Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick. Is my first impression a
tactile illusion?

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Thanks in advance.


--

Regards,


Mongke

- "mongke" - spluttered in
:


And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see
anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the
hot bead. How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

For stick, 5/32 or smaller, try a #9 lense.

mongke wrote:

Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick. Is my first impression a
tactile illusion?

You typically maintain an arc length equal to the diameter of the rod.

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Avoid bright light sources behind you if possible. I have good luck
with a #12 lens.

Practice, practice, practice. People get paid good money to weld
so you know it's not something you learn in 15 minutes.

Rods such as 6013 and 7014 are also called contact rods. They can be
dragged along with the flux coating touching the metal. The
penetration is modest as well. Once the metal cools, it shrinks and
the flux covering usually removes easily to reveal a very nice
surface. Surface prep is very desirable.

Rods such as 6011 and 6010 have a greater "digging" action and
penetrate better. They also work better with less than great surface
conditions, reducing preparation time. The slag is more difficult to
remove.

If you drag the rod, rather than push it, it is more difficult to
follow the joint between the two parts. With practice, you will not
watch the arc, not watch the tip and not watch the bead. It's the
puddle of molten metal which must be perceived, even though you will
"see" the other things as well.


On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 22:12:42 -0500, "mongke"
wrote:

Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick. Is my first impression a
tactile illusion?

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Thanks in advance.

mongke wrote:
Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick.
The rod will not stick once there is a pool of molten metal. It sticks
to COLD metal which makes a tiny spot weld and then cools the rod. Once
the end of the rod is good and hot, it will also be much more resistant
to sticking.

If there is any force on the rod, it may actually be an electrical force
pulling the rod in. But, that should be pretty small.

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?
I usually like to weld near the open garage door, facing south. I get
full sun on the work, so I can see a little of it through the hood, but
I don't have full sun on me or getting in the back of the hood. Of
course, auto-dark hoods are vastly better for this. Once the arc gets
going well, and the metal heats up a bit, you should be able to see
enough of the work to follow the seam. For these small rods you may
need a lighter shade of glass.

Jon

E 6013 will allow you to drag the rod. Once the rod is hot and an arc is
established you can drag the rod at about 30 degrees to the vertical resting
the flux on the parent metal. The puddle will form behind the slanted rod.
Slight wrist action will maintain ensure that the flux coating is resting on
the parent metal as you progress along with your weld bead.
You can also hold the rod about ten degrees off the vertical and hold a
gap of about 1/8th inch above your weld pool. With this technique you can
weave side to side to widen your bead. This method is often used to ensure
that both sides of a joint are fused.
Scratch start is certainly easier to do and good when you are beginning.
Randy

"mongke" wrote in message
...
Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it
without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to
lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite
smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt
a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick. Is my first impression a
tactile illusion?

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Thanks in advance.


--

Regards,


Mongke

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 22:12:42 -0500, "mongke"
wrote:

Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.
Now the question:
-In that second the half inch of rod (3/32" of 6013) consumed quite smoothly. My
feeling was that the mere weight of my hand pushed the rod into the pool.
I say "pushed" because I got the impression, I can't be sure, that I felt a
very slight up force countering my hand.
My understanding is that getting the rod tip into the pool will
extinguish the arc and cause the rod to stick. Is my first impression a
tactile illusion?

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Thanks in advance.

From my personal experience, I find the 6013 likes to be "pushed in"
closer than other rods. This could be a characteristic of my welder,
the settings etc.

The best tip is, practice & experiment.

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 23:20:50 +0000, Thomas Kendrick wrote:



Rods such as 6013 and 7014 are also called contact rods. They can be
dragged along with the flux coating touching the metal. The penetration is
modest as well. Once the metal cools, it shrinks and the flux covering
usually removes easily to reveal a very nice surface. Surface prep is very
desirable.

Rods such as 6011 and 6010 have a greater "digging" action and penetrate
better. They also work better with less than great surface conditions,
reducing preparation time. The slag is more difficult to remove.

If you drag the rod, rather than push it, it is more difficult to follow
the joint between the two parts. With practice, you will not watch the
arc, not watch the tip and not watch the bead. It's the puddle of molten
metal which must be perceived, even though you will "see" the other things
as well.


By pushing you mean forehand, with the rod slanted away from the travel
direction?

--

Regards,


Mongke

In article ,
"mongke" wrote:

[...]

And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the hot bead.
How does people ever manage to follow a joint?

Thanks in advance.

I'm learning too. I focus my eyes just a bit ahead of my weld rather
than looking right at it and I can just tell where I'm headed. Then
again, my welds look like crap, so maybe I should start looking at the
weld. (:

--
B.B. --I am not a goat! thegoat4 at airmail.net

"mongke" wrote in message
...
Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it
without
killing myself and so on.
Set up a piece of angle iron and began to try my hand. Countless attempts
to strike the arc, numerous rod stickups, on several ocassions I could not
free it quickly so the rod turned red hot and bent like an S, etc, etc.
I soon found that sratching to strike rather than tapping seems to work
better for me. And finally in a whole second of pure glory I managed to
lay
half an inch of bead. It was shiny, no apparent porosity, had a bit of the
stack of coins look.

Where I worked many years ago, we had an arc welder that had been purchased
for repairing sheet steel panels and doors on the photocopiers we were
refurbishing. I quickly realised that it wasn't much use for that sort of
thing, and we should have bought gas welding equipment. After about a day of
trial and error, I managed to join pieces of steel fairly reliably and
neatly. Haven't touched one since.

Leon

I'd consider 5/32" and #9 to be a bit light on the lens. More like 3/32
and #9 for me. I like the #9 for tack welding, even with the bigger rod.

Greg M wrote:
- "mongke" - spluttered in
:


And yet another thing that surprised me is that one can't see
anything
trough the welding glass but the rod tip, the arc itself and the
hot bead. How does people ever manage to follow a joint?


For stick, 5/32 or smaller, try a #9 lense.

By pushing you mean forehand, with the rod slanted away from the travel
direction?


Here's a picture for you. Read the rest of the tutorial, too.
http://www.aussieweld.com.au/arcwelding/page4/page4.htm


To see the joint, 1) weld in bright sunlight with your head in the shade, 2)
grind "V"s on both sides to be joined so you not looking at a seam but a
good indent in the surface.

I'd weld about 50 (no kidding) rods onto scrap at different angles,
locations, etc. before doing anything for real. Another useful thing is too
weld two pieces together for one inch, put in vice and twist until it
breaks - should break on one side of weld not in weld. Should be very hard
to break also.

Good luck

Karl

That's an odd story to tell a new welder who is obviously excited about the
prospect of welding.

"Leon Heller" wrote in message
...
"mongke" wrote in message

Where I worked many years ago, we had an arc welder that had been
purchased
for repairing sheet steel panels and doors on the photocopiers we were
refurbishing. I quickly realised that it wasn't much use for that sort of
thing, and we should have bought gas welding equipment. After about a day
of
trial and error, I managed to join pieces of steel fairly reliably and
neatly. Haven't touched one since.

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 22:12:42 +0000, mongke wrote:

From: "mongke"
Subject: First try with arc welder
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 22:12:42 -0500
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Well today I finally hooked up an arc welder I got. Managed to wire it
without
killing myself and so on.

Well right now I'm practicing with thin sheet. I can lay now some beads
and even without blowing too much holes ;-).
One thing I just noticed is the closer to the work clamp one welds then
there are small arcs leaping from the clamp to the work. Is that normal?


--

Regards,


Mongke

On Sat, 14 Aug 2004 16:51:48 +0000, Karl Townsend wrote:




Here's a picture for you. Read the rest of the tutorial, too.
http://www.aussieweld.com.au/arcwelding/page4/page4.htm


Karl

Nice tutorial. Right now I'm practicing building a pad as they advise.

Thanks
--

Regards,


Mongke

Mongke, to start learning arc welding, I would suggest using some thicker
stock -- at least 1/8". 1/4" would be even better. The reason is that the
thicker metal will allow you to turn up the amps without worrying about
burning through; turning up the amps will make it much easier to start the
rod. After a year of arc welding, I think I am a not-too-bad hobbiest welder
.... I can generally cleanly strike an arc without scratching if I'm running
above 50-60 amps ... but below 50 amps, it can be a challenge to start the
arc, and to get it well established without either sticking the rod or
pulling it too far back. (Once the arc is well established, it is easier ...
but still not as easy as it is when running at higher amps.) In the last
couple of months, I have found myself welding some thin materials (.0625 or
less), and it has been challenging ... but I'm getting better at it!

One mistake that I made, and that everyone I have taught to weld (all three
of them) seems to make at first, is not keeping the tip of the rod close
enough in to the weld. You have to wait until the puddle forms, but then you
can and should run with the tip practically right in the edge of the puddle.
(This is assuming 6013, 7014, or even 7018, and it is assuming thicker
stock; with 6010 and 6011, you should keep the tip close in, but ideally you
should probably be doing a stitch motion ... and if you're welding thin
sheet metal, you've got to keep moving right smartly to keep from blowing
holes.)

You mentioned that you were using 6013, but not what sort of machine you are
using. Is it DC or AC? Inverter or transformer? 110v or 220v? I ask because,
when I first learned, I was using a 110v buzz box ... and that led to some
bad habits. It just didn't have the oomph that my "new" (actually, 50 years
old) 220v monster has, so it was harder to start the arc and maintain the
arc.

Have fun ... it is addictive!

"mongke" wrote in message
...
Well right now I'm practicing with thin sheet. I can lay now some beads
and even without blowing too much holes ;-).
One thing I just noticed is the closer to the work clamp one welds then
there are small arcs leaping from the clamp to the work. Is that normal?


--

Regards,


Mongke

On Sat, 14 Aug 2004 20:58:24 +0000, Andrew H. Wakefield wrote:


One mistake that I made, and that everyone I have taught to weld (all
three of them) seems to make at first, is not keeping the tip of the rod
close enough in to the weld. You have to wait until the puddle forms,
but then you can and should run with the tip practically right in the
edge of the puddle. (This is assuming 6013, 7014, or even 7018, and it
is assuming thicker stock; with 6010 and 6011, you should keep the tip
close in, but ideally you should probably be doing a stitch motion ...
and if you're welding thin sheet metal, you've got to keep moving right
smartly to keep from blowing holes.)

Just made some passes with 1/8" 6013. After some hours of practice I can
do beads, not pretty but beads. One thing I notice with 6013 is that the
molten pool grows so fast that one has to move fast to keep the rod tip
from getting into the molten metal.
6011 is another story. So far I'm unable to keep the arc going. I got
only one irregular bead but it looked very flat (with 3/32" rod).


You mentioned that you were using 6013, but not what sort of machine you
are using. Is it DC or AC? Inverter or transformer? 110v or 220v? I ask
because, when I first learned, I was using a 110v buzz box ... and that
led to some bad habits. It just didn't have the oomph that my "new"
(actually, 50 years old) 220v monster has, so it was harder to start the
arc and maintain the arc.

A 110v AC transformer. BTW, is it possible to measure OCV without damaging the
meter or killing oneself?

Have fun ... it is addictive!

"mongke" wrote in message
...
[quoted text muted]

--

Regards,


Mongke

50 Years of welding I say watch the puddle... Every so often look to
see where you are going... But watch the puddle is what counts...

On Sat, 14 Aug 2004 14:17:11 -0500, "mongke"
wrote:

[Snip]

Well right now I'm practicing with thin sheet. I can lay now some beads
and even without blowing too much holes ;-).
One thing I just noticed is the closer to the work clamp one welds then
there are small arcs leaping from the clamp to the work. Is that normal?


Placing a chunk/sheet of copper under the areas to be welded, on thin
sheet is a big help, if it's practical.