In the words of Kipling, an offensive effluvia has been noted in our
entrance hall.

There was a slight back up when I lifted the manhole covers but no real
blockage. Anyway, after rodding and flushing I had a peer around with a
mirror on a stick and a torch. Two points of interest for which comments
and advice are sought....

Where the new soil pipe for our extension is coupled in to an
existing manhole there is a gap in the haunching which might allow
backed up dirty water to leak into the trench and seep through the pea
shingle back under the house. I have plenty of soft sand and masonry
cement to hand but is there a special mix for the job?

The second issue is that, for reasons only known to the drainage
contractor in 1975, our soil pipe starts as 6" salt glaze, travels round
the side of the house (90 degree bend with inspection pit) reaches a
second pit still in 6" and then reduces to 4" plastic! Not only is there
ponding at the reducer but the pipe used has a spiral scroll inside;
surely not intended for this use.

The cure must be to *up it* and re-do. Not easy as it is about 3'6" down
in a tarmacced yard. But, does anyone know why this reducer was used?

regards
--
Tim Lamb

"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In the words of Kipling, an offensive effluvia has been noted in our
entrance hall.

There was a slight back up when I lifted the manhole covers but no real
blockage. Anyway, after rodding and flushing I had a peer around with a
mirror on a stick and a torch. Two points of interest for which comments
and advice are sought....

Where the new soil pipe for our extension is coupled in to an
existing manhole there is a gap in the haunching which might allow
backed up dirty water to leak into the trench and seep through the pea
shingle back under the house. I have plenty of soft sand and masonry
cement to hand but is there a special mix for the job?

The second issue is that, for reasons only known to the drainage
contractor in 1975, our soil pipe starts as 6" salt glaze, travels round
the side of the house (90 degree bend with inspection pit) reaches a
second pit still in 6" and then reduces to 4" plastic! Not only is there
ponding at the reducer but the pipe used has a spiral scroll inside;
surely not intended for this use.

The cure must be to *up it* and re-do. Not easy as it is about 3'6" down
in a tarmacced yard. But, does anyone know why this reducer was used?

regards

Tim Lamb


I take it this drainage system is for solid waste removal, correct? If it
is, then you do have the wrong type pipework in place, don't you.

Any system meant for solid waste removal must continue in pipework that is
as smooth as is at all possible. As you can imagine what happens when this
type of waste product comes in to contact with rough surfaces or spurious
protrusions.

Although, that said, there are cases where waste systems must be slowed not
to cause conflict with connections further down the line, but these are very
few and far between. But I have to ask a question here, and it's to do with
the pipe you say has a spiral inside it (?). Does this pipe drop away
almost vertically? Or at least beyond an angle of 65 degrees off
horizontal?

In message , BigWallop
writes

I take it this drainage system is for solid waste removal, correct? If it
is, then you do have the wrong type pipework in place, don't you.

Correct.

The drainage project was fairly major as all the properties in the lane
had their existing septic tank provision re-routed to a new pumping
station at the back of my yard.

In our case there might have been some confusion as the original plan
was to include waste from the dairy and milking sheds.

Any system meant for solid waste removal must continue in pipework that is
as smooth as is at all possible. As you can imagine what happens when this
type of waste product comes in to contact with rough surfaces or spurious
protrusions.

To be fair, they dropped the 4" so that the flow continues to fall
properly. The scroll does not help but the bigger issue is the funnel
mouth of the 6"-4" adapter. This causes an inch deep puddle and collects
er.. crap!

Although, that said, there are cases where waste systems must be slowed not
to cause conflict with connections further down the line, but these are very
few and far between. But I have to ask a question here, and it's to do with
the pipe you say has a spiral inside it (?). Does this pipe drop away
almost vertically? Or at least beyond an angle of 65 degrees off
horizontal?

No. We are the lowest part of the system so running around 75m to the
main sewer, fall is an issue.

I think they must have decided to overcome the 6" to 4" issue with a
commercial reducer not intended for laying horizontally.

How would one approach the problem if the reduction were done within the
actual inspection pit? Existing is a heavy duty cast concrete manhole
with the 6" half round gulley properly haunched leading to the bodged
reducing cone at the exit. Our extension feeds in over the top of the
gully and simply needs leak proofing.

The sewage authority are sympathetic but adamant that this is a private
system despite it travelling below a public highway and then other
private property before joining the main. I strongly suspect that our
builders may have inadvertently allowed rubble into the system which is
gradually wending its way to the main, causing regular blockages.

CC tv 120ukp:-(

regards



--
Tim Lamb

"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In message , BigWallop
writes

I take it this drainage system is for solid waste removal, correct? If
it
is, then you do have the wrong type pipework in place, don't you.

Correct.

The drainage project was fairly major as all the properties in the lane
had their existing septic tank provision re-routed to a new pumping
station at the back of my yard.

In our case there might have been some confusion as the original plan
was to include waste from the dairy and milking sheds.

Any system meant for solid waste removal must continue in pipework that
is
as smooth as is at all possible. As you can imagine what happens when
this
type of waste product comes in to contact with rough surfaces or spurious
protrusions.

To be fair, they dropped the 4" so that the flow continues to fall
properly. The scroll does not help but the bigger issue is the funnel
mouth of the 6"-4" adapter. This causes an inch deep puddle and collects
er.. crap!

Although, that said, there are cases where waste systems must be slowed
not
to cause conflict with connections further down the line, but these are
very
few and far between. But I have to ask a question here, and it's to do
with
the pipe you say has a spiral inside it (?). Does this pipe drop away
almost vertically? Or at least beyond an angle of 65 degrees off
horizontal?

No. We are the lowest part of the system so running around 75m to the
main sewer, fall is an issue.

I think they must have decided to overcome the 6" to 4" issue with a
commercial reducer not intended for laying horizontally.

How would one approach the problem if the reduction were done within the
actual inspection pit? Existing is a heavy duty cast concrete manhole
with the 6" half round gulley properly haunched leading to the bodged
reducing cone at the exit. Our extension feeds in over the top of the
gully and simply needs leak proofing.

The sewage authority are sympathetic but adamant that this is a private
system despite it travelling below a public highway and then other
private property before joining the main. I strongly suspect that our
builders may have inadvertently allowed rubble into the system which is
gradually wending its way to the main, causing regular blockages.

CC tv 120ukp:-(

regards


Tim Lamb


Is this a communal drainage system? Then get together with the other user
and have the whole thing cleaned properly and inspected fully, of course, by
a reputable company. Communal drainage costs can be shared between everyone
that is on the system, and this helps in keeping the price down for each
individual user.

Tackling a communal system may leave you in the proverbial that normally
goes down the drain, and others may say that you caused the problem if there
part starts to give problems in the future. So this is the time to make
contact with them all, and get your heads together on this one. Everyone
must be affected by the blockages, so everyone needs to share in its repair.

In message , BigWallop
writes

Is this a communal drainage system? Then get together with the other user
and have the whole thing cleaned properly and inspected fully, of course, by
a reputable company. Communal drainage costs can be shared between everyone
that is on the system, and this helps in keeping the price down for each
individual user.

The other user is my sister so any costs are likely to be mine.

Tackling a communal system may leave you in the proverbial that normally
goes down the drain, and others may say that you caused the problem if there
part starts to give problems in the future. So this is the time to make
contact with them all, and get your heads together on this one. Everyone
must be affected by the blockages, so everyone needs to share in its repair.

I have plenty of drain rods and I could pi*s faster than the last
commercial jetting system here. Each time it happens I put the gear away
thinking I have fixed it:-(

The leak I will fix next time the yard is dry and I feel like lying face
down in an inspection pit. Sorting the narrowing is long term and may
never happen. If there is debris in the system it is now below my
sister's garden where there is a run of some 50m and no inspection
access.

regards



--
Tim Lamb

"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In message , BigWallop
writes

Is this a communal drainage system? Then get together with the other
user
and have the whole thing cleaned properly and inspected fully, of course,
by
a reputable company. Communal drainage costs can be shared between
everyone
that is on the system, and this helps in keeping the price down for each
individual user.

The other user is my sister so any costs are likely to be mine.

Tackling a communal system may leave you in the proverbial that
normally
goes down the drain, and others may say that you caused the problem if
there
part starts to give problems in the future. So this is the time to make
contact with them all, and get your heads together on this one. Everyone
must be affected by the blockages, so everyone needs to share in its
repair.

I have plenty of drain rods and I could pi*s faster than the last
commercial jetting system here. Each time it happens I put the gear away
thinking I have fixed it:-(

The leak I will fix next time the yard is dry and I feel like lying face
down in an inspection pit. Sorting the narrowing is long term and may
never happen. If there is debris in the system it is now below my
sister's garden where there is a run of some 50m and no inspection
access.

regards

Tim Lamb


Oh bugger!!! So your stuck with all the costs anyway? Oh bugger!!!!

The only thing I can advise is to scrape the pipework between each
inspection point, and not just rod it to clear large debris.

Once you have made sure the system is running smoothly, then fit the large
rubber washer type device on the end of your rods and drag it through the
whole run to make sure it is properly cleared out. We used to blow a rope
through with an air line, then tie the large scraper on it and pull with all
our might. This also showed up any cracks or breaks in the pipework, and
gave a good idea of where they are using the length of rope used.

If you do find something that is causing a major slow down in the pipes
using this method, then you will have a good idea where to start with any
repair or replacement that may need doing.

The scraper should be larger in diameter than internal diameter of the pipe.
So a six inch internal diameter pipe needs at least a seven inch scraper
pulled through it to make sure it properly cleaned and cleared.

In message , BigWallop
writes

Oh bugger!!! So your stuck with all the costs anyway? Oh bugger!!!!

The only thing I can advise is to scrape the pipework between each
inspection point, and not just rod it to clear large debris.

Once you have made sure the system is running smoothly, then fit the large
rubber washer type device on the end of your rods and drag it through the
whole run to make sure it is properly cleared out. We used to blow a rope
through with an air line, then tie the large scraper on it and pull with all
our might. This also showed up any cracks or breaks in the pipework, and
gave a good idea of where they are using the length of rope used.

If you do find something that is causing a major slow down in the pipes
using this method, then you will have a good idea where to start with any
repair or replacement that may need doing.

The scraper should be larger in diameter than internal diameter of the pipe.
So a six inch internal diameter pipe needs at least a seven inch scraper
pulled through it to make sure it properly cleaned and cleared.

I like the rope idea:-)

The final run has not been rodded because the inspection pit is rather
deep for conventional rods. My scraper is a slack fit in 110mm pipe. The
6" stuff is never a problem.

I think I will fix the leak, wait for the next blockage and then get
some expert help.

Thanks

regards



--
Tim Lamb

"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In message , BigWallop
writes

Oh bugger!!! So your stuck with all the costs anyway? Oh bugger!!!!

The only thing I can advise is to scrape the pipework between each
inspection point, and not just rod it to clear large debris.

Once you have made sure the system is running smoothly, then fit the
large
rubber washer type device on the end of your rods and drag it through the
whole run to make sure it is properly cleared out. We used to blow a
rope
through with an air line, then tie the large scraper on it and pull with
all
our might. This also showed up any cracks or breaks in the pipework, and
gave a good idea of where they are using the length of rope used.

If you do find something that is causing a major slow down in the pipes
using this method, then you will have a good idea where to start with any
repair or replacement that may need doing.

The scraper should be larger in diameter than internal diameter of the
pipe.
So a six inch internal diameter pipe needs at least a seven inch scraper
pulled through it to make sure it properly cleaned and cleared.

I like the rope idea:-)

The final run has not been rodded because the inspection pit is rather
deep for conventional rods. My scraper is a slack fit in 110mm pipe. The
6" stuff is never a problem.

I think I will fix the leak, wait for the next blockage and then get
some expert help.

Thanks

regards

Tim Lamb


If these blockages are a pretty regular occurrence, then it seems there
could well be a crack or break somewhere. Or it could be roots from a tree
or hedge that have grown through into the pipe.

Do you have enough rods to set a half way mark in the longest run? If you
do, or can borrow some, then put a rope on the end of the rods and push it
in half way before letting it go. This can usually be done with a twist or
two of the rope around the end of a plain rod. Go to the other end of the
run and attach the corkscrew attachment to the rods. Push along until you
reach where the rope should and twist the rods around until the rope is
caught.

Once you have rope, then you can tie the rubber plunger disk on the end and
pull it through to make sure the drain is clear enough. You don't need any
real fancy gear for this simple test, and it'll save a fortune if you can
tell the drainage guys where the blockage or damage is in the run.

Good luck with it.

In message , BigWallop
writes

If these blockages are a pretty regular occurrence, then it seems there
could well be a crack or break somewhere. Or it could be roots from a tree
or hedge that have grown through into the pipe.

It takes a year or two and the location has moved. I'm fairly sure it
must be debris and is now in the final section.

Do you have enough rods to set a half way mark in the longest run? If you
do, or can borrow some, then put a rope on the end of the rods and push it
in half way before letting it go. This can usually be done with a twist or
two of the rope around the end of a plain rod. Go to the other end of the
run and attach the corkscrew attachment to the rods. Push along until you
reach where the rope should and twist the rods around until the rope is
caught.

Yes. If it blocks in that stretch I'm going to call the professionals as
I am very nervous of making things worse.

regards
--
Tim Lamb