On 03/08/2011 15:24, Nightjar wrote:
On 03/08/2011 10:46, tony sayer wrote:
In articleN_WdnWnISeWhk6XTnZ2dnUVZ8oGdnZ2d@giganews. com, Nightjar
scribeth thus
On 02/08/2011 10:07, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 02 Aug 2011 09:15:59 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

A charity is simply an organisation that does not return a profit.

Yep, so it has to spend all the money it recieves or generates or the
Charity Commision comes down on it like a ton of bricks.

The big problem is lack of transparancy and the abilty of the average
punter to quickly and easily find out how much of each £1 donated
goes to "the cause" and is not swallowed up by wages and overheads
(office space, heat& Light, publicity, etc).

Personally I think all charities with incomes over say £100,000/year
should have to produce a simple break down of where that money goes.
...

Something like this?

http://www.rnli.org.uk/what_we_do/money_matters

Colin Bignell


Fine admirable outfit the Lifeboat men and women for that matter. But
this does question that they are in effect providing a public service
and to that end why doesn't the government pay for them?....

The RNLI holds the view that it can do a much better job without the
government having any say in its running.

And they are probably right!

Its hard to think of many organisations where that would not also be the
case! Defence, policing, some of the civil service excepted.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.


Why I have never said *anything* about the poor.


However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The Group
Idiot".


I don't think he will take your title yet.

On 03/08/2011 18:37, John Rumm wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Nightjar wrote:
On 03/08/2011 10:46, tony sayer wrote:
In articleN_WdnWnISeWhk6XTnZ2dnUVZ8oGdnZ2d@giganews. com, Nightjar
scribeth thus
On 02/08/2011 10:07, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 02 Aug 2011 09:15:59 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

A charity is simply an organisation that does not return a profit.

Yep, so it has to spend all the money it recieves or generates or the
Charity Commision comes down on it like a ton of bricks.

The big problem is lack of transparancy and the abilty of the average
punter to quickly and easily find out how much of each £1 donated
goes to "the cause" and is not swallowed up by wages and overheads
(office space, heat& Light, publicity, etc).

Personally I think all charities with incomes over say £100,000/year
should have to produce a simple break down of where that money goes.
...

Something like this?

http://www.rnli.org.uk/what_we_do/money_matters

Colin Bignell


Fine admirable outfit the Lifeboat men and women for that matter. But
this does question that they are in effect providing a public service
and to that end why doesn't the government pay for them?....

The RNLI holds the view that it can do a much better job without the
government having any say in its running.

And they are probably right!

Its hard to think of many organisations where that would not also be the
case! Defence, policing, some of the civil service excepted.

One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people
would welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

Colin Bignell

One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people
would welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

If you mean 2% return on capital then I suspect the same people would
blame the companies when the lights went out because no one was willing
to invest in supply infrastructure for such a poor return. And many
of the same people would also be complaining because their equity
investments/pension pots aren't worth as much as they thought they were
going to be. Or are you really looking to bring back the good old days
of the nationalised industries which returned such big figures to
taxpayers in their profit and loss accounts? (I was involved at the
margins of several privatisations in the 1980s and was boggled that such
much could have been lost for so many by so few industries.)

In any event, is the electricity industry really doing such a bad job
given it had 13 years of Ministers refusing to take any decisions and
yet HEPI continues to show our prices compare pretty well with most of
Europe (albeit thanks in part to lower than average taxes)?
http://www.vaasaett.com/projects/hep...press-release/
--
Robin
PM may be sent to rbw0{at}hotmail{dot}com

"Nightjar" wrote in message
...

One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people would
welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

They probably wouldn't.. or at least the ones with pension funds wouldn't.
The "profits" would just go into general taxation instead of pension fund
growth.

Which greasy pole is that then? The councillors I worked to help get
elected this year will do their 8 or 12 years as councillors and then
most likely not stand again. And one I helped in our previous
constituency, a widow with two daughters, was certainly out of pocket.
She could claim mileage for going to council meetings, and nothing
else. If you're an active councillor, there's a damn sight more
travelling than that to do.

I stand corrected - and surprised. Most councils (I'm not sure about
Parish ) in England are allowed to pay expenses to councillors for -
among other things - any travel in carrying out of any duty approved by
the authority in connection with the discharge of the functions of the
authority or any of its committees or sub-committees. But I assume they
are not obliged to do so and that one doesn't. If so that does seem
harsh.

I thought all councils were also required to have a scheme of allowances
which included a basic allowances payable to all councillors. But I
suppose that too admits "nil allowances". I apologise for not
recognising that there might be councils which still kept things frugal
as opposed to the many who pay substantial amounts - typically c£10,000
as the basic allowance for County Councils and London Boroughs.

--
Robin
PM may be sent to rbw0{at}hotmail{dot}com

On 03/08/2011 22:29, Robin wrote:
One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people
would welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

If you mean 2% return on capital

No, I mean 2% profit - the excess of income over expenditure.

then I suspect the same people would
blame the companies when the lights went out because no one was willing
to invest in supply infrastructure for such a poor return.

No one is properly investing in electricity supply infrastructure anyway.

And many
of the same people would also be complaining because their equity
investments/pension pots aren't worth as much as they thought they were
going to be. Or are you really looking to bring back the good old days
of the nationalised industries which returned such big figures to
taxpayers in their profit and loss accounts? (I was involved at the
margins of several privatisations in the 1980s and was boggled that such
much could have been lost for so many by so few industries.)

That was the way the figures were presented to justify the
privatisation. The electricity supply industry had 20, 30 and 60 year
plans, which often involved spending money now to save it later. It is
not difficult to make that look like excessive spending.

In any event, is the electricity industry really doing such a bad job
given it had 13 years of Ministers refusing to take any decisions and
yet HEPI continues to show our prices compare pretty well with most of
Europe (albeit thanks in part to lower than average taxes)?
http://www.vaasaett.com/projects/hep...press-release/

It will be of little comfort that we don't pay much for electricity if
there is not enough to go around because of poor investment in
generating capacity.

Colin Bignell

"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
harryagain wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


--
Adam
I take it you're one of the idle?

"Huge" wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart noble wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.

"Grimly Curmudgeon" wrote in message
...
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance.
Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

Ah. Another of the idle.

"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The Group
Idiot".


Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the half
witted.

On 04/08/2011 06:27, harryagain wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.


Physically handicapped?
Mentally handicapped?
Those injured through no fault of their own? Damages are not always
recoverable.
Those abandoned by partners?
Victims of poor parenting?

The list is endless

In article ,
harryagain wrote:
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off school
or not do their homework.

Therefore the corollary must be true - anyone who does well at school etc
will automatically have a successful career?

--
*With her marriage she got a new name and a dress.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 04/08/2011 09:25, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 06:27, harryagain wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.


Physically handicapped?
Mentally handicapped?
Those injured through no fault of their own? Damages are not always
recoverable.
Those abandoned by partners?
Victims of poor parenting?

The list is endless

The list is as long as your budget will allow, so the last two are
hardly going to be a priority in the current climate.

"harryagain" wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
harryagain wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.

I take it you're one of the idle?

No, he's extremely hard working and a well regarded tradesman who has built
his own business. I take it that you're a stupid gob****e? No need to
reply, your posts provide all the evidence anyone needs.

On 04/08/2011 10:29, stuart noble wrote:
On 04/08/2011 09:25, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 06:27, harryagain wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the
average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.


Physically handicapped?
Mentally handicapped?
Those injured through no fault of their own? Damages are not always
recoverable.
Those abandoned by partners?
Victims of poor parenting?

The list is endless

The list is as long as your budget will allow, so the last two are
hardly going to be a priority in the current climate.

The eternal problem. How do you ensure that the children of the feckless
get enough to eat to be healthy and enough encouragement not to follow
in their parents footsteps.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:


"Grimly Curmudgeon" wrote in message
.. .
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance.
Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

Ah. Another of the idle.

No, just someone who dislikes arseholes.

"Nightjar" wrote in message
...
On 03/08/2011 22:29, Robin wrote:
One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people
would welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

If you mean 2% return on capital

No, I mean 2% profit - the excess of income over expenditure.

The problem with such a scheme is that there is no incentive to cut costs.

they just hire an extra couple of 100 managers at 100K each to wipe up the
excess profit

tim

On 04/08/2011 13:30, tim.... wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 03/08/2011 22:29, Robin wrote:
One piece of government interference from when I worked in the then
nationalised electricity supply industry that I suspect many people
would welcome today is a 2% cap on profits.

If you mean 2% return on capital

No, I mean 2% profit - the excess of income over expenditure.

The problem with such a scheme is that there is no incentive to cut costs.

they just hire an extra couple of 100 managers at 100K each to wipe up the
excess profit

What we actually did, as a nationalised industry, was to cut tariffs if
the profit looked like going too high. The Treasury took a very close
interest in how we spent the public's money.

Colin Bignell

On 04/08/2011 12:26, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 10:29, stuart noble wrote:
On 04/08/2011 09:25, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 06:27, harryagain wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the
average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.


Physically handicapped?
Mentally handicapped?
Those injured through no fault of their own? Damages are not always
recoverable.
Those abandoned by partners?
Victims of poor parenting?

The list is endless

The list is as long as your budget will allow, so the last two are
hardly going to be a priority in the current climate.

The eternal problem. How do you ensure that the children of the feckless
get enough to eat to be healthy and enough encouragement not to follow
in their parents footsteps.

Feeding them is no problem, but only the parents can provide
encouragement. Not a job the state is remotely equipped for.

On 04/08/2011 14:32, stuart noble wrote:
On 04/08/2011 12:26, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 10:29, stuart noble wrote:
On 04/08/2011 09:25, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 04/08/2011 06:27, harryagain wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 2011-08-03, stuart wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:24, Hugh - Was Invisible wrote:
On 03/08/2011 15:15, ARWadsworth wrote:
wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


Agreed. About as much knowledge of the under-privileged as the
average
MP or lord (with a very few exceptions)

Can there be anything we don't already know about poverty?

Yes. How to "cure" it. Otherwise there wouldn't be arguments about
it.

There is no cure. Remember the proverb about taking horses to water?
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school or
not do their homework.
I expect at the time they thought it was boring or "cool".
Well now they pay the price. I don't give a toss about them.
Poverty in this country is self inflicted.

Consequenses of actions. Too thick to see it.


Physically handicapped?
Mentally handicapped?
Those injured through no fault of their own? Damages are not always
recoverable.
Those abandoned by partners?
Victims of poor parenting?

The list is endless

The list is as long as your budget will allow, so the last two are
hardly going to be a priority in the current climate.

The eternal problem. How do you ensure that the children of the feckless
get enough to eat to be healthy and enough encouragement not to follow
in their parents footsteps.

Feeding them is no problem, but only the parents can provide
encouragement. Not a job the state is remotely equipped for.

Which takes us back to charities?

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
harryagain wrote:
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off school
or not do their homework.

Therefore the corollary must be true - anyone who does well at school etc
will automatically have a successful career?


I think they have a much better chance, don''t you?
Especially these days. And things are just going to get worse in the
employment field.
All thanks to Bliar/Brown &co.

On 04/08/2011 16:03, harryagain wrote:
"Dave Plowman wrote in message
...
In ,
wrote:
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off school
or not do their homework.

Therefore the corollary must be true - anyone who does well at school etc
will automatically have a successful career?


I think they have a much better chance, don''t you?
Especially these days. And things are just going to get worse in the
employment field.
All thanks to Bliar/Brown&co.


On your rowing boat (formerly bike):

The Rail Minister Theresa Villiers added to the growing list of
ministerial media gaffes this week when she suggested that sacked
call-centre workers in Newcastle relocate - to Mumbai.

The way the Conservative are taking this country we will all have to
relocate because there will be no country left.

Just as long as the multinational financial institution I did so well in
continue to pay my generous RPI linked pension.

OK I was in the fortunate position of being able to work hard and retire
in my mid fifties. Plenty of people are at a disadvantage and suffering
largely unnecessary cuts due to political dogma while I get 5 percent a
year pension increases.

These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school
or not do their homework.

Therefore the corollary must be true - anyone who does well at
school etc
will automatically have a successful career?


I think they have a much better chance, don''t you?
Especially these days. And things are just going to get worse in the
employment field.
All thanks to Bliar/Brown&co.

On your rowing boat (formerly bike):

The Rail Minister Theresa Villiers added to the growing list of
ministerial media gaffes this week when she suggested that sacked
call-centre workers in Newcastle relocate - to Mumbai.

I feel we can expect to see her relocated herself before long, perhaps
to Mumbai or Madras. Nice places but a touch hot in summer, we understand.

The way the Conservative are taking this country we will all have to
relocate because there will be no country left.

Just as long as the multinational financial institution I did so well
in continue to pay my generous RPI linked pension.

Would that be a public sector pension?

No, an old non-contributory final salary pension from a multinational
insurance company. Scheme was closed a while back and I had to
contribute for the last few years. Some years ago it changed to money
purchase for new employees and CARE for existing employees. I was just
lucky.

OK I was in the fortunate position of being able to work hard and
retire in my mid fifties. Plenty of people are at a disadvantage and
suffering largely unnecessary cuts due to political dogma while I get
5 percent a year pension increases.

How can the requirement to cut the nation's borrowing be "dogma"? Or do
you think that the deficit doesn't matter or that the shortfall can be
made up in other ways?

I do not believe our predicament was anything like as bad as some would
have us believe. We are one of the few AAA rated economies in the world
and most of our debt is relatively long term unlike some other countries.
Cuts were necessary but not as hard as those being introduced. With no
growth and likely recession if the austerity programme continues as it
is there is going to be less tax to collect and more benefits to pay
out. How does that reduce the debt?

In article ,
Tim Streater wrote:

Seems to me these schemes should have been made illegal years ago. In
fact, it should be illegal for any company that is not a pension company
to offer pension schemes. All pension schemes should be contributory
(with the company putting in if it wants to) and then the payout will
depend on what you do with your pot. Immediate end of all "underfunded
pension schemes" nonsense. No one has yet explained to me why ordinary
companies should be offering pension schemes: hardly their core business
is it?

IIRC, it's a long time since any company was allowed to handle its
employee's pension pot. Too many temptations.

If a company decides to make pension contributions part of your salary
rather than a 'deduction', so what? It's only a book keeping exercise.
Although these days it makes sense to make it *look* like the employee is
paying direct.

My brother - now retired - taught all his working life. Putting up with
the poor pay in the knowledge he'd get a reasonable pension. (Teachers are
much better paid these days in proportion) And rightly gets annoyed when
some say he hasn't paid for his pension.

--
*Vegetarians taste great*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Steve Firth wrote:
"harryagain" wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
harryagain wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.

I take it you're one of the idle?

No, he's extremely hard working and a well regarded tradesman who has
built his own business. I take it that you're a stupid gob****e? No
need to reply, your posts provide all the evidence anyone needs.


Having just got back from a 10 hour profitable day at work I will let harry
decide.

--
Adam

harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".


Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the half
witted.

Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the povery
problem.

--
Adam

On 04/08/2011 17:56, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In ,
Tim wrote:

Seems to me these schemes should have been made illegal years ago. In
fact, it should be illegal for any company that is not a pension company
to offer pension schemes. All pension schemes should be contributory
(with the company putting in if it wants to) and then the payout will
depend on what you do with your pot. Immediate end of all "underfunded
pension schemes" nonsense. No one has yet explained to me why ordinary
companies should be offering pension schemes: hardly their core business
is it?

IIRC, it's a long time since any company was allowed to handle its
employee's pension pot. Too many temptations.

Indeed. I was not best pleased at being forced to pay an insurance
company to act as a trustee for my small self-managed pension scheme and
having to get their approval for every investment I made. As I was the
only one who would benefit from the scheme, it was very much in my best
interests to make it as profitable as possible. Fortunately, some of my
riskiest, and ultimately most profitable, investments were made before
they had a say in what I did with the money.

Colin Bignell

ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the half
witted.

Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the povery
problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

I suppose the shock of having an african housemaid ask me if she could
have the jacket I had thrown out that had completely worn through the
elbows, because she could mend it and sell it in Soweto, really brought
it home to me. Along with shoes made of bits of car tyres, trousers
laced together where the fly zips had gone... no safe drinking water,
days without food beyond boiled cornmeal..

I don't often agree with Harry, but we don't have any poverty here
unless someone is mentally ill.

dennis@home wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.


Why I have never said *anything* about the poor.

Maybe you haven't, but when I read a post that has been made by someone who
has just had a big sip out of the **** goblet your name usually crops up as
the poster. In this case every stupid comment you have ever made has been
overshadowed by harry's comment.


However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".


I don't think he will take your title yet.

I like a challenge but the competition is too great for me to even get into
the top 10:-)

--
Adam

"Hugh - Was Invisible" wrote in message
...
On 04/08/2011 16:03, harryagain wrote:
"Dave Plowman wrote in message
...
In ,
wrote:
These people were failures from the time they decided to bunk off
school
or not do their homework.

Therefore the corollary must be true - anyone who does well at school
etc
will automatically have a successful career?


I think they have a much better chance, don''t you?
Especially these days. And things are just going to get worse in the
employment field.
All thanks to Bliar/Brown&co.


On your rowing boat (formerly bike):

The Rail Minister Theresa Villiers added to the growing list of
ministerial media gaffes this week when she suggested that sacked
call-centre workers in Newcastle relocate - to Mumbai.

Quite apart from this being ridiculous from a personal pov, the minister
really ought to check if this is possible.

Usually, the Indian government will not give work visas to foreigners to be
employed in the sector that is being transferred.

tim

On 04/08/2011 17:56, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In ,
Tim wrote:

Seems to me these schemes should have been made illegal years ago. In
fact, it should be illegal for any company that is not a pension company
to offer pension schemes. All pension schemes should be contributory
(with the company putting in if it wants to) and then the payout will
depend on what you do with your pot. Immediate end of all "underfunded
pension schemes" nonsense. No one has yet explained to me why ordinary
companies should be offering pension schemes: hardly their core business
is it?

IIRC, it's a long time since any company was allowed to handle its
employee's pension pot. Too many temptations.

If a company decides to make pension contributions part of your salary
rather than a 'deduction', so what? It's only a book keeping exercise.
Although these days it makes sense to make it *look* like the employee is
paying direct.

My brother - now retired - taught all his working life. Putting up with
the poor pay in the knowledge he'd get a reasonable pension. (Teachers are
much better paid these days in proportion) And rightly gets annoyed when
some say he hasn't paid for his pension.

My wife is a local government employee approaching an allowed retirement
age and is trying hard to get made redundant before she gets TUPE'd out
again or the scheme changes. She gets about 75 percent what she would in
the private sector.

In message , harryagain
writes

"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
harry wrote:
It's back! (Google I man)

Watching the box this AM. There was a suit whining that local
councils were cutting back on money given to charities & they were
going bust..

Not that I was aware that my council tax money was being given away to
the extent it apparently is/was.

The thought crossed my mind as to how "charites" have been made into a
well paid career. How is it a "charity" when everyone is being paid?
I thought charities were run by volunteers.

I've given up donating to them years ago anyway. They only encourage
dependancy.

I did look into being a volunteer at one point. I discovered that
being a volunteer means doing the donkey work whilst some halfwitted
well paid suit sits in an office and directs things.


Have you ever met anyone in need?

If not, then you have lived a very sheltered or spoilt life.


I have travelled in many third world countries. Africa, Asia and South
America. Often staying in the homes of very poor people.
Now THERE is need. I can spread a little largess whilst there.

Patronising **** - I bet you haggled over every cent

I know
where it's going that way.
There is very little in this country. Need here seems to be "I need a
mobile phone".
That might change in the next few years I suppose

Here's a place I stayed at for a week or so.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pampagrande

Richest town in Bolivia a week before you arrived, I bet



If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every chance.
Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.



You are a total ******, aren't you

--
geoff

In message , harryagain
writes

"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
harryagain wrote:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

What a crock of ****.


--
Adam
I take it you're one of the idle?


No - he's a hard working self employed tradesman who does a professional
job.

I can testify to that


What do you do Harry, in between scraping the moss off your solar panels

Can't be much in the way of jobs for geriatrics in Wales


--
geoff

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had
every chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with
consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the
half witted.

Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the
povery problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

If you look on a map you will discover that Britain is not in Africa.

--
Adam

In message , harryagain
writes

"Grimly Curmudgeon" wrote in message
.. .
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance.
Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.

You arsehole.

Ah. Another of the idle.


In all the time you've been infesting this NG, you seem to have totally
failed to grasp even the basics of what others who post here do

No wonder you are so clueless about things in general

--
geoff

In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the half
witted.
Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the
povery problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

I suppose the shock of having an african housemaid ask me if she could
have the jacket I had thrown out that had completely worn through the
elbows, because she could mend it and sell it in Soweto, really brought
it home to me. Along with shoes made of bits of car tyres, trousers
laced together where the fly zips had gone... no safe drinking water,
days without food beyond boiled cornmeal..

I don't often agree with Harry, but we don't have any poverty here
unless someone is mentally ill.

Its still poverty, just not in the same league

not what you would expect in this supposedly first world country


--
geoff

ARWadsworth wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had
every chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with
consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the
half witted.
Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the
povery problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

If you look on a map you will discover that Britain is not in Africa.

and what exactly is the point of that utterly moronic remark?

geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when
the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had every
chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from dennis.

However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of "The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the half
witted.
Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the
povery problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

I suppose the shock of having an african housemaid ask me if she could
have the jacket I had thrown out that had completely worn through the
elbows, because she could mend it and sell it in Soweto, really
brought it home to me. Along with shoes made of bits of car tyres,
trousers laced together where the fly zips had gone... no safe
drinking water, days without food beyond boiled cornmeal..

I don't often agree with Harry, but we don't have any poverty here
unless someone is mentally ill.

Its still poverty, just not in the same league

not what you would expect in this supposedly first world country



Not you maybe. I am surprised its not ten times worse..

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
harryagain wrote:
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
...
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert,
when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "harryagain"
saying something like:

If you're poor in the UK, it's your own fault. You have had
every chance. Idleness or the failure to link action with
consequence.
You arsehole.
I would have expected such a comment about poor people from
dennis. However it seems that harry is challenging for the title of
"The
Group Idiot".

Well, explain where I am wrong. Just seen abuse so far from the
half witted.
Of course you have only seen abuse. You have your eyes shut to the
povery problem.

I have not seen real poverty in Britain since the 50's

Not like African poverty.

If you look on a map you will discover that Britain is not in Africa.

and what exactly is the point of that utterly moronic remark?

Britain is not a 3rd world country.

--
Adam