Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if
there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or
should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

Thanks
Dan

On 27 Apr, 10:07, Dan wrote:
Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. *I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if
there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or
should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

Thanks
Dan

If you can do it without bu**ering it up why not move the master
socket to the location of the the BT52A and fit a secondary where the
master is now.

In article ,
Dan writes:
Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if

This is the type of thing used indoors nowadays...
http://cpc.farnell.com/_/77ar/juncti...idc/dp/TE05896
These will be punchdown connections.

There's also a version with two screw terminals for the A and B
incoming wires and punchdowns for the internal wiring, which I
have bought from CPC in the past but I can't find on their website
anymore.

There are screw terminal versions too if you aren't happy doing
punchdown wiring. Somewhere like Maplin will have a few different
types on the shelf.

there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or

No, unless you still have old style phones with bells and pulse
dialling. I've come across installations where BT have done this.

should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

That's up to you. Check in uk.telecom, but I think their call-out
is now well over £100. How confident are you that you can do the
wiring without messing up? There's plenty of help available here
and in uk.telecom of course.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 02:07:29 -0700 (PDT), Dan wrote:

The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it.

Precisely it's BT side it's their problem and cost to repair/replace.

I can't find replacement connection blocks ...

There are modern equivalents, the sheds have 'em but they will probably be
IDC rather than screw. But this is BT side it's not your problem ring them
up and report it they should fix it for free.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 27 Apr, 10:38, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
In article ,
* * * * Dan writes:

Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. *I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if

This is the type of thing used indoors nowadays...http://cpc.farnell.com/_/77ar/juncti...idc/dp/TE05896
These will be punchdown connections.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

I'm confident I can sort the wiring myself, but I'd need a screw
terminal box as the incoming pair of wires are fairly thick compared
to the wires that then go off to the Master.

Thanks for all the advice,
Dan

In article ,
GD writes:
On 27 Apr, 10:38, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
In article ,
* * * * Dan writes:

Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. *I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if

This is the type of thing used indoors nowadays...http://cpc.farnell.com/_/77ar/juncti...idc/dp/TE05896
These will be punchdown connections.

I'm confident I can sort the wiring myself, but I'd need a screw
terminal box as the incoming pair of wires are fairly thick compared
to the wires that then go off to the Master.

That would be a BT80A, see pictures on
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/btsockets.htm

You could use an entirely screw terminal one, of course,
although BT wouldn't do that nowadays.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article et, Dave
Liquorice writes
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 02:07:29 -0700 (PDT), Dan wrote:

The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it.

Precisely it's BT side it's their problem and cost to repair/replace.

I can't find replacement connection blocks ...

There are modern equivalents, the sheds have 'em but they will probably be
IDC rather than screw. But this is BT side it's not your problem ring them
up and report it they should fix it for free.

BT are not required to carry out free repairs when their equipment is
damaged by the occupier (as it sounds like here, albeit possibly a
previous one). This would be a chargeable repair.

To the o/p, this should be a simple DIY repair, just needing you to find
a suitable screw terminal junction box. Plenty showing on a search for
telephone junction box screw terminal, some at TLC & Maplin.
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

On 27 Apr 2009 09:38:40 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

That's up to you. Check in uk.telecom, but I think their call-out
is now well over £100.

But this is BT side not customer side. You don't get charged for them to
repair a faults on their plant. This box is their plant. They may say
there is no "fault" and that as "you have damaged the box" you should pay
but this to my mind (as currently described by the OP) is wrong.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.net...
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 02:07:29 -0700 (PDT), Dan wrote:

The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it.

Precisely it's BT side it's their problem and cost to repair/replace.

I can't find replacement connection blocks ...

There are modern equivalents, the sheds have 'em but they will probably be
IDC rather than screw. But this is BT side it's not your problem ring them
up and report it they should fix it for free.

--
Cheers
Dave.


Some thoughts from our experience two years ago on moving house, and opening
a new BT account - we had a cable phone account at the last house.

Arrive at house - slightly noisy line - on inspection find overhead line to
corroded j/box on cable, to elderly Post Office Telephones j/box on entry to
the house, connected to a veritable rats nest of internal extensions.

Phone BT to request that the line be brought up to a reasonable noise free
state, and that a new master socket be fitted - me to deal with internal
wiring. BT operative would not agree a no-fee visit, even if the work was on
BTs side. Agreed in the end that "the engineer would inspect and tell me if
the job was chargeable"

Engineer arrives, agrees problems, runs new cable from gable to new master
socket on entry. Without being asked connects one internal extension to the
master socket - see later for implications. No mention of costs. Leaves.
Time on site less than 90 mins. I assume that is a job done.

One week later a bill for £274 arrives. Spend a good part of the day arguing
with BT callcentre bods. Final conclusion - bill reduced to £5.60 - cost of
the new master socket.

Lessons a

Be clear that the work needed is entirely on the BT side of the master
socket.

It helps if you can hear analogue noise on the line - this could well be
"intermittent" ie you hear it, but it is "gone" when the engineer is there.

DO NOT let the engineer connect ANY of your own wiring after the master
socket - this makes the job at least partly chargeable.

If you get a silly bill afterward ARGUE. I found other people had the same
experience, and I wonder if there is an unofficial charging policy, with
refunds if the subscriber argues. Convenient way of getting the subscriber
to pay for BTs infrastructure upgrades.....

We moved away from BT in our last house when an alternative became
available, some 20 years ago, because of BTs unhelpful behaviour at the
time. I assumed, when on moving we had no choice but to rejoin them, that
they would have got better in the interval. But, same old, same old!


Best of luck,

Charles F

Dan wrote:
Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if
there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or
should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

Thanks
Dan

As others have said, moving the master socket and installing a slave where
the existing master is will be the better solution if it is practical, and
you have at least three wires between the two locations. (I you have
broadband, then it's best to have the master socket where your router is, ad
then fit a filtered faceplate, like they have here
http://www.solwise.co.uk/adsl_splitters.htm

Otherwise, a simple junction box with screw terminals on at least one side.

Whenever I need any official BT stuff, I just ask a BT engineer next time I
see one in a van, they have always just given me a master socket or junction
box without even suggesting I should be touching it myself :-)

It helps having a main distribution cabinet outside my house, as they seem
to be at it quite often!

Toby...

In article et,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On 27 Apr 2009 09:38:40 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
That's up to you. Check in uk.telecom, but I think their call-out
is now well over £100.
But this is BT side not customer side. You don't get charged for them to
repair a faults on their plant. This box is their plant. They may say
there is no "fault" and that as "you have damaged the box" you should pay
but this to my mind (as currently described by the OP) is wrong.

You are now charged for repairing damage on your premises, even
if you didn't do it. This is down to OpenReach being a separate
business, and their staff are instructed to recover all costs.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 27 Apr 2009 11:24:39 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

You are now charged for repairing damage on your premises, even
if you didn't do it. This is down to OpenReach being a separate
business, and their staff are instructed to recover all costs.

Bar stewards, how long has that been in?

I think one of the screws may work loose 'cause the box is floating about
on the cabling instead of being fixed. This will cause a crackles and
noise... I guess a bolshy engineer could still say the problem stems form
the damage but plyed with beverage of choice and chocolate biscuits may
well not play that card.

Still it is a simple DIY job with easyly obtainable parts. It may also pay
the OP to revise any ADSL/filters/extensions on the installation as well.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Dan" wrote in message
...
Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if
there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or
should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

My anecdote relating how you might not get what you want:

A 1980's estate development house in the Birmingham area with BT - 2 line
capacity cable arriving via underground ducting to a 'cavity' in the lounge
wall covered by a plastic plate type 67AM. There was probably originally a
tagstrip in the cavity but later replaced by individual compression
connector buttons. The previous owner had utilised both lines, each
terminated in master sockets type LJU2/1A located in different rooms in the
house. This was not very satisfactory as it was intended to completely
redecorate the house and remove the old unnecessary wiring.

There was also considerable noise on the line due to corrosion in
compression connectors in the wall cavity eventually it became unusable,
meaning a BT call out as it was on their side of the master socket.

I wanted to ensure that when the BT engineer came he terminated the line in
a new NTE5 type box where the cable came into the house so that BT's
responsibility ended there and the obsolete wiring to the
master socket in the bedroom could be replaced. But this did not happen.

The BT engineer flatly refused to fit a type NTE5 line box at the cable
entry point or anywhere, and we are still stuck with the old master socket
in the bedroom. All that was done was to replace a couple of the connector
buttons in the hole in the wall.

I had been under the impression that it in the light of the demarcation of
responsibilities, fitting of a line box type NTE5 or similar was current
requirement, but it turns out BT have no obligation to fit a such a line box
if they can't be bothered.

When the bill came, BT attempted to charge over one hundred pounds for the
visit even though the fault was all on their side.

The moral of this tale is that its best to get on with it and do it
yourself. Calling out BT in the Birmingham area was the worst thing we
could have done.

Roger R

On Apr 28, 2:07*pm, "Roger R" wrote:
"Dan" wrote in message

...

Hi,
The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection
block (http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg) and then on to
the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs.
The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing,
wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT
side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess
with it. *I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if
there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or
should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the
associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).

My anecdote relating how you might not get what you want:

A 1980's estate development house in the Birmingham area with BT - 2 line
capacity cable arriving via underground ducting to a 'cavity' in the lounge
wall covered by a plastic plate type 67AM. *There was probably originally a
tagstrip in the cavity but later replaced by individual compression
connector buttons. *The previous owner had utilised both lines, each
terminated in master sockets type LJU2/1A located in different rooms in the
house. *This was not very satisfactory as it was intended to completely
redecorate the house and remove the old unnecessary wiring.

There was also considerable noise on the line due to corrosion in
compression connectors in the wall cavity eventually it became unusable,
meaning a BT call out as it was on their side of the master socket.

I wanted to ensure that when the BT engineer came he terminated the line in
a new NTE5 type box where the cable came into the house so that BT's
responsibility ended there and the obsolete wiring to the
master socket in the bedroom could be replaced. *But this did not happen.

In article et,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On 27 Apr 2009 11:24:39 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

You are now charged for repairing damage on your premises, even
if you didn't do it. This is down to OpenReach being a separate
business, and their staff are instructed to recover all costs.

Bar stewards, how long has that been in?

Since not long after OpenReach was formed, but the actual
implementation/enforcement was more gradual as they
changed mentality to being a separate business from BT.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article , Huge
scribeth thus
On 2009-04-28, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article et,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On 27 Apr 2009 11:24:39 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

You are now charged for repairing damage on your premises, even
if you didn't do it. This is down to OpenReach being a separate
business, and their staff are instructed to recover all costs.

Bar stewards, how long has that been in?

Since not long after OpenReach was formed, but the actual
implementation/enforcement was more gradual as they
changed mentality to being a separate business from BT.

My 91 y/o MIL had a "Continuous Engaged" fault caused by a faulty
(BT branded) walkabout 'phone. An engineer was summoned, unplugged the
walkabout base unit, whereupon the fault disappeared. The subsequent
bill was £160. Polite requests to BT to waive the bill on the grounds that
my MIL is 91 and cannot be expected to grovel on the floor unplugging
telephones were equally politely ignored. I wrote to my MILs MP and the
bill was subsequently retracted. (Or rather, since she had already paid
it, credited to her account, which given her level of phone use, the
credit will outlive her.)


What an absolute bunch of arseholes they truly are..

I HATE dealing with them((((((((((.

And before anyone suggests it, attempts to give her an "easy use" cellular
phone to use in emergencies have failed miserably. Twice.


--
Tony Sayer

On 30 Apr 2009 10:26:34 GMT, Huge wrote:

My 91 y/o MIL had a "Continuous Engaged" fault caused by a faulty
(BT branded) walkabout 'phone. An engineer was summoned, unplugged the
walkabout base unit, whereupon the fault disappeared. The subsequent
bill was £160.

Instruments are still listed in the BT Price List so MIL could rent one
from BT which should put the ball back in their court. Their kit is
faulty, their problem to correct/replace at their cost. Not a particularly
cheap option mind at £5 to £10/month. Visit by nice SIL would be cheaper
and nicer for MIL. B-)

At 91 is she still capable of looking after herself and home 100%? No
weekly home help for cleaning or a carer to assist with a bathing or
morning/night to get to and from bed? Pretty damn impressive if so, or
just pig stubborn in not accepting assistance.

--
Cheers
Dave.

In article et, Dave
Liquorice scribeth thus
On 30 Apr 2009 10:26:34 GMT, Huge wrote:

My 91 y/o MIL had a "Continuous Engaged" fault caused by a faulty
(BT branded) walkabout 'phone. An engineer was summoned, unplugged the
walkabout base unit, whereupon the fault disappeared. The subsequent
bill was £160.

Instruments are still listed in the BT Price List so MIL could rent one
from BT which should put the ball back in their court. Their kit is
faulty, their problem to correct/replace at their cost. Not a particularly
cheap option mind at £5 to £10/month. Visit by nice SIL would be cheaper
and nicer for MIL. B-)

At 91 is she still capable of looking after herself and home 100%? No
weekly home help for cleaning or a carer to assist with a bathing or
morning/night to get to and from bed? Pretty damn impressive if so, or
just pig stubborn in not accepting assistance.


Awwww.. bless her, tell her shes a fine old lady to do all that at that
age;!.....

Those arseholes at BT ought to have phone poles shoved up their nether
regions...

--
Cheers
Dave.




--
Tony Sayer