Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

"Stephen" wrote in message
...
Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

Someone should have let you know "Pipe benders" don't come with instructions
:-)

Put the pipe in a workmate and apply slight pressure on the pipe,repeat a
few turns at a time for straightness.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 GMT, Stephen
wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

Why can you not use soldered fittings and why do you have to use
m/bore?

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 +0000, Stephen wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

==========================================
You use an external spring with microbore instead of the internal type
used for 15mm etc. - try Screwfix.

To straighten the tube push the spring onto the coil of tube and
straighten the section in the spring before moving on to another section.

Use the same spring to create your bends. There's a limit to the radius of
any bend so don't be too ambitious.

Cic.

--
==========================================
Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
==========================================

"Cicero" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 +0000, Stephen wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

==========================================
You use an external spring with microbore instead of the internal type
used for 15mm etc. - try Screwfix.

To straighten the tube push the spring onto the coil of tube and
straighten the section in the spring before moving on to another section.

Use the same spring to create your bends. There's a limit to the radius of
any bend so don't be too ambitious.

Cic.

--
==========================================
Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
==========================================


Tell me, how would he get the spring off the pipe after making a 80 or 90
deg bend?

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:13:57 GMT, Cicero
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 +0000, Stephen wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

==========================================
You use an external spring with microbore instead of the internal type
used for 15mm etc. - try Screwfix.

To straighten the tube push the spring onto the coil of tube and
straighten the section in the spring before moving on to another section.

Use the same spring to create your bends. There's a limit to the radius of
any bend so don't be too ambitious.

Cic.

You can get pipe benders ( not springs) for microbore .BSC ( is that
correct name?) sell them

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:25:04 +0000, George wrote:


"Cicero" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 +0000, Stephen wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

==========================================
You use an external spring with microbore instead of the internal type
used for 15mm etc. - try Screwfix.

To straighten the tube push the spring onto the coil of tube and
straighten the section in the spring before moving on to another section.

Use the same spring to create your bends. There's a limit to the radius of
any bend so don't be too ambitious.

Cic.


==========================================


Tell me, how would he get the spring off the pipe after making a 80 or 90
deg bend?

-------------------------------------
Perfectly simple. The spring works a bit like one of those springs that
walk downstairs (slinky?). The coils of the 8 or 10mm springs open up
slightly with the bend and the spring is removed with a twisting action.
Simple if you know how - as some of us do.

Cic.

--
==========================================
Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
==========================================

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:45:44 +0000, NOSPAMnet wrote:

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:13:57 GMT, Cicero
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 +0000, Stephen wrote:

Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

Because it's for oil, I cannot use solder fittings.

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

Thanks,
Stephen.

==========================================
You use an external spring with microbore instead of the internal type
used for 15mm etc. - try Screwfix.

To straighten the tube push the spring onto the coil of tube and
straighten the section in the spring before moving on to another section.

Use the same spring to create your bends. There's a limit to the radius of
any bend so don't be too ambitious.

Cic.

You can get pipe benders ( not springs) for microbore .BSC ( is that
correct name?) sell them

------------------------------------------
I know - I've got one. The trouble is (as the OP stated) that it's a bit
difficult to gauge the exact position of your bends. Everybody chooses
what suits them best.

I also have a home-made bender for making fixed brake pipes which works
very well but there's still a need for some free-hand bending.

Cic.

--
==========================================
Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
==========================================

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Stephen
saying something like:


I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

Practice. You don't need a pipe bender for 10mm, just a dollop of common
sense.

I have tried using compression fittings but when using elbows, if I
tighten too much, the pipe bends.

Don't be so ham-fisted. The most common cause of failure on 10mm
fittings is over-tightening. Use some gloop for fuel line joints.

Also, how are you supposed to straighten the coil of pipe into
straight lengths to begin with?

Unroll the coil in its natural way - don't pull it off the coil in a
spring fashion, stand the coil up and unroll it as you walk along with
it between your knees.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:04:27 +0000, wrote:

Why can you not use soldered fittings and why do you have to use
m/bore?

I was told it's for fire safety. If there was a fire hot enough to
melt the solder, oil would gush everywhere making the fire worse. IIRC
the plastic oil pipe can only be used underground; perhaps for the
same reasons?

Stephen.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 19:10:42 +0000, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

Practice. You don't need a pipe bender for 10mm, just a dollop of common
sense.

Thanks for the replies.

I thought I had read a post here some time ago against bending without
using a bender? The post was talking about CH rather than oil, but I
think the point was that sludge would deposit around irregularities in
a hand bend. Perhaps for oil, this does not matter?

Don't be so ham-fisted. The most common cause of failure on 10mm
fittings is over-tightening. Use some gloop for fuel line joints.

It's a difficult balance: too tight and copper twists everywhere; too
loose and puddles of smelly oil!

Unroll the coil in its natural way - don't pull it off the coil in a
spring fashion, stand the coil up and unroll it as you walk along with
it between your knees.

That's more or less what I was doing; it's reassuring to know I was at
least doing something right!

Thanks.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:45:44 +0000, wrote:

BSC ( is that
correct name?) sell them

I haven't heard of them; do you mean BES? I've already got a
mini-bender from Screwfix; I just don't know how to use it properly
;-)

I would like to try a spring- I imagine they are easier than using
springs with 15 and 22mm pipe- but I just placed an order with BES
this afternoon and can't justify placing another order just for a
spring and a £5.95 carriage charge.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 20:54:12 GMT, Stephen
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:45:44 +0000, wrote:

BSC ( is that
correct name?) sell them

I haven't heard of them; do you mean BES? I've already got a
mini-bender from Screwfix; I just don't know how to use it properly
;-)


Yes BES

I would like to try a spring- I imagine they are easier than using
springs with 15 and 22mm pipe- but I just placed an order with BES
this afternoon and can't justify placing another order just for a
spring and a £5.95 carriage charge.

Any Plumbers Merchants near you or Plumb Centre ( Center)

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 20:46:27 GMT, Stephen
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:04:27 +0000, wrote:

Why can you not use soldered fittings and why do you have to use
m/bore?

I was told it's for fire safety. If there was a fire hot enough to
melt the solder, oil would gush everywhere making the fire worse.

Gas is used with soldered joints but s'pose it doesn't spread like oil
does
IIRC
the plastic oil pipe can only be used underground; perhaps for the
same reasons?

Stephen.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:00:53 GMT, Stephen wrote:

I bought a pipe bender but it doesn't come with any instructions and
I'm finding it hard to get the bends in the right places.

There is an excellent pipe bending FAQ out there somewhere, here we are
first hit from google UK on "pipe bending":

http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/plumbing/Pi...%20(BillP).pdf

OK it doesn't cover 10mm, but the principles will be the same and the
"magic" number is almost certainly related to the diameter/radius of the
former.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 21:40:37 +0000, wrote:

Gas is used with soldered joints but s'pose it doesn't spread like oil
does

Aye, cut a gas pipe post meter and you'll just get a big yellow flame and
all the gas being burnt. Cut an oil pipe and you'll flood the floor with
burning oil, it'll be coming out of the pipe *much* faster than it will
burn.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Stephen" wrote in message
...
Hello,

I'm having to use 10mm copper for the oil to my boiler. I haven't used
microbore before and I can't say I want to use it again, ever!

i have built a couple of motorhomes, and when plumbing the gas system use
what i thought was microbore copper pipe, 10mm for the main feed from the
tanks regulator, 8mm for the runs from the manifold to the apliances.

always bought the stuff from the caravan shop (before they got all arsey and
stopped selling it to members of the plublic, (i just go to the workshop now
and buy it off the fitters for the price of a pint)

likewise they had rolls of the flexi pipe for connecting bottles to the
pipework in a van, but will only sell them in 1 meter lengths, i wanted 3
meters for a bbq so i could plug it into the bbq gas outlet on the van, and
have the thing well away from the van and awning, no can do, 1 meter lengths
only,
so as a joke i asked for 3 x 1 meter lengths, a couple of hose tail fittings
so i could cut the compression bit off and use the straight brass pipe as a
joiner, and 6 jubilee clips,
they happily pulled the pipe off the roll, cut into 3 lengths, and sold me
the bits to re-join it making the 3 meter length i wanted, but with 6
potential leak points instead of 2.

Anyway, one day i was modifying the gas system, adding an oven i believe,
caravan shop was shut, but plumb centre was open, so i went there and asked
if they did the 8mm pipe used in caravan gas supplies,
they sold me a 10 meter roll of 8mm microbore copper pipe, for what i
thought was the bargian price of a fiver (was paying about 2 quid a meter
from caravan shop)

then i tried to use the stuff, bloody kink city, turns out the caravan gas
pipe is thick walled, the microbore is very thin walled, with the gas pipe i
have always bent it by hand, try that with microbore and it ends up in
tears,

i even bought a mini pipe bender but couldent get satisfactory bends in the
microbore, now i'll never touch the stuff again too, evil stuff,

the copper gas pipe you get from caravan shops nowadays has a plastic
coating over it for corrosion resistance, as the gas pipes are run under the
floors nowadays, this help make it even more hand bendable, if you can kink
that stuff you should stick to crushing rocks with your bare hands for a
living

anyhoo, if you get too ****ed off with the microbore crap, try and get some
caravan type gas pipe, you may have to get the 12mm stuff to get the
internal bore you need for the flow, but you will get your pipe run done in
minutes, bent to the shape you want, with the fittings put on the ends
without crushing the pipe,

Stephen wrote:

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/plumbing/Pi...%20(BillP).pdf


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 20:54:12 GMT someone who may be Stephen
wrote this:-

I would like to try a spring- I imagine they are easier than using
springs with 15 and 22mm pipe- but I just placed an order with BES
this afternoon and can't justify placing another order just for a
spring and a £5.95 carriage charge.

Large orange tin sheds should have them.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 03:51:08 +0000, John Rumm
wrote:

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?

http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/plumbing/Pi...%20(BillP).pdf

Thanks, I had already found that but wasn't clever enough to work out
how to use it with 10mm pipe!

On the pipe bender angles are marked from 0 to 180 degrees. Surely
it's not possible to bend a pipe through 180 degrees and if it were,
why would you want to?

On the arm there is "0 R L". I am guessing L=left and R=right but what
are they all about?

Thanks.

On Nov 5, 7:00*pm, Cicero wrote:


The trouble is (as the OP stated) that it's a bit
difficult to gauge the exact position of your bends. Everybody chooses
what suits them best.

What I do is make a template. Take a bit of tube put it in the bender
and scratch a mark on it at the palce where, for example, the grip
holds the pipe. Then bend it. You can then use this template to
work out where to start your bends and get them in exactoy the right
place.

IMHO a proper pipe bender is miles easier than using springs.

Robert

On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 02:07:06 -0800, RobertL wrote:

On Nov 5, 7:00*pm, Cicero wrote:


The trouble is (as the OP stated) that it's a bit
difficult to gauge the exact position of your bends. Everybody chooses
what suits them best.

What I do is make a template. Take a bit of tube put it in the bender
and scratch a mark on it at the palce where, for example, the grip
holds the pipe. Then bend it. You can then use this template to
work out where to start your bends and get them in exactoy the right
place.

IMHO a proper pipe bender is miles easier than using springs.

Robert
=========================================
As I said, people have their personal preference and it makes sense to use
the bender if that's what suits you. On the other hand a spring is more
versatile since you can make bends and shapes (within limits) of any size
whereas the bender produces bends of a fixed radius only.

Cic.

--
==========================================
Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
==========================================

Stephen wrote:
On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 03:51:08 +0000, John Rumm
wrote:

Can anyone point me towards a microbore or pipe bender how-to?
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/plumbing/Pi...%20(BillP).pdf

Thanks, I had already found that but wasn't clever enough to work out
how to use it with 10mm pipe!

I presume you could do a test bend or two and measure carefully to
establish figures for 10mm. All you need to know is the horizontal
distance used getting the bend in place. This is going to equal the
radius of the pipe former on the bending machine.

On the pipe bender angles are marked from 0 to 180 degrees. Surely
it's not possible to bend a pipe through 180 degrees and if it were,
why would you want to?

If you can bed it 90, then you can by extension, bend it 180. Why you
would want to however is another matter - but I guess there may be times
where you need to double back on yourself to get round an obstruction.

On the arm there is "0 R L". I am guessing L=left and R=right but what
are they all about?

Perhaps to allow you to select centre, right, and left sides of the pipe
to align on your chosen bend position?


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 08:34:00 +0000, David Hansen
wrote:

Large orange tin sheds should have them.

Only small orange sheds around here but there is a big one in the next
town. Are all springs created equal or are some makes better than
others?

Thanks.

On Fri, 07 Nov 2008 09:58:33 GMT someone who may be Stephen
wrote this:-

Only small orange sheds around here but there is a big one in the next
town.

You might even find one in a small orange shed, they are easy to
miss but should be with the other springs. As they are external
springs they have a big end, rather than the small ends of internal
springs.

Are all springs created equal or are some makes better than
others?

Pass.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54