong way.

Yeah, few of them have a clue.

Most educational video that puts the message across in a few
minutes is Cesar "dog whispering" Cartman of southpark fame.
http://tinyurl.com/797grvp
http://www.cesarsway.com/newsandeven...lan-vs-cartman

:¬)

|-)

www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.


Cant agree more.

Man-dog relationhips are subtle things and you need to work on them,
but having done so both parties know where they stand,.



Most educational video that puts the message across in a few minutes is
Cesar "dog whispering" Cartman of southpark fame.
http://tinyurl.com/797grvp
http://www.cesarsway.com/newsandeven...lan-vs-cartman

:¬)

--
http://www.gymratz.co.uk/rapid-fatloss-book
Not for weight watchers or food junkies.


--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 22:12:10 +0100, Alan
wrote:

In message , ARWadsworth
wrote
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

And does anyone believe it will make any difference? How many postal
workers have been bitten whilst walking in the street. I suspect that if
they are bitten/attacked it will when delivering to a property

I worked as a postie for a very short time. Some dogs used to try and
bite my hands when I was pushing the letters through the letterbox. I
made sure those letters were heavily chewed.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

[Default] On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 20:56:02 +0100, a certain chimpanzee,
"ARWadsworth" , randomly hit the
keyboard and wrote:

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

I always get the owner to put the dog into another room, or outside,
or somewhere I'm not.

From times when I delivered papers or leaflets, I quickly learned to
NEVER put my hands through the letterbox.
--
Hugo Nebula
"If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this,
just how far from the pack have I strayed"?

On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 12:27:30 +0100, Hugo Nebula
wrote:

[Default] On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 20:56:02 +0100, a certain chimpanzee,
"ARWadsworth" , randomly hit the
keyboard and wrote:

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

I always get the owner to put the dog into another room, or outside,
or somewhere I'm not.

From times when I delivered papers or leaflets, I quickly learned to
NEVER put my hands through the letterbox.

During earlier times, delivering leaflets, I developed the "Odell
Baton." Roll leaflet into a tube, such that it will spring open on the
doormat, right-side up for the occupier to see; push the "baton"
through the letterbox, forcing past the brush draught excluder or
inner sprung flap; finish the job off with a pencil - not a finger!

Nick

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesar_Millan

I've always wondered where the scars on his arm come from ....

On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 12:43:30 +0000, Jethro_uk wrote:

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesar_Millan

I've always wondered where the scars on his arm come from ....

wrestling once with a blocked saniflo, I think.

On Sun, 22 Apr 2012 20:56:02 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17807349

OK, possibly off topic but many of you must visit houses where there are
dogs.

Has anyone alse been bitten by a customers dog?

I have been bitten twice.

About twice ,neither much more than a nip in over thirty years.
The vast majority of premises I worked at were pubs and most had a
Dog. Some were ok with people and as would be expected in a pub used
to strangers,others you made sure they were shut away. In between
there was quite range,some were ok after introduction which may have
been on each visit or with some just once and you were ok for the
future. Others were fine in parts of the building and protective of
other parts which is often why they were there.
Of the two that nipped me one was a bad tempered small mongrel thing
that should been drowned for looking ugly ,the other was an Ex Police
Alsatian that had retired with his owner. He actually looked quite
menacing but knew me and was usually fine. One morning on a visit he
came up and got given the regular pat on the head at which point he
nipped me on the arm just the owner shouted " Don't touch the Dog !".
Turned out that hours before the pub had suffered a break in and
knowing the Dog was there the perpetuators coshed him ,it was to the
Dogs credit that he moderated his bite after an instictive response to
my patting the sore spot.
Most trouble with dogs was cheeky ones knicking tools or daft ones
attempting to eat small washers and other bits.
OTOH many of the same dogs made a colleague feel very uncomfortable
,they just didn't seem to like him for no apparent reason.
G.Harman

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesn’t get bitten except in a situation where he doesn’t
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of this type
of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the dog use "flight" to
get out of the bad situation. But this does not mean the dog will not use
"fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in science are
the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are seeing the light and
moving to this kind of training, including some of the celebrity trainers
such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

On 23/04/12 10:57, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.


Cant agree more.

Man-dog relationhips are subtle things and you need to work on them, but
having done so both parties know where they stand,.

Correct. But Cesar Milan has set back this kind of understanding of canines
more than 20 years

funkyoldcortina wrote:

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of this
type of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the dog use
"flight" to get out of the bad situation. But this does not mean the dog
will not use "fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...204/did-cesar-
millan-have-hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in science
are the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are seeing the light
and moving to this kind of training, including some of the celebrity
trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

This all feels vaguely familiar.

Ah - yes, Labour education policy.

--
Tim Watts

Tim Watts wrote:
funkyoldcortina wrote:

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for
that too.

Cesar Millan doesn't get bitten except in a situation where he
doesn't care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or
dominant member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad"
behaviour. Most dog owners are completely clueless as to how dogs
"work" even the rescue homes and animal shelters etc go about
things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of
this type of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the
dog use "flight" to get out of the bad situation. But this does not
mean the dog will not use "fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...204/did-cesar-
millan-have-hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in
science are the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are
seeing the light and moving to this kind of training, including
some of the celebrity trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's
me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

This all feels vaguely familiar.

Ah - yes, Labour education policy.

She sounds like a social worker to me.
--
Adam

Jethro_uk wrote

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a
situation where he doesnt care about that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesar_Millan

I've always wondered where the scars on his arm come from ....

Likely from childhood accidents. Thats where my scars come from.

I do have one dog bite scar on my leg, but thats from a
dog that was under a big trailer at a travelling circus. I
didnt even notice that the dog was under there until it bit
me when I walked past too close when I was about 7 or so.

On 22/04/2012 22:53, Rod Speed wrote:
dennis@home wrote
Phil L wrote

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take
place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..
it was well behaved with everyone..
well everyone until my brother visited for the first time..
as soon as the dog saw him it went barking mad and does so every time
he went there.
It never did that with anyone else.

Yeah, some dogs can be weird like that.

We've recently acquired a puppy, now 3 months old and we're doing all we
can to 'socialise' her within her first 6 months - apparently that's
when the form all their notions about stuff and is the owner's
opportunity to ensure they end up with a well-balanced mutt and not a
canine psycho. Eg - look at: http://tinyurl.com/cfxyarp (or
http://www.myhillskitten.com/~/media...31325234667765)

Funny thing really - ours has been totally laid back about everything
and everyine she's experienced so far - tail never stops wagging - until
today when she came across someone in the park with a push-chair.
Nearly went into orbit! What's all that about...?

David

funkyoldcortina wrote
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote
Rod Speed wrote

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesn’t get bitten except in a situation where he doesn’t
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

He knows a hell of a lot more about dogs than you do.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission.

Mindlessly silly. That’s not how dogs operate.

Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that submission-based
training is outdated and wrong.

Even sillier.

The side effect of this type of training is that you hide the symptoms and
make the dog use "flight" to get out of the bad situation.

Even sillier.

But this does not mean the dog will not use "fight" later.

His don’t.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...hang-the-husky

Just because some fool claims something doesn’t make it gospel.

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in science
are the way and have long-term success.

Easy to claim. Havent seen you getting the results Cesar has with problem
dogs.

Many trainers are seeing the light and moving to this kind of training,
including some of the celebrity trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from
it's me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

She has never got anything like the results that Cesar has.

En el artículo , ARWadsworth adamwadsworth@
blueyonder.co.uk escribió:

And if the customer is a bit of a dog?

Tetanus injection and HIV test.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

En el artículo , Jethro_uk
escribió:

I've always wondered where the scars on his arm come from ....

I've always wondered why he has more teeth than the entire Osmond family
combined.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

Lobster wrote
Rod Speed wrote
dennis@home wrote
Phil L wrote

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take
place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..
it was well behaved with everyone..
well everyone until my brother visited for the first time..
as soon as the dog saw him it went barking mad and does so every time
he went there.
It never did that with anyone else.

Yeah, some dogs can be weird like that.

We've recently acquired a puppy, now 3 months old and we're doing all we
can to 'socialise' her within her first 6 months - apparently that's when
the form all their notions about stuff and is the owner's opportunity to
ensure they end up with a well-balanced mutt and not a canine psycho.

Its rather more complicated than that.

The jesuits used to claim that about kids, that what you do
in the first 7 years determines how they will behave as adults,
but the military has known for millennia now that its actually
much more complicated than that and that you can still have
one hell of an effect when they are late teenagers too.

Eg - look at: http://tinyurl.com/cfxyarp (or
http://www.myhillskitten.com/~/media...31325234667765)

I never bothered with anything like that and the best dog
turned out fine, left all the rest I have ever had for dead.

Funny thing really - ours has been totally laid back about everything and
everyine she's experienced so far - tail never stops wagging - until today
when she came across someone in the park with a push-chair. Nearly went
into orbit! What's all that about...?

It would be interesting to test whether it was the push chair or the
individual with it.

Most who have much to do with dogs know that some dogs
do take a particular dislike to particular individuals and it isnt
just because that individual has ever taken to them with a piece
of pipe etc either.

I know in my case that my dog never had anything to do with that individual.

On 23/04/12 19:06, ARWadsworth wrote:
Tim Watts wrote:
funkyoldcortina wrote:

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for
that too.

Cesar Millan doesn't get bitten except in a situation where he
doesn't care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or
dominant member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad"
behaviour. Most dog owners are completely clueless as to how dogs
"work" even the rescue homes and animal shelters etc go about
things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of
this type of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the
dog use "flight" to get out of the bad situation. But this does not
mean the dog will not use "fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...204/did-cesar-
millan-have-hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in
science are the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are
seeing the light and moving to this kind of training, including
some of the celebrity trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's
me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

This all feels vaguely familiar.

Ah - yes, Labour education policy.

She sounds like a social worker to me.

Hardly. Veterinary associations and dog training associations prefer her
methods to Cesar Milan's. His show has a disclaimer at the start warning
people not to try his methods at home, hardly suprising since they are
grounded in myth and make-believe. Science-based methods do not come with
such a disclaimer. I know I wouldn't touch a dog that Cesar Milan had "cured"
with a bargepole...

On 23/04/12 19:59, Lobster wrote:
On 22/04/2012 22:53, Rod Speed wrote:
dennis@home wrote
Phil L wrote

it takes a combination of idiot dog *and* owner for an attack to take
place.

That's not always true..
my mom had a recue poodle..
it was well behaved with everyone..
well everyone until my brother visited for the first time..
as soon as the dog saw him it went barking mad and does so every time
he went there.
It never did that with anyone else.

Yeah, some dogs can be weird like that.

We've recently acquired a puppy, now 3 months old and we're doing all we can
to 'socialise' her within her first 6 months - apparently that's when the
form all their notions about stuff and is the owner's opportunity to ensure
they end up with a well-balanced mutt and not a canine psycho. Eg - look at:
http://tinyurl.com/cfxyarp (or
http://www.myhillskitten.com/~/media...31325234667765)


Funny thing really - ours has been totally laid back about everything and
everyine she's experienced so far - tail never stops wagging - until today
when she came across someone in the park with a push-chair. Nearly went into
orbit! What's all that about...?


Up until about 12 weeks puppies have almost no fear! Everything is
interesting and fascinating to them. That's why you have to get the
socialisation done early, to take advantage of this natural curiosity and
allow them to associate the things they discover with positive experiences.

After about 12 weeks, things gradually start to spook them, so you have to
make more of an effort to ensure the puppy has positive experiences to avoid
them developing a lifelong irrational fear.

Sounds like she's starting to reach this stage now and the pushchair was
something new and ultra-freaky to her, with her reaction being that of
nervousness now, rather than inquisitiveness.

On 23/04/12 18:57, Tim Watts wrote:
funkyoldcortina wrote:

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for that too.

Cesar Millan doesnt get bitten except in a situation where he doesnt
care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or dominant
member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad" behaviour. Most dog
owners are completely clueless as to how dogs "work" even the rescue
homes and animal shelters etc go about things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of this
type of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the dog use
"flight" to get out of the bad situation. But this does not mean the dog
will not use "fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...204/did-cesar-
millan-have-hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in science
are the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are seeing the light
and moving to this kind of training, including some of the celebrity
trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

This all feels vaguely familiar.

Ah - yes, Labour education policy.


A better metaphor would be to compare Victorian treatment of children and the
vulnerable to modern day. Dominance theory is totally debunked. See

http://www.4pawsu.com/dogpsychology.htm

for the reasons why, and the differences between dogs and wolves.

And for an article with advice from a vet association, read here

http://www.4pawsu.com/dominancestatement.pdf

It's simple. It's not just that using dominance theory to try and control a
dog doesn't work. It can actually be dangerous and/or make a problem WORSE.

"funkyoldcortina" wrote in message
...
On 23/04/12 19:06, ARWadsworth wrote:
Tim Watts wrote:
funkyoldcortina wrote:

On 23/04/12 10:26, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 22/04/2012 23:55, Rod Speed wrote:

Sure, but if you did understand dogs, you'd have allowed for
that too.

Cesar Millan doesn't get bitten except in a situation where he
doesn't care about that.

Cesar is brilliant. Humans allowing dogs to become an equal or
dominant member of "the pack" is what causes dogs "bad"
behaviour. Most dog owners are completely clueless as to how dogs
"work" even the rescue homes and animal shelters etc go about
things the wrong way.

Cesar Milan is totally out of touch and out of date.

The reason dogs obey him is because he basically frightens them into
submission. Most dog trainers have seen the light and know that
submission-based training is outdated and wrong. The side effect of
this type of training is that you hide the symptoms and make the
dog use "flight" to get out of the bad situation. But this does not
mean the dog will not use "fight" later.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...204/did-cesar-
millan-have-hang-the-husky

Modern positive-reinforcement-based methods which are grounded in
science are the way and have long-term success. Many trainers are
seeing the light and moving to this kind of training, including
some of the celebrity trainers such as Victoria Stilwell (from it's
me or the dog).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Stilwell

This all feels vaguely familiar.

Ah - yes, Labour education policy.

She sounds like a social worker to me.

Hardly. Veterinary associations and dog training associations prefer her
methods to Cesar Milan's.

More fool them. Her results are nothing like his as
seen in their respective TV series.

His show has a disclaimer at the start warning people not to try his
methods at home,

Just because of the stupid litigious yanks

hardly suprising since they are grounded in myth and make-believe.

That's a lie.

Science-based methods do not come with such a disclaimer.

Wrong again with lion taming.

I know I wouldn't touch a dog that Cesar Milan had "cured" with a
bargepole...

Everyone feels that same about your ****.