I first subscribed to this newsgroup about 4 years ago when we forst thought
about doing a renovation. Plans are now finally submitted and I'm making a
list of things to include for builder's quotes. The house will get a full
height extension to the side and a roof space conversion. With a kitchen,
two bathrooms and two bedrooms to sort I'll have loadsa questions in the
near future.

Can all those wonderful people that have answered questions for me over the
years, please keep an eye to my posts in the next month? (TIA).

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light
isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go
dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

Thanks,
Suzanne.

Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light
isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go
dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

Thanks,
Suzanne.

I dont understand what youre trying to achieve, or to put it another
way, why you want a light rigged to the door.


NT

On 3 Dec 2006 05:54:14 -0800, wrote:

Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light
isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go
dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

Thanks,
Suzanne.

I dont understand what youre trying to achieve, or to put it another
way, why you want a light rigged to the door.


NT

His girls won't go into the bathroom unless the light is on first.

What he needs is something like a passive infared outdoor light with a
timer of say 4 or 5 minutes?

I suppose really he could take the innards out of the outdoor passive
light encase them into a metal box and mount the sensor also in the
box.

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
wrote:

Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it
will have a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light
left on. Is this possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls
won't go in if the light isn't on already. But it would need a
motion sensor too so it doesn't go dark while they are parked
reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor outside the door as it
is at the very top of the stairs and would get triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation
together?

Thanks,
Suzanne.

I dont understand what youre trying to achieve, or to put it another
way, why you want a light rigged to the door.


NT

I think she wants the light to come on and go off automatically while the
bathroom is occupied so that it cannot be left on accidentally.

To the OP: You probably need *two* switches wired in parallel - so that when
either or both are closed the light will be on. The first is the sort of
switch which is often used in stairwells in blocks of flats. It's a spring
loaded button rather than a toggle switch, plus a timer. When the button is
pressed, the light comes on and stays on for a pre-determined time - maybe
one minute. The second is a PIR (passive infra-red) switch as used on
outside lights etc. This needs to be inside the bathroom.

All you have then to do is the press the button before going into the
bathroom. The light will come on immediately and remain on for as long as
there is someone in the bathroom.
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!

Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible?

A bathroom is a "non habitable" room for building regs purposes, so you
can do without a firedoor if you want. This would allow use of a door
with a frosted glass panel for example.

Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light
isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go
dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

You could do all sorts of nifty stuff, although I expect a switch with
neon indicator would do well enough. You could make it two way switched
so that you can turn the light off without having to go up there.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 13:27:13 -0000 someone who may be "Suz"
wrote this:-

Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible?

How will it detect that the bathroom is in use? One that goes on and
off sequentially could be fooled by opening and closing the door.
One that goes on when the door is locked means the light would not
be on until one shut and locked the door.

As others have said a neon indicate somewhere would be useful for
you to see what is going on. You are going to use energy saving
bulbs?


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

"Suz" wrote in message
...
....
First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have
a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the
light isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it
doesn't go dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a
motion senor outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and
would get triggered too often...

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion sensor
switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push the switch
before opening the door and, if they are still inside after the timer runs
out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

Colin Bignell

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion sensor
switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push the switch
before opening the door and, if they are still inside after the timer runs
out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion sensor
switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push the switch
before opening the door and, if they are still inside after the timer runs
out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.

the motion sensor goes in the bowl, then it tells you when youre done.
Serously, this thread isnt making any sense in my brain yet. Is the
problem fear of ghosts?


NT

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
John Rumm wrote:

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a
motion sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls
could push the switch before opening the door and, if they are still
inside after the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the
light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.


I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which detects
the presence of a warm body.
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!

Suz wrote:
I first subscribed to this newsgroup about 4 years ago when we forst thought
about doing a renovation. Plans are now finally submitted and I'm making a
list of things to include for builder's quotes. The house will get a full
height extension to the side and a roof space conversion. With a kitchen,
two bathrooms and two bedrooms to sort I'll have loadsa questions in the
near future.
snip

I would be looking at an extractor timer, that's designed to time
extractor fans.
You connect up the extractor timer to a momentry switch, and a switched output from the PIR in parallel, to a momentary switch.
This way, you get an extra 5 mins (or whatever you set it to) whenever
the PIR triggers, or whenever the light is pressed). Run the fan from
the same circuit.

Easy alternative.
1W LED light, on all the time, that's enough to see where you are going
to turn the main switch on.

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 18:22:11 UTC, "Roger Mills"
wrote:

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
John Rumm wrote:

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a
motion sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls
could push the switch before opening the door and, if they are still
inside after the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the
light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.


I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which detects
the presence of a warm body.

And there might not be any motions if you're constipated...
--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
Avenue Supplies, http://avenuesupplies.co.uk

Roger Mills wrote:

I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which detects
the presence of a warm body.

IME, they still stop triggering unless the warm body is moving (at least
some of the time)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In message , Roger Mills
wrote

I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which detects
the presence of a warm body.


PIR work by detecting a change in radiation (heat) falling on the sensor
- they are motion detectors.


--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 18:22:11 -0000 someone who may be "Roger Mills"
wrote this:-

I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which detects
the presence of a warm body.

Not quite. They detect the movement of a warm body.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

The message
from John Rumm contains these words:

IME, they still stop triggering unless the warm body is moving (at least
some of the time)

Quite. If you look at a PIR sensor you'll see there's a moulded plastic
fresnel lens that's split into many patches. The idea is that the sensor
only sees strips of the coverage area, only those parts focussed by the
lens. The bits in between aren't visible to the sensor. The detector
works by seeing a sudden change as you walk from a bit that's covered to
a bit that isn't - or vice versa.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

On Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:02:57 GMT, SirBenjamin wrote:

I suppose really he could take the innards out of the outdoor passive
light encase them into a metal box and mount the sensor also in the
box.

You don't have to do that you can get stand alone PIRs. I think one of
the recent CPC flyers had a ceiling mounted 360 deg jobbie.

But the big snag is that PIRs do need movement to keep 'em triggered.
Stand or sit still long enough and the lights go out. I fitted a PIR to
the kitchen light in my flat so I didn't leave the 180W of light burning
away every evening. Worked very well, light came on as I entered and a
wave when it goes off whilst doing the washing up.

Donno if an intruder alarm PIR with the "anti creep" feature would be of
any use, would need an interface and power supply though.

Education of daughters to enter darkened rooms would be better in the
long term but appreciate that in the short term the technological
solution has a lot going for it. Darkness mid wee excepted... I can hear
the scream from here!

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 21:47:33 GMT someone who may be Guy King
wrote this:-

Quite. If you look at a PIR sensor you'll see there's a moulded plastic
fresnel lens that's split into many patches. The idea is that the sensor
only sees strips of the coverage area, only those parts focussed by the
lens. The bits in between aren't visible to the sensor. The detector
works by seeing a sudden change as you walk from a bit that's covered to
a bit that isn't - or vice versa.

Provided the warm object is moving at more than the minimum speed
which the detector will detect. If the warm object is stationary or
moving slowly enough it will not be detected. That is why
sophisticated alarm systems tend not to use such sensors.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

The message
from David Hansen contains these words:

Provided the warm object is moving at more than the minimum speed
which the detector will detect. If the warm object is stationary or
moving slowly enough it will not be detected. That is why
sophisticated alarm systems tend not to use such sensors.

Because of the way the lens works it's very hard to move slowly enough
to not trigger the sensor. What does work is a thermal blanket. Even a
carboard sheild will work in most cases.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion
sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push
the switch before opening the door and, if they are still inside after
the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new meaning
in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit disconcerting if
you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.

The PIR light switch I use in my bathroom can trigger an on period of up to
20 minutes from one detection. If you haven't moved in that time, you are
probably past needing any light.

Colin Bignell

"Roger Mills" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
wrote:

Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it
will have a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light
left on. Is this possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls
won't go in if the light isn't on already. But it would need a
motion sensor too so it doesn't go dark while they are parked
reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor outside the door as it
is at the very top of the stairs and would get triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation
together?

Thanks,
Suzanne.

I dont understand what youre trying to achieve, or to put it another
way, why you want a light rigged to the door.


NT

I think she wants the light to come on and go off automatically while the
bathroom is occupied so that it cannot be left on accidentally.

To the OP: You probably need *two* switches wired in parallel - so that
when either or both are closed the light will be on. The first is the sort
of switch which is often used in stairwells in blocks of flats. It's a
spring loaded button rather than a toggle switch, plus a timer. When the
button is pressed, the light comes on and stays on for a pre-determined
time - maybe one minute. The second is a PIR (passive infra-red) switch as
used on outside lights etc. This needs to be inside the bathroom.

All you have then to do is the press the button before going into the
bathroom. The light will come on immediately and remain on for as long as
there is someone in the bathroom.

You have understood the question perfectly Roger.

That sounds almost perfect. If I could replace the push button with one
that get flicked by the door opening.... I'm imagining a ceiling mounted
dangly thing that the door bumps when opened an inch... don't know if this
exists.

"Owain" wrote in message
...
Suz wrote:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will
have a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is
this possible? Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if
the light isn't on already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it
doesn't go dark while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a
motion senor outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and
would get triggered too often.

Bathrooms don't usually need fire doors even on loft conversions, because
they are classed as being a low risk source of ignition or fuel.

Why not have a light switch with neon indicator outside the bathroom door,
with a repeater neon indicator somewhere downstairs?

Owain

Hiking up the stairs to switch it off or shouting "Turn that flaming light
of"? I prefer it to happen automatically.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will
have a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is
this possible?

A bathroom is a "non habitable" room for building regs purposes, so you
can do without a firedoor if you want. This would allow use of a door with
a frosted glass panel for example.

Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light isn't on
already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go dark
while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

You could do all sorts of nifty stuff, although I expect a switch with
neon indicator would do well enough. You could make it two way switched so
that you can turn the light off without having to go up there.

--
Cheers,

John.

Ah this is what Owain probably meant. Sounds quite good, but again it
depends on me passing and noticing at some point. If it is too far away
from the bathroom, how would I know if one of the wee beggars are in there
or not?

"David Hansen" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 13:27:13 -0000 someone who may be "Suz"
wrote this:-

Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will have
a
fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is this
possible?

How will it detect that the bathroom is in use? One that goes on and
off sequentially could be fooled by opening and closing the door.
One that goes on when the door is locked means the light would not
be on until one shut and locked the door.

As others have said a neon indicate somewhere would be useful for
you to see what is going on. You are going to use energy saving
bulbs?

We intend using energy saving bulbs everywhere. We have them in most rooms
now and have got used to the dim startup.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion
sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push
the switch before opening the door and, if they are still inside after
the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new meaning
in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit disconcerting if
you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.

Yes I was wondering about that. More importantly lounging in the bath - you
wouldn't want to have to get and dance the mambo to get it back on.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Suz wrote:

First question:
Thinking of a door activated sensor for the attic bathroom as it will
have a fire door and I won't be passing to notice the light left on. Is
this possible?

A bathroom is a "non habitable" room for building regs purposes, so you
can do without a firedoor if you want. This would allow use of a door with
a frosted glass panel for example.

Not motion sensor only because my girls won't go in if the light isn't on
already. But it would need a motion sensor too so it doesn't go dark
while they are parked reading the Beano. Can't put a motion senor
outside the door as it is at the very top of the stairs and would get
triggered too often.

Any example of a 'door' switch and motion sensor in operation together?

You could do all sorts of nifty stuff, although I expect a switch with
neon indicator would do well enough. You could make it two way switched so
that you can turn the light off without having to go up there.

John, just thought of a reason this is a VERY BAD IDEA. The boys in the
house. Dark and creepy night. Sister on the loo. Control of lights from
outside the bathroom.... Brings back memories of my older brother rigging
up a scarcrow with a lamp behind, telling me there was someone in my room,
pushing me in, and holding the door shut. Shudder.

the motion sensor goes in the bowl, then it tells you when youre done.
Serously, this thread isnt making any sense in my brain yet. Is the
problem fear of ghosts?


NT

I probably used the wrong terms.
2 issues: Most importantly, not having lights left on when the room is not
in use; secondly a fear of dark that means a simple motion sensor won't
suffice because they wouldn't go far enough in to set it of.

"Roger Mills" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
John Rumm wrote:

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a
motion sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls
could push the switch before opening the door and, if they are still
inside after the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the
light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.


I wouldn't use a motion sensor - I'd simply use a PIR detector which
detects the presence of a warm body.
--
Cheers,
Roger

How would this cope is someone was in the shower/bath?

The PIR light switch I use in my bathroom can trigger an on period of up
to 20 minutes from one detection. If you haven't moved in that time, you
are probably past needing any light.

Colin Bignell
Colin, Colin. Girls in a bathroom? 20 minutes staring at complexion is
probably standard.

"Ian Stirling" wrote in message
...
Suz wrote:
I first subscribed to this newsgroup about 4 years ago when we forst
thought
about doing a renovation. Plans are now finally submitted and I'm making
a
list of things to include for builder's quotes. The house will get a full
height extension to the side and a roof space conversion. With a
kitchen,
two bathrooms and two bedrooms to sort I'll have loadsa questions in the
near future.
snip

I would be looking at an extractor timer, that's designed to time
extractor fans.
You connect up the extractor timer to a momentry switch, and a switched
output from the PIR in parallel, to a momentary switch.
This way, you get an extra 5 mins (or whatever you set it to) whenever
the PIR triggers, or whenever the light is pressed). Run the fan from
the same circuit.

Good point whatever lighting solution is chosen.

Easy alternative.
1W LED light, on all the time, that's enough to see where you are going
to turn the main switch on.

I think this is probably a good idea for a backup, no matter what is put in.

On Mon, 4 Dec 2006 04:55:05 -0000 someone who may be "Suz"
wrote this:-

We intend using energy saving bulbs everywhere. We have them in most rooms
now and have got used to the dim startup.

Some start with a high initial light output and are ideal for places
like bathrooms.

With energy saving bulbs I wonder how much complication is
worthwhile, in energy as well as financial terms.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 22:55:18 GMT someone who may be Guy King
wrote this:-

Because of the way the lens works it's very hard to move slowly enough
to not trigger the sensor.

I can manage it.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

"Suz" wrote in message
...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:

How about a push to operate time switch outside the door and a motion
sensor switch in the bathroom, wired in parallel? The girls could push
the switch before opening the door and, if they are still inside after
the timer runs out, the motion sensor should keep the light on.

The difficulty with motion sensors (the phrase takes on a whow new
meaning in a loo!), is what happens whey you stop moving... Bit
disconcerting if you are sat on the loo at the lights go off.

Yes I was wondering about that. More importantly lounging in the bath -
you wouldn't want to have to get and dance the mambo to get it back on.

Waving a hand works, although the switch in my bathroom is set to five
minutes and I have rarely had a problem with it not detecting some motion
during that time.

Colin Bignell

On Mon, 4 Dec 2006 04:45:49 -0000, Suz wrote:

All you have then to do is the press the button before going into the
bathroom. The light will come on immediately and remain on for as long
as there is someone in the bathroom.

You have understood the question perfectly Roger.

That sounds almost perfect. If I could replace the push button with
one that get flicked by the door opening.... I'm imagining a ceiling
mounted dangly thing that the door bumps when opened an inch... don't
know if this exists.

Or something like the three at the bottom of:

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Ind...Kitchen_Lighti
ng/Switches_Miniture/index.html

http://snipurl.com/1402g

This does mean if the door is left open the light is on and if the person
in the bathroom doesn't keep moving the when the door is shut the light
will go off after the PIR timeout.

If you make the PIR timeout say 20 mins I doubt anyone could stay still
that long unless asleep in the bath. The lights going out may also be a
good indication that prehaps they have been in the bathroom long
enough... Looks like a hallway switch (push for preset time) and a PIR
with long timeout is your best bet, be aware that CFLs don't like short
cycles.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

The message
from "Suz" contains these words:

Yes I was wondering about that. More importantly lounging in the bath
- you
wouldn't want to have to get and dance the mambo to get it back on.

The one in our downstairs loo just needs a lazy flap of the hand.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Suz wrote:
The PIR light switch I use in my bathroom can trigger an on period of up
to 20 minutes from one detection. If you haven't moved in that time, you
are probably past needing any light.

Colin Bignell
Colin, Colin. Girls in a bathroom? 20 minutes staring at complexion is
probably standard.

One would hope that by the time they're at that stage, they've worked
out the whole fear of the dark thing...

Suz wrote:

the motion sensor goes in the bowl, then it tells you when youre done.
Serously, this thread isnt making any sense in my brain yet. Is the
problem fear of ghosts?

I probably used the wrong terms.
2 issues: Most importantly, not having lights left on when the room is not
in use; secondly a fear of dark that means a simple motion sensor won't
suffice because they wouldn't go far enough in to set it of.

Comprendi. having 2 lights works well, one is a 3w cfl and is left
always on. No need for motion sensing or remote switching as the bigger
light doesnt get used most of the time. Ubersimple.


NT