Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.

1st, run another conduit down the outside wall of the garage beside
the one I will run for power and bring both phone and coax up through
the garage wall and down into the trench in separat conduit with the
power. Run would be roughly 140 feet.

Also, I will have to run water at the end of the house. (It is in the
video the long winding route between the tree and field lines to the
back of the house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace.
Distance would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of
not having to fish it inside the garage wall.

The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.

What do you think?

stryped wrote:
Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.

1st, run another conduit down the outside wall of the garage beside
the one I will run for power and bring both phone and coax up through
the garage wall and down into the trench in separat conduit with the
power. Run would be roughly 140 feet.

Also, I will have to run water at the end of the house. (It is in the
video the long winding route between the tree and field lines to the
back of the house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace.
Distance would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of
not having to fish it inside the garage wall.

The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.

What do you think?


If the telephone wires will be buried they have to be jell filled or
water will get in and even though the
insulation is OK the change in capacitance will probably kill the
signal. The distance will be OK as
long as the distance to the telephone office is not marginal.


Bill K7NOM

On Nov 6, 9:05*am, Bill Janssen wrote:
stryped wrote:
Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.

1st, run another conduit down the outside wall of the garage beside
the one I will run for power and bring both phone and coax up through
the garage wall and down into the trench in separat conduit with the
power. Run would be roughly 140 feet.

Also, I will have to run water at the end of the house. (It is in the
video the long winding route between the tree and field lines to the
back of the house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace.
Distance would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of
not having to fish it inside the garage wall.

The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.

What do you think?

If the telephone wires will be buried they have to be jell filled or
water will get in and even though the
*insulation is OK the change in capacitance will probably kill the
signal. The distance will be OK as
long as the distance to the telephone office is not marginal.

Bill K7NOM

Just connect the length of wire and coax you are going to use and see
if they work! Leave them coiled up. Don't have to run them out to see
if they will work!

Paul, KD7HB

On Nov 6, 12:12*pm, " wrote:
On Nov 6, 9:05*am, Bill Janssen wrote:





stryped wrote:
Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.

1st, run another conduit down the outside wall of the garage beside
the one I will run for power and bring both phone and coax up through
the garage wall and down into the trench in separat conduit with the
power. Run would be roughly 140 feet.

Also, I will have to run water at the end of the house. (It is in the
video the long winding route between the tree and field lines to the
back of the house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace.
Distance would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of
not having to fish it inside the garage wall.

The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.

What do you think?

If the telephone wires will be buried they have to be jell filled or
water will get in and even though the
*insulation is OK the change in capacitance will probably kill the
signal. The distance will be OK as
long as the distance to the telephone office is not marginal.

Bill K7NOM

Just connect the length of wire and coax you are going to use and see
if they work! Leave them coiled up. Don't have to run them out to see
if they will work!

Paul, KD7HB

Telephone wire can go for many miles, yours probably does already on
the poles.

RG-6 coax loses about 3/4 of the upper channels' signal strength and
half of the lower ones' per hundred feet. ( Cliffstromath, or Infinite
Implausibility Drivel )

Before spendiing on the coax you could test for good reception of the
weaker signal with splitters, a 2-way cuts the strength signal in
half, a 4-way to 1/4. The unused outputs need terminators.

jsw

On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 07:20:34 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.

1st, run another conduit down the outside wall of the garage beside
the one I will run for power and bring both phone and coax up through
the garage wall and down into the trench in separat conduit with the
power. Run would be roughly 140 feet.

Also, I will have to run water at the end of the house. (It is in the
video the long winding route between the tree and field lines to the
back of the house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace.
Distance would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of
not having to fish it inside the garage wall.

The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.

What do you think?

First, try to keep the conduits for the phone and TV as far from the
power conduit in the common trench as you can, laterally or
vertically. 6" if you must,12" is enough, over18" is overkill.

If they are too close and running parallel for long distances, the
power lines can inductively couple over and give you hum problems on
the phone lines, and mess up the video and computers. This is why
power lines are 4 to 6 feet below Power on the pole.

(Well, that and to leave room so dumb Phone linemen aren't sticking
their heads into the power lines... Been there, Saw that happen once,
and the end results {Darwin Award} were not at ALL pretty...)

And {$Deity} forbid you get a lightning strike on the power lines,
you don't want THOSE currents induced on the Phone or TV. Matter of
fact, haveing lightning arresters on the phone and TV where they hit
the shed is a good thing, and a local ground rod or two for the shop
building.

Tie the ground rods at house and shop together with the power line
ground wire, and don't scrimp. You don't want different ground
potentials at opposite ends of the line, that can be real bad.

Make the conduits big enough to Future-Proof them - 1" minimum, 1-1/2"
or 2" is better. And leave a spare pipe for the stuff they haven't
even dreamed up yet, or to pull through a new cable before pulling out
one of the old ones that is failing.

Telephone has no hard distance limits, but if you were going over 300'
or so I'd bump up from the usual 24-gauge to 22-gauge. If it was
1000' or more, I'd go 19-gauge... And if you are already miles away
from the main Switchroom, you might have to bump it up to keep the
Shop phone legible - that 18,000 feet of phone cable getting to your
house counts in the total voltage drop too, that's where the -48V
supply and the dialtone comes from.

The gel-filled 3-pair underground phone drop wire is about 3/8" OD,
and the gopher-armored direct burial stuff is pushing 3/4" OD. You
don't need the armored, but if that's all you can get in-stock locally
you want it to fit inside the pipe...

A 5/8" or 3/4" OD cable is NOT going inside 1/2" trade size PVC
period, and with 3/4" PVC you are cutting it way too close, the sweep
bends tend to oval out a little. Might go in once with a grand
Tug-Of-War, and never come out again...


Get the sheath bonding clamps when you get the underground phone wire,
and use them. The metal armor sheath in the phone cable needs to be
bonded and grounded to the lightning arrestors at both ends.

And if you want computer networking in the Shop, they do make the
same underground phone cable dual-rated as CAT-5 or 5E or6 - Run a
Seperate Networking Cable, don't try to double up with the phones. You
can sometimes get away with it, but never count on it...

The limit between points on a Twisted-pair Ethernet network is about
300', which will work fine - you might want to put a full Hub out in
the shop to act as a repeater.

Or convert to Fiber with a Media Converter Hub at both ends, and pull
through a 12-fiber cable to the Shop. The Fiber Networking uses one
fiber for Tx/Rx each direction, which will give you 10 spares that you
can later convert to CATV or Security CCTV, or other uses...

And they make filled underground RG-11 TV coax too, the Cable
Companies use it for service drops. Again, the local big electrical
wholesale houses should stock it.

-- Bruce --

Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Nov 6, 12:12 pm, " wrote:
On Nov 6, 9:05 am, Bill Janssen wrote:





stryped wrote:
Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be
ran? I have two options. 1st, run another conduit down the
outside wall of the garage beside the one I will run for power
and bring both phone and coax up through the garage wall and
down into the trench in separat conduit with the power. Run
would be roughly 140 feet. Also, I will have to run water at
the end of the house. (It is in the video the long winding
route between the tree and field lines to the back of the
house.) I can run it in this ditch to the crawspace. Distance
would be roughly 190 feet but an easier install becasue of not
having to fish it inside the garage wall. The phone will be a
plain phone. The coax will be connected to my rooftop antenna
on the house for local tv stations and also will be connected
to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever the
sat box is tuned to. What do you think?
If the telephone wires will be buried they have to be jell filled
or water will get in and even though the insulation is OK the
change in capacitance will probably kill the signal. The distance
will be OK as long as the distance to the telephone office is not
marginal. Bill K7NOM
Just connect the length of wire and coax you are going to use and
see if they work! Leave them coiled up. Don't have to run them out
to see if they will work!

Paul, KD7HB

Telephone wire can go for many miles, yours probably does already on
the poles.

RG-6 coax loses about 3/4 of the upper channels' signal strength and
half of the lower ones' per hundred feet. ( Cliffstromath, or
Infinite Implausibility Drivel )

Before spendiing on the coax you could test for good reception of the
weaker signal with splitters, a 2-way cuts the strength signal in
half, a 4-way to 1/4. The unused outputs need terminators.

jsw

Then in a few years you will be able to tear the coax back out when the
FCC kills all broadcast TV.

That is what the current people in charge want to do. These are the same
ones who also pushed for the digital conversion boxes and "rebates" for
them.

From The Wall Street Journal

FCC Considers Shifting Some TV Airwaves to Broadband

By AMY SCHATZ

WASHINGTON—Federal regulators are considering taking back some
airwaves from television broadcasters and auctioning them off to
wireless companies to increase the availability of wireless broadband
services.

Federal Communications Commission Chairman Julius Genachowski has
warned that the U.S. doesn't have enough airwaves set aside for
wireless broadband service in the future, and the agency is looking
at a variety of ways to remedy that shortage.

"The record is very clear that we're facing a looming spectrum gap,"
said Blair Levin, a former telecom analyst who is in charge of
crafting the FCC's national broadband plan, which is expected to lay
out a variety of things the U.S. can do to increase broadband
availability and usage. The plan will be released in February.

It's not clear if the proposal will actually make it into the FCC's
final plan. At this stage, FCC officials are mostly trying to get
input from broadcasters and others. Station owners are likely to
fight the plan, although the FCC is envisioning paying broadcasters
for any airwaves that are taken away.

The agency is "looking at everything, including broadcasting"
airwaves, Mr. Levin said.

The National Association of Broadcasters "believes it is imperative
that policy makers explore spectrum efficiency choices that don't
limit consumer access to the full potential of digital broadcasting,"
said spokesman Dennis Wharton.

On Friday, the Consumer Electronics Association released a study it
commissioned on the value of the large chunk of airwaves set aside
for TV broadcasters. If the FCC took back all of those airwaves and
auctioned them off, the government could make up to $62 billion, the
study found.

Such an approach would cost about $12 billion in payments to
broadcasters and about $9 billion to "migrate all households that
rely on over-the-air broadcasts to subscription services," the study
found.

The political will to take such an approach could be weak, however,
because the federal government just spent $2.15 billion over the last
two years to help consumers move to digital-only broadcast
television. Consumers who rely on free TV now might also take a dim
view of being asked to subscribe to cable or satellite television,.
Many of them just had to go through the trouble of either buying new
digital TVs or hooking up digital converter boxes to their old TVs to
keep them working.

The FCC isn't looking at taking away all of the broadcasters'
airwaves. Instead, FCC officials are focusing on the benefits of
taking back a portion of the airwaves set aside for digital TV
broadcasts and auctioning those off to wireless companies that want
to offer more wireless Internet services. It's not clear yet how much
of the airwaves they might suggest taking back.

Some broadcast-station owners are already expressing concern about
the idea. They want to keep those airwaves for themselves. Many
broadcasters would like wireless phones and other gadgets to come
equipped with receivers that would allow consumers to watch digital
TV.

"CEA's study ignores the immeasurable public benefit of a vibrant
free and local broadcasting system that is ubiquitous, reliable as a
lifeline service in times of emergency, and flexible enough to
include HDTV, diverse multicast programming and mobile DTV," said Mr.
Wharton, the broadcasters' spokesman.



--
Steve W.

stryped wrote:
Do you know anythign abotu how far telephone and coax can be ran? I
have two options.


The phone will be a plain phone. The coax will be connected to my
rooftop antenna on the house for local tv stations and also will be
connected to an interior dish network sat box so I can watch whatever
the sat box is tuned to.
The phone wires run MILES from the CO to your house. My phone run is
currently 18000 feet. So, your additional 140' will be a minute addition.

The TV cable from a converter or other inside source will be plenty
strong, but trying to pipe signals received from a broadcast antenna
over a long cable may not work as well. You can get extra low-loss
coax if you need it.

Jon

On Nov 6, 3:54*pm, Jon Elson wrote:

The TV cable from a converter or other inside source will be plenty
strong, but trying to pipe signals received from a broadcast antenna
over a long cable may not work as well. *You can get extra low-loss
coax if you need it.

Jon

Has anyone here had good results on DTV with a mast-top or indoor
amplifier?

jsw

On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 14:30:12 -0800 (PST), Jim Wilkins
wrote:


Has anyone here had good results on DTV with a mast-top or indoor
amplifier?

I got quite a bit of improvement with a mast mounted amp, but we're
still getting a few dropouts and occasionally some channels are
unwatchable.

This is the amp. It's in the attic on the largest antenna that can
swing on a rotator in the space available. Overall, our reception is
somewhat better than predicted by antennaweb.
http://www.a1components.com/itemdisplayn.aspx?item=1076


--
Ned Simmons

Jim Wilkins wrote in news:bba47d73-3e2c-4985-b20d-
:

On Nov 6, 3:54*pm, Jon Elson wrote:

The TV cable from a converter or other inside source will be plenty
strong, but trying to pipe signals received from a broadcast antenna
over a long cable may not work as well. *You can get extra low-loss
coax if you need it.

Jon

Has anyone here had good results on DTV with a mast-top or indoor
amplifier?

jsw

Yes.

I've a mast-top amplified antenna [Phillips] that is, actually, INSIDE my
garage.

FWIW, the altitude of the antenna is actually lower than the roof of my
house which, BTW, is about 60 miles from the nearest DTV transmission
point.

Jim Wilkins writes:

On Nov 6, 3:54=A0pm, Jon Elson wrote:

The TV cable from a converter or other inside source will be plenty
strong, but trying to pipe signals received from a broadcast antenna
over a long cable may not work as well. =A0You can get extra low-loss
coax if you need it.

Jon

Has anyone here had good results on DTV with a mast-top or indoor
amplifier?

DTV is RF just the same as NTSC. But note that preamps are not the same
as distribution amps. And in general, you are better off with a bigger
antenna.
--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433