Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere. Can I make a plasterboard tube, say 20 cm square,
to surround the space above the lamp, clearing a tunnel, and put the
insulation back around that? I intend to keep the connector
block ourside the tunnel. Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat
wasted in my kitchen.

R.

Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere.

Install intumescent covers. Better still, remove them and help save the
planet!

http://www.toolstation.com/index.html?code=97605

Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat wasted in my kitchen.

There will be anyway. Halogen space lighting is very wasteful of the
planet's resources.

Christian.

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:04:28 +0000, Richard A Downing
wrote:

Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere. Can I make a plasterboard tube, say 20 cm square,
to surround the space above the lamp, clearing a tunnel, and put the
insulation back around that? I intend to keep the connector
block ourside the tunnel. Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat
wasted in my kitchen.

How about old cans with both ends removed, or ceramic flower pots?
They have a nice little hole in the top to let the heat escape.

sponix

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:23:46 -0000
"Christian McArdle" wrote:

Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow,
shouldn't have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the
lamp heat has to escape somewhere.

Install intumescent covers. Better still, remove them and help save
the planet!

Can't - the ceiling is wood - intumescent covers void the F mark.

There will be anyway. Halogen space lighting is very wasteful of the
planet's resources.

The current lighting is 400 Watts, the new will be about 200, using
narrow focus 35W bulbs with the light directed when it is needed - these
are special F certified units because of the flamable ceiling
construction.

Background lighting is by low-power flouresents.

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:27:55 GMT
(sPoNiX) wrote:

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:04:28 +0000, Richard A Downing
wrote:

Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow,
shouldn't have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the
lamp heat has to escape somewhere. Can I make a plasterboard tube,
say 20 cm square, to surround the space above the lamp, clearing a
tunnel, and put the insulation back around that? I intend to keep
the connector block ourside the tunnel. Otherwise there is doing to
be a lot of heat wasted in my kitchen.

How about old cans with both ends removed, or ceramic flower pots?
They have a nice little hole in the top to let the heat escape.

Cans seem a bad idea, they will get very very hot and transmit the heat
to the sides. I want the heat to go up. A ceramic tube sounds like it
would work though - not sure the hole in a flowerpot is big enough.

R.

Richard A Downing wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:23:46 -0000
"Christian McArdle" wrote:

Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow,
shouldn't have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the
lamp heat has to escape somewhere.

Install intumescent covers. Better still, remove them and help save
the planet!

Can't - the ceiling is wood - intumescent covers void the F mark.

How come?

In my case, the BCO recommended I used lengths of plastic 100mm ducting
to make "chimneys" which protrude through the Rockwool insulation -
seemed to work pretty well.

David

Richard A Downing wrote:
Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere. Can I make a plasterboard tube, say 20 cm square,
to surround the space above the lamp, clearing a tunnel, and put the
insulation back around that? I intend to keep the connector
block ourside the tunnel. Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat
wasted in my kitchen.

R.

Bout time for a downlighting faq methinks! Its all beeen written, just
needs assmebling.

NT

Christian McArdle wrote:
Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere.

Install intumescent covers. Better still, remove them and help save the
planet!

http://www.toolstation.com/index.html?code=97605

Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat wasted in my kitchen.

There will be anyway. Halogen space lighting is very wasteful of the
planet's resources.

Christian.

It wasn't that long ago when every house just had one light bulb in the
centre of the room with a 60 or 100w bulb in it. Now, when we're
supposed to be getting greener more and more people are installing
recessed lighting. I think many don't even realise the amount of power
they're sucking with these things on.

My sister is in a newly built one-bed flat with thirty six (yes 36!)
GU10 50w light fittings in the lounge. Okay, they're operated by 3
switches but it's still a horrendous waste of energy. The best part is
I have to go about changing the bloody bulbs every other time I visit!

On 24 Jan 2006 11:00:39 -0800, wrote:


Christian McArdle wrote:
Downlighters, even the 12V SELV units I have in my bungalow, shouldn't
have loft insulation over them. Fair enough, clearly the lamp heat has
to escape somewhere.

Install intumescent covers. Better still, remove them and help save the
planet!

http://www.toolstation.com/index.html?code=97605

Otherwise there is doing to be a lot of heat wasted in my kitchen.

There will be anyway. Halogen space lighting is very wasteful of the
planet's resources.

Christian.

It wasn't that long ago when every house just had one light bulb in the
centre of the room with a 60 or 100w bulb in it. Now, when we're
supposed to be getting greener more and more people are installing
recessed lighting. I think many don't even realise the amount of power
they're sucking with these things on.

My sister is in a newly built one-bed flat with thirty six (yes 36!)
GU10 50w light fittings in the lounge. Okay, they're operated by 3
switches but it's still a horrendous waste of energy. The best part is
I have to go about changing the bloody bulbs every other time I visit!

I have a couple of friends with thousands of these 'fashion' lights
and they complain how often they trip the MCB ?

I still have two 5' flouros in the kitchen as they are economical,
cheap to replace, run cool and provide ample light (the required
function of a 'light' methinks)? We use the kitchen for prepairing
food (to eat not to display) and I can't remember anyone ever
mentioning anything about the lighting? Maybe if it was the kitchen in
a designer flat and we had loads of dinner parties I might need
'different' lighting (well I wouldent but others might)?

In the lounge we have a 60 bulb (will be low energy when I can find
one to fit?) in the middle of the ceiling mounted fan (a life saver in
the summer) and we have a single low energy lamp on top of a high
shelf (in 'uplighting' mode) for general room lighting.

We pretty well have low energy lamps throught the rest of the house.

I was given an armfull of new / used low energy lamps the other day
because the lady 'didn't like them' (she even took the one out of a
basic lampshade off the landing .. hardly a 'mood lighting issue
there?). I tried to (gently) explain that if we all used them we could
close a power station and she could save money (etc etc) but that
wasn't of interest to her.

But then I'm only a simple bloke, never been into 'style' or 'form
over function' .. and like to spend my money on other things not the
electricity bill shrug?

All the best ..

T i m

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 09:45:29 GMT someone who may be T i m
wrote this:-

I still have two 5' flouros in the kitchen as they are economical,
cheap to replace, run cool and provide ample light (the required
function of a 'light' methinks)?

Assuming a kitchen roughly divided into a work area and a dining
area. Independently switched fluorescent tubes over each area
provide general lighting as necessary. Add a 100W GLS spotlight on a
dimmer to illuminate the dining table, for better atmosphere while
dining at the table with the general lighting switched off. One
might risk a halogen light here, but these are generally too harsh
for gentle light. Add a recessed downlighter over the sink (these
can now be fitted with an excellent 20W CFL) for task lighting. Add
fluorescent lights under cupboards and cooker hoods to deal with any
dark area. End result - flexible lighting fit for purpose that does
not make the electricity meter spin round like a catherine wheel.
"Fancy" lighting? Stick fluorescent tubes on top of the cupboards
and use them as uplighters.

In the lounge we have a 60 bulb (will be low energy when I can find
one to fit?)

In the shops you should be able to find a General Electric CFL
called "mini extra", or "extra mini". These are as short as GLS
bulbs and will fit nearly everywhere that a GLS bulb will. They are
even shorter then the "Mr Whippy" ones. Sometimes a lamp holder will
block the control gear box on the bulb. These holders can often be
sorted out with the aid of a suitable saw.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

wrote:

It wasn't that long ago when every house just had one light bulb in the
centre of the room with a 60 or 100w bulb in it. Now, when we're
supposed to be getting greener more and more people are installing
recessed lighting. I think many don't even realise the amount of power
they're sucking with these things on.

I would disagree.
We have 2 banks of 5x50W 12v jobbies which allow eithe half of the
lounge to be illuminated via a diagonal line.

What we have found is in normal use, ony one half is ever on, and that
is dimmed down to virtually as low as they can be which provides a nice
atmospheric mood lighting.

1 Ikea "feature" lamp (looks like Medusa's hair)provides ample
background lighting.

Sure, not quite as economical as a pair of 7W CFL bulbs, but only a
teensy weensy bit of the 0.5 KW output they are capable of for about 98%
of the time.


--
http://gymratz.co.uk - Best Gym Equipment & Bodybuilding Supplements UK.
http://trade-price-supplements.co.uk - TRADE PRICED SUPPLEMENTS for ALL!
http://fitness-equipment-uk.com - UK's No.1 Fitness Equipment Suppliers.
http://gymratz.co.uk/hot-seat.htm - Live web-cam! (sometimes)

On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 03:07:10 GMT, "Pet @ www.gymratz.co.uk ;¬)"
wrote:

wrote:

It wasn't that long ago when every house just had one light bulb in the
centre of the room with a 60 or 100w bulb in it. Now, when we're
supposed to be getting greener more and more people are installing
recessed lighting. I think many don't even realise the amount of power
they're sucking with these things on.

I would disagree.
We have 2 banks of 5x50W 12v jobbies which allow eithe half of the
lounge to be illuminated via a diagonal line.

What we have found is in normal use, ony one half is ever on, and that
is dimmed down to virtually as low as they can be which provides a nice
atmospheric mood lighting.

1 Ikea "feature" lamp (looks like Medusa's hair)provides ample
background lighting.

Sure, not quite as economical as a pair of 7W CFL bulbs, but only a
teensy weensy bit of the 0.5 KW output they are capable of for about 98%
of the time.

Even though your light output is teensy weensy the electricity used
will be (teensy weensy) * 3 or something like that, because even the
modern electronic dimmers are not perfect, you'd be better off with
lower rated bulbs. Old fashioned dimmers are much worse and only save
a maximum of something like 10%. However all dimmers make the bulbs
last longer and the soft start ones in particular.

In article ,
"Pet @ www.gymratz.co.uk ;¬)" writes:

I would disagree.
We have 2 banks of 5x50W 12v jobbies which allow eithe half of the
lounge to be illuminated via a diagonal line.

What we have found is in normal use, ony one half is ever on, and that
is dimmed down to virtually as low as they can be which provides a nice
atmospheric mood lighting.

Sure, not quite as economical as a pair of 7W CFL bulbs, but only a
teensy weensy bit of the 0.5 KW output they are capable of for about 98%
of the time.

But if you measure the power consumption, you'll find it drawing
a large percentage 0.5 KW. A demo I've done a few times is to
measure the power consumption of a 500W halogen. When dimmed to
the light output of something like a 25W or 40W lamp, it still
draws over 300W. To a first approximation, don't assume a dimmer
saves electricity -- it's primarily a knob to turn down the
efficiency of your lamps.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Pet @ www.gymratz.co.uk ;¬)" writes:

I would disagree.
We have 2 banks of 5x50W 12v jobbies which allow eithe half of the
lounge to be illuminated via a diagonal line.

What we have found is in normal use, ony one half is ever on, and that
is dimmed down to virtually as low as they can be which provides a nice
atmospheric mood lighting.

Sure, not quite as economical as a pair of 7W CFL bulbs, but only a
teensy weensy bit of the 0.5 KW output they are capable of for about 98%
of the time.

But if you measure the power consumption, you'll find it drawing
a large percentage 0.5 KW. A demo I've done a few times is to
measure the power consumption of a 500W halogen. When dimmed to
the light output of something like a 25W or 40W lamp, it still
draws over 300W. To a first approximation, don't assume a dimmer
saves electricity -- it's primarily a knob to turn down the
efficiency of your lamps.


Quite. Use a switchbank instead.


NT

On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 15:03:39 GMT, wrote:

On 28 Jan,
marble wrote:


Even though your light output is teensy weensy the electricity used
will be (teensy weensy) * 3 or something like that, because even the
modern electronic dimmers are not perfect, you'd be better off with
lower rated bulbs. Old fashioned dimmers are much worse and only save
a maximum of something like 10%. However all dimmers make the bulbs
last longer and the soft start ones in particular.

Dimmed lamps may last longer, but the power consumed is a much greater
proportion of the full load than the light output is.

Thats what I said, reading it back I should have been clearer.

It is much more
efficient to dim by reducing the number of lamps lit.

Or use lower rated lamps.

12 lamps in one room is
very much OTT, unless it is a public hall.

With halogens its not OTT in a room of say 20m2, they are realy poor
as ambiant lights.