Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)


But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G


How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...



Cheers

Tim



--
Tim Watts

Tim Watts spake thus:

Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...

snip

Tim

If you don't get an iPhone 4S, how will other people know that you are
better than them?

On Jan 17, 1:13*pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included..

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Scion wrote:

Tim Watts spake thus:

Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...

snip

Tim

If you don't get an iPhone 4S, how will other people know that you are
better than them?

With me, having a hacked 'roid phone would be of more snob value

But, no - this is one type of technology where "just works" "hackability"
(although I do like hacking stuff).

--
Tim Watts

" wrote:
On Jan 17, 1:13 pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Um, I had an iPod touch and linked it to my Nokia phone using its wifi
hotspot. Having replaced the combo with an iPhone 3GS I can say that the
iPhone is *much* better than the combo.

Tim

Tim wrote:

" wrote:
On Jan 17, 1:13 pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the
iPhone is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of
Android apps are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of
RAM on my ancient 3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form
factor should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is
it for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Um, I had an iPod touch and linked it to my Nokia phone using its wifi
hotspot. Having replaced the combo with an iPhone 3GS I can say that the
iPhone is *much* better than the combo.

Tim

The iPhone 4S is supposed to be a lot faster for hotspot access too. I'm
going to speedtest it in Three' shop with my laptop and possibly compare it
to an Android doing the same (they all have 3 data SIMs in the display
phones).

Personally, I'm trying to carry less crap - not having to take the 3 MIFI
around wil be a plus

--
Tim Watts

On Jan 17, 4:51*pm, Tim wrote:
" wrote:
On Jan 17, 1:13 pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Um, I had an iPod touch and linked it to my Nokia phone using its wifi
hotspot. Having replaced the combo with an iPhone 3GS I can say that the
iPhone is *much* better than the combo.

Tim

You didn't have a 4G iPod touch then.. it's got the same display and
IOS as the iPhone 4.
install Skype and you can even make calls with it. it's wafer thin and
the battery lasts for ever too, I love it.

On 17/01/2012 13:13, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

I downloaded all the bits the other day. Not get a chance to actually
try anything yet, but it seems all there. Shame it uses Eclipse rather
than NetBeans, but other than that seems fine.

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

I get the impression both have a fair collection of crap apps available,
but the iPhone probably has slightly better looking crap apps! The
fundamentals of pretty much anything you need seem to be available now
on android as well. Each time I think "perhaps I ought to write x", I
then find there are already a dozen apps on the marketplace already!

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that
ruled the iPhone out.

All in all very pleased with my choice. It does all the stuff a phone is
supposed to but at the same time does not try to pretend there is not a
computer lurking underneath. Hence it has proper files system and apps
that interact with it, and it can see network shares, act as a
fileserver etc as required. You can plug it into a computer an use it
either as a MTP device or a mass storage device and drag stuff to and from.

If there is any part of it your don't like, you just change it... even
the interface is not untouchable - so if you want a new keyboard, or
wifi hotspot, or emulator for some other platform, then just click
download and off it goes.

If I were looking for a iPhone sized device, then the Sony Ericsson
Xperia Arc has a good spec and looks very nice.

[1] Got mine sim free and unbranded. Much prefer not having any operator
specific crap on there!

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

" wrote:
On Jan 17, 4:51 pm, Tim wrote:
" wrote:
On Jan 17, 1:13 pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Um, I had an iPod touch and linked it to my Nokia phone using its wifi
hotspot. Having replaced the combo with an iPhone 3GS I can say that the
iPhone is *much* better than the combo.

Tim

You didn't have a 4G iPod touch then.. it's got the same display and
IOS as the iPhone 4.
install Skype and you can even make calls with it. it's wafer thin and
the battery lasts for ever too, I love it.

Nope, I didn't. But then, I only have to carry and charge one device now.

Tim

John Rumm wrote:

On 17/01/2012 13:13, Tim Watts wrote:

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

I'm happy with Android, rooted my N1 within weeks of buying it, and have
used 'community' firmware on it ever since, I'm willing to give up some
of the iPhone's gleam and glitter to be able to do whatever *I* want on
my phone.

I downloaded all the bits the other day. Not get a chance to actually
try anything yet, but it seems all there. Shame it uses Eclipse rather
than NetBeans, but other than that seems fine.

I've used netbeans for a bit of android programming, learning rather
than doing really, and the netbeans stuff does tend to lag behind the
eclipse stuff

http://www.nbandroid.org/

On Tue, 17 Jan 2012 21:57:21 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

I get the impression both have a fair collection of crap apps available,
but the iPhone probably has slightly better looking crap apps! The
fundamentals of pretty much anything you need seem to be available now
on android as well. Each time I think "perhaps I ought to write x", I
then find there are already a dozen apps on the marketplace already!

According to a colleague who has done this, that really doesn't matter.
People will stumble across your app, and if it's good, they'll buy it
anyway. OK, you'll miss quite a few, but sales should still be OK.

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that
ruled the iPhone out.

I got a Galaxy S2, but actually preferred a soft keyboard. It's much
easier for my big fingers, and the screen is big anough for me to do
things without finding the glasses or monocle.

All in all very pleased with my choice. It does all the stuff a phone is
supposed to but at the same time does not try to pretend there is not a
computer lurking underneath. Hence it has proper files system and apps
that interact with it, and it can see network shares, act as a
fileserver etc as required. You can plug it into a computer an use it
either as a MTP device or a mass storage device and drag stuff to and
from.

Agreed. It works very well. Just waiting for them to send the Ice Cream
Sandwich update, which the S2 is apparently getting.

If there is any part of it your don't like, you just change it... even
the interface is not untouchable - so if you want a new keyboard, or
wifi hotspot, or emulator for some other platform, then just click
download and off it goes.

Yes, the email program didn't do what I wanted, so I just found another
one. Tried three SIP phone apps before I found one that would do SIP over
TCP...!

[1] Got mine sim free and unbranded. Much prefer not having any operator
specific crap on there!

Same here.



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

John Rumm wrote:
[snip]

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that ruled the iPhone out.

I must be imagining this hard (moving key) keyboard for my iPhone then. Oh
hang on, no, it's real and it works.

FWIW every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display. But if that's what you want, power to your fingertips.
Not much power of course.

On 17/01/2012 22:46, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
[snip]

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that ruled the iPhone out.

I must be imagining this hard (moving key) keyboard for my iPhone then. Oh
hang on, no, it's real and it works.

Built in, runs from the main iPhone battery?

(you can add a bluetooth KB to many phones, but personally I like having
it as a part of the phone).

FWIW every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display. But if that's what you want, power to your fingertips.
Not much power of course.

Try taking your rose tinted apple branded specs off then...


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 17/01/2012 15:03, Tim Watts wrote:
Scion wrote:

Tim Watts spake thus:

Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...

snip

Tim

If you don't get an iPhone 4S, how will other people know that you are
better than them?

With me, having a hacked 'roid phone would be of more snob value

But, no - this is one type of technology where "just works" "hackability"
(although I do like hacking stuff).

See what the remaining Mr. Apple has to say:

http://www.reghardware.com/2012/01/1...e_limitations/


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:
On 17/01/2012 22:46, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
[snip]

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that
ruled the iPhone out.

I must be imagining this hard (moving key) keyboard for my iPhone then. Oh
hang on, no, it's real and it works.

Built in, runs from the main iPhone battery?

Oh now you start changing the spec.

(you can add a bluetooth KB to many phones, but personally I like having
it as a part of the phone).

Whatever.

FWIW every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display. But if that's what you want, power to your fingertips.
Not much power of course.

Try taking your rose tinted apple branded specs off then...

Try not talking ********.

Steve Firth wrote:

John Rumm wrote:
On 17/01/2012 22:46, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
[snip]

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of
stuff the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to
nanny in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so
that ruled the iPhone out.

I must be imagining this hard (moving key) keyboard for my iPhone then.
Oh hang on, no, it's real and it works.

Built in, runs from the main iPhone battery?

Oh now you start changing the spec.

No, it was pretty clear what he meant.

--
Tim Watts

John Rumm wrote:

On 17/01/2012 13:13, Tim Watts wrote:

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the
iPhone is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of
Android apps are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of
RAM on my ancient 3G

snip

I get the impression both have a fair collection of crap apps available,
but the iPhone probably has slightly better looking crap apps! The
fundamentals of pretty much anything you need seem to be available now
on android as well. Each time I think "perhaps I ought to write x", I
then find there are already a dozen apps on the marketplace already!

Some of the Android are are just quite explody - I suppose that's the price
for a free for all market vs a regulated one.

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of stuff
the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to nanny
in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so that
ruled the iPhone out.

All in all very pleased with my choice. It does all the stuff a phone is
supposed to but at the same time does not try to pretend there is not a
computer lurking underneath. Hence it has proper files system and apps
that interact with it, and it can see network shares, act as a
fileserver etc as required. You can plug it into a computer an use it
either as a MTP device or a mass storage device and drag stuff to and
from.

If there is any part of it your don't like, you just change it... even
the interface is not untouchable - so if you want a new keyboard, or
wifi hotspot, or emulator for some other platform, then just click
download and off it goes.

Your selling it John

At least I do have a testbed in the form of a 'roid pad.

If I were looking for a iPhone sized device, then the Sony Ericsson
Xperia Arc has a good spec and looks very nice.

OK - I will look at that - cheers for the tip. I'll see if the Three shop on
the Strand has one then I can test it with a data connection live too
(tethering my laptop on the train will be 70% of its purpose).

[1] Got mine sim free and unbranded. Much prefer not having any operator
specific crap on there!


Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to get
the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my only
choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.


Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts

in 1097751 20120117 131356 Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)


But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G


How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

Get an Orange Monte Carlo from Argos (change from £100)
http://tinyurl.com/7y5qwol
then unlock it, repartition and install CyanogenMod 7.
I must admit that for me it's as much a toy as a phone but CM7 is as solid as a rock
and you have a full Linux system which you can program in Python, Ruby, Rexx etc etc

John Rumm wrote:

Steve Firth wrote:

every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display.

Try taking your rose tinted apple branded specs off then...

Indeed ...

Apple iPhone 4S: 960x640 pixels
Samsung Galaxy Nexus: 1280x720 pixels

You can argue about pentile vs RGB pixel layouts if you want, but
everyone seems to agree it's a stunning display, I'm not convinced I
need a 4.65" screen on a phone though.

Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

Steve Firth wrote:

every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display.

Try taking your rose tinted apple branded specs off then...

Indeed ...

Apple iPhone 4S: 960x640 pixels
Samsung Galaxy Nexus: 1280x720 pixels

You can argue about pentile vs RGB pixel layouts if you want, but
everyone seems to agree it's a stunning display, I'm not convinced I
need a 4.65" screen on a phone though.

My phone has 15 buttons and no display at all.

On Jan 17, 1:13*pm, Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included..

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

Generally they are fine. As others have said, Android is a bit more
free and open than Apple and the phones usually have SD card slots,
standard micro-USB ports, more customisable interface and more choice
of sizes and power.

Whether any of that is important to you, only you can say.

Samsung and HTC are two of the more popular handset manufacturers.

Matt

On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 08:24:03 +0000, Bob Martin wrote:

in 1097751 20120117 131356 Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)


But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the
iPhone is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of
Android apps are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of
RAM on my ancient 3G


How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form
factor should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

Get an Orange Monte Carlo from Argos (change from £100)
http://tinyurl.com/7y5qwol
then unlock it, repartition and install CyanogenMod 7. I must admit that
for me it's as much a toy as a phone but CM7 is as solid as a rock and
you have a full Linux system which you can program in Python, Ruby, Rexx
etc etc

Ooh, REXX on my phone! Mind, I can already run 'classic UNIX' and VAX/
VMS...


--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 17/01/2012 20:23, wrote:
On Jan 17, 4:51 pm, wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 17, 1:13 pm, Tim wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone 3G;
b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house; c)
Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on Android,
so the closed gate has been opened...

I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)

But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the iPhone
is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of Android apps
are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of RAM on my ancient
3G

How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form factor
should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).

And do you miss iTunes (OK, I can RIP my iTunes purchases - but how is it
for selection of new stuff)...

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
For the cost of an iPhone you can get an iPod touch and a second hand
Galaxy S.
The best of both worlds and man other advantages... ( like being able
to carry spare batteries for a start )

I use my iPod whilst at home most of the time, although Android tries
to do every thing IOS can, it's just not the same.

Um, I had an iPod touch and linked it to my Nokia phone using its wifi
hotspot. Having replaced the combo with an iPhone 3GS I can say that the
iPhone is *much* better than the combo.

Tim

You didn't have a 4G iPod touch then.. it's got the same display and
IOS as the iPhone 4.

Not really:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3903/a...ans-iphone-4/2

install Skype and you can even make calls with it.

It all looks back to front to me. Seems from reviews that it is
possible, though.

it's wafer thin and
the battery lasts for ever too, I love it.

Yep, they're pretty good. GPS and a decent camera and I'd get one.

Rob

On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 08:40:09 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

Steve Firth wrote:

every android phone I have tried has been clunky ****e with a low
resolution display.

Try taking your rose tinted apple branded specs off then...

Indeed ...

Apple iPhone 4S: 960x640 pixels
Samsung Galaxy Nexus: 1280x720 pixels

You can argue about pentile vs RGB pixel layouts if you want, but
everyone seems to agree it's a stunning display, I'm not convinced I
need a 4.65" screen on a phone though.

My phone has 15 buttons and no display at all.

Buttons? It should have a handle to wind.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.

Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 08:24:03 +0000, Bob Martin wrote:

in 1097751 20120117 131356 Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in my
area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an iPhone
3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside my house;
c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with tethering
included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS banking,
Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally appeared on
Android, so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for myself
(can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)


But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the
iPhone is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of
Android apps are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out of
RAM on my ancient 3G


How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form
factor should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).
Get an Orange Monte Carlo from Argos (change from £100)
http://tinyurl.com/7y5qwol
then unlock it, repartition and install CyanogenMod 7. I must admit that
for me it's as much a toy as a phone but CM7 is as solid as a rock and
you have a full Linux system which you can program in Python, Ruby, Rexx
etc etc

Ooh, REXX on my phone! Mind, I can already run 'classic UNIX' and VAX/
VMS...


You know there has to be bloatware somewhere when you can ren on a
mobile phone, apps, better than you could on a DEC minicomputer....of
the 1990s

On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 09:36:07 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 08:24:03 +0000, Bob Martin wrote:

in 1097751 20120117 131356 Tim Watts wrote:
Thankfully, the O2 contract is nearly up (bloody useless coverage in
my area).

I was about to plump for an iPhone 4S from Three as a) I have an
iPhone 3G; b) Three works really well on the Hastings line and inside
my house; c) Three have an excellent Allyoucaneat data package with
tethering included.

But, now I notice that all the must-have apps I depend on (RBS
banking, Ocado to name two) have in the last few months finally
appeared on Android, so the closed gate has been opened...



I like Android, the philosophy - I might even write some apps for
myself (can't do on iPhone, 'cos I don't have a Mac)


But comparing iPhone with SWMBO's Android pad, my perception is the
iPhone is much more in the "just works" camp than Android. Loads of
Android apps are crashy IME. Very rare on iOS except for running out
of RAM on my ancient 3G


How do others find Android - and who makes a decent handset? (Form
factor should be similar to iPhone - I find that a convenient size).
Get an Orange Monte Carlo from Argos (change from £100)
http://tinyurl.com/7y5qwol
then unlock it, repartition and install CyanogenMod 7. I must admit
that for me it's as much a toy as a phone but CM7 is as solid as a
rock and you have a full Linux system which you can program in Python,
Ruby, Rexx etc etc

Ooh, REXX on my phone! Mind, I can already run 'classic UNIX' and VAX/
VMS...


You know there has to be bloatware somewhere when you can ren on a
mobile phone, apps, better than you could on a DEC minicomputer....of
the 1990s

Well, classic UNIX was even earlier - I started using it in mid-1975! And
VMS was around the same time...originally.


--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 18/01/2012 08:53, Rob wrote:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3903/a...ans-iphone-4/2


install Skype and you can even make calls with it.

It all looks back to front to me. Seems from reviews that it is
possible, though.

it's wafer thin and
the battery lasts for ever too, I love it.

Yep, they're pretty good. GPS and a decent camera and I'd get one.


Nah, overpriced.

Compare hardware spec and cost of the iPod Touch against T-mobiles
Vivacity. The former is expensive for a toy entertainment device. The
latter _is_ a toy (ignore the phone bit) and for me does Android toy
things extremely well (well, except for the camera).

I was about to upgrade my first Generation iPod Touch...

However, if it were iOS vs Android for a working phone, i'd do iOS.

--
Adrian C

"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...


Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all
you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to get
the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my only
choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

How does that differ from the all you can eat data + an android handset for
£16 pm (not £30 sim only) that they are advertising in my local three store?

I don't like the iPhone, it has a poor battery and its not changeable. It is
a no no for many that actually want to use the data facilities.
Of course if you just want a fashion item to just make calls its OK.
You need to carry external battery packs if you want to use an iPhone much
and that is inconvenient.

I have a galaxy s2 and its a better phone hardware wise and the software is
just as good.
You can fit bigger batteries or just change them.
It will be even better when the Android 4 software is released for it.
BTW the screen is better than the iPhone too.

"Mark" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 08:40:09 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

8

My phone has 15 buttons and no display at all.

Buttons? It should have a handle to wind.

To wind the wire up when he gets closer to home?

dennis@home wrote:



"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...


Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all
you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to
get the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my
only choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

How does that differ from the all you can eat data + an android handset
for £16 pm (not £30 sim only) that they are advertising in my local three
store?

If it's not in the "One" range, it supposedly cannot tether - which is 70%
of the device's job for me.

I have not bothered looking to see if hacking the phone will get round this,
just going on the blurb at face value.



I don't like the iPhone, it has a poor battery and its not changeable. It
is a no no for many that actually want to use the data facilities.
Of course if you just want a fashion item to just make calls its OK.
You need to carry external battery packs if you want to use an iPhone much
and that is inconvenient.

I have a galaxy s2 and its a better phone hardware wise and the software
is just as good.
You can fit bigger batteries or just change them.
It will be even better when the Android 4 software is released for it.
BTW the screen is better than the iPhone too.
--
Tim Watts

"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
dennis@home wrote:



"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...


Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S
(189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all
you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to
get the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my
only choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

How does that differ from the all you can eat data + an android handset
for £16 pm (not £30 sim only) that they are advertising in my local three
store?

If it's not in the "One" range, it supposedly cannot tether - which is 70%
of the device's job for me.

I have not bothered looking to see if hacking the phone will get round
this,
just going on the blurb at face value.

My O2 s2 "doesn't" tether either, other than by usb, blue tooth, or wifi
that is.

Andy Burns wrote:
[snip]

Indeed ...

Apple iPhone 4S: 960x640 pixels
Samsung Galaxy Nexus: 1280x720 pixels

The Nexus is also a brick, has all the same restrictions as the iPhone (no
removable storage) has some bizarre restrictions that make it slightly
worse than the iPhone such as not supporting mass storage (feasible with
jail broken iPhones or standard iPhones with iPhone explorer). And lastly
it's ****ing expensive. To the point that even Apple users will look at it
and say "How ****ing Much?". I've also seen no comment on using it as a
wifi access gateway, it may be possible but if it is, why aren't Samsung
shouting about it?

Oh add in the extra that you will need for a man bag to carry it.

If it meets your needs then fine, however it doesn't have the hardware
keyboard that John thought was essential.

Tim Watts wrote:
[snip]

Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to get
the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my only
choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

The SIM only offering from Three that allows tethering and 1GB per month is
£15. I haven't managed to get close to that in any month and I now use the
phone for all of my mobile computing comms. When at home it uses wifi so
you use non of the data plan.

Electing for that deal will save you £360 over the life of the contract and
you can stop the contract with no penalty and one month's notice.

The three network connection has been good for me, O2 was terrible -not
enough base stations for 3G, Vodafone was relatively poor - no signal at
home or work. Just never, ever call 3 support because it is dire.

Tim Watts wrote:
Steve Firth wrote:

John Rumm wrote:
On 17/01/2012 22:46, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
[snip]

I have used various friends iPhones although never owned one of my own.
Recently I got a 'droid phone of my own[1]. While there is lots of
stuff the iPhones do quite nicely, I was less keen on being tethered to
nanny in the form of Apple. Also I wanted one with a hard keyboard, so
that ruled the iPhone out.

I must be imagining this hard (moving key) keyboard for my iPhone then.
Oh hang on, no, it's real and it works.

Built in, runs from the main iPhone battery?

Oh now you start changing the spec.

No, it was pretty clear what he meant.

It was pretty clear what he said, it's also pretty clear that you assume
that he meant something he didn't say.

If a keyboard is important then it's possible to use one with an iPhone. If
someone insists then it can be attached to the phone where it slide out or
fold out depending on model. It will also act as an external battery for
the phone.

I would imagine that if anyone were *seriously* considering the iPhone they
would have looked at the feature. TBH I think such things are an
abomination for iPhone or android since keyboard phones are always bricks.

It's clear to me that John was just indulging in the ever-popular sport of
apple-bashing and if he has to warp the facts to fit the theory, what the
heck? Quite who soapy people find it necessary to declare that they have
bought a phone and it's not apple I don't know. The only other appliance I
see this zeal expressed for is the sodding Dyson cleaner.

Steve Firth wrote:

Tim Watts wrote:
[snip]

Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all
you can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not
to get the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my
only choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

The SIM only offering from Three that allows tethering and 1GB per month
is £15. I haven't managed to get close to that in any month and I now use
the phone for all of my mobile computing comms. When at home it uses wifi
so you use non of the data plan.

Electing for that deal will save you £360 over the life of the contract
and you can stop the contract with no penalty and one month's notice.

The three network connection has been good for me, O2 was terrible -not
enough base stations for 3G, Vodafone was relatively poor - no signal at
home or work. Just never, ever call 3 support because it is dire.

Cheers for that - I'll search out for it on their website...

--
Tim Watts

Steve Firth wrote:

The Nexus is also a brick

I did say I thought it was too big, same with the Galaxy SII too, but
somebody must be buying them 'cause the trend for bigger doesn't seem to
be slowing down, unfortunately.

has all the same restrictions as the iPhone (no
removable storage)

At least the battery is replaceable. Though I think we're possibly past
the time where replaceable batteries are much of an issue, my 2 year old
Nexus1 the battery now lasts longer then it did when new - obviously
power management has improved, but the battery itself doesn't seem to
have deteriorated.

Again, I would prefer removable storage, but in practice I haven't yet
filled the microSDHC card mine was supplied with.

has some bizarre restrictions that make it slightly
worse than the iPhone such as not supporting mass storage (feasible with
jail broken iPhones or standard iPhones with iPhone explorer).

The trend is to using MTP/PTP protocols rather than mounting the memory
device to the PC, which precludes the phone talking to it at the same
time. I could share it via CIFS or webDav if I wanted to, doubt Apple
would like people doing that.

And lastly
it's ****ing expensive. To the point that even Apple users will look at it
and say "How ****ing Much?".

SIM free 16GB iPhone4S from eXpansys £620, 16GB Galaxy Nexus from same
supplier £499.

I've also seen no comment on using it as a
wifi access gateway, it may be possible but if it is, why aren't Samsung
shouting about it?

WiFi and USB tethering is standard on Android, there's been no need to
make a song and dance about it for years.

Oh add in the extra that you will need for a man bag to carry it.

:-)

If it meets your needs then fine, however it doesn't have the hardware
keyboard that John thought was essential.

Then you're into a Motorola Droid, or something that is in danger of
looking like a Blackberry.

On 18/01/2012 16:47, Steve Firth wrote:

The SIM only offering from Three that allows tethering and 1GB per month is
£15.

Care to give a pointer to this? Most 3 contracts exclude tethering. You
need a five pound per month addon to get it. The one-plan is different.
It does allow tethering but is twenty-five pounds a month.

Other than that I agree with Steve. 3 data is good. Customer service
abysmal.

Andrew

Tim Watts wrote:

Steve Firth wrote:

Tim Watts wrote:
[snip]

Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S
(189/99 upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's
an all you can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make
sense not to get the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live,
Three is my only choice of operator - everyone else is more or less
black here.

The SIM only offering from Three that allows tethering and 1GB per month
is £15. I haven't managed to get close to that in any month and I now use
the phone for all of my mobile computing comms. When at home it uses wifi
so you use non of the data plan.

Electing for that deal will save you £360 over the life of the contract
and you can stop the contract with no penalty and one month's notice.

The three network connection has been good for me, O2 was terrible -not
enough base stations for 3G, Vodafone was relatively poor - no signal at
home or work. Just never, ever call 3 support because it is dire.

Cheers for that - I'll search out for it on their website...


Hmm - looks like this one might be a goer:

http://store.three.co.uk/SIM_Only/Voice_Pay_Monthly

SIM 300 - 1 month All-you-can-eat data. - £15

Looks possible. I use sod all minutes, nearly no texts and VOIP for most
calls. But I do use over 1GB/month. Not clear about the tethering though -
they said in the shop only the "One" plan permits it. Although, unless thye
have a way to lock Andriod down, I'm not sure how they can stop it - like a
Jailbroken iPhone could tether on a non tether plan...

--
Tim Watts

"dennis@home" wrote:
"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...


Ideally yes. However, with Three doing £35/month for an iPhone 4S (189/99
upfront) for a 2 year contract vs £30/month for just SIM (that's an all you
can eat data plan that allows tethering) it does not make sense not to get
the device as part of the bundle. Due to where I live, Three is my only
choice of operator - everyone else is more or less black here.

How does that differ from the all you can eat data + an android handset
for £16 pm (not £30 sim only) that they are advertising in my local three store?

I don't like the iPhone, it has a poor battery and its not changeable. It
is a no no for many that actually want to use the data facilities.
Of course if you just want a fashion item to just make calls its OK.
You need to carry external battery packs if you want to use an iPhone
much and that is inconvenient.

Utter cobblers. I charged my phone on the drive to work this morning.
Since then I have used to read my mail, book a couple of hotel stays, take
around 20 phone calls and browse Usenet and create posts such as this one.
The display now reads 81% battery life remaining. On the absolute worst
days when I spend a lot of my time mailing, reviewing PDFs and reading
books the phone will reach 20%!charge remaining around midnight when the
phone can be docked until morning. Using abroad when it gets less use
because if roaming charges I get three days life from the battery.

It's not as good as my old Nokia but it is on a par with other smartphones.

I have a galaxy s2 and its a better phone hardware wise

Bull****. It has an inferior display and despite the supposedly faster
processor the Galaxy is slow and laggy in use.

and the software is just as good.

It's bug ridden malware.

Tim Watts wrote:


Hmm - looks like this one might be a goer:

http://store.three.co.uk/SIM_Only/Voice_Pay_Monthly

SIM 300 - 1 month All-you-can-eat data. - £15


Oh - no...

Found the 3 smallprint that says tethering requires One *or* Internet Max
addon.

OK - so SIM 100 1 month = £10
Internet Max 2GB = £5.11

So about £15

Tethering is not available in PAYG packages.

So as Steve says, £340 saving to buy a handset with. Given also an iPhone 4S
is an additional £189 upfront for the 32GB model, if there is a reasonable
Android in the £250 bracket it is a net saving without much extra upfront
cost...



Looks possible. I use sod all minutes, nearly no texts and VOIP for most
calls. But I do use over 1GB/month. Not clear about the tethering though -
they said in the shop only the "One" plan permits it. Although, unless
thye have a way to lock Andriod down, I'm not sure how they can stop it -
like a Jailbroken iPhone could tether on a non tether plan...

--
Tim Watts