Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy

"Wordy" wrote in message
ps.com...
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.


That sounds ecologically and economically ghastly - the resource and energy
costs would seem huge for the benefit of the few days a year we have high
temperatures. Why not DIY a swamp cooler or build a cooler like this
http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/%7Egmilburn/ac/pete_ac.html , rather than pay
over the odds for a better way of burning scarce hydrocarbons.

Andy

Br

Wordy

"Andy McKenzie" wrote in message
...

That sounds ecologically and economically ghastly - the resource and
energy costs would seem huge for the benefit of the few days a year we
have high temperatures. Why not DIY a swamp cooler or build a cooler like
this http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/%7Egmilburn/ac/pete_ac.html , rather than
pay over the odds for a better way of burning scarce hydrocarbons.

Erm - isn't the cooler in that site as bad as an AC unit?

cheers,
clive

Clive George wrote:
Why not DIY a swamp cooler or build a cooler like
this http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/%7Egmilburn/ac/pete_ac.html , rather than
pay over the odds for a better way of burning scarce hydrocarbons.

Erm - isn't the cooler in that site as bad as an AC unit?

No, it's worse, uglier and less efficient.
http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/~gmilburn/ac/

It's a coil of copper tube, fixed to a domestic fan and with cold water
pumped through the coil. The cooling is done by a domestic freezer. For
an engineering student, it's pretty bad.

The message om
from "Wordy" contains these words:

so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q

Don't forget that you need both boxes - and they're £270something /each/
not for the whole system.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Wordy wrote:
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy
I fitted one last year in an attic. Relatively straight forward. I tend
not to go in the attic at all in the very hot weather. Although the ac
works well the roof is so hot it is like standing next to an extremely
hot radiator and no amount of cooling from the ac will remedy that. It
is perfectly adequate in moderateley hot weather but you situation is
not quite the same as me trying to use the loft. This is for a model
railway by the way.
As to using energy to make use of a facility that you have I don't see
what the problem is.
That haven't outlawed V8 4x4's yet or Jags and vitually every office
and supermarket in the country is airconditioned.
When Tony Blair gives up jetting overseas on holiday then I will know
it is time to worry.
That would be the place to start.

Kevin

Andy McKenzie wrote:


That sounds ecologically and economically ghastly - the resource and energy
costs would seem huge for the benefit of the few days a year we have high
temperatures. Why not DIY a swamp cooler or build a cooler like this
http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/%7Egmilburn/ac/pete_ac.html , rather than pay
over the odds for a better way of burning scarce hydrocarbons.



...or just a couple of fans and some insulation.

"Wordy" wrote in message
ps.com...
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy


Why don't you insulate the shed?
Probably cheaper to do, and would keep the heat out?

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 13:49:36 +0100, Wordy wrote
(in article om):

Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy


As a starting point, it would make sense to insulate this on the inside with
50mm of Celotex. This is a reasonable compromise between effectiveness of
insulation and loss of space.

The effect would be that you could use a smaller AC unit and obtain good
results with probably 2kW or so of cooling vs. about 10 or more if you don't.

Wordy wrote:
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy


Used to use a portable A/C unit, with a hose out of the window, in our
tiny "toy room" - 9ft by 6ft, 2 beefy computers and two bodies for
myself and the wife to play silly computer games for 12 hrs a day. The
room is west facing and catches the full sun from mid-day through to
sun-down. Relatively new build house - well insulated with double
glazing (of course).

The room was unbearable.

The portable A/C unit worked as well as could be expected, but having to
vent through a window, it drew warm air back into the room. Noisy, and
have to be emptied (condensate) every three or four hours. In the end,
gave it away on Freecycle.

Now, got a 9,000 BTU split unit from B&Q. Despite some neighbourly
objections to having the outdoor unit on the side of the house
(something I'm trying to resolve, despite B&Q's absolutely crap
ordering/delivery service - soon going to hit 8 weeks from the original
order, still with no delivery!), it actually works very well. It
certainly cools this room (which I'm currently imprisoned in, from the
heat of the rest of the house) and will gradually cool the rest of the
house. We find that it cools the bedroom (next room) sufficiently that
we can actually have a decent nights sleep in this weather (for anyone
googling this later, currently hitting 34-36C mid-afternoon, on a
mid-July day).

Not only does it cool, but it de-humidifies as well - probably as big of
an issue in maintaining a pleasant atmosphere. The drain pipe for the
condensate is currently dripping about every second, that should give
you an idea of how much water it is extracting from the air.

The indoor unit is quiet (you can hear it, but its quieter than a desk
fan, for example). The system also doubles up as a climate-controlled
heater/cooler, to maintain a temperature, if you need such a device.

Total cost to us was some £450 for the two units, £15 for the wall
bracket and £15 for the core-drill. I've now got a 2m extension hose on
order (as mentioned above) - £65 to allow the unit to be floor standing
- the unit as delivered only has a 4m hose between indoor and outdoor
units.

Is it worth it?, well apart from the apathy from the neighbours which
I'm trying to resolve, just to be able to use the house in this weather
and to get a decent nights sleep is enough justification for me.

For those about to spout on about more insulation - that's fine provided
that you can keep the heat out of the room in the first place - 9 hours
in the sun through a 4.5' x 3.5' window, with 2 powerful computers and 2
large people and the insulation is exacerbating the problem because we
cannot dump the heat out of the house. The A/C was a solution to this
very problem.

Regarding after-sales support - well, I'm rapidly gaining an opinion of
what that's likely to be from B&Q - and there's no much in the way of
obvious support from the manufacturer - so I cannot comment.

Andy Hall wrote:

As a starting point, it would make sense to insulate this on the inside with
50mm of Celotex. This is a reasonable compromise between effectiveness of
insulation and loss of space.

Yup go along with that certainly. My workshop only has 50mm of jablite
insulation but it would be well within the capability of a moderate air
con unit to heat or cool it from that starting point. Without any
insulation however you would be fighting a loosing battle.

The effect would be that you could use a smaller AC unit and obtain good
results with probably 2kW or so of cooling vs. about 10 or more if you don't.

If you also fitted a heat pump type air con that would take care of
heating the building in the cooler parts of the year.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 22:34:04 +0100, John Rumm wrote
(in article ):

Andy Hall wrote:

As a starting point, it would make sense to insulate this on the inside
with
50mm of Celotex. This is a reasonable compromise between effectiveness of
insulation and loss of space.

Yup go along with that certainly. My workshop only has 50mm of jablite
insulation but it would be well within the capability of a moderate air
con unit to heat or cool it from that starting point. Without any
insulation however you would be fighting a loosing battle.

The effect would be that you could use a smaller AC unit and obtain good
results with probably 2kW or so of cooling vs. about 10 or more if you
don't.

If you also fitted a heat pump type air con that would take care of
heating the building in the cooler parts of the year.



Also, AIUI, heat pumps are subject to reduced VAT.

Wordy wrote:
Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it.

I'd have thought a couple of decent extractor fans would be a better
(cheaper, more efficient) place to start. If you can keep the air
moving it'll get rid of most of the heat, but clearly won't get the
temperature below that of outside (may not be a problem?).

Evaporative cooling maybe... hmm, would trickling water onto the
roof/walls be effective in neutralising the absorbed heat?


Kim.

Wordy wrote:
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

Br

Wordy

Insulate before considering ac, as has been said. But also I'd say
shade the whole thing (eg with a deciduous climber) before shelling out
on insulation. You may find thats all thats needed. And if you do need
to insulate, the shading will work with the insulation to reduce heat
input further.


NT

"Wordy" wrote in message
ps.com...
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

Start by adding shade (external to the shed, trees, sails, fence, etc.).
Its a lot cheaper to add shade to keep the heat off than it is to move it
later.
Even if you do buy AC you will still want the shade so that it doesn't have
to work too hard.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...

Also, AIUI, heat pumps are subject to reduced VAT.


5% VAT if fitted in a domestic environment.

On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 07:15:22 GMT, dennis@home wrote:

"Wordy" wrote in message
ps.com...
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

Start by adding shade (external to the shed, trees, sails, fence, etc.).
Its a lot cheaper to add shade to keep the heat off than it is to move it
later.
Even if you do buy AC you will still want the shade so that it doesn't have
to work too hard.

Yes, this was my thought too. The idea of spending a ton of money
trying to cool a garden shed for a few extra days a year doesn't
make sense to me.
Alternatively, why not spend the money on a paddling pool instead?

Pete


--
.................................................. .........................
.. never trust a man who, when left alone ...... Pete Lynch .
.. in a room with a tea cosy ...... Marlow, England .
.. doesn't try it on (Billy Connolly) .....................................

"Wordy" wrote in message
ps.com...
Hi,

Our wooden summer house in the garden (essentially a large shed) was
intended to be used as a kiddies play house, but with the recent hot
weather it is useless between 9am and 9pm, as it is too bl**dy hot !

I have been looking at whether to install an a/c unit into it. As the
building is about 6m x 3m I do not think a portable one is up to the
job, so I have been looking at the split units from B&Q and
global-cooling (www.global-cooling.co.uk) Does anyone have any
experience of installing these units, how good they are, and what the
backup and warranty are like. I have been looking at the DC invertor
models which apparently are more efficient, but I am not sure if this
marketing spiel or not.

I have read some posts on a refridgeration-engineer forum that slates
these DIY systems, but I am not sure if this is just sour grapes, as
they are losing out on business.

With my kids play house I insulated (50mm) the roof, covered with boarding
and fitted a fan in the apex. Wired up using tuff kiddie proof cable (like
SWA but the steel mesh) and outdoor rated switch and works well. Kids
disappear in and when they do come out don't appear to be too hot.