Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway !

;-)


If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Thank god for nookoleer powah!

Just find something radioscary to irradiate yer gonads for a few
minutes. Once done, you will be able to go through the rest of ye life
without ever paying a heating bill again. The "ready break" method:-)

--
Adrian C

Adrian C wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Thank god for nookoleer powah!

Just find something radioscary to irradiate yer gonads for a few
minutes. Once done, you will be able to go through the rest of ye life
without ever paying a heating bill again. The "ready break" method:-)

But it wont be a very LONG life will it?

I had sorta hoped to see in 2020

On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 23:09:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I had sorta hoped to see in 2020

I hope to see in 2050! If I live to the same age as my Dad make that
2053...

As for electric boilers yes:

http://www.heatandplumb.com/acatalog...c_Boilers.html

First decent hit from google. Seem to max out at 12kW.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 23:09:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I had sorta hoped to see in 2020

I hope to see in 2050! If I live to the same age as my Dad make that
2053...

As for electric boilers yes:

http://www.heatandplumb.com/acatalog...c_Boilers.html

First decent hit from google. Seem to max out at 12kW.

That's probably on account of the electricity supply restrictions.
One of the models went to 14.4KW which equates to around 60A, which is
actually the fuse limit on many domestic supplies.

Mmm. It really not that hard is it?

In message , at 08:41:27 on
Sat, 26 Apr 2008, The Natural Philosopher remarked:
As for electric boilers yes:
http://www.heatandplumb.com/acatalog...c_Boilers.html
First decent hit from google. Seem to max out at 12kW.

That's probably on account of the electricity supply restrictions.
One of the models went to 14.4KW which equates to around 60A, which is
actually the fuse limit on many domestic supplies.

And, of course, places like Cambridge are maxed out on the wholesale
supply of electricity. So you can't just build some nooclear power
stations, sell everyone electrical heating, without a lot of other
infrastructure upgrades as well.
--
Roland Perry

On Sat, 26 Apr 2008 08:41:27 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

That's probably on account of the electricity supply restrictions.

Very likely and the availabilty of suitably rated protection/switching kit
without going fully industrial. Though several have "soft start" so your
lights don't suddenly go dim they fade down... B-) I wonder what the time
constant of the "soft start" is?

Mmm. It really not that hard is it?

No, and we already have E7 but on Equipower, it would have to change to
another supplier/tarrif if we actually started to use it. Interesting
concept to plug into the drawing board overall heatbank/store system. I'd
thought about solar, a wood burner, oil and wind electic but not mains
electic but with off peak mains cheaper than oil it makes sense.

Needs an intelligent controller to use the cheapest(*) energy source(s)
before the expensive ones like oil. Would be nice to have it able to
pre-emtively signal that it was about to use something "expensive" and
would you like to light the wood burner...

(*) As in cost per kWhr excluding capital. So the solar and wind electric
are "free", oil and electric are easy to put a figure on the p/kwhr not so
sure about wood. Any one any rough ideas on p/kwhr for wood based on say
£40/tonne?

--
Cheers
Dave.

In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Adrian C wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Thank god for nookoleer powah!

Just find something radioscary to irradiate yer gonads for a few
minutes. Once done, you will be able to go through the rest of ye life
without ever paying a heating bill again. The "ready break" method:-)

But it wont be a very LONG life will it?

I had sorta hoped to see in 2020

Go for the radiation YKIMS


--
geoff

The message
from The Natural Philosopher contains these words:

Adrian C wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Thank god for nookoleer powah!

Just find something radioscary to irradiate yer gonads for a few
minutes. Once done, you will be able to go through the rest of ye life
without ever paying a heating bill again. The "ready break" method:-)

But it wont be a very LONG life will it?

I had sorta hoped to see in 2020

Under these circumsfances you just might -- albeit as an almost woman :-)

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway !

;-)


If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!



Hi, I fitted one of these for a client about four or five years ago -
has worked flawlessly and he is very impressed with it:-

http://www.amptec.co.uk/at/index.htm

--
Regards,

Will.

Will wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)


If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!



Hi, I fitted one of these for a client about four or five years ago -
has worked flawlessly and he is very impressed with it:-

http://www.amptec.co.uk/at/index.htm

Hmm. How much power can you get?

I am semi seriously considering this to do the 'wee small hours' winter
UFH heating.

And how much do they cost, and what amperage do they need to run..and
how do you switch them on and off..bloody great 50A Triac?


Although my total heating requirements are allegedly 10Kw, I dont think
the actual UFH could absorb much more than 5Kw without overheating the
screed.

I could run the boiler and the immersion of a switched circuit maybe..

On Sat, 26 Apr 2008 00:12:29 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Will wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)


If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

Hi, I fitted one of these for a client about four or five years ago -
has worked flawlessly and he is very impressed with it:-
http://www.amptec.co.uk/at/index.htm

Hmm. How much power can you get?


Rather a lot, the biggest I've fitted was 40A.
http://www.1st-direct.com/acatalog/E...c_Heaters.html

You can get significantly larger 3ph ones.


I am semi seriously considering this to do the 'wee small hours' winter
UFH heating.

And how much do they cost, and what amperage do they need to run..and
how do you switch them on and off..bloody great 50A Triac?


Traditionally you just use a contactor, many economy seven systems had
them, I've just thrown half a dozen away. You can get MCB style 40A
contactors that fit inside your/a consumer unit.


Although my total heating requirements are allegedly 10Kw, I dont think
the actual UFH could absorb much more than 5Kw without overheating the
screed.

I could run the boiler and the immersion of a switched circuit maybe..

Hi, I fitted one of these for a client about four or five years ago -
has worked flawlessly and he is very impressed with it:-

http://www.amptec.co.uk/at/index.htm

Hmm. How much power can you get?

I am semi seriously considering this to do the 'wee small hours' winter
UFH heating.

And how much do they cost, and what amperage do they need to run..and
how do you switch them on and off..bloody great 50A Triac?


Although my total heating requirements are allegedly 10Kw, I dont think
the actual UFH could absorb much more than 5Kw without overheating the
screed.

I could run the boiler and the immersion of a switched circuit maybe..

They vary in rating, but as I recall, it was 300 odd quid, soft start
electronics and timers etc on board - so only need a domestic supply (ie
from main board - 24/7), the one I fitted drew 50 Amps at 240V. Can be
controlled by normal tankstat, roomstat etc. they have several elements
within, so "modulate" dependant upon temperature set and present
temperature attained (by the boiler itself - not the room temp etc.)

--
Regards,
Will.

In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?


--
geoff

geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?


Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central
heating for anyway ?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

I knew you hadn't killfiled me, it just needed a bit of taunting

ha ha


--
geoff

geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central
heating for anyway ?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

I knew you hadn't killfiled me, it just needed a bit of taunting

ha ha


I have,but not in this NG...

In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central
heating for anyway ?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.
I knew you hadn't killfiled me, it just needed a bit of taunting
ha ha

I have,but not in this NG...


there is nowhere else that I can think of


--
geoff

In article , The Natural
Philosopher scribeth thus
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?


Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

No Gas out your way then?...
--
Tony Sayer

tony sayer wrote:
In article , The Natural
Philosopher scribeth thus
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?


Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

No Gas out your way then?...

Only what the border terrier produces...when he's been at the cat food.

In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central
heating for anyway ?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

'kin hell - six words without a spelling mistake

must be a record for you


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
geoff wrote:
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

'kin hell - six words without a spelling mistake

must be a record for you

Maxie, people have CDs these days.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway
!

With the amount of hot air you produce,what do you need central heating
for anyway ?

Maxie, your insight is fabulous. Fantastic indeed. You are a breath of
fresh air, clearly physcadelic.

On Apr 25, 10:47 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway !

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

One solution would be a heat bank with immersion heaters. A decent
sized one could run the UFH directly and supply the hot water.

http://www.heatweb.com/specs/Specification%205341-5.htm for instance.

A

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway
!

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing oil
boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

If I recall rightly you have an overlarge unvented cylinder. A more
powerful immersion can be fitted, or two if two bosses available. Then a
take off using a bronze pump and a plate heat exchanger to mesh into the
heating circuit. Then you have the electricity and oil available.

Doctor Drivel wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

If I recall rightly you have an overlarge unvented cylinder. A more
powerful immersion can be fitted, or two if two bosses available. Then a
take off using a bronze pump and a plate heat exchanger to mesh into the
heating circuit. Then you have the electricity and oil available.


Not a lot of use for central heating is it tho?

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

If I recall rightly you have an overlarge unvented cylinder. A more
powerful immersion can be fitted, or two if two bosses available. Then a
take off using a bronze pump and a plate heat exchanger to mesh into the
heating circuit. Then you have the electricity and oil available.


Not a lot of use for central heating is it tho?

You did not understand. The unvented cylinder is converted to a thermal
store. The hot water in the cylinder is pumped through a plate heat X which
then heats the FUN.

All you need is:

- a plate heat X. A 100kW will do, as used in Gledhill Systemates (about
£80-90)
- a Bronze pump (about £60 on Ebay)
- A more powerful immersion heater (around £100)
- some pipework and fitting.

You say you only need 10kW for the house. A 9 to 12kW immersion, which can
fit a 2 1/4" bosse will do. You have the advantage of storing the heat over
night and then a ready supply of hot water. You say the UFH can only absorb
5kW, so no probs.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

If I recall rightly you have an overlarge unvented cylinder. A more
powerful immersion can be fitted, or two if two bosses available. Then a
take off using a bronze pump and a plate heat exchanger to mesh into the
heating circuit. Then you have the electricity and oil available.


Not a lot of use for central heating is it tho?

You did not understand. The unvented cylinder is converted to a thermal
store. The hot water in the cylinder is pumped through a plate heat X which
then heats the UFH

All you need is:

- a plate heat X. A 100kW will do, as used in Gledhill Systemates (about
£80-90)
- a Bronze pump (about £60 on Ebay)
- A more powerful immersion heater (around £100)
- some pipework and fitting.

You say you only need 10kW for the house. A 9 to 12kW immersion, which can
fit a 2 1/4" bosse will do. You have the advantage of storing the heat
overnight and then a ready supply of hot water in he morning for the UFH.
You say the UFH can only absorb 5kW, so no probs.

I would go down this route.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator
anyway !

;-)

If my existing boiler was as low as 50% efficient (its non condensing
oil boiler) I might expect electricity to be cheaper in the daytime a
well.

Thank god for nookoleer powah!

If I recall rightly you have an overlarge unvented cylinder. A more
powerful immersion can be fitted, or two if two bosses available. Then a
take off using a bronze pump and a plate heat exchanger to mesh into the
heating circuit. Then you have the electricity and oil available.

What size is your cylinder in litres?

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?


There are several of these about ... but of more interest would be:

1) heat pump ... remarkably more efficient, air-air easy enough but ground
to air, or water to air even better

can be linked to geothermal storage if you want maximum efficiency.

2) Home power plant ... not only heat house & water, but produce energy that
you sell back to grid ... this at the moment is the most efficient system
around (at least one that you can control .. unlike wind or solar)

Rick Hughes wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient
boiler is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?


There are several of these about ... but of more interest would be:

1) heat pump ... remarkably more efficient, air-air easy enough but
ground to air, or water to air even better


Interested in that too.


can be linked to geothermal storage if you want maximum efficiency.

2) Home power plant ... not only heat house & water, but produce energy
that you sell back to grid ... this at the moment is the most efficient
system around (at least one that you can control .. unlike wind or solar)

On Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:20:58 +0100, Rick Hughes wrote:
There are several of these about ... but of more interest would be:

1) heat pump ... remarkably more efficient, air-air easy enough but ground
to air, or water to air even better

Has anyone here managed to homebrew one of these? I did some reading up on
them a few weeks ago and the theory seems easy enough, but I'm not sure
how specialist some of the bits need to be...

(air-source isn't practical around here due to low winter temps, but
ground-source should be possible)

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Jules
saying something like:

1) heat pump ... remarkably more efficient, air-air easy enough but ground
to air, or water to air even better

Has anyone here managed to homebrew one of these? I did some reading up on
them a few weeks ago and the theory seems easy enough, but I'm not sure
how specialist some of the bits need to be...

Half a dozen freezer guts would do the job.
--

Dave

On Fri, 02 May 2008 00:17:31 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Jules
saying something like:

1) heat pump ... remarkably more efficient, air-air easy enough but ground
to air, or water to air even better

Has anyone here managed to homebrew one of these? I did some reading up on
them a few weeks ago and the theory seems easy enough, but I'm not sure
how specialist some of the bits need to be...

Half a dozen freezer guts would do the job.

I saw somewhere that people were generally using a water/antifreeze mix
for the subterranean loop, and fitting a heat exchanger mechanism so that
the refrigerant loop was kept small and maintainable.

I suspect there's lots of room for screw-ups - not only when it comes to
figuring out loop sizes, but also with the pump/compressor choice.
i.e. getting something that sort-of works is perhaps easy, but getting
something that maximises efficiency might be a little more tricky...

(I noticed last week that my local power company gives rebates for
houses with ground-source heat pumps, but only if they have gov't
approval - homebrewing doesn't count! :-)

cheers

Jules

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway
!


Good site here for comparing costs...

http://www.nottenergy.com/energy-costs-comparison3

On Apr 26, 4:31*pm, "CWatters"
wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in .net...

Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway
!

Good site here for comparing costs...

http://www.nottenergy.com/energy-costs-comparison3

Interesting thread:

Seems like an opportunity, with all the know how represented here, to
ask a question that has been in mind for at least the last 50 years!

Recalling that, back in the early 1950s, read an article about a
power cable across the North Sea from Scotland to Norway?

Recollection is that it was, or proposed to be, a DC cable with
conversion from/to 50 cycle/hertz AC at each end. The purpose being to
load share between the power grids of the two countries etc.

I'm pretty sure recalling the article is not a figment of my
imagination.

But was that cable a fact or proposal?

Still very curious and would welcome any informed comment. Cheers.

terry wrote:
On Apr 26, 4:31 pm, "CWatters"
wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in . net...

Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.
Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.
Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.
Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler is
still 5.184p per Kwh.
Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?
I have UFH, which is tantamount to a big ****-off storage radiator anyway
!
Good site here for comparing costs...

http://www.nottenergy.com/energy-costs-comparison3

Interesting thread:

Seems like an opportunity, with all the know how represented here, to
ask a question that has been in mind for at least the last 50 years!

Recalling that, back in the early 1950s, read an article about a
power cable across the North Sea from Scotland to Norway?

Recollection is that it was, or proposed to be, a DC cable with
conversion from/to 50 cycle/hertz AC at each end. The purpose being to
load share between the power grids of the two countries etc.

I'm pretty sure recalling the article is not a figment of my
imagination.

But was that cable a fact or proposal?

Still very curious and would welcome any informed comment. Cheers.

Not sure if that one is a fact: others are,but the cost of the cable
plus the cost of energy the other end has to be less than the cost of
building a ocal power station, and by and large it isn't.

Undersea cable being pretty expensive things.

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher writes:
terry wrote:

Interesting thread:

Seems like an opportunity, with all the know how represented here, to
ask a question that has been in mind for at least the last 50 years!

Recalling that, back in the early 1950s, read an article about a
power cable across the North Sea from Scotland to Norway?

Recollection is that it was, or proposed to be, a DC cable with
conversion from/to 50 cycle/hertz AC at each end. The purpose being to
load share between the power grids of the two countries etc.

I'm pretty sure recalling the article is not a figment of my
imagination.

But was that cable a fact or proposal?

Still very curious and would welcome any informed comment. Cheers.

Not sure if that one is a fact: others are,but the cost of the cable
plus the cost of energy the other end has to be less than the cost of
building a ocal power station, and by and large it isn't.

Undersea cable being pretty expensive things.

There was a proposal a couple of years ago to build a ring main
or interconnect under the north sea, connecting UK, Holland,
Germany, Denmark, Norway, and also allowing easier connection
of sea-based wind farms. Don't know where that's got to now.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher writes:
terry wrote:
Interesting thread:

Seems like an opportunity, with all the know how represented here, to
ask a question that has been in mind for at least the last 50 years!

Recalling that, back in the early 1950s, read an article about a
power cable across the North Sea from Scotland to Norway?

Recollection is that it was, or proposed to be, a DC cable with
conversion from/to 50 cycle/hertz AC at each end. The purpose being to
load share between the power grids of the two countries etc.

I'm pretty sure recalling the article is not a figment of my
imagination.

But was that cable a fact or proposal?

Still very curious and would welcome any informed comment. Cheers.
Not sure if that one is a fact: others are,but the cost of the cable
plus the cost of energy the other end has to be less than the cost of
building a ocal power station, and by and large it isn't.

Undersea cable being pretty expensive things.

There was a proposal a couple of years ago to build a ring main
or interconnect under the north sea, connecting UK, Holland,
Germany, Denmark, Norway, and also allowing easier connection
of sea-based wind farms. Don't know where that's got to now.


Probably booted well into touch when the costs were calculated.


As with a lot off greenwash stuff, its all just more cat-belling.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_the_cat

On Apr 25, 10:47*pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Apropos of something else, I was moved to research my energy costs.

Night time electricity is currently 4.85p per Kwh.

Oil is a staggering 54p a liter.

Oil energy density is 37.5MJ /liter. Which with a 100% efficient boiler
is still 5.184p per Kwh.

Does anyone make electrical central heating boilers?

Get one of these:

http://www.airconwarehouse.com/acatalog/Hitachi_AquaFree.html

Keep the boiler for the odd cold snap.

cheers,
Pete.