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Ben Blaukopf

wrote:
Hi,

I was hoping to fit UFH. I've looked at Screwfix and also TLC direct.
The latter seems cheaper (taking into account they quote ex vat). The
Screwfix ones come with diy instructions (albeit the electrics must be
connected by a suitable person if in a bathroom: part P etc). However
the TLC ones say strictly not for DIY use. Are they really that
different? From what I can see, installation is the same. You measure
the resistance before and the resistance after. It should be the same.
If it isn't you don't use it and call an expert in.

I looked at the TLC one. The installation manual requires that you
measure the insulation resistance at 500V. I've never seen any others
that ask you to use anything more than 10 quid multimeter. I'd use a
megger anyway, but I've got one; most (95%) DIYers won't. I suspect
that's most of what they mean by 'not for DIY'.

The most noticable thing about the product is that the cable is 4mm.
Everyone else seems to be offering 3mm - 3.5mm. The difference, of
course, is no more than an extra bag of adhesive, if that. Maybe BN are
offering old stock, maybe they've decided that 3mm is too fragile.
Dunno. But FHS (Handyheat by another name) have been around for 4 years
longer than BN (est summer 2005, 'with the simple objective of being the
best choice for commercial and industrial electric heating').

I'm about to buy from Handyheat/FHS. They offer a lifetime guarantee
(versus 10 years for TLC). Still worth sod all, since I doubt it covers
relaying the floor in the event of a problem. They also don't require
the thermostat to be put in conduit. I emailed them to ask why (at 8pm,
and got a reply at 3am!), and they said it's because they have a new
one-piece design made a few years ago, and since then have had zero
sensor failures. The thermostat appears to be exactly the same as the
TLC one, though obviously the thermostat is the least critical part of
the system for reliability. Oh, and they also have telephone support. No
idea what that's like.

I'll be laying a cable kit, with spacing suitable to keep the floor
warm, and using a radiator to heat the room when required. It turns out
that TLC are actually more expensive for that, after adding a stat,
delivery, and vat.

Ben

Ben Blaukopf

wrote:
On Fri, 04 May 2007 00:12:35 +0100, Ben Blaukopf
wrote:

I looked at the TLC one. The installation manual requires that you
measure the insulation resistance at 500V. I've never seen any others
that ask you to use anything more than 10 quid multimeter. I'd use a
megger anyway, but I've got one; most (95%) DIYers won't. I suspect
that's most of what they mean by 'not for DIY'.

The most noticable thing about the product is that the cable is 4mm.
Everyone else seems to be offering 3mm - 3.5mm.

Hello,

No I don't have a megger. Can I use a multimeter?

You can do what you like, but don't expect TLC to honour the guarantee.

More to the point, this falls under part P. How are you going to test it
for the BCO? You can't fill in a Minor Works certificate without
measuring R @ 500V, regardless of what the installation manual says.
Most DIY-kits would expect your electrician to measure this for you when
making the final connections. This kit wants R @ 500V recorded at 3
times during the process.

Do I measure the resistance of (1) the heating cable and check that
does not vary before and after and also (2) the resistance between the
cable and earth to check there is no short circuit?

Have you actually read the installation manual?

Ben

Ben Blaukopf

wrote:
On Fri, 04 May 2007 15:36:05 +0100, Ben Blaukopf
wrote:

Most DIY-kits would expect your electrician to measure this for you when
making the final connections. This kit wants R @ 500V recorded at 3
times during the process.

This is exactly my problem. I can have it measured by the electrician
at the end but I don't want to have him called out to check it twice
before, especially if I can do it myself. That's why I was asking for
your advice.

That's my point - it looks like the TLC kit makes you jump through more
hoops than the others.

Have you actually read the installation manual?

Yes but I wanted reassurance that I had understood it correctly. You
sound as though you have done this before and know what you are
talking about.

Nope, I haven't (though I am about to!) and my advice is worth what you
paid for it.

I only skimmed to the end of the manual, but it certainly looked like
that was what you were supposed to do. Again, this is an advantage of
the Handyheat system - you can phone up and ask if you don't know. I
suspect the TLC kit is cheaper partly because they offer zero technical
support.

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