Hi,

I have moved into a new house and want to change the current light to a
new light. The current one is just your standard cord and bulb.

I have two pictures at the following link with shows the current light
and the new light fitting

http://khever.googlepages.com/lights


I unscrewed the light part that is closest to the ceiling (as seen in
current light picture) and as you can see there are about three brown
and three blue wires. For my new light there is only one slot for Live
and only one slot for Neutral. Am I supposed to join all the blue
wires together and put them into their repective slot i.e. Neutral. And
then do the same for the brown wires. As there is only one slot on the
new light fitting for Neutral and on slot for Live.


Thanks.

wrote in message
ups.com...


Hi,

I have moved into a new house and want to change the current light to a
new light. The current one is just your standard cord and bulb.

I have two pictures at the following link with shows the current light
and the new light fitting

http://khever.googlepages.com/lights


I unscrewed the light part that is closest to the ceiling (as seen in
current light picture) and as you can see there are about three brown
and three blue wires. For my new light there is only one slot for Live
and only one slot for Neutral. Am I supposed to join all the blue
wires together and put them into their repective slot i.e. Neutral.

No, because if you do and the light switch is OFF, the light will be on. If
you then turn the light switch ON, there will be a bit of a bang, the
breaker will trip and the switch contacts may be fused together.

You can see on your photo where the light L & N connect to, which is where
your new light must connect to. I presume there is no room under this new
light for the ceiling rose, in which case you have a problem. The correct
solution in this circumstance is to take up the floor above (assuming there
is one), fit the ceiling rose in the void and run the two core flex through
to the light.


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

wrote:
Hi,

I have moved into a new house and want to change the current light to a
new light. The current one is just your standard cord and bulb.

I have two pictures at the following link with shows the current light
and the new light fitting

http://khever.googlepages.com/lights


Your "current light" is called a ceiling rose and is a junction box for
the wires in the lighting ring, the switch and the light fitting.


I unscrewed the light part that is closest to the ceiling (as seen in
current light picture) and as you can see there are about three brown
and three blue wires. For my new light there is only one slot for Live
and only one slot for Neutral. Am I supposed to join all the blue

NO! The blue wires are not all joined together, they are joined in two
banks.

Your lights are wired in a ring with the supply going from one fitting
to the next with wires from each rose to it's respective lightswitch.

In your picture you have three blue neutral wires for the light
fitting, the wire from the previous light fitting in the ring and the
wire to the next fitting in the ring. In the middle are three live
wires from the previous fitting, to the next fitting and to the switch.
Then there are two wires, one from the switch and the brown one to the
fitting. The three wires in the middle are NOT connected to the other
two wires.

wires together and put them into their repective slot i.e. Neutral. And
then do the same for the brown wires. As there is only one slot on the
new light fitting for Neutral and on slot for Live.

Your fitting must connect in the same place as the old one. Don't
forget the earth wires, so you would need four "slots". Your fitting
only has three.

You need a proper junction box (or re-use the existing rose) in the
void above the ceiling.

MBQ

wrote:

Your "current light" is called a ceiling rose and is a junction box for
the wires in the lighting ring, the switch and the light fitting.

There is no such thing as a 'lighting ring', it's a terminological
inexactitude. What you have a light circuit wired on the loop-in
principle. The advice on wiring is correct though.

See http://www.diydata.com/planning/elec...ric_lights.htm.

You need to convert from loop-in (ceiling rose) to junction-box wiring
as shown clearly in the article.

R.

wrote:

You need a proper junction box (or re-use the existing rose) in the
void above the ceiling.

or simply add a one more of those terminal strip blocks to the new
fitting to give you the extra.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
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\================================================= ================/

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
wrote:

You need a proper junction box (or re-use the existing rose) in the
void above the ceiling.

or simply add a one more of those terminal strip blocks to the new
fitting to give you the extra.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

That's what I did a few days ago - the new light had only 3 terminals, so I
added a single terminal block from a strip. Since then I've been wondering
whether this is maybe bad practice or against regulations. Seems OK though.

The correct
solution in this circumstance is to take up the floor above (assuming there
is one), fit the ceiling rose in the void and run the two core flex through
to the light.

Or even more correctly use a 4 terminal junction box instaed of the rose.

Dave

FaultyFiesta wrote:

That's what I did a few days ago - the new light had only 3 terminals, so I
added a single terminal block from a strip. Since then I've been wondering
whether this is maybe bad practice or against regulations. Seems OK though.

It is pretty standard practice, and also ok with the regs so long as you
use an insulated terminal and it is fully enclosed in the box of the
light fitting (i.e. not hanging out somewhere where it could be
touched). If a chockie block terminal does not fit then a crimp usually
will.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Hi all,

Thanks for all the input. I am now starting to see clearer what i
should be doing.

Thank god i posted this topic cos i was just going to go ahead and do
it but then started to think - there has to be a reason for so many
wires!

To make things clearer for me. There is a void in the ceiling - so if
i could put the ceiling rose (block that has the wires together) up
into that and then use the existing single Live and existing single
Neutral wires that currently go down to the existing bulb for the new
light fitting. In that I put these two wires into the Live and Neutral
slot of the new light. Then would i take the yellow and green striped
wire as seen in current picture (which i presume is the earth wire) and
put this in the middle slot of the new light (the earth slot). Will
this work for me or should i do it another way.

One thing that concerns me about putting something into the void is
with the wires heating and possibly starting a fire. If i put that
block into the void - does the block get hot etc.. when the light is
on. My concern would be if it was touching against something etc.

Thanks again for all help.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi all,

Thanks for all the input. I am now starting to see clearer what i
should be doing.

Thank god i posted this topic cos i was just going to go ahead and do
it but then started to think - there has to be a reason for so many
wires!

To make things clearer for me. There is a void in the ceiling - so if
i could put the ceiling rose (block that has the wires together) up
into that and then use the existing single Live and existing single
Neutral wires that currently go down to the existing bulb for the new
light fitting. In that I put these two wires into the Live and Neutral
slot of the new light. Then would i take the yellow and green striped
wire as seen in current picture (which i presume is the earth wire) and
put this in the middle slot of the new light (the earth slot). Will
this work for me or should i do it another way.

One thing that concerns me about putting something into the void is
with the wires heating and possibly starting a fire. If i put that
block into the void - does the block get hot etc.. when the light is
on. My concern would be if it was touching against something etc.


If it gets hot then there's something seriously wrong! (ie no it won't get
hot). Yes, if an earth is provided for it should be used.


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

Cheers for that.

I am going to try and put the Block in the void and get the new light
up.

One other question about the earth wire - I just want to go over this
to be sure.

On -
http://khever.googlepages.com/lights

In the first photo the earth wire is the green and yellow striped wire.
In the third photo (new photo i added), that striped wire from the
first photo goes into the middle slot between the L and N - the slot
maked with a circular smbol (which i presume means earth). Isn't that
right.

Thanks.

On 31 Mar 2006 06:12:53 -0800 someone who may be
wrote this:-

I am going to try and put the Block in the void

Then it must be inside a suitable enclosure.

In the first photo the earth wire is the green and yellow striped wire.
In the third photo (new photo i added), that striped wire from the
first photo goes into the middle slot between the L and N - the slot
maked with a circular smbol (which i presume means earth). Isn't that
right.

Yes.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Hi David,

When you say a 'suitable enclosure' - what do mean exactly and what
would be suitable in this case.

Thanks.

wrote in message
oups.com...

Hi David,

what do mean exactly and what would be suitable in this case.


Judging by your questions an electrician, or a 'friend' who knows about
electrics!

Cheers

John

Thanks John.

But I'll never learn if I keep getting an electrician in. We all have
to start somewhere....

Now does anyone know of an example of a 'suitable enclosure' so i can
take a shot at this.

Thanks.

wrote:
Thanks John.

But I'll never learn if I keep getting an electrician in. We all have
to start somewhere....

Now does anyone know of an example of a 'suitable enclosure' so i can
take a shot at this.

Thanks.

Do you have access from above (i.e. under floorboards or in loft?)

unfort there is no way access can be gained from above.

On 31 Mar 2006 06:28:09 -0800 someone who may be
wrote this:-

When you say a 'suitable enclosure' - what do mean exactly and what
would be suitable in this case.

A suitable enclosure is a term that exactly specifies what is
necessary. I have not seen your ceiling and so cannot tell what
would be suitable in your case. There is also the question of what
precisely you mean by a block. It appears from other messages that
you may be talking about a ceiling rose, which is in fact a suitable
enclosure within which there are several terminal blocks.

What I might do in this sort of case is as follows:

1) Unscrew the ceiling rose fixing screws and see how much slack
cable there is.

2) Probe to see if it is fitted to a joist slightly to the side of
the centre. Assuming suitability from these two points go on to:

3) Replace the existing flex with three core flex.

4) Enlarge the holes the wires come through into one of hand size.

5) Fix the rose to the joist. Short screws and a short screwdriver
are useful here.

6) Patch up the hole.

7) Fix the luminaire to the ceiling, covering up the patched hole.

This avoids dismantling the ceiling rose and labelling the cables to
get them back the right way.

A major factor is the temperature the luminaire will reach. This
affects the type of cable to use for the drop.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Cheers for all your help.

I kept the ceiling rose and used the void which worked well for the
light fixture.

I wired it up and all is working fine.

Thanks again!!!