I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

Not at all.

BILs house was reduced to a similar state, sold and rebuilt nicely.

It will also need insulation to modern standards - and its that *sort*
opf issue that often leads to complete demolition - the cost of
upgrading old stuff to new standards exceeds a demo/rebuild.

Things that may catch you ou are

damp proof courses - there? sound?
subsidence and general foundation issues - underpinning aint worth it on
a derelict.
insulation and windows - will it be simple to bring it up to spec? or
costly with special hand work needed.
Overall drainage and rainwater dispoal - are there good working drains
where you want them? Soakaway?
In the end commercial (comopany) rebuilds opt for the 'known cost' of a
new build rather than the risk of the restoration and that also tends to
need more intelligence on site. And they get VAT back too.





--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

On Mar 8, 4:26*pm, R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?


Depends on the degree of heat the masony was subjected to but it may
not be as bad as it appears. Needs careful checking that walls
haven't got out of plumb etc.
If the masonry was wet and it wasseverely heated this can be a major
destroyer. The steam blows the cement out of the joints. Walls fall
down, go out of plumb etc.= demolition job.
Hard one to call. Demoltion/replacement can often be cheaper than
refurb. even in a sound building

The Natural Philosopher wrote
R D S wrote

I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need new floors and a roof but other than that is
there any reason why it couldn't be usable?

Not at all.

BILs house was reduced to a similar state, sold and rebuilt nicely.

It will also need insulation to modern standards - and its that *sort* opf issue that often leads to complete
demolition - the cost
of upgrading old stuff to new standards exceeds a demo/rebuild.

And a demo/rebuild is a lot easier to do too when the cost is similar
and you arent contrained by the original 'design'

Things that may catch you ou are

damp proof courses - there? sound?
subsidence and general foundation issues - underpinning aint worth it on a derelict.
insulation and windows - will it be simple to bring it up to spec? or
costly with special hand work needed.
Overall drainage and rainwater dispoal - are there good working drains
where you want them? Soakaway?
In the end commercial (comopany) rebuilds opt for the 'known cost' of
a new build rather than the risk of the restoration and that also
tends to need more intelligence on site. And they get VAT back too.

On 3/8/2012 12:10 PM, harry wrote:
On Mar 8, 4:26 pm, R D wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?


Depends on the degree of heat the masony was subjected to but it may
not be as bad as it appears. Needs careful checking that walls
haven't got out of plumb etc.
If the masonry was wet and it wasseverely heated this can be a major
destroyer. The steam blows the cement out of the joints. Walls fall
down, go out of plumb etc.= demolition job.
Hard one to call. Demoltion/replacement can often be cheaper than
refurb. even in a sound building

I agree about possible hidden damage. If it were me I'd hire a
structural engineer to do a survey of the building prior to purchasing it.

"R D S" wrote in message
...
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up for
sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need new
floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it couldn't
be usable?

Heat can reduce the mortar strength to the extent the walls can collapse.
You need to get it checked to see if the walls are salvageable.

On Mar 8, 4:26*pm, R D S wrote:
perfect for my needs.

*smile*, go with your spreadsheet, not your heart :-)

On Mar 8, 4:26*pm, R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

Nobody mentioned heath and safety.

By the time you have had it inspected the weather will have got to
work on the internals, it was already suffering from damp. Now the
upper storey has to be made safe to work under.

If you rip it down and have no trouble with planning permission and
the like, you get to design it to suit you. Otherwise you are stuck
with the original design vss modern materials.

Weatherlawyer wrote:
On Mar 8, 4:26 pm, R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

Nobody mentioned heath and safety.

By the time you have had it inspected the weather will have got to
work on the internals, it was already suffering from damp. Now the
upper storey has to be made safe to work under.

If you rip it down and have no trouble with planning permission and
the like, you get to design it to suit you. Otherwise you are stuck
with the original design vss modern materials.

In general you trash ALL the wood work - if it was a big fire it will be
soaked through from the fire hoses anyway.

BILS place we managed to recover some stuff - lot of smoke damage but we
restored a china set that had survived. He also owes his face and
possibly his life to me pointing out that the damp shotgun cartridge
that misfired (cap went off, not main charge) had almost certainly left
the wadding and the charge in the barrel and possibly half the pellets
Sure enough it had and the next shot that did fire the charge would have
split the barrel

In that case the brickwork was sound enough: Its relative ******** to
talk about mortar blowing under heat - I know because I have had masonry
red hot in a fireback - i've even seen the glow from the street outside
on the wall - without it doing more than superficial damage.

You have to have it red hot for a prolonged period for it to go down,
and chances are if it was in the state the fire officer would already
have demolished it on safety grounds.

In short no wood will be usable is a safe bet and all brickwork will be
fine.

Its a half built shell thats left - repserenting about 20-30% of the
rebuild cost.

Perhaps 40% of the materials cost (finishing and fitting out is light on
materials, heavy on labour)


--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

On 09/03/2012 01:28, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Its a half built shell thats left - repserenting about 20-30% of the
rebuild cost.


It's a unit i'm looking at, so non domestic.

Everything else i'm looking at is a ******** so would want knocking back
to a shell anyway.

The council are hounding the owner to put it right so i'm sure it could
be got for a steal.

It shares a wall with a house so i'm guessing any potential mortar
problems aren't an issue.

On 08/03/2012 4:26 PM, R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

Loads of barn conversions out there show it must be pretty common.

The issue I guess is that to refit joists, & roof ... in an existing
stone shell is so much hard work that it is quicker to demolish &
rebuild .... time is money for a builder .. could be a benefit to
d-i-y, in that it is time an not money you have to lay out.

On 09/03/2012 7:46 PM, Rick wrote:
On 08/03/2012 4:26 PM, R D S wrote:
I know of a building which has been gutted by fire, stone and brick
construction.

It was empty for ages before the fire and I had my eye on it coming up
for sale as it would be perfect for my needs.

Most buildings in this state seem to end up demolished, it would need
new floors and a roof but other than that is there any reason why it
couldn't be usable?

Loads of barn conversions out there show it must be pretty common.

The issue I guess is that to refit joists, & roof ... in an existing
stone shell is so much hard work that it is quicker to demolish &
rebuild .... time is money for a builder .. could be a benefit to d-i-y,
in that it is time an not money you have to lay out.

forgot to add .. on a new build you can reclaim the VAT as a
Selfbuilder, but not on a refurb.