I just poured my first ever concrete.

6 cu yds, made a nice big slab for the garage/machineshop.

I don't think I did too good a job on the finishing - combination of
misjudging the time to do stuff, and not knowing how to do it anyway.

So I think I would like to paint the top of the slab.

What should I paint it with?

What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come away
pretty easily.

On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 18:22:26 -0300, "jtaylor"
wrote:

===I just poured my first ever concrete.
===
===6 cu yds, made a nice big slab for the garage/machineshop.
===
===I don't think I did too good a job on the finishing - combination of
===misjudging the time to do stuff, and not knowing how to do it anyway.
===
===So I think I would like to paint the top of the slab.
===
===What should I paint it with?
===
===What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come away
===pretty easily.
===


You need to let it age for a bit before you paint it. Keep grease and
oils off it to make it easier to clean prior to painting. There are
numeorus 2 component paints for floors as well as some good single
component paints like Valspars floor paint for maasonary and outdoors
use. I have that on my floor and it takes a beating and still looks
good. Lowes in our area had quite a bit of 2 component floor paints
for concrete at rediculous marked down prices of $10.00 for a 2 gal
kit..........and it was an epoxy based paint.......To bad it was not
in white or I would have bought osme, but they had greys, tans and a
few other colors....Deft in my opinion makes about the best 2 part
urethane floor coating made, followed by Tennent (makers of floor
cleaning machines).
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wife,
I had no input whatsoever.
Remove "nospam" from email addy.

In article ,
"jtaylor" wrote:
....
I don't think I did too good a job on the finishing - combination of
misjudging the time to do stuff, and not knowing how to do it anyway.

So I think I would like to paint the top of the slab.

Paint is a good idea, but it won't correct the finishing of the concrete
itself.

What should I paint it with?

Many available paints, expoxies, systems. Depends what you want, and
what you want to pay. I've been happy with UGL Drylock floor paint
(latex base) - not their waterproofer (which is for walls) and I have
not used their oil based. White - makes for much more light than the
typical tan/gray/red or bare concrete. Latex Drylock is easy to recoat
in case of damage, has pretty cgood coverage, and does not require added
antislip materials (it's not slippery) or 3 different coatings, as some
"systems" do. Some folks seem very happy with epoxy finishes, some
people have posted horror stories...

What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come away
pretty easily.

Surface prep should be per your paint/coating manufactuer's
instructions. Cure the concrete for at least 30 days, typically, keep
oil off of it before paint to make cleaning before painting a reasonable
job.

--
Cats, Coffee, Chocolate...vices to live by

Greetings and Salutations....

On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 18:22:26 -0300, "jtaylor"
wrote:

I just poured my first ever concrete.

6 cu yds, made a nice big slab for the garage/machineshop.

I don't think I did too good a job on the finishing - combination of
misjudging the time to do stuff, and not knowing how to do it anyway.

So I think I would like to paint the top of the slab.

What should I paint it with?

What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come away
pretty easily.


Nothing like starting at the top for an exciting way
to learn how to do a task...and ESPECIALLY fun with concrete.
Now...the question I have is "what do you mean by not
too good a job on finishing?". It is just a matter of some
roughness here and there? Are there ridges? Are there
hills and hollows?
Add some details about how bad it is, and, it will
make it easier to give reasonable options.
Thanks
Dave Mundt

You have received plenty of paint advice. As far as the finish, I've been
successful renting a professional floor sander (as used on wooden floors)
and plenty of sanding belts. I got about 150 sq. ft. out of a single belt.
Depends on how bad your concrete finish is. You can sand it until it feels
like glass.

BTW, you needn't tell the rental place that you are going to use it on
concrete.
Wear a mask.

Ivan Vegvary

"jtaylor" wrote in message
...
I just poured my first ever concrete.

6 cu yds, made a nice big slab for the garage/machineshop.

I don't think I did too good a job on the finishing - combination of
misjudging the time to do stuff, and not knowing how to do it anyway.

So I think I would like to paint the top of the slab.

What should I paint it with?

What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come
away
pretty easily.

Dave Mundt wrote in message
.. .

What surface prep should I do - in places I think some of it might come
away
pretty easily.


Nothing like starting at the top for an exciting way
to learn how to do a task...and ESPECIALLY fun with concrete.
Now...the question I have is "what do you mean by not
too good a job on finishing?". It is just a matter of some
roughness here and there? Are there ridges? Are there
hills and hollows?
Add some details about how bad it is, and, it will
make it easier to give reasonable options.

Well, there are places where it has a nice troweled finish, that I'm happy
with.
There are places where the surface will sort of flake off and it looks sandy
underneath.
There are some areas where it seems like water marks.
There are places where you can see footprints, and marks from the
kneeboards.

Nothing deeper than about 1/8 inch.

I told the ready-mix place what I was doing and the fellow said I'd need
4000 psi mix; the truck driver was very helpful but I think he put some
extra water in on the way - it was very soupy - the pictures of "slump" in
the concrete books I had read _all_ looked stiffer, even the ones the books
said were too wet.

It made for easy pouring and screeding, but I did notice that there was a
large amount, a bulge, of sandy water in the middle after I floated it the
first time, with a 4 foot piece of wood on a 12 foot handle. The slab was
beside an existing building, so there was a bit of difficulty getting to one
side, and with screeding, As well, the last part of it was in the sun, so
it seems to me that the first and last parts set before the middle; that's
where I left footprints, anyway...

Greetings and Salutations....
Thanks for the details...it really clarifies things.

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 09:12:51 -0300, "jtaylor"
wrote:
*snip*

Well, there are places where it has a nice troweled finish, that I'm happy
with.

Yep, it is always nice to see that!

There are places where the surface will sort of flake off and it looks sandy
underneath.
There are some areas where it seems like water marks.
There are places where you can see footprints, and marks from the
kneeboards.

Nothing deeper than about 1/8 inch.

I told the ready-mix place what I was doing and the fellow said I'd need
4000 psi mix; the truck driver was very helpful but I think he put some
extra water in on the way - it was very soupy - the pictures of "slump" in
the concrete books I had read _all_ looked stiffer, even the ones the books
said were too wet.

It made for easy pouring and screeding, but I did notice that there was a
large amount, a bulge, of sandy water in the middle after I floated it the
first time, with a 4 foot piece of wood on a 12 foot handle. The slab was
beside an existing building, so there was a bit of difficulty getting to one
side, and with screeding, As well, the last part of it was in the sun, so
it seems to me that the first and last parts set before the middle; that's
where I left footprints, anyway...


Yea...that sounds as if someone screwed up. Probably not the
driver, as they typically don't do anything to the mix between the
time it gets dumped into the truck and the time it reaches your site.
I would suspect that something got set wrong at the concrete yard,
and, no one noticed it.
No use crying over spilled milk, but, I suspect it would be
a GOOD thing to get one of the supervisors from the company to come
out and take a look at your pour. It might not get YOU anything
but, it probably will make a mixing operator's life uncomfortable
for a little while. On the other hand, it might get you some
compensation, and, certainly would be good to have a professional
eye look at the slab.
Now...it does sound as if you started out with a WAY too
soupy mix. this is bad for several reasons, not the least of
which is that concrete consists of a mixtures of glue (the cement)
and matrix (rocks, sand, etc). It gets its strength from the EVEN
distribution of that matrix through the entire slab. If it is too
wet, as you work (or overwork) the concrete, all the matrix will
work its way to the bottom, leaving a fairly low-strength layer
of sand and cement on top. It may work ok for as long as you
live there. It may start spalling off and falling apart in a
year... I would be inclined to drill a test core someplace, to see
what the distribution looks like.
Your comment about the flaky, sandy areas make me think
that it is REALLY separated out, and, for me, that is a bad thing.
If it is flaking now, there is an excellent chance it will flake
even worse when you start moving heavy machines across it. Also,
if the matrix has really settled out, there is an increased chance
of cracking and other problems. Which reminds me... I forgot to
ask if there is any steel in this slab? Rebar or grid to keep
it from breaking up? Also, what about expansion joints?
As for the footprints, etc, those will have to be filled
in and levelled out, or your life is going to get WAY too exciting
later on. There is nothing like moving a 1000 lb, top-heavy lathe
(for example) and having a wheel on the dolly catch in an imperfection
in the floor! DAMHIKT *smile*.
Now...what to do to "fix" the whole thing. I can see a few
of ways out of this.
1) Jack hammer it all up and pour a new slab, with the RIGHT
mix this time. THis is kind of the worst-case scenario, and would
not be one that I would take unless a pro said the slab was crap.
(hence the reason for getting one out to look at YOUR slab). If it
were me, I would also look at some serious help from the concrete
company on this, if it was their fault that the concrete did not
meet specs.
2) put forms back on the slab, and, pour another couple
inches of the RIGHT mix on top. You will probably want to pin
re-enforcing mesh to the existings slab for this, to ensure
good bonding and stability.
I don't know if you tried flattening the concrete on your
own, but, if you did...this time see if you can wave a six-pack
in the direction of a couple of buddies to help spread the mix and
screed it off. Also, be sure to rent a big bull float to do the
"final" topping. They come with long enough handles that you
should NEVER have to actually walk on the concrete itself.
The good news is that you are a lot more educated about
pouring concrete now, and, the NEXT slab will be a lot better
(cold comfort, I know).
3) you could take a hybrid approach. Fill in the holes
with patching compound and knock down the ridges with a sander,
to get it as smooth as possible. Then, there are a number of
epoxy based floor coatings that one can put down that will
provide an excellent surface. I don't recall any names just
off the bat, but, a quick poke through the yellow pages under
floor treatments should get you some names. Also, I am sure
that the concrete company would have a clue about this too
(which is a good reason to try and stay on friendly terms with
them...) In any case, the deal is that you spread this thick
layer of epoxy on the floor, then, sprinkle on these flakes
of material..sometimes coarse sand, sometimes little flakes
of plastic. It then gets rolled down flat. Once it sets up
it will be a nearly indestructable floor treatment. We had
this done to the concrete floor of the fellowship hall in my
church back in the mid-70s or so, and, it STILL looks just
as good as it did then (and it has had a LOT of use, too).
I would be a little concerned about the areas you
mention as spalling off...that does not bode well for a good
surface, but, perhaps the epoxy will stabilize it enough that
all will be well. Or...at the worst...the areas that are really
bad are JUST where you will put a workbench or some large,
stationary tool (*smile*).
Regards
Dave Mundt

jtaylor wrote:
I just poured my first ever concrete.
...snippage...

Anyone have an opinion on using this stuff for a home shop floor covering?

http://www.racedeck.com/racedeck.htm

--
Doug
http://www.des.indianchief.com/index.htm

"Doug Smith" wrote in message
newsj4Zc.101056$mD.51380@attbi_s02...
jtaylor wrote:
I just poured my first ever concrete.
...snippage...

Anyone have an opinion on using this stuff for a home shop floor covering?

http://www.racedeck.com/racedeck.htm

--
Doug
http://www.des.indianchief.com/index.htm

Doug,

I think it would be close to impossible to move a heavy machine on that
stuff. Even if it didn't give, just the molded in ridges would stop a
machinery caster. A tiny pebble seems like a boulder on even a smooth floor
when you're moving something heavy. Looks cool though.

George

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 19:28:20 GMT, Doug Smith wrote:
Anyone have an opinion on using this stuff for a home shop floor covering?

http://www.racedeck.com/racedeck.htm

I like the concept, but I'd want to see prices.

Gary

gglines wrote:
I think it would be close to impossible to move a heavy machine on that
stuff. Even if it didn't give, just the molded in ridges would stop a
machinery caster. A tiny pebble seems like a boulder on even a smooth floor
when you're moving something heavy. Looks cool though.

Yeah, good point. I also think it would be a bitch to clean up all the
oils and other stuff I tend to have flinging around the shop on any
given day. Seems to me it would seep down through the cracks and settle
on the concrete and, over time, make a helluva mess.

I'm starting to think Roy has the right idea -- good quality paint..
--
Doug
http://www.des.indianchief.com/index.htm

Gary Coffman wrote:
I like the concept, but I'd want to see prices.

Purty damn expensive. $3.75 per tile -- that's 1 square foot. I think
this stuff is for show, not for a working environment.

I'm liking paint more and more! Gotta look into that Valspar stuff..
--
Doug
http://www.des.indianchief.com/index.htm

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 04:19:44 -0400, Gary Coffman
wrote:

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 19:28:20 GMT, Doug Smith wrote:
Anyone have an opinion on using this stuff for a home shop floor covering?

http://www.racedeck.com/racedeck.htm

I like the concept, but I'd want to see prices.

Gary

SnapLock doesn't sell direct. I'm in S.E. Michigan and they referred
me to the only dealer in the state, who is some 300miles away.

CircleTrac, FastDeck and Diamond Tile Are $3.32 per square foot,
delivered.

The free flow is $2.95 per sq ft,

The Laminate is $4.82 sq. ft,

Add fifty cents per sq. ft. for quantities under 500 sq. ft.

If you want to mix and match colors, prices are based on the total
square footage, not the amount of each color.

Tiles come 48 pieces to a case, about 40 pounds. Tiles are already
snapped together in 4x4 foot squares. Shipping is UPS, or truck if
you have a loading dock. Truck is cheaper. I suppose you could save
yourself a few bucks if the dealer is close enough for pickup.

Warranty is 10 years.

Call Snaplock at 800-457-0174 for dealer in your area and double check
prices with him. Could be significant variance here.

The dealer I talked with offered to send me samples. Small 2x3"
pieces. I dont know if all dealers will do that.

If you're in Michigan and wondering about the dealer it's
Garage Outfitters
Traverse City
866-466-8808

Nice stuff, but in my shop we're looking at over $3,000. Not sure if
it's worthwhile or not but it sure would cure some problems for me.

Ridge Custom WoodWorks
Happiness is the art of enjoying the inevitable.

Roy wrote:
You need to let it age for a bit before you paint it. Keep grease and
oils off it to make it easier to clean prior to painting. There are
numeorus 2 component paints for floors as well as some good single
component paints like Valspars floor paint for maasonary and outdoors
use. I have that on my floor and it takes a beating and still looks
good.

Say, Roy, I'm looking at the Valspars web site and I'm not sure I'm
finding the paint you used on your shop floor.

I see this "Exterior Masonry & Stucco Paint" but it's branded
"McCloskey" and says "Do not use on glazes brick, floors or steps".

The only other likely suspect I see is "Valspar Premium Concrete and
Masonry Sealer" but that looks like it might be a colorless sealer.
And, on the Valspar commercial web site I see lots of epoxy coverings.

Can you give me any more specifics on your floor paint?

Thanks,
--
Doug
http://www.des.indianchief.com/index.htm