On Fri, 24 Feb 2012 20:53:29 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

At least with an email you can hover over an email/web address
and see
where it's really pointing to.

Not if the HTML page is just an attached file. It points to your hard
disk :-)

If I load a file from the local disc with external links into my
browser I and hover over those links the browser tells me the content
of the href. Don't these, recent, all singin', all dancin', enchanced
web experience, browsers do that?

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 24 Feb 2012 20:53:29 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

At least with an email you can hover over an email/web address
and see
where it's really pointing to.

Not if the HTML page is just an attached file. It points to your hard
disk :-)

If I load a file from the local disc with external links into my
browser I and hover over those links the browser tells me the content
of the href.

A FORM statement is not a url. Its isnt a link. You cant 'hover over it'

Its just where you go when you push that submit button.



Don't these, recent, all singin', all dancin', enchanced
web experience, browsers do that?


Of course, but it makes no difference. All the LINKS are to the genuine
bank pages.

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

A FORM statement is not a url. Its isnt a link. You cant 'hover over it'
Its just where you go when you push that submit button.

Or what javascript gets triggered as you change values in the fields and
is whisked away via XHR before you even think about pressing the button.

On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 10:38:24 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:

There is no HREF underneath. You're clicking a button to submit a
form.
That doesn't show up in the status bar.

Ha lost the track of the thread, probably something to do with
leaving for work at 0600 yesterday and not getting back 'till 2130
and getting up again at 0700 this morning.

I should also have said that the browser's response is therefo

"Sorry Dave, I can't do that."

B-)

I must watch that, ages since I did, got it on Bluray for Christmas.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Andy Burns wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

A FORM statement is not a url. Its isnt a link. You cant 'hover over it'
Its just where you go when you push that submit button.

Or what javascript gets triggered as you change values in the fields and
is whisked away via XHR before you even think about pressing the button.

I saw no sign of that, I have to say.

On 27/02/2012 10:24, Mark wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 10:44:27 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote:

Worse than that they sometimes cold call me and demand that *I* prove to
them who I am. My response is tell me the first line of my address (and
they won't because of data protection) we deadlock at that point.

Even worse is when this is an automated system and you can't tell them
that their security model is flawed.

Capital One have a similar problem with their automated phone system. I
used to have a credit card with them when I lived in the UK. When I
moved to France I gave them my French address but they don't permit me
to have a card any more due to being non-resident in the UK. Fair
enough. But every few months they send me a letter in the post about
something or other such as changes to their terms and conditions. This
has gone on for over six years now. I haven't had a Capital One card now
for over six years but they still keep sending me mail as though I'm a
card holder. I tried to phone them to ask them to stop but it is
impossible because their phone system insists I enter my card number -
which has long since expired and I forgot 6 years ago. It is impossible
to speak to anyone without entering that number. So complete deadlock.
They keep sending me mailings about my zero balance account (no account
number specified in their mailings) and I keep destroying and binning them.

--
David in Normandy.
To e-mail you must include the password FROG on the
subject line, or it will be automatically deleted
by a filter and not reach my inbox.

On 27/02/2012 13:14, David in Normandy wrote:
On 27/02/2012 10:24, Mark wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 10:44:27 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote:

Worse than that they sometimes cold call me and demand that *I* prove to
them who I am. My response is tell me the first line of my address (and
they won't because of data protection) we deadlock at that point.

Even worse is when this is an automated system and you can't tell them
that their security model is flawed.

Capital One have a similar problem with their automated phone system. I
used to have a credit card with them when I lived in the UK. When I
moved to France I gave them my French address but they don't permit me
to have a card any more due to being non-resident in the UK. Fair
enough. But every few months they send me a letter in the post about
something or other such as changes to their terms and conditions. This
has gone on for over six years now. I haven't had a Capital One card now
for over six years but they still keep sending me mail as though I'm a
card holder. I tried to phone them to ask them to stop but it is
impossible because their phone system insists I enter my card number -
which has long since expired and I forgot 6 years ago. It is impossible
to speak to anyone without entering that number. So complete deadlock.
They keep sending me mailings about my zero balance account (no account
number specified in their mailings) and I keep destroying and binning them.

Striking letters through "NOT KNOWN AT THIS ADDRESS" works eventually.

Be *very* careful if you have ever registered for any of the bank
branded card protection services linked to one of your cards if you move
house. For reasons of "data protection" your change of address sent to
the credit card and bank is not shared with the same named card security
firm (which is actually a third party provider). The upshot of this is
at renewal a complete list of all your credit cards is sent to the
address where you previously lived. Then you have to get them to admit
that it is a third party provider and which one to sort it out!

I have had it happen to me and had a similar pacakage of stuff come to
my new address and with a surprising name collision that suggested it
might actually be identity fraud (ie addressed to another Mr Brown).

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 14:14:47 +0100, David in Normandy
wrote:

On 27/02/2012 10:24, Mark wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 10:44:27 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote:

Worse than that they sometimes cold call me and demand that *I* prove to
them who I am. My response is tell me the first line of my address (and
they won't because of data protection) we deadlock at that point.

Even worse is when this is an automated system and you can't tell them
that their security model is flawed.

Capital One have a similar problem with their automated phone system. I
used to have a credit card with them when I lived in the UK. When I
moved to France I gave them my French address but they don't permit me
to have a card any more due to being non-resident in the UK. Fair
enough. But every few months they send me a letter in the post about
something or other such as changes to their terms and conditions. This
has gone on for over six years now. I haven't had a Capital One card now
for over six years but they still keep sending me mail as though I'm a
card holder.

I guess I'm lucky. C1 stopped sending me anything after I cancelled my
credit card.

I tried to phone them to ask them to stop but it is
impossible because their phone system insists I enter my card number -
which has long since expired and I forgot 6 years ago. It is impossible
to speak to anyone without entering that number. So complete deadlock.
They keep sending me mailings about my zero balance account (no account
number specified in their mailings) and I keep destroying and binning them.

I had a similar, but less serious problem with Santander. I am trying
to get my last bank statement from them since I closed my account last
year. They also keep asking for my card number (account number won't
do). However, after about 5 minutes of keep asking/waiting, it does
eventually put me through to a human. I still haven't received my
statement though :-(
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 14:14:47 +0100, David in Normandy wrote:

I tried to phone them to ask them to stop but it is impossible because
their phone system insists I enter my card number - which has long since
expired and I forgot 6 years ago. It is impossible to speak to anyone
without entering that number.

Some times if you remain quiet and don't press any buttons you will
eventually fall through to a real person. May take a while and lots
of nagging from the other end mind...

Having said that if you don't know the account number they might be
reluctant to do anything anyway, at least not the run of the mill
script jockey.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Mark wrote
Andy Champ wrote
Mark wrote

And it's easy to work out where the spammer got your address from.

That doesn't always help. Here are two sample responses (I paraphrase)

"Terribly sorry, our server was hacked into and the mailing list was stolen".

Then they have admitted it's their poor security that caused the problem.

"There's nothing wrong with our systems, it must have been you"

Then they're lying.

Either way I would not deal with them again.

You dont always have a choice, most obviously with the supplier
of spare parts you cant get anywhere else or with software etc.

On 27/02/2012 09:22, Mark wrote:
On Fri, 24 Feb 2012 22:46:13 +0000, Andy
wrote:

On 24/02/2012 11:34, Mark wrote:
And it's easy to work out where the spammer got your address from.

That doesn't always help. Here are two sample responses (I paraphrase)

"Terribly sorry, our server was hacked into and the mailing list was
stolen".

Then they have admitted it's their poor security that caused the
problem.

"There's nothing wrong with our systems, it must have been you"

Then they're lying.

Either way I would not deal with them again.

I'd rather deal with the company that had a problem, detected it, and
admits to it, than the one who either out and out lies or won't even
believe there's a problem.

Andy

On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 20:50:28 +0000, Andy Champ
wrote:

On 27/02/2012 09:22, Mark wrote:
On Fri, 24 Feb 2012 22:46:13 +0000, Andy
wrote:

On 24/02/2012 11:34, Mark wrote:
And it's easy to work out where the spammer got your address from.

That doesn't always help. Here are two sample responses (I paraphrase)

"Terribly sorry, our server was hacked into and the mailing list was
stolen".

Then they have admitted it's their poor security that caused the
problem.

"There's nothing wrong with our systems, it must have been you"

Then they're lying.

Either way I would not deal with them again.

I'd rather deal with the company that had a problem, detected it, and
admits to it, than the one who either out and out lies or won't even
believe there's a problem.

Maybe I would actually let the former off if they were an otherwise
reputable organisation. IIRC they normally don't reply at all if I
ask them about how my email address got into the hands of spammers.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?