The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes, you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any different
than foreign governments demanding access to others' communications as well.
It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk about open internet
principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom.

On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, the renowned "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes, you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any different
than foreign governments demanding access to others' communications as well.
It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk about open internet
principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom.

All countries (including the US) are gravitating to the mainland
Chinese standard of internet privacy (not to mention availability).
IMHO, it's nothing to do with which party is in power, just a matter
of losing rights that are not insisted upon by the public. AFAIUI,
they're being doing this on a massive scale at least since 2002-3.

Eg.
http://cryptome.org/klein-decl.htm

The STASI in East German was using similar methods to what the NSA is
reportedly doing-- there are a number of papers out there on how they
(and presumably many other governments) implement undetectable optical
taps.

What exactly are you doing that you would not want the authorities to
know ALL about? ;-)


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

On Feb 18, 7:39*am, Spehro Pefhany
wrote:

What exactly are you doing that you would not want the authorities to
know ALL about? ;-)

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." * * * * * * * * * * * * *"The Journey is the reward"
* * * * * * Info for manufacturers:http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog *Info for designers: *http://www.speff.com

Silly question-

How to survive and thrive under the coming fascist authoritarian
repressive regime being shuttled into existence by both the democrats
and the republicans, and ultimately, how to overthrow them, of course.


Dave

On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 05:10:06 -0800 (PST), Dave__67
wrote:

On Feb 18, 7:39*am, Spehro Pefhany
wrote:

What exactly are you doing that you would not want the authorities to
know ALL about? ;-)

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." * * * * * * * * * * * * *"The Journey is the reward"
* * * * * * Info for manufacturers:http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog *Info for designers: *http://www.speff.com

Silly question-

How to survive and thrive under the coming fascist authoritarian
repressive regime being shuttled into existence by both the democrats
and the republicans, and ultimately, how to overthrow them, of course.


Dave


http://www.helium.com/items/1907880-...g-on-americans

First time I heard about huge computers to simulate nukes / virtual
explosions, I shook my head saying yeah right... Same thing with spy
satellites, think about a telescope pointing down. Surprised that
there isn't a whole system on the moon to leave behind as a legacy.

Its when they turn on you. I ran into a person who told me something I
had already known that blew me away. They threatening you with
existence.

People are asleep at the wheel. They're all involved, the last one was
the greatest. He basically said it on TV and no one listened. Their
going to take a list of the books you check out of the library, go
through your mail, and listen / record your calls.

Don't look anywhere near up on a clear day. Especially with face
recognition and with intelligent video, your anomalous vehicle
movements will trip the ice fishing flag.

Its not paranoia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moore%27s_law

I just love the microphones in cars. And that is old news. Was a
federal case in LV about a titty bar guy paying off the city leaders
and they crossed the state line and thus opened up the already open
microphone !


SW

On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes, you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout history.
snip
===============
Several threads come together here, with citizen
surveillance out sourced and corporate mass propaganda
efforts.

http://www.sacbee.com/2011/02/18/341...o-company.html
snip
An obscure cybersecurity firm from Sacramento has been swept
up in a bizarre scandal involving an affiliated company and
an alleged plot to discredit liberal critics of the U.S.
Chamber of Commerce.

As the controversy intensified, the Sacramento company
abruptly withdrew from a high-profile cybersecurity
convention being held this week at the Moscone Center in San
Francisco. The conference ends today.

The company, HBGary Inc., pulled out because employees "have
received numerous threats of violence, including threats at
our trade show booth," according to a statement posted on
its website.

The controversy involves an affiliated company called HBGary
Federal Inc., which has offices in Colorado and Washington,
D.C.

According to e-mails obtained by the hacker group Anonymous
and posted by ThinkProgress.org, a left-leaning group,
HBGary Federal was crafting a disinformation campaign to
undermine such liberal organizations as the Service
Employees International Union and Change to Win, a coalition
of labor unions.

Numerous reports say the campaign was to include
cyber-attacks, creation of false personas on social media
websites and ==intelligence gathering.== Published and
online reports said HBGary Federal was teaming with two
other security firms to pitch the idea to a law firm that
works for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
snip
The hacker group, Anonymous, obtained some 40,000 of HBGary
Federal's e-mails and another 27,000 e-mails from the
Sacramento company, HBGary, according to a report on Forbes
magazine's website.

Anonymous "broke into computer systems and stole proprietary
and confidential information," the Sacramento company said
on its website. "This breach was in violation of federal and
state laws, and stolen information was publicly released
without our consent."
{ BOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO }
snip





-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
...............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

"azotic" wrote in message
...
The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes,
you read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US
government is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company
that doesn't comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the
US government massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly
throughout history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any
different than foreign governments demanding access to others'
communications as well. It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk
about open internet principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the
same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom

Not to worry. The ability of Feds to wiretap with absolutely no approval
isn't far behind. Wait, it's already here.

Never mind.

Steve

"F. George McDuffee" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes,
you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US
government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout
history.
snip
===============
Several threads come together here, with citizen
surveillance out sourced and corporate mass propaganda
efforts.

http://www.sacbee.com/2011/02/18/341...o-company.html
snip
An obscure cybersecurity firm from Sacramento has been swept
up in a bizarre scandal involving an affiliated company and
an alleged plot to discredit liberal critics of the U.S.
Chamber of Commerce.

As the controversy intensified, the Sacramento company
abruptly withdrew from a high-profile cybersecurity
convention being held this week at the Moscone Center in San
Francisco. The conference ends today.

The company, HBGary Inc., pulled out because employees "have
received numerous threats of violence, including threats at
our trade show booth," according to a statement posted on
its website.

The controversy involves an affiliated company called HBGary
Federal Inc., which has offices in Colorado and Washington,
D.C.

According to e-mails obtained by the hacker group Anonymous
and posted by ThinkProgress.org, a left-leaning group,
HBGary Federal was crafting a disinformation campaign to
undermine such liberal organizations as the Service
Employees International Union and Change to Win, a coalition
of labor unions.

Numerous reports say the campaign was to include
cyber-attacks, creation of false personas on social media
websites and ==intelligence gathering.== Published and
online reports said HBGary Federal was teaming with two
other security firms to pitch the idea to a law firm that
works for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
snip
The hacker group, Anonymous, obtained some 40,000 of HBGary
Federal's e-mails and another 27,000 e-mails from the
Sacramento company, HBGary, according to a report on Forbes
magazine's website.

Anonymous "broke into computer systems and stole proprietary
and confidential information," the Sacramento company said
on its website. "This breach was in violation of federal and
state laws, and stolen information was publicly released
without our consent."
{ BOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO }
snip
-- Unka George (George McDuffee)

It just depends on who is doing it as to whether or not it is a crime.

Steve

As far as I know, this story (FBI demanding easier wiretap access to
everything) has been a constant topic since a long time ago and there
is nothing new, but this is a very interesting subject indeed.

The "new telecom" providers like Skype, claim that they are not
telecom within the meaning of the old wiretap laws, and do not need to
provide wiretap capabilities.

At the same time, FBI has many tools at its disposal, that can give it
surveillance of almost any suspect, but they are costlier than a
wiretap at the click of a mouse. For example, they can remotely
install spyware such as CIPAV on a suspect's Windows computer, break
into a suspect's home and install a keylogger, issue a subpoena, etc.

The FBIs problem is that it is much more expensive and riskier.

Most people (like drug dealers or online pedophiles) who try to cover
their tracks and use encryption, are barely computer literate, and
usually use Windows. This is their downfall. Windows, apparently, has
backdoors for the FBI to install this CIPAV tool, it stores temporary
files in an insecure manner, etc. Maybe it is "good for the country",
but not for those criminals. They try to use encryption protocols
without deep understanding of what they mean exactly. Or do not
password protect their encryption keys, etc. Or they use some snake
oil security software.

i

On 2011-02-18, azotic wrote:
The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes, you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any different
than foreign governments demanding access to others' communications as well.
It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk about open internet
principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom.

"F. George McDuffee" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes,
you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US
government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout
history.
snip
===============
Several threads come together here, with citizen
surveillance out sourced and corporate mass propaganda
efforts.

http://www.sacbee.com/2011/02/18/341...o-company.html
snip
An obscure cybersecurity firm from Sacramento has been swept
up in a bizarre scandal involving an affiliated company and
an alleged plot to discredit liberal critics of the U.S.
Chamber of Commerce.

As the controversy intensified, the Sacramento company
abruptly withdrew from a high-profile cybersecurity
convention being held this week at the Moscone Center in San
Francisco. The conference ends today.

The company, HBGary Inc., pulled out because employees "have
received numerous threats of violence, including threats at
our trade show booth," according to a statement posted on
its website.

The controversy involves an affiliated company called HBGary
Federal Inc., which has offices in Colorado and Washington,
D.C.

According to e-mails obtained by the hacker group Anonymous
and posted by ThinkProgress.org, a left-leaning group,
HBGary Federal was crafting a disinformation campaign to
undermine such liberal organizations as the Service
Employees International Union and Change to Win, a coalition
of labor unions.

Numerous reports say the campaign was to include
cyber-attacks, creation of false personas on social media
websites and ==intelligence gathering.== Published and
online reports said HBGary Federal was teaming with two
other security firms to pitch the idea to a law firm that
works for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
snip
The hacker group, Anonymous, obtained some 40,000 of HBGary
Federal's e-mails and another 27,000 e-mails from the
Sacramento company, HBGary, according to a report on Forbes
magazine's website.

Anonymous "broke into computer systems and stole proprietary
and confidential information," the Sacramento company said
on its website. "This breach was in violation of federal and
state laws, and stolen information was publicly released
without our consent."
{ BOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO }
snip





-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

The same company HBGary was exposed working with BOA to
discredit wikileaks.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...reenwald.shtml

Best Regards
Tom.

"Spehro Pefhany" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, the renowned "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes,
you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US
government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout
history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any
different
than foreign governments demanding access to others' communications as
well.
It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk about open internet
principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom.

All countries (including the US) are gravitating to the mainland
Chinese standard of internet privacy (not to mention availability).
IMHO, it's nothing to do with which party is in power, just a matter
of losing rights that are not insisted upon by the public. AFAIUI,
they're being doing this on a massive scale at least since 2002-3.

Eg.
http://cryptome.org/klein-decl.htm

The STASI in East German was using similar methods to what the NSA is
reportedly doing-- there are a number of papers out there on how they
(and presumably many other governments) implement undetectable optical
taps.

What exactly are you doing that you would not want the authorities to
know ALL about? ;-)


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

I was just wondering why gunner has dissapeared.
Havent seen any posts from him in a while.

Best Regards
Tom.

azotic wrote:

"Spehro Pefhany" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 04:00:27 -0800, the renowned "azotic"
wrote:

The unfortunate, if not surprising, news story making the rounds today is
that the feds in the US are looking to pass new laws to legally require a
wiretap backdoor in every kind of internet communication offering. Yes,
you
read that right. If there's any way to communicate online, the US
government
is demanding the right to be able to wiretap it. Any company that doesn't
comply will face fines. This despite the long history of the US government
massively abusing its wiretapping privileges repeatedly throughout
history.

And, yes, this would supposedly apply to non-US communications services as
well:

Foreign-based providers that do business inside the United States must
install a domestic office capable of performing intercepts.
Yeah, that'll go over well. It's difficult to see how this is any
different
than foreign governments demanding access to others' communications as
well.
It's pretty ridiculous for President Obama to talk about open internet
principles to the UN, while cooking this up at the same time.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...ications.shtml

Double speak is alive and well in the white house.

Best Regards
Tom.

All countries (including the US) are gravitating to the mainland
Chinese standard of internet privacy (not to mention availability).
IMHO, it's nothing to do with which party is in power, just a matter
of losing rights that are not insisted upon by the public. AFAIUI,
they're being doing this on a massive scale at least since 2002-3.

Eg.
http://cryptome.org/klein-decl.htm

The STASI in East German was using similar methods to what the NSA is
reportedly doing-- there are a number of papers out there on how they
(and presumably many other governments) implement undetectable optical
taps.

What exactly are you doing that you would not want the authorities to
know ALL about? ;-)


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

I was just wondering why gunner has dissapeared.
Havent seen any posts from him in a while.


Someone reported that Gunner was having computer problems and
couldn't get on line.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a band-aid on it, because it's
Teflon coated.