So have been doing a bit of plumbing recently to install a new hot water
tank and tidying up a lot of old stuff leftover from what appears to
be many years of job on job on job ... And I've found quite a few pipe
joins that are made without a sleeve - they have expanded one ond of a
pipe just enough to push the next section in, then solder.

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Cheers,

Gordon

"Gordon Henderson" wrote in message
...

8

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Hand...0/sd210/p58051

In article ,
Gordon Henderson writes:
So have been doing a bit of plumbing recently to install a new hot water
tank and tidying up a lot of old stuff leftover from what appears to
be many years of job on job on job ... And I've found quite a few pipe
joins that are made without a sleeve - they have expanded one ond of a
pipe just enough to push the next section in, then solder.

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

It's an expanded pipe joint. They never were that common with
water plumbing, and with time being money nowadays and the common
fittings costing peanuts, verses the time spent expanding the pipe
and the thought you have to put into doing it before installing the
pipe, it's well out of favour now with regular plumbing.
Still used with aircon pipework though.

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Yes, a tube expander.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
Gordon Henderson wrote:
So have been doing a bit of plumbing recently to install a new hot water
tank and tidying up a lot of old stuff leftover from what appears to
be many years of job on job on job ... And I've found quite a few pipe
joins that are made without a sleeve - they have expanded one ond of a
pipe just enough to push the next section in, then solder.

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

It was certainly more common with the softer copper tubing of old.

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Yes. But IIRC pretty expensive.

--
*What boots up must come down *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Gordon Henderson writes:

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Yes, a tube expander.

Guess I didn't google for the obvious then !!!

Thanks (And to denis@home)

£210 for the gadget... Shiny new toy... but I think I'll stick to sleeves!

Thanks,

Gordon

On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:11:34 +0000, Gordon Henderson wrote:

So have been doing a bit of plumbing recently to install a new hot water
tank and tidying up a lot of old stuff leftover from what appears to be
many years of job on job on job ... And I've found quite a few pipe
joins that are made without a sleeve - they have expanded one ond of a
pipe just enough to push the next section in, then solder.

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Cheers,

Gordon

================================================== ============

I've got the hand-tool version. It has two sliding formers (15mm + 22mm)
and works a bit like a slide hammer with a hammer. It's hard work and not
really worth the effort most of the time.

Cic.

--
================================================== =============
Using Ubuntu Linux 9.04
Windows shown the door
================================================== =============

On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:11:34 +0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

A lot of old plumbers did it. I made the tool for 15mm pipe in an
electric drill years ago for curiosity.

It was simply to save on the cost of fittings and took only a few
seconds to do.

It did make really nice elegent joints as well.

In article ,
Cicero wrote:
I've got the hand-tool version. It has two sliding formers (15mm + 22mm)
and works a bit like a slide hammer with a hammer. It's hard work and
not really worth the effort most of the time.

As I said it was easier with the older soft copper pipe. Annealing modern
stuff would probably help. But as you say probably not worth the bother.

--
*Am I ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 15:09:29 +0100, wrote:

On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:11:34 +0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

Is this a technique of olden times as I'm not sure I've seen it before.

A lot of old plumbers did it. I made the tool for 15mm pipe in an
electric drill years ago for curiosity.

It was simply to save on the cost of fittings and took only a few
seconds to do.

It did make really nice elegent joints as well.

and 1 fewer joint per, er, join.
--
Peter.
The head of a pin will hold more angels if
it's been flattened with an angel-grinder.

In message , Gordon Henderson
writes
In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Gordon Henderson writes:

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Yes, a tube expander.

Guess I didn't google for the obvious then !!!

Thanks (And to denis@home)

£210 for the gadget... Shiny new toy... but I think I'll stick to sleeves!

Yes, its not what a professional would use

The proper (cheaper ones) are hammered home to expand the pipe to create
a sleeve. I used one when I last replaced my boiler


--
geoff

On Aug 24, 3:38*pm, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:
In article ,
* *Cicero wrote:

I've got the hand-tool version. It has two sliding formers (15mm + 22mm)
and works a bit like a slide hammer with a hammer. It's hard work and
not really worth the effort most of the time.

As I said it was easier with the older soft copper pipe. Annealing modern
stuff would probably help. But as you say probably not worth the bother.


Now that we all have SDSes, I wonder if the method might be worth
revisiting.


NT

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Gordon Henderson
writes
In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Gordon Henderson writes:

It does seem to make for a neater join with only one soldering
required
as opposed to both sides of a sleeve... Is there a magic tool to
expand
the end of the pipe without it splitting?

Yes, a tube expander.

Guess I didn't google for the obvious then !!!

Thanks (And to denis@home)

£210 for the gadget... Shiny new toy... but I think I'll stick to
sleeves!

Yes, its not what a professional would use

The proper (cheaper ones) are hammered home to expand the pipe to
create
a sleeve. I used one when I last replaced my boiler


--
geoff

When I bought my last house some years back I inherited masses of 1"
pipe in good nick, which encouraged me to turn up on the lathe a
simple 'wack it with a hammer' pipe expander to convert to metric
sizes. Worked a dream. I made it stepped to accomodate 28mm 22mm &
15mm - still have it somewhere - only really applicable on longish
pipes to get the 'back inertia' when you thwack it!. Anneal the pipe
well and you get a good neat joint.

AWEM

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...

When I bought my last house some years back I inherited masses of 1"
pipe

Was the inheritance a coincidence?

Bill

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in
message
...

When I bought my last house some years back I inherited masses of
1"
pipe

Was the inheritance a coincidence?

Bill


Previous owner of the house was the heating contractor who fitted out
Heathrow term 3 when it was built, and had used 1" copper in nice long
lengths all over the house that bore a remarkable similarity to that
at the airport!. When I re-boilered and relaid out the heating system
(in perhaps 1984) the heavy guage Imperial copper was far to good to
chuck - anyway the budget was VERY tight, just like me G

AWEM