A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

All stainless pop rivets. I get them from an outfit in Phoenix for marine
work. I've got several bags of them in various length 1/8 inch diameter
hanging from the pegboard in the shop. No clue what alloy they are. They
pop in easily enough. I suppose for "finish" work I could knock out the
stub of the stem, and then used a center punch and then pin punch to spread
and flatten the pull side.

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:15:38 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:

A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn


Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:15:38 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:

A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn


Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Theres an old adage in applied art metalwork that says,
if you cant hide the joint, make a feature of it.
so those of us who have the blessing of a partner for more than 30 yrs,
this sort of repair job will eventually come up.
I had a similar job last year.
Her indoors, has a omlette turner? of stainless steel, the turner part
was also spot welded to the handle.
After many yrs of regular use the two seperated.
God knows how they come to break things
Probably used to open a tin lid.
She's not one to throwthings about!! in the kitchen,
Fix this for me dear was the call,
now I have tig, silver brazing alloy, etc but decided to drill out the
spot welds to 1/4in, counter sink both sides, cut a 1/4in length of
anealed copper rod insert and cold rivet over times 2.
filed flat.
also I hope, good enough for another lifetime, and no hold ups on the
omlette front.
Could have used stainless, or 70/30 brass rod but copper looks nicer,
and you can get a better feel in the rivetting.
But Thats another big subject,for another day.
Something to do with using a hammer,
Most satisfying tool.

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 06:39:33 +0000, Ted Frater
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:15:38 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:

A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn


Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Theres an old adage in applied art metalwork that says,
if you cant hide the joint, make a feature of it.
so those of us who have the blessing of a partner for more than 30 yrs,
this sort of repair job will eventually come up.
I had a similar job last year.
Her indoors, has a omlette turner? of stainless steel, the turner part
was also spot welded to the handle.
After many yrs of regular use the two seperated.
God knows how they come to break things
Probably used to open a tin lid.
She's not one to throwthings about!! in the kitchen,
Fix this for me dear was the call,
now I have tig, silver brazing alloy, etc but decided to drill out the
spot welds to 1/4in, counter sink both sides, cut a 1/4in length of
anealed copper rod insert and cold rivet over times 2.
filed flat.
also I hope, good enough for another lifetime, and no hold ups on the
omlette front.
Could have used stainless, or 70/30 brass rod but copper looks nicer,
and you can get a better feel in the rivetting.
But Thats another big subject,for another day.
Something to do with using a hammer,
Most satisfying tool.


Indeed. And I rather like copper fitments.

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Bob La Londe wrote:
"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

All stainless pop rivets. I get them from an outfit in Phoenix for
marine work. I've got several bags of them in various length 1/8 inch
diameter hanging from the pegboard in the shop. No clue what alloy they
are. They pop in easily enough. I suppose for "finish" work I could
knock out the stub of the stem, and then used a center punch and then
pin punch to spread and flatten the pull side.



Smallest pops I've seen are 3/32" diameter.

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

Send it to me and I will spotweld it.

On Dec 22, 11:26*pm, "Bob La Londe" wrote:
"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...
All stainless pop rivets. *I get them from an outfit in Phoenix for marine
work. *...

Stanley does or did make stainless pop rivets. 1/8" dia X 1/2" long is
part # PTT48, bar code 45731 13090. The store where I found them sells
imports, closeouts and overstock so I don't know a good quick source
elsewhere.

jsw

On Dec 23, 4:15*am, Joseph Gwinn wrote:

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. *But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

I do not think that hot riveting would have any benefits. The length
of the shank is maybe 1/16th of an inch. Not a lot of shrinkage in
that short a length.


Dan

On Dec 22, 10:15*pm, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. *I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. *So, I must repair it.

In article ,
"Bob La Londe" wrote:

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

All stainless pop rivets. I get them from an outfit in Phoenix for marine
work. I've got several bags of them in various length 1/8 inch diameter
hanging from the pegboard in the shop. No clue what alloy they are. They
pop in easily enough. I suppose for "finish" work I could knock out the
stub of the stem, and then used a center punch and then pin punch to spread
and flatten the pull side.

I didn't consider pop rivets because they yield this big sharp thing on
the blind side, and are weak relative to bolting or solid rivets. There
is actually a lot of force on these feet, given the leverage and general
banging around any kitchen implement receives.

The drive the stem out and upset with a punch approach will improve
strength and appearance but sounds like as much work as upsetting a
solid rivet, and yields something not as neat looking.

Joe Gwinn

In article , "Buerste"
wrote:

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

Send it to me and I will spotweld it.

Thanks Tawm, but I have already drilled the welds out and bolted it, so
now I'm more or less committed to replacing the peened-over bolting with
rivets, which are also very common in cookware.

Joe Gwinn

In article
,
" wrote:

On Dec 23, 4:15*am, Joseph Gwinn wrote:

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. *But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

I do not think that hot riveting would have any benefits. The length
of the shank is maybe 1/16th of an inch. Not a lot of shrinkage in
that short a length.

I think you are right that these rivets are too small. I was asking
more for future reference than current need.

Joe Gwinn

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

On Dec 22, 10:15*pm, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. *I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. *So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. *Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic. *
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. *Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. *The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. *The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. *(Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. *I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. *The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. *But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better. *
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. *This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. *These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. *But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Gunner Asch wrote:

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:15:38 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:

A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn


Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

The color was no issue - milady would not have cared, and copper is easy
to get and to form.

My worry is that copper is too soft and weak for such rivets to work for
long. The colander foot is fairly long compared to the space between
the welds/rivets, so the leverage is large, and I figured it would shear
off the first time the colander was dropped.

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Ted Frater wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:15:38 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:

A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

[snip]


Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

Gunner


Theres an old adage in applied art metalwork that says,
if you cant hide the joint, make a feature of it.
so those of us who have the blessing of a partner for more than 30 yrs,
this sort of repair job will eventually come up.
I had a similar job last year.
Her indoors, has a omlette turner? of stainless steel, the turner part
was also spot welded to the handle.
After many yrs of regular use the two seperated.
God knows how they come to break things
Probably used to open a tin lid.
She's not one to throwthings about!! in the kitchen,
Fix this for me dear was the call,
now I have tig, silver brazing alloy, etc but decided to drill out the
spot welds to 1/4in, counter sink both sides, cut a 1/4in length of
anealed copper rod insert and cold rivet over times 2.
filed flat.
also I hope, good enough for another lifetime, and no hold ups on the
omlette front.
Could have used stainless, or 70/30 brass rod but copper looks nicer,
and you can get a better feel in the rivetting.
But Thats another big subject,for another day.
Something to do with using a hammer,
Most satisfying tool.

I agree with the make-it-a-feature approach for sure.

As discussed in my answer to Gunner, I didn't think that copper was
strong enough. Nor do I have space for 1/4" rivets - the foot might be
1/2" wide. The holes I drilled are 3/32" diameter.

So, button-head or truss-head SS rivets may be the solution.

Joe Gwinn

On Dec 23, 11:07*am, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article
,
*"Denis G." wrote:





On Dec 22, 10:15*pm, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. *I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. *So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. *Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.. *
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. *Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. *The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. *The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. *(Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. *I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. *The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. *But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better. *
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. *This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. *These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. *But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. *The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. *But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: *In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. *(Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

Joe Gwinn-

You are making a lot out of a simple task. Countersink the foot if you
like, then pound the rivet head and the bowl into it with a flat piece
of steel drilled for the rivet shank. For neatness you could pull the
shank only enough to snug it in the hole, then remove it, Flare the
end with a center punch and knock it down with a ball pein hammer.

In my experience salvaging stuff the sheet metal will deform
considerably before a stainless steel pop rivet breaks.

jsw

On Dec 23, 2:54*pm, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
...
The problem with pop rivets (and hollow rivets in general) is that they
loosen long before they pop out, because too little metal is carrying
the load. *A solid rivet won't loosen, if properly sized and installed.

Joe Gwinn

True, but you have the means to retighten them, and they are much
easier to drill out without enlargening the hole. Hopefully they will
hold until you happen onto some solid rivets, probably the day after
you finish it.

I have two standards for workmanship, Unlikely to Fail for finished
products that ship, and Easy to Change for prototypes that stay in
house.

jsw

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.



This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

So did heat make a difference, or was it just not doable with that
particular alum. alloy?

--
REMEMBER: The sooner you fall behind,
the more time you'll have to catch up!

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:11:21 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Gunner Asch wrote:
Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

The color was no issue - milady would not have cared, and copper is easy
to get and to form.

My worry is that copper is too soft and weak for such rivets to work for
long. The colander foot is fairly long compared to the space between
the welds/rivets, so the leverage is large, and I figured it would shear
off the first time the colander was dropped.

Kinda like a crush bumper, it might be just the thing the colander
needs to survive yet another drop, eh? It may be worth considering
copper or aluminum rivets instead of S/S.

--
REMEMBER: The sooner you fall behind,
the more time you'll have to catch up!

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...

snip
Send it to me and I will spotweld it.

Thanks Tawm, but I have already drilled the welds out and bolted it, so
now I'm more or less committed to replacing the peened-over bolting with
rivets, which are also very common in cookware.

Joe Gwinn

Well, you know I'd do ANYTHING for you Joe! GL!

Joseph Gwinn wrote:
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the o, the collander bowl istoo thin to countersink, the feet are too small to use proper sized rivets,
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

So the collander bowl is too thin to counter sink, the feet are too
small for a larger rivet size,
the leverage on the feet is too great,
seems to me different approach is needed.
other than remaking the feet in larger stainless sheet, how about a ring
of 1/8thin stainless wire connecting the feet together.half way along
their length?
would replicate the circular collander bases other collanders have and
spread the load when in use,
ifv you havnt stainless wire then copper or brass or even galvanised
plain would do.
how you fix it to the legs depends on how the legs are formed.

We need a photo of it to devise a proper engineering solution.
Im sure NASA would have the expertise to solve this .

In article
,
Jim Wilkins wrote:

On Dec 23, 2:54*pm, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
...
The problem with pop rivets (and hollow rivets in general) is that they
loosen long before they pop out, because too little metal is carrying
the load. *A solid rivet won't loosen, if properly sized and installed.

Joe Gwinn

True, but you have the means to retighten them, and they are much
easier to drill out without enlargening the hole. Hopefully they will
hold until you happen onto some solid rivets, probably the day after
you finish it.

The current nut and peened-over machine screws will last until I tire of
looking at them.


I have two standards for workmanship, Unlikely to Fail for finished
products that ship, and Easy to Change for prototypes that stay in
house.

Well I don't know that there is much to prototype in colanders, the
design having settled at least a century ago, and I prefer doing such
jobs at most once.

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:11:21 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Gunner Asch wrote:
Just out of curiosity..other than color blend..what about Copper?

The color was no issue - milady would not have cared, and copper is easy
to get and to form.

My worry is that copper is too soft and weak for such rivets to work for
long. The colander foot is fairly long compared to the space between
the welds/rivets, so the leverage is large, and I figured it would shear
off the first time the colander was dropped.

Kinda like a crush bumper, it might be just the thing the colander
needs to survive yet another drop, eh? It may be worth considering
copper or aluminum rivets instead of S/S.

The metal of the bowl and feet is soft enough that it will simply bend
if the rivets hold.

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.

There's a thought - tools!

Dapping blocks and punches are not the same thing as a rivet head
forming punch. But I bet McMaster carries the correct tools.

Or, for one use, I could make the tools from soft steel.


This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

So did heat make a difference, or was it just not doable with that
particular alum. alloy?

No, the issue was that it was too slow and too hard to heat the airplane
up, and a WW2 airplane had tens of thousands of rivets holding it
together.

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Ted Frater wrote:

Joseph Gwinn wrote:
A few days ago, a foot broke off of my wife's favorite colander. I was
going to replace the colander, but she has had for at least 30 years,
and likes its now uncommon wide and shallow shape. So, I must repair it.

The colander is completely made of stainless steel, the bowl being about
12" in diameter and 5" deep. Alloy unknown, but it is not magnetic.
Fabrication was a bit sloppy. Each foot is spot-welded to the bowl in
three places, at least in theory. The foot that came off instead had
one weld plus two good-intention dents, and the one weld eventually
fatigued and broke. The other two feet were each missing at least one
weld, but it was hard to tell without pulling the joint apart.

I don't have a welder, and silver brazing was going to leave a very
large and ugly heat-affected zone, which could well rust. (Not knowing
the alloy, I have to assume that it is one of those that can rust if
raised to red heat.)

So, I drilled foot and bowl to accept three stainless steel 2-56 machine
screws and nuts, with the screwheads inside the bowl. I also put one
screw apiece in the other two feet, replacing the most obvious missing
welds. The bits of screw shaft protruding from the nuts were then
peened over with a ball peen hammer to form a rough rivethead.

So far so good - it will not fail in my lifetime. But it does look a
bit crude, and the peened thread ends are a bit sharp (as I didn't form
a real rivethead), and I think real rivets would have been better.
Copper is probably too weak, ordinary steel rusts, so the rivets should
be made of stainless steel.

The question is what alloys are best for making SS rivets. This is two
questions, actually, as one may wish to cold rivet (as I did with the
2-56 screws), or hot-rivet.

Whatever alloy those SS 2-56 screws are made of certainly would work as
a rivet. These screws were intended for use on airplanes, as the o, the
collander bowl istoo thin to countersink, the feet are too small to use
proper sized rivets,
flat-head screws have 100-degree heads, so they were probably made to
some MIL-SPEC.

Googling on "stainless steel rivet" yields that lots of rivets are made
of 304 and 316 alloys, so perhaps that's the best answer, at least for
cold riveting. But then there is hot riveting, where the rivet is
heated red hot before hammering into shape.

Joe Gwinn

So the collander bowl is too thin to counter sink, the feet are too
small for a larger rivet size, the leverage on the feet is too great,
seems to me different approach is needed.
other than remaking the feet in larger stainless sheet, how about a ring
of 1/8thin stainless wire connecting the feet together.half way along
their length?
would replicate the circular collander bases other collanders have and
spread the load when in use,
ifv you havnt stainless wire then copper or brass or even galvanised
plain would do.
how you fix it to the legs depends on how the legs are formed.

But then that wire ring would catch on everything. The usual
alternative is to replace the separate legs with a sheet-metal ring
shaped like a truncated cone. But this is far too much work.

I suppose I could make my own rivets from hobbyshop SS wire, which I
recall is type 304.


We need a photo of it to devise a proper engineering solution.

It's a flat-bottomed hemisphere with three bent-strap feet spotwelded to
the flat bottom. I didn't see any catalog offerings that look exactly
like it.


Im sure NASA would have the expertise to solve this.

Yeah - use at least four welds, so even if one weld fails the foot won't
come off.

Or the conical ring spotwelded in at least four places to the bowl -
this is a very common design, and the ring isn't going to come off so
easily.


Joe Gwinn

In article , "Buerste"
wrote:

"Joseph Gwinn" wrote in message
...

snip
Send it to me and I will spotweld it.

Thanks Tawm, but I have already drilled the welds out and bolted it, so
now I'm more or less committed to replacing the peened-over bolting with
rivets, which are also very common in cookware.

Joe Gwinn

Well, you know I'd do ANYTHING for you Joe! GL!

Well, I appreciate that, but is a colander challenging enough?

Joe Gwinn

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:



This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

So did heat make a difference, or was it just not doable with that
particular alum. alloy?

No, the issue was that it was too slow and too hard to heat the airplane
up, and a WW2 airplane had tens of thousands of rivets holding it
together.

Joe Gwinn

There's a tool for that, of course. I'm only aware of it because I
hired a guy as a SS fabricator whose experience consisted of operating
a thermo-dimpler in the Air Force. Unfortunately that seemed to be his
only experience, and we didn't have anything that needed dimpling.
Though we were willing to train him, he just stopped showing up one
day.
http://www.tpub.com/content/aviation.../14018_531.htm

--
Ned Simmons

In article ,
Ned Simmons wrote:

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, Joseph Gwinn
wrote:



This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

So did heat make a difference, or was it just not doable with that
particular alum. alloy?

No, the issue was that it was too slow and too hard to heat the airplane
up, and a WW2 airplane had tens of thousands of rivets holding it
together.

Joe Gwinn

There's a tool for that, of course. I'm only aware of it because I
hired a guy as a SS fabricator whose experience consisted of operating
a thermo-dimpler in the Air Force. Unfortunately that seemed to be his
only experience, and we didn't have anything that needed dimpling.
Though we were willing to train him, he just stopped showing up one
day.
http://www.tpub.com/content/aviation.../14018_531.htm

I guess the modern alloys like to be warm when dimpled. I'm pretty sure
that dimpling was done cold in WW2.

I have to wonder about someone who only learned how to operate a thermo
dimpler in the USAF, so you may have dodged a bullet.


Joe Gwinn

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.

There's a thought - tools!

Dapping blocks and punches are not the same thing as a rivet head
forming punch. But I bet McMaster carries the correct tools.

Um, I thought you wanted to deform the colander foot holes, forming
them for the head of the rivet. shrug


Or, for one use, I could make the tools from soft steel.

"If you get the chance to buy tools, go for it!" I sez.


This dimple-the-sheet method is the reason for 100 degree flathead
screw/rivet heads: In WW2, it was found that the aluminum sheet used
for airplane skins could be cold dimpled to 100 degrees included angle
without cracking, but 82 degrees was too severe. (Don't know about the
90 degree heads used in metric screws, but I bet that 90 degrees is also
too severe.)

So did heat make a difference, or was it just not doable with that
particular alum. alloy?

No, the issue was that it was too slow and too hard to heat the airplane
up, and a WW2 airplane had tens of thousands of rivets holding it
together.

Yeah, that might take 3 hands.

--
REMEMBER: The sooner you fall behind,
the more time you'll have to catch up!

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.

There's a thought - tools!

Dapping blocks and punches are not the same thing as a rivet head
forming punch. But I bet McMaster carries the correct tools.

Um, I thought you wanted to deform the colander foot holes, forming
them for the head of the rivet. shrug

Yes, but to accept flathead rivets, so that the rivet heads do not
protrude into the bowl, which requires conical dimples, not domed.


Or, for one use, I could make the tools from soft steel.

"If you get the chance to buy tools, go for it!" I sez.

Yep. McMaster probably has them.

Joe Gwinn

On Fri, 25 Dec 2009 20:02:44 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.

There's a thought - tools!

Dapping blocks and punches are not the same thing as a rivet head
forming punch. But I bet McMaster carries the correct tools.

Um, I thought you wanted to deform the colander foot holes, forming
them for the head of the rivet. shrug

Yes, but to accept flathead rivets, so that the rivet heads do not
protrude into the bowl, which requires conical dimples, not domed.

So check the Griz link again. It's for -conical- dapping. Looks like
100 degree, but you wouldn't be able to use the die base with it for a
big colander.


Or, for one use, I could make the tools from soft steel.

"If you get the chance to buy tools, go for it!" I sez.

Yep. McMaster probably has them.

Prolly so.

--
REMEMBER: The sooner you fall behind,
the more time you'll have to catch up!

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Fri, 25 Dec 2009 20:02:44 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 12:01:18 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 11:07:04 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article
,
"Denis G." wrote:

McMaster Carr has countersunk stainless steel solid rivets:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#solid-rivets/=5228i4
They might look less obvious..

I did think of this, but there is a twist. The bowl material is too
thin to countersink, but there is a standard dodge from the airplane
industry - one countersinks the piece to which the sheet will be
riveted
(the foot in the present example), and dimples the (bowl) sheet to
match. But it's going to require some tooling to make those dimples
in
stainless steel sheet.

Excellent! Now you have a solid reason for new tools, Joe. Getchersef
a brand-spankin' new doming die/dapping punch set!

http://fwd4.me/9LD Griz $80ish

http://fwd4.me/9LJ HF $45ish ($36 local, GO FOR IT!)

http://fwd4.me/9LL eBay dapping punches, $20ish
eBay dapping block, $67ish

http://fwd4.me/9LF Amazon $46; brass, may be too soft.

There's a thought - tools!

Dapping blocks and punches are not the same thing as a rivet head
forming punch. But I bet McMaster carries the correct tools.

Um, I thought you wanted to deform the colander foot holes, forming
them for the head of the rivet. shrug

Yes, but to accept flathead rivets, so that the rivet heads do not
protrude into the bowl, which requires conical dimples, not domed.

So check the Griz link again. It's for -conical- dapping. Looks like
100 degree, but you wouldn't be able to use the die base with it for a
big colander.

I know the picture makes the punches look conical, but a jewler's doming
punch always has a spherical tip, so I distrust the picture.



Joe Gwinn

On Sat, 26 Dec 2009 09:31:13 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

So check the Griz link again. It's for -conical- dapping. Looks like
100 degree, but you wouldn't be able to use the die base with it for a
big colander.

I know the picture makes the punches look conical, but a jewler's doming
punch always has a spherical tip, so I distrust the picture.

shrug WhatEVER...

--
REMEMBER: The sooner you fall behind,
the more time you'll have to catch up!