David Pashley wrote:
Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

TIA
David

where are you ?

Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

TIA
David

where are you ?


Sorry, should have mentioned. Stratford-on-Avon.

David

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:48:30 -0800, David Pashley wrote:

Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?


Why don't you do it yourself - or are you currently lacking some of the
tools or skills?

How much would you want (over and above your normal rate of pay) to make
space in your personal and/or working life for an important job taking
a few days that you don't absolutely have to do?

With time to plan the work and with a fairly straight forward install you
could well pay less. In the middle of winter you should be thankful they
are not asking what _some_ people might be prepared to pay.

I would say 1000 for this job is fair, in winter, if done well.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:48:30 -0800, David Pashley wrote:

Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

£1000

:-)

David Pashley wrote:
where are you ?


Sorry, should have mentioned. Stratford-on-Avon.

David

mate's going to ring tonight, I'll let you know if he's interested.

Ed Sirett wrote:


Why don't you do it yourself - or are you currently lacking some of the
tools or skills?

I lack some of the plumbing skills (one in particular - confidence).


How much would you want (over and above your normal rate of pay) to make
space in your personal and/or working life for an important job taking
a few days that you don't absolutely have to do?

In my line of work my customers are companies, not individuals or
households. Having said that, I will go to considerable time and
lengths to help people who I like and respect.

If I were providing a service to individuals, I would feel bound to
take into account their circumstances and my values would not allow me
to take advantage of a customer in a tough situation (e.g. little
children + no heating/hw), or to charge more because others were facing
hardship.


With time to plan the work and with a fairly straight forward install you
could well pay less. In the middle of winter you should be thankful they
are not asking what _some_ people might be prepared to pay.

I would say 1000 for this job is fair, in winter, if done well.

I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I respect
your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in my 10th year
on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.

Many Thanks
David

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

Fraid there is no easy answer but where did the idea that the gas valve was
*definately* faulty come from? Maybe repair is an option after all.

A couple of other comments which unfortunately doesn't help you may may help
others. Losing everything is just one of several downsides to having a
Combi and if you chose not to have a maintenace contract you need a Plan B.

Jim A

"David Pashley" wrote in message
ups.com...

Ed Sirett wrote:


Why don't you do it yourself - or are you currently lacking some of the
tools or skills?

I lack some of the plumbing skills (one in particular - confidence).

Confidence is the worst one to lack. We can talk you through fitting a
boiler if you can't afford the money, since it's a short move not a complete
relocation it wouldn't be that difficult. Two downsides: if you do it
yourself you are unlikely to get your heat back more quickly than if you get
a CORGI man in, since there is always the faffing around around element when
you do something new.

Secondly, there is always a question mark over the guarantee's validity - if
something goes wrong. I don't think fitting it yourself invalidates the
guarantee, but the jobsworths trying to wriggle out of any commitments might
argue.

I was in just your situation, with a knackered boiler and not much heat and
no hot water. The gas engineer came around once then kept breaking promises
to come around again. I eventually told him I would start the pipework
myself and he got a strop on and that was the last I saw of him. I did a
complete move/replacement of a boiler from a bedroom to an outbuilding
though and that was fairly complicated to do in the end.

Meantime I used an electric oil-filled radiator and a log fire to keep warm.

Hot water was at a premium, and was supplied by boiling up water in the
kettle and on the stove in big pots. I reckon a bath took 3/4 hour to fill.
Not surprisingly I only did that once a week. Warm water for washing in the
morning etc was via a kettle and a big bowl. It was just like the old days
really, I was only missing the big copper bath in front of the fire! Have
you any folks in the area who will let you use their baths?

Seriously, this shows the drawbacks of a combi, which you can only get
around by having back up gas/electric fires and a hot water cylinder with an
immersion heater.

Andy.

How much would you want (over and above your normal rate of pay) to make
space in your personal and/or working life for an important job taking
a few days that you don't absolutely have to do?

In my line of work my customers are companies, not individuals or
households. Having said that, I will go to considerable time and
lengths to help people who I like and respect.

If I were providing a service to individuals, I would feel bound to
take into account their circumstances and my values would not allow me
to take advantage of a customer in a tough situation (e.g. little
children + no heating/hw), or to charge more because others were facing
hardship.


With time to plan the work and with a fairly straight forward install you
could well pay less. In the middle of winter you should be thankful they
are not asking what _some_ people might be prepared to pay.

I would say 1000 for this job is fair, in winter, if done well.

I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I respect
your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in my 10th year
on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.

Many Thanks
David

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he
http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group (you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

cheers,
clive

On 5 Jan 2007 09:58:07 -0800 David Pashley wrote :
I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I
respect your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in
my 10th year on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.

Floor to wall is definitely going to be more than a few hours work,
especially if you do a proper job of flushing out the system and
spend a bit of time doing a neat job on the pipework.

I had to do a similar job for my mother a few years back (old
boiler sprung a leak the week before Christmas) and it ended up as
three solid days work - though obviously I would not claim to work
as fast as a pro.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk

Clive George wrote:


FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group (you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.

Also, I didn't raise the fact that we have a baby in order to engender
sympathy or some sort of discount, but initially to emphasize the
urgency of the situation, and subsequently to point out that I will not
be exploited by "professionals" who think it's OK to charge more
because of this vulnerability.

In practice, we will get by for as long as it takes to find a
fairly-priced solution. My main objective in posting was to find out
what the experienced people here think is fair.

David

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...

Clive George wrote:

FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group
(you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a
lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.

Erm - what assumptions? Try not to take offence where none was intended, it
makes for a much happier life.
(are you the grandparent by any chance?)

Also, I didn't raise the fact that we have a baby in order to engender
sympathy or some sort of discount, but initially to emphasize the
urgency of the situation, and subsequently to point out that I will not
be exploited by "professionals" who think it's OK to charge more
because of this vulnerability.

It's pretty common business practice to charge more for a job completed
earlier - ie an 'urgent' one. And in the business we're currently discussing
there will be plenty of work around at the moment (ie fixing people's
boilers), so there's definitely scope for paying to jump queues.

In practice, we will get by for as long as it takes to find a
fairly-priced solution. My main objective in posting was to find out
what the experienced people here think is fair.

Good.

With that in mind, you can afford to be more relaxed in front of the people
pricing work - ie you have time to look around the market (ie the
competition) a little more. If they can see you don't have time for that,
they've got no reason to drop their prices - you're a captive market. And if
you push the small baby thing, it could well work against you.

cheers,
clive

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...

Clive George wrote:


FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group
(you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a
lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.

Also, I didn't raise the fact that we have a baby in order to engender
sympathy or some sort of discount, but initially to emphasize the
urgency of the situation,

perhaps the slightly unsympathetic hearing is because you had a
vulnerability to single point failure, no maintenance contract and no plan B

and subsequently to point out that I will not
be exploited by "professionals" who think it's OK to charge more
because of this vulnerability.


I'm no friend of installers but where is the evidence of your assertion?
You only have one quote, which the consensus here thinks is probably
reasonable - because its winter and others have a need for urgent repair
services - and not because it exploits your vulnerability.

Jim A

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:39:30 +0000, Clive George wrote:

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group (you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

aye: when I were a lad ....

BSF a few electric convectors, oil filled rads & fan heaters
plus any open fireplaces you have and some skipdiving, coupled with warm
woolies should see you right for space heating. If you can lay your hands
on a serviceable Fortic (scrap merchants or friendly plumbers) that would
do you for HW too, otherwise it's kettles and neighbours. Then you
don't need to be panicked into a hasty boiler replacement and can shop
around for a good price and/or maybe do some/all of the work yourself.

David Pashley wrote:

Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.

Depends on what you mena by predate... As a kid our house had no CH (did
not get it until the mid 80's). HW was from an immersion heater that was
very expensive to run in a huge uninsulated cylinder. Hence it was
switched on for only one or two nights a week to provide bathing
facilities. The following day warm water was available, other days it
was cold. At the time it did not seem unusual or a big hardship,
although I would not want to go back to not having hot water on demand,
lack of it is hardly life threatening.

Also, I didn't raise the fact that we have a baby in order to engender
sympathy or some sort of discount, but initially to emphasize the
urgency of the situation, and subsequently to point out that I will not
be exploited by "professionals" who think it's OK to charge more
because of this vulnerability.

ISTM that babies are not so much of a problem - they are easy to dress
warm, and to bath them does not take much hot water.


No offennce intended, but It sounds to me as if you prefessional quoted
you a resonable price for the work. Perhaps you have been mislead into
believeing that doing this job is somehow quick and easy.

I would expect the work will amount to several days if done well and
carefully.

In practice, we will get by for as long as it takes to find a
fairly-priced solution. My main objective in posting was to find out
what the experienced people here think is fair.

In your situation, and doing a good job I would expect something like 4
man days worth of work. You can probably convert that to a currency
amount for you local area.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 5 Jan 2007 12:10:44 -0800, "David Pashley"
wrote:



|Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
|wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
|problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
|amenity.

We evacuated ourselves away from Hull and the wartime bombing into an old
cottage without running Domestic Hot Water and lived there till 1951ish, We
had to light the kitchen fire and use an old tin bath in front of the fire.
--
Dave Fawthrop dave hyphenologist co uk Google Groups is IME the *worst*
method of accessing usenet. GG subscribers would be well advised get a
newsreader, say Agent, and a newsserver, say news.individual.net. These
will allow them: to see only *new* posts, a killfile, and other goodies.

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:58:07 -0800, David Pashley wrote:

Ed Sirett wrote:


Why don't you do it yourself - or are you currently lacking some of the
tools or skills?

I lack some of the plumbing skills (one in particular - confidence).


How much would you want (over and above your normal rate of pay) to make
space in your personal and/or working life for an important job taking
a few days that you don't absolutely have to do?

In my line of work my customers are companies, not individuals or
households. Having said that, I will go to considerable time and
lengths to help people who I like and respect.

If I were providing a service to individuals, I would feel bound to
take into account their circumstances and my values would not allow me
to take advantage of a customer in a tough situation (e.g. little
children + no heating/hw), or to charge more because others were facing
hardship.


With time to plan the work and with a fairly straight forward install you
could well pay less. In the middle of winter you should be thankful they
are not asking what _some_ people might be prepared to pay.

I would say 1000 for this job is fair, in winter, if done well.

I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I respect
your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in my 10th year
on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.


Then, you may have noticed that I am not one of those who say
that boilers can be changed in a few hours.

I take it that there are TRVs on most radiators and in good order?



--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards

In article ,
Ed Sirett wrote:
I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I respect
your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in my 10th year
on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.


Then, you may have noticed that I am not one of those who say
that boilers can be changed in a few hours.

It's something that annoys me greatly when a person obviously not familiar
with or capable of doing a particular job knows exactly how long it should
take others they just happen to be paying to do it.
I have a fairly wide range of DIY skills and can never estimate exactly
how long a job will take me in my own place - let alone a strange one.
If it were a straightforward boiler swop it might be easier for a pro to
give a guide, but this job isn't.

--
*It IS as bad as you think, and they ARE out to get you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Ed Sirett wrote:
I've seen elsewhere in the group that it's a few hours' work. I respect
your opinion, but I'm also quite surprised by it. And in my 10th year
on uk.d-i-y that's rather unusual.


Then, you may have noticed that I am not one of those who say
that boilers can be changed in a few hours.

It's something that annoys me greatly when a person obviously not familiar
with or capable of doing a particular job knows exactly how long it should
take others they just happen to be paying to do it.
I have a fairly wide range of DIY skills and can never estimate exactly
how long a job will take me in my own place - let alone a strange one.
If it were a straightforward boiler swop it might be easier for a pro to
give a guide, but this job isn't.


One can't help noticing that ex gas board fitters are better than the
newer crop of CORGIs.
I've found a couple of good ones by getting the list off the Corgi
website and ringing them all. The last couple I've used have said they
didn't normally do "private work" and were surprised I'd found their
details. These are the sort of blokes who prefer regular work from
builders, don't want to advertise, and probably don't like the public
very much. Both were 50 ish and their pipework was pure artistry.

Dave Fawthrop wrote:
On 5 Jan 2007 12:10:44 -0800, "David Pashley"
wrote:


We evacuated ourselves away from Hull and the wartime bombing into an old
cottage without running Domestic Hot Water and lived there till 1951ish, We
had to light the kitchen fire and use an old tin bath in front of the fire.

That's impressive indeed. Right now an old tin bath and a means of
heating enough water would be handy!

To be honest we're coping fine without the heating, it's getting used
to not having the luxury of a daily shower, and bathing the baby in the
sink (which at least he seems to like!) that are the major stresses.

David

In article .com,
David Pashley wrote:
We evacuated ourselves away from Hull and the wartime bombing into an
old cottage without running Domestic Hot Water and lived there till
1951ish, We had to light the kitchen fire and use an old tin bath in
front of the fire.

That's impressive indeed. Right now an old tin bath and a means of
heating enough water would be handy!

To be honest we're coping fine without the heating, it's getting used
to not having the luxury of a daily shower, and bathing the baby in the
sink (which at least he seems to like!) that are the major stresses.

When I were a lad it was a weekly bath. Rest of the time you washed in the
sink.

My parent's house as I remember it had coal fires and the 'main' one had a
back boiler for heating water. Supplemented by an immersion heater for
summer etc use. Built in the '30s, the original hot water system was a
form of gas multi-point in the kitchen, which they had taken out as they
didn't want gas in the house. Dunno why, though.

--
*What do little birdies see when they get knocked unconscious? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article .com,
David Pashley wrote:
We evacuated ourselves away from Hull and the wartime bombing into an
old cottage without running Domestic Hot Water and lived there till
1951ish, We had to light the kitchen fire and use an old tin bath in
front of the fire.

That's impressive indeed. Right now an old tin bath and a means of
heating enough water would be handy!

To be honest we're coping fine without the heating, it's getting used
to not having the luxury of a daily shower, and bathing the baby in the
sink (which at least he seems to like!) that are the major stresses.

When I were a lad it was a weekly bath. Rest of the time you washed in the
sink.


When I were a lad and we did a lot of caravanning, washing in the sink with
naff all hot water and no shower or bath for 2 weeks was normal. Couldn't
do it now *shudder*. If I go for more than 2 days without a shower, I feel
gross. It's got a lot with what your used to.

Cheers

Tim

Wading into the labour cost for a moment...

I recently had the need to consult a lawyer. Luckily for me he had an
assistant who specialised in one of the other aspects of law needed. he said
"money, now I'm £200 ph and so is he" So because of the system I'm having to
stump up £400 ph. Now because I'm not a lawyer -and indeed may need 5-7
years to enable me to be of that ilk I- simply had to sit there and take it
like a man.

Similarly a Corgi plumber is offering a skill which takes years to acquire
and carries expensive specialist tools to offer a full service. You may feel
£50+ is expensive however personally I feel the UK would be far better as a
whole if a lawyer charged £50 and the plumber charged £200. (+VAT of
course;-)

Ignore the rate and go on recommendations as the difference in cost is
horrendous !!

Cheers

Richard

"David Pashley" wrote in message
oups.com...

Clive George wrote:


FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group
(you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a
lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.


Ding Dong! My bus-pass demonstrates that the world regards me as 'old' but I
didn't realise that I was classified as 'ancient' ! My mother's house, and
my grandmothers' houses - and the surrounding streets -did _not_ have the
luxury of 'HW'. A cold water tap was to be found in the kitchen and any
water above ambient temperature was obtained from kettles heated on the
'swivel thing' adjacent to the coal-fire. But I certainly 'predate ...
amenity ' of running HW - and apparently my age-group is the largest decile
in the population of England and Wales.

Isn't it amazing what one learns through this broadband stuff^W amenity!

--

Brian

David Pashley wrote:
Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

So, what happened in the end is that we had a number of quotes from
local firms, all in the £1,000 for boiler plus £1,000 to £1,500 plus
VAT range for fitting. Despite the amount they were hoping to charge,
none of them could turn up when they said they would, provide a quote
by when they said they would, or show any glimmer of reliability.

But we got used to the lack of heat and water, and were able to look
around for a better solution without being panicked into paying this
sum; as I have already made clear, £1,000 (plus profit on sourcing the
boiler) is not an amount I am comfortable paying.

Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

Don't get me wrong, I quietly admire those of you that are pleased to
be making £1,500 a day fitting boilers (£300k per year, not bad!). I
just feel bad for those of your customers who can't really afford to
keep you in Ferraris. ;-)

On 19 Jan 2007 06:49:26 -0800, "David Pashley"
wrote:


David Pashley wrote:
Hi,

Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

Don't get me wrong, I quietly admire those of you that are pleased to
be making £1,500 a day fitting boilers (£300k per year, not bad!). I
just feel bad for those of your customers who can't really afford to
keep you in Ferraris. ;-)

And it took them what? about 4 hours max to fit the thing?

And it's not Ferraris, it seems to be foreign homes visited every
other weekend )

"David Pashley" wrote in message
ps.com...

David Pashley wrote:
Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

So, what happened in the end is that we had a number of quotes from
local firms, all in the £1,000 for boiler plus £1,000 to £1,500 plus
VAT range for fitting. Despite the amount they were hoping to charge,
none of them could turn up when they said they would, provide a quote
by when they said they would, or show any glimmer of reliability.

But we got used to the lack of heat and water, and were able to look
around for a better solution without being panicked into paying this
sum; as I have already made clear, £1,000 (plus profit on sourcing the
boiler) is not an amount I am comfortable paying.

Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

Don't get me wrong, I quietly admire those of you that are pleased to
be making £1,500 a day fitting boilers (£300k per year, not bad!). I
just feel bad for those of your customers who can't really afford to
keep you in Ferraris. ;-)

Well done,

I had the same problem with people not turning up when they said they would.
I can understand that, what I couldn't understand was not getting a 'phone
call to tell me why they hadn't arrived. Two weeks of that and I just went
for it myself.
My total bill for a Vaillant Turbomax 828 was about £900, which includes
boiler, flue plus two right angles, thermostat and wiring, insulation and
all tools and piping necessary to relocate a boiler from a bedroom to an
outside toilet.

Of course, you end up paying in inconvenience and blood, sweat and tears but
at least you know you're making progress.

Do you have to drain down in two weeks and refill with Fernox/Sentinel?

Andy.

Andy wrote:

Do you have to drain down in two weeks and refill with Fernox/Sentinel?

No, proper job including Sentinel. All warranty and CORGI paperwork
done.

In answer to Eric P - even for a pro, it's a full day's work. So I
suppose the question is what's a full day's work worth?

David

David Pashley wrote:
Clive George wrote:

FWIW I wouldn't be pushing the small baby thing too hard in this group (you
did mention it as a reason to get a discount later). There are quite a lot
of older readers who raised kids before CH was the norm.

Your assumptions about my age and child-rearing experience are 100%
wrong, as it happens. Anyway, it's the lack of HW that's the main
problem, and I doubt any of us are ancient enough to predate that
amenity.

Many people have lived in properties without running hot water, and its
not just 'ancient' people that have been there.

The wiki could have helped you out temporarily
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?..._Water_Systems


NT

wrote:


The wiki could have helped you out temporarily
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?..._Water_Systems


:-)

wrote:


The wiki could have helped you out temporarily
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?..._Water_Systems


:-)

David Pashley wrote:

In answer to Eric P - even for a pro, it's a full day's work. So I
suppose the question is what's a full day's work worth?

In many cases it can be a full days work for two men... and even that
can be pushing it if you flush everything first and/or run into any
problems. Also its not only what a full days work is worth, it is what a
proportion of all the combined overheads of running a plumbing/gas
fitting business are worth as well.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

That's the going rate as far as I'm concerned, and it's still pretty
good money. I'm sure it *can* take 2 blokes a whole day sometimes, but
I've stood and watched at least 3 combi replacements done by one bloke
in less than half a day. 20 years with BG and I guess you get pretty
fast with the pipework

On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:49:26 -0800, David Pashley wrote:

David Pashley wrote:
Hi,

As a follow on from my earlier "faulty boiler" post, we are now in the
worst possible situation, as we have no heating or HW, a small baby in
the house, and so need a new boiler quickly.

We just had a local firm out who have quoted £2,000. Now I can obtain
a Vaillant EcotecPlus 831 boiler for under £950 including flue kit and
VAT, so basically it's £1,000 for fitting.

I think that's a ripoff, but I'm beginning to run out of options.

What do the experts here think is a reasonable charge for replacing a
floor-mounted boiler with a wall mounted unit nearby?

So, what happened in the end is that we had a number of quotes from
local firms, all in the £1,000 for boiler plus £1,000 to £1,500 plus
VAT range for fitting. Despite the amount they were hoping to charge,
none of them could turn up when they said they would, provide a quote
by when they said they would, or show any glimmer of reliability.

But we got used to the lack of heat and water, and were able to look
around for a better solution without being panicked into paying this
sum; as I have already made clear, £1,000 (plus profit on sourcing the
boiler) is not an amount I am comfortable paying.

Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

Don't get me wrong, I quietly admire those of you that are pleased to
be making £1,500 a day fitting boilers (£300k per year, not bad!). I
just feel bad for those of your customers who can't really afford to
keep you in Ferraris. ;-)


You'd get me for two working weeks for £1500 which is rather more than
even the most complex heating upgrade will take. Exchanging a boiler never
takes me less than a 2 days usually 3. I don't think I'm particularly slow
but I'm probably fairly thorough.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards

On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:23:54 +0000, Stuart Noble wrote:


Eventually, an acquaintance of a relative kindly came along on
Wednesday and fitted for £300 + VAT (excluding electrics, TRVs, and
making good of old boiler flue hole) a Worcester 30cdi that I bought
for £850 + VAT from a local supplier.

That's the going rate as far as I'm concerned, and it's still pretty
good money. I'm sure it *can* take 2 blokes a whole day sometimes, but
I've stood and watched at least 3 combi replacements done by one bloke
in less than half a day. 20 years with BG and I guess you get pretty
fast with the pipework

Nearly every heating upgrade (which includes a boiler replacment) IME
involves adding/replacing TRVs even if you are really quick you won't do
more than 4 an hour. So you have 2 hours of work or more on those alone.



--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html
Gas Fitting Standards Docs he http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFittingStandards