Hello
Just put up some fencing. What a weekend.
Dug tight hole, put post in, filled with concrete, tampered down, and
next day put in panels. Great - job looks pretty good.
However, only after we finished, I noticed the cement hadn't gone down
as much as I expected.
Turns out, its unlikley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

Now - fence is perfectly straight, but concrete isn't yet set (48
hours) - its very loose (as one may expect!!!!!). This MAY be down to
the ground being wet and/or the amount of rain we had.

Anyway - you see where I'm coming from......

No way are we going to dig it all up again to redo - its not worth it
unless the fence falls down. No way can we dig around and change the
concrete.

Bit of a f**k up really.

I was wondering, is it worth making a cement/water mix, and pouring
this around the base of each post? If the "concrete" is simpy badly
stuck balast, surely this may help it bond? Saying this as I remeber
the solid lump I ended up with after another DIY task. If so, how much
cement per how much water?


As you can imagine, I don't want to tell the wife the entire weekend
with mates helping was a waste due to crap concrete - I'm pleased I
have a wife that "helps"

So - would my suggestion help? Would it be better than nothing and
praying? Or is everything okay; 10:1 mix is okay; and its just due to
the weather? I know my suggestion may not be normal practice - but
pretty worried!

Much appreciated.

MM

wrote:
Hello
Just put up some fencing. What a weekend.
Dug tight hole, put post in, filled with concrete, tampered down, and
next day put in panels. Great - job looks pretty good.
However, only after we finished, I noticed the cement hadn't gone down
as much as I expected.
Turns out, its unlikley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

Now - fence is perfectly straight, but concrete isn't yet set (48
hours) - its very loose (as one may expect!!!!!). This MAY be down to
the ground being wet and/or the amount of rain we had.

Anyway - you see where I'm coming from......

No way are we going to dig it all up again to redo - its not worth it
unless the fence falls down. No way can we dig around and change the
concrete.

Bit of a f**k up really.

I was wondering, is it worth making a cement/water mix, and pouring
this around the base of each post? If the "concrete" is simpy badly
stuck balast, surely this may help it bond? Saying this as I remeber
the solid lump I ended up with after another DIY task. If so, how
much cement per how much water?


As you can imagine, I don't want to tell the wife the entire weekend
with mates helping was a waste due to crap concrete - I'm pleased I
have a wife that "helps"

So - would my suggestion help? Would it be better than nothing and
praying? Or is everything okay; 10:1 mix is okay; and its just due to
the weather? I know my suggestion may not be normal practice - but
pretty worried!

Much appreciated.

MM

Just leave it as it is, even ballast is better than soil for infill, and I
suspect there's /some/ cement in the mix, IME even a 20:1 mix sets,
eventually, although not as fast or hard as a proper mix....that said, your
10:1 mix won't be far off normal strength if you've used ballast, ballast is
around 2:1 stone to sand, meaning your mix is around 6 stone, 3 sand and one
cement....maybe you've come across a patch at the top where the rain has
washed the cement out of the mix before it's had chance to set.

The message .com
from contains these words:

Turns out, its unlikley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

It'll probably go solid eventually. More likely if it was rammed well
down. Left loose and raggedy it won't be very strong no matter what you
do/did with it.

As Phil L says - protect it from the rain.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Guy King wrote:
The message .com
from contains these words:

Turns out, its unlikley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

It'll probably go solid eventually. More likely if it was rammed well
down. Left loose and raggedy it won't be very strong no matter what you
do/did with it.

As Phil L says - protect it from the rain.


If its set crunchy, the rain won't hurt..only in the first 24 hours is
rain a problem as it may leach cement from the surface, leaving it powdery..

Now this is how I think cement works.

You have stones. In order to stop them moving you add sand, This should
be enough to just fill the gaps between the stones. Now you add cement
to fill the gaps between the sand...if you fully fill them that cement
is as strong and as impervious to water as it ever can be.

Too much cement, and the cement becomes the weak point. Too little and
the sand has voids in it..so the mixture gets porous friable and WEAK.

Now, in all cases of concrete posts I have gug up or pushed over, it was
not the concrete that gave way. It was the soil around the concrete.
Ergo my take is that the concrete itself was overly strong, and more of
it and weaker, would have done just as well.

Conclusion? Just leave it to set solid. It will be more than good enough.

Ive worked with 10:1 when I ran out of cement..bricklaying..yes, its a
bit crunchy and you can scrape it out with a chisel or a trowel, but it
still set hard enough to do the job.

The advice I got for setting fence posts was to get a lump of concrete
on the end of a post and set as deep in the ground as I was willing to
achieve. I agree that the strength of the mix matters little. At my old
house (which was very wind exposed in the middle of the fens), I simply
bored deep, positioned the posts, poured in dry postfix mixture, poured
a bucket of water on top. 7 years later those fences are still
perfectly upright. Depth and mass.

wrote:
Hello
Just put up some fencing. What a weekend.
Dug tight hole, put post in, filled with concrete, tampered down, and
next day put in panels. Great - job looks pretty good.
However, only after we finished, I noticed the cement hadn't gone down
as much as I expected.
Turns out, its unlikley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

Now - fence is perfectly straight, but concrete isn't yet set (48
hours) - its very loose (as one may expect!!!!!). This MAY be down to
the ground being wet and/or the amount of rain we had.

Anyway - you see where I'm coming from......

No way are we going to dig it all up again to redo - its not worth it
unless the fence falls down. No way can we dig around and change the
concrete.

Bit of a f**k up really.

I was wondering, is it worth making a cement/water mix, and pouring
this around the base of each post? If the "concrete" is simpy badly
stuck balast, surely this may help it bond? Saying this as I remeber
the solid lump I ended up with after another DIY task. If so, how much
cement per how much water?


As you can imagine, I don't want to tell the wife the entire weekend
with mates helping was a waste due to crap concrete - I'm pleased I
have a wife that "helps"

So - would my suggestion help? Would it be better than nothing and
praying? Or is everything okay; 10:1 mix is okay; and its just due to
the weather? I know my suggestion may not be normal practice - but
pretty worried!

Much appreciated.

MM

just leave em they'll be fine, I've done some in the past by digging a
hole and filling round the post with dry mix (but at 6:1) and leaving
it to the elements, set solid in a few weeks :-). easier than getting
amicer to some places !

Staffbull wrote:
wrote:

Just put up some fencing. What a weekend.
Dug tight hole, put post in, filled with concrete, tampered down, and
next day put in panels.
However, only after we finished, I noticed the cement [stock?] hadn't gone down
as much as I expected.
Turns out, its unlikeley the requested 6:1 mix was made - more likely
10:1. (Don't ask - but put it down to a novice mistake)

Now - fence is perfectly straight, but concrete isn't yet set (48
hours) - its very loose (as one may expect!!!!!). This MAY be down to
the ground being wet and/or the amount of rain we had.

Anyway - you see where I'm coming from......

No way are we going to dig it all up again to redo - its not worth it
unless the fence falls down. No way can we dig around and change the
concrete.

Bit of a f**k up really.

I was wondering, is it worth making a cement/water mix, and pouring
this around the base of each post? If the "concrete" is simply badly
stuck ballast, surely this may help it bond? Saying this as I remember
the solid lump I ended up with after another DIY task. If so, how much
cement per how much water?

So - would my suggestion help? Would it be better than nothing and
praying? Or is everything okay; 10:1 mix is okay; and its just due to
the weather? I know my suggestion may not be normal practice - but
pretty worried!

just leave em they'll be fine, I've done some in the past by digging a
hole and filling round the post with dry mix (but at 6:1) and leaving
it to the elements, set solid in a few weeks

I don't know if I'd take them up but I'd be prepared to if they do
fail. What a plonker to mess that up and save how much money in the
process?

But even had he put the right mix in, he shouldn't have put the panels
in for a week or so.

Weatherlawyer wrote:

I don't know if I'd take them up but I'd be prepared to if they do
fail. What a plonker to mess that up and save how much money in the
process?

But even had he put the right mix in, he shouldn't have put the panels
in for a week or so.

The panels go in at the same time as the posts, I've only ever known two
people to do it that way, IE to get all the posts in first then try and fit
the mis-shapen and downright 'miles out' panels in later, both of them only
ever did one fence[1]....the procedure is dig two holes at 'about' the right
spacings, get one post in, then all the panels, then insert the next post up
to it/them and concrete both posts in, then dig the third hole and repeat.


[1]
both took 3 times longer than budgeted for, both were an absolute mess when
finished and also used up dozens of the old style carborundum disks (before
D-disks)...the reason is that concrete panels are rarely the same length,
and the timber ones are a law unto themselves

ever did one fence[1]....the procedure is dig two holes at 'about' the
right spacings, get one post in, then all the panels, then insert the next
post up to it/them and concrete both posts in, then dig the third hole and
repeat.

Exactly. That's how I did mine. Otherwise you're never going to get it mm
perfect when you fit the panels.

Christian.