This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George" said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George" said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will
because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.



Me thinks MrHall does sneakingly pops into Aldi when no ones looking.

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol

On Mon, 17 Sep 2007 09:43:45 GMT, "George"
wrote:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

It will only measure the power consumption of the device plugged into
it, nothing else.
--
Peter Parry.
http://www.wpp.ltd.uk/

George wrote:
"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George" said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will
because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422
Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.



Me thinks MrHall does sneakingly pops into Aldi when no ones looking.

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol



It's ok for M&S to diversify

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George" said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.


Hand picked in The Cotswolds no doubt

On Mon, 17 Sep 2007 10:03:02 GMT, "George"
wrote:

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol

Well M&S is primarily a clothes shop. Groceries are a sideline.

Their inorganic cheese scones are lovely - I'm off now to buy a few

:-)

--
Frank Erskine

"Stuart Noble" wrote in message
...
Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George" said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will
because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.


Hand picked in The Cotswolds no doubt

Apparently not. The hapless "Restauranteurs" tried their local Waitrose
and it had very little local veg.

On Sep 17, 10:43 am, "George" wrote:
This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

How can it measure something not plugged into it? That's why it has a
socket, doh! It's like trying to measure a window by holding the ruler
up to the door.

You need a different method to measure the current in the ring, e.g. a
clamp meter, and the knowledge of how to use it.

MBQ

Frank Erskine wrote:
On Mon, 17 Sep 2007 10:03:02 GMT, "George"
wrote:

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol

Well M&S is primarily a clothes shop. Groceries are a sideline.



Well, that's not true any more. M&S sold about £3.5bn of clothes and
£3.9bn of food in the financial year 2006/7.

That kinda makes them a food retailer which also happens to be the uk's
biggest clothing retailer...

George wrote:
"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On 2007-09-17 10:43:45 +0100, "George"
said:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power
thats being used without plugging a power tool into it? I think it
will because whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a
reading?

http://tinyurl.com/2zndjj

Colour survielance camera here as well.

http://tinyurl.com/ynu422

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.



Me thinks MrHall does sneakingly pops into Aldi when no ones looking.

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol

Wholewheat Dungarees?


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message

Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.



Me thinks MrHall does sneakingly pops into Aldi when no ones looking.

ps M&S do organic clothes. I kid thee not. lol

Wholewheat Dungarees?


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257



Nah,probably rice paper underpants.

In message . com,
" writes

You need a different method to measure the current in the ring, e.g. a
clamp meter, and the knowledge of how to use it.

so that's what clamp meters are for - I've never bought one as I
could never work out why I might need one

--
Si

"Si" $3o&m wrote in message
...
In message . com,
" writes

You need a different method to measure the current in the ring, e.g. a
clamp meter, and the knowledge of how to use it.

so that's what clamp meters are for - I've never bought one as I could
never work out why I might need one

--
Si

A useful DIY adjunct to a clamp meter is a shortish plug and socket
extension cord. One can then clamp between the plug and the socket (which
obviously feeds the device under test) and see whether current is flowing.
fr'instance switch the heaters ON and see whether the washing machine's
heaters are working. It can save hours/minutes of testing.
[Dribble will probably swear that real men use a hacksaw and gauge the size
of the arc.]
[[ Dyed-in-the-wool sparkies will insist that one takes the top off a plug
and insert the leads of their trusty war-surplus AVO in series with the LIVE
conductor where the fuse 'lives; if the range selectors are wrong they'll
just tape down the reset button, ]]

--

Brian

"Jim Alexander" wrote in message
. uk...


Waitrose has some great offers on organic fruit and veg this week.


Hand picked in The Cotswolds no doubt

Apparently not. The hapless "Restauranteurs" tried their local Waitrose
and it had very little local veg.

Ours does.

Mary

Brian Sharrock wrote:

A useful DIY adjunct to a clamp meter is a shortish plug and socket
extension cord. One can then clamp between the plug and the socket (which
obviously feeds the device under test) and see whether current is flowing.
fr'instance switch the heaters ON and see whether the washing machine's
heaters are working. It can save hours/minutes of testing.

Might be worth mentioning that ones special extension lead needs a
length of outer insulation stripped from it so that you can clamp round
the individual wires rather than the whole cable. (otherwise you end up
measuring the sum of the current flowing in and out of the appliance
(hopefully nil!)

Another handy trick is to make a small coil of say ten turns in one of
the wires. Clamp round that and you will read ten times the actual load
- hence adding a decimal place of resolution to your meter.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

George wrote:

This power meter do you think it'll read the consumption of power thats
being used without plugging a power tool into it?

Nope, not a chance....

I think it will because
whatevers on the ringmain its plugged into will give a reading?

No, the best you will get without something plugged into it, is you will
be able to measure the voltage.

There is a secondary issue here as well, if the description is to be
believed then this one does not seem to take account of the power factor
of the connected appliance either. Hence on reactive loads (computer
kit, fridges, freezers, and the posher power tools) you will get answers
that are somewhat out.

Maplin do one that while not perfect is better specified: (currently on
special)

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?...ter& doy=18m9

If you want to measure loading on a whole circuit, or a whole house,
then a true RMS clamp meter will allow you to monitor the current load.

(For a circuit measurement you can clip it round the wire leaving the
MCB in the CU, and for the whole house clamp round a meter tail).


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In message , John Rumm
writes
Brian Sharrock wrote:

A useful DIY adjunct to a clamp meter is a shortish plug and socket
extension cord. One can then clamp between the plug and the socket
(which obviously feeds the device under test) and see whether current
is flowing. fr'instance switch the heaters ON and see whether the
washing machine's heaters are working. It can save hours/minutes of testing.

Might be worth mentioning that ones special extension lead needs a
length of outer insulation stripped from it so that you can clamp round
the individual wires rather than the whole cable. (otherwise you end up
measuring the sum of the current flowing in and out of the appliance
(hopefully nil!)

Another handy trick is to make a small coil of say ten turns in one of
the wires. Clamp round that and you will read ten times the actual load
- hence adding a decimal place of resolution to your meter.

John, do you mean clamp around the whole coil or through the centre of
it?

--
Si

Si wrote:

Another handy trick is to make a small coil of say ten turns in one of
the wires. Clamp round that and you will read ten times the actual
load - hence adding a decimal place of resolution to your meter.

John, do you mean clamp around the whole coil or through the centre of it?

Round one side of it - so the clamp joins up through the centre. The
idea being you want the current flow to pass through the clamp ten (or
however many times) in the same direction. If you clamp right round the
coil you are back to measuring the sum of current flow in two directions
(so it would cancel out and you are back to nil again).

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 17 Sep, 14:02, "George" wrote:

Nah,probably rice paper underpants.-

They do chafe the groin.

John Rumm wrote:

[snip 7 quid power meter from Aldi]

There is a secondary issue here as well, if the description is to be
believed then this one does not seem to take account of the power factor
of the connected appliance either. Hence on reactive loads (computer
kit, fridges, freezers, and the posher power tools) you will get answers
that are somewhat out.

Aldi still had these on offer this week in Kendal. It claimed on the pack
that it displayed power factor so I bought one to "play" with. It certainly
does more than they say in the brief advert but I'm not so sure how
accurate it is for small loads. FWIW here's my opinions after giving it a
bit of use.

It displays the power factor and the power (both instantaneous watts and
cumulative KWh), plus voltage, current and frequency. For those who don't
want to do simple arithmetic it can be programmed with the price per KWH
and displays the total cost along with elapsed time "on load". A neat
little extra is that you can set up 2 different prices for different
periods of the day which may be of use for those on economy 7 tariff.

It also indicates maximum current and power, which AFAICS can only be reset
by removing the batteries (2 off AG-13 button cells).

There's a facility to set an arbitrary "overload" power level which causes a
red LED to light up if it's exceeded, I can't see any real use for this but
I suppose it might appeal to some. Nor can I see the point of displaying
the frequency, I expect the mains frequency is regulated to much closer
tolerances than the accuracy of this meter.

The claimed accuracy leaves something to be desired. Voltage and current are
+/-3% but power is +/-5% of displayed value and/or +/-10 watts so not much
use for checking the low power consumption of things like TV's on standby.
I checked it against known resistive loads like tungsten lamps and 3KW
heaters with reasonable results, it displayed the right values for a 20w
halogen lamp and an 11W CFL but a 7W CFL came up as zero watts! Inductive
loads like the freezer and dishwasher motor were quite erratic, in
particular the value for the dishwasher swung erratically from about 120W
down to near zero with corresponding power factor swinging between 0.9 and
near zero.

Would I recommend one? As a serious measurement tool - no, but as a cheap
and cheerful indicator it's probably OK. It's main use for me was to assess
the overall consumption of things with a variable duty cycle like the
freezer, or the washing machine and dishwasher where it's hard to estimate
just how long the heater is no for each cycle. For most other devices just
looking at the rating plate or counting the revolutions or flashes on
the 'leccy board meter is probably the best approach.

--
Mike Clarke

Mike Clarke wrote:

[snip 7 quid power meter from Aldi]

There is a secondary issue here as well, if the description is to be
believed then this one does not seem to take account of the power factor
of the connected appliance either. Hence on reactive loads (computer
kit, fridges, freezers, and the posher power tools) you will get answers
that are somewhat out.

Aldi still had these on offer this week in Kendal. It claimed on the pack
that it displayed power factor so I bought one to "play" with. It certainly
does more than they say in the brief advert but I'm not so sure how
accurate it is for small loads. FWIW here's my opinions after giving it a
bit of use.

It displays the power factor and the power (both instantaneous watts and
cumulative KWh), plus voltage, current and frequency. For those who don't
want to do simple arithmetic it can be programmed with the price per KWH
and displays the total cost along with elapsed time "on load". A neat
little extra is that you can set up 2 different prices for different
periods of the day which may be of use for those on economy 7 tariff.

It also indicates maximum current and power, which AFAICS can only be reset
by removing the batteries (2 off AG-13 button cells).

Maximum current including reactive components or not?

There's a facility to set an arbitrary "overload" power level which causes a
red LED to light up if it's exceeded, I can't see any real use for this but
I suppose it might appeal to some. Nor can I see the point of displaying
the frequency, I expect the mains frequency is regulated to much closer
tolerances than the accuracy of this meter.

The claimed accuracy leaves something to be desired. Voltage and current are
+/-3% but power is +/-5% of displayed value and/or +/-10 watts so not much
use for checking the low power consumption of things like TV's on standby.
I checked it against known resistive loads like tungsten lamps and 3KW
heaters with reasonable results, it displayed the right values for a 20w
halogen lamp and an 11W CFL but a 7W CFL came up as zero watts! Inductive
loads like the freezer and dishwasher motor were quite erratic, in
particular the value for the dishwasher swung erratically from about 120W
down to near zero with corresponding power factor swinging between 0.9 and
near zero.

Would I recommend one? As a serious measurement tool - no, but as a cheap
and cheerful indicator it's probably OK. It's main use for me was to assess
the overall consumption of things with a variable duty cycle like the
freezer, or the washing machine and dishwasher where it's hard to estimate
just how long the heater is no for each cycle. For most other devices just
looking at the rating plate or counting the revolutions or flashes on
the 'leccy board meter is probably the best approach.

Thanks for that Mike, it gives a much more useful indication of what you
can expect than the Aldi write up!

Based on your description I would say the Maplin one probably has the
edge - in that it seems to handle inductive loads like fridges etc quite
well. Still not accurate on very low powers or low power factors,
although it does give a steady reading.




--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article John Rumm wrote:

Maximum current including reactive components or not?

Yes, it can display maximum current but no breakdown into components.

--
Mike Clarke

In article ,
says...
Maximum current including reactive components or not?

Yes, it can display maximum current but no breakdown into components.


Reset by holding in one of the buttons for three secs - but for the life
of me I can't remember which.
--
Skipweasel.
Never knowingly understood.

In article Skipweasel
wrote:

In article ,
says...
Maximum current including reactive components or not?

Yes, it can display maximum current but no breakdown into components.


Reset by holding in one of the buttons for three secs - but for the life
of me I can't remember which.

Yes, it turns out that press and hold the down arrow clears the maximum
values though I can't find it anywhere in the instructions. It only seems
to mention press and hold "price" to clear the accumulated costs.

--
Mike Clarke

Si wrote:

In message . com,
" writes


You need a different method to measure the current in the ring, e.g. a
clamp meter, and the knowledge of how to use it.


so that's what clamp meters are for - I've never bought one as I
could never work out why I might need one

A couple of years ago, when I had the site supervisors job at the local
primary school a totally deaf electrician came with a clamp meter to
measure which phase to connect the new air conditioning to.

Air con lads cam down. Fitted the units and wired it up to the nearest
available phase. So like you, I can't see what use they are :-)

Dave