I've noticed that more and more Li-ion tools are being made available,
but given the careful charging and handling requirements of the
batteries are these going to be dangerous for site or DIY use?

There are many examples of Li-ion batteries exploding and injuring
users. And it is recommended that these batteries are not left
unattended when charging.

As these batteries are more likely to be knocked and sustain unnoticed
damage, I wondered if they can be trusted?

dg

dg wrote:
I've noticed that more and more Li-ion tools are being made available,
but given the careful charging and handling requirements of the
batteries are these going to be dangerous for site or DIY use?

There are many examples of Li-ion batteries exploding and injuring
users. And it is recommended that these batteries are not left
unattended when charging.

As these batteries are more likely to be knocked and sustain unnoticed
damage, I wondered if they can be trusted?


There is nothing inherently more dangerous about Li-ion or Li-poly than
NiCd and NiMH.

Many of the problems that have hit the news have been due to
manufacturing faults. Because the cells in these batteries are different
from the standard cylindrical configuration, manufacturers have had to
re-tool in order to manufacture them. This is the first major re-tool in
a very long time, and it's just taken a bit of time to iron out some
difficulties.

The advantages of Li-ion are huge - much higher power density, no heavy
metal content, great charge-discharge characteristics, the list goes on.

For a glimpse of what can be done with Li-ion, take a look at this:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html


--
Grunff

Grunff wrote:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html

"It is truly an outstanding example of British innovation at it's
best!"

Pity we never invented the metric system isn't it. Pity someone never
told their advertisers. I would never consider looking seriously at an
ad that gave the specs in French. Nothing against the French of course.

But if the morons overlooked the fact that we drive miles in this
country and still consume fuel by the gallon despite what the arses in
government want us to do, I might be looking at a car designed to
travel on the wrong side of the street for my tastes.

But if the morons overlooked the fact that we drive miles in this
country and still consume fuel by the gallon

It does give the fuel consumption as 80 mpg. And where do you buy
fuel by the gallon these days. I measure my fuel consumption in
miles/litre.

In message . com,
Weatherlawyer writes

Grunff wrote:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html

"It is truly an outstanding example of British innovation at it's
best!"

Pity we never invented the metric system isn't it. Pity someone never
told their advertisers. I would never consider looking seriously at an
ad that gave the specs in French. Nothing against the French of course.

But if the morons overlooked the fact that we drive miles in this
country and still consume fuel by the gallon despite what the arses in
government want us to do, I might be looking at a car designed to
travel on the wrong side of the street for my tastes.

WTF are you whittering on about this time ?

--
geoff

On Sun, 03 Sep 2006 18:39:14 GMT, raden wrote:

In message . com,
Weatherlawyer writes

Grunff wrote:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html

"It is truly an outstanding example of British innovation at it's
best!"

Pity we never invented the metric system isn't it. Pity someone never
told their advertisers. I would never consider looking seriously at an
ad that gave the specs in French. Nothing against the French of course.

But if the morons overlooked the fact that we drive miles in this
country and still consume fuel by the gallon despite what the arses in
government want us to do, I might be looking at a car designed to
travel on the wrong side of the street for my tastes.

WTF are you whittering on about this time ?

Its a Sunday, he starts early.

in 565679 20060903 193914 raden wrote:
In message . com,
Weatherlawyer writes

Grunff wrote:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html

"It is truly an outstanding example of British innovation at it's
best!"

Pity we never invented the metric system isn't it. Pity someone never
told their advertisers. I would never consider looking seriously at an
ad that gave the specs in French. Nothing against the French of course.

But if the morons overlooked the fact that we drive miles in this
country and still consume fuel by the gallon despite what the arses in
government want us to do, I might be looking at a car designed to
travel on the wrong side of the street for my tastes.

WTF are you whittering on about this time ?

It's still 1906 for a lot of people in this country. Don't disturb them.

"Grunff" wrote in message
...
dg wrote:
I've noticed that more and more Li-ion tools are being made available,
but given the careful charging and handling requirements of the
batteries are these going to be dangerous for site or DIY use?

There are many examples of Li-ion batteries exploding and injuring
users. And it is recommended that these batteries are not left
unattended when charging.

As these batteries are more likely to be knocked and sustain unnoticed
damage, I wondered if they can be trusted?


There is nothing inherently more dangerous about Li-ion or Li-poly than
NiCd and NiMH.

Many of the problems that have hit the news have been due to manufacturing
faults. Because the cells in these batteries are different from the
standard cylindrical configuration, manufacturers have had to re-tool in
order to manufacture them. This is the first major re-tool in a very long
time, and it's just taken a bit of time to iron out some difficulties.

The advantages of Li-ion are huge - much higher power density, no heavy
metal content, great charge-discharge characteristics, the list goes on.

For a glimpse of what can be done with Li-ion, take a look at this:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html


--
Grunff

Very impressive, would love to see it go

My only worry is there are NO mechanical brake. Fully reliant on
software/hardware for the regen braking!!!!

On 2006-09-03 16:35:48 +0100, "Tim Morley" tim.morley*REMOVE
said:


"Grunff" wrote in message
...


There is nothing inherently more dangerous about Li-ion or Li-poly than
NiCd and NiMH.

Many of the problems that have hit the news have been due to
manufacturing faults. Because the cells in these batteries are
different from the standard cylindrical configuration, manufacturers
have had to re-tool in order to manufacture them. This is the first
major re-tool in a very long time, and it's just taken a bit of time to
iron out some difficulties.

The advantages of Li-ion are huge - much higher power density, no heavy
metal content, great charge-discharge characteristics, the list goes on.

For a glimpse of what can be done with Li-ion, take a look at this:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html


--
Grunff

Very impressive, would love to see it go

My only worry is there are NO mechanical brake. Fully reliant on
software/hardware for the regen braking!!!!

Don't worry about that..... Grunff wrote the software. He's very good :-)

On Sun, 03 Sep 2006 13:52:42 +0100, Grunff wrote:

http://www.pmlflightlink.com/archive/news_mini.html

"No mechanical brakes" it sez.
I note the blocks under the tyres in the top picture :-)

dg wrote:

I've noticed that more and more Li-ion tools are being made available,
but given the careful charging and handling requirements of the
batteries are these going to be dangerous for site or DIY use?

No. The problem is specific to laptop batteries, where extra thin
separators are used to squeeze more capacity into a small space.


NT

The message .com
from contains these words:

No. The problem is specific to laptop batteries, where extra thin
separators are used to squeeze more capacity into a small space.

Not just laptops. Model aeroplanes have had a few go pop, too.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Guy King wrote:
The message .com
from contains these words:

No. The problem is specific to laptop batteries, where extra thin
separators are used to squeeze more capacity into a small space.

Not just laptops. Model aeroplanes have had a few go pop, too.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

And the ones for cameras, phones and small torches too (Cr123). I
understood it was the technology not the actual design which is
sensitive.

I've even read of problems with non rechargeable Li-ions

dg

On 3 Sep 2006 11:38:06 -0700, "dg" wrote:


Guy King wrote:
The message .com
from contains these words:

No. The problem is specific to laptop batteries, where extra thin
separators are used to squeeze more capacity into a small space.

Not just laptops. Model aeroplanes have had a few go pop, too.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

And the ones for cameras, phones and small torches too (Cr123). I
understood it was the technology not the actual design which is
sensitive.


And I've had difficulty getting such posted from the US .. (laptop
battery).

And for the car .. 80 mpg indeed .. ;-)

Oh and .. "Emissions - Zero for 4 hours" .. so charged by
hydroelectric then?

Steps back and waits for Dr Drivel .. ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

T i m wrote:

And for the car .. 80 mpg indeed .. ;-)

Oh and .. "Emissions - Zero for 4 hours" .. so charged by
hydroelectric then?


Who cares - have you seen how fast it is??


--
Grunff

"dg" writes:

As these batteries are more likely to be knocked and sustain unnoticed
damage, I wondered if they can be trusted?

I think there's definitely something there yes.

They are more difficult to make than what went before, nothing like as
robust, poor at high rate discharge (where lead acid and NiCd excel)
and prone to manufacturers pushing limits to make unrealistic
capacities.

Jon

That is yes I think they are a little untrustworthy.

Jon

I wrote:

"dg" writes:

As these batteries are more likely to be knocked and sustain unnoticed
damage, I wondered if they can be trusted?

I think there's definitely something there yes.

They are more difficult to make than what went before, nothing like as
robust, poor at high rate discharge (where lead acid and NiCd excel)
and prone to manufacturers pushing limits to make unrealistic
capacities.

Jon