On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On Sat, 03 Oct 2009 23:09:12 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus2624
scrawled the following:

Here's an awesome webpage, a must read on the subject, from our usual
authority.

http://www.snopes.com/food/warnings/pyrex.asp

I'll bet the phrase "scarred heavily" came from a speaking weasel
(attorney) who took up the Righteous Fight for Justice Against Lime
Glass. Feh!

WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.


Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it exlpodes
for almost no reason.

I want to replace my Pyrex dishes with borosilicate ones now.

i

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 07:52:39 -0400, the infamous Wes
scrawled the following:

Gunner Asch wrote:

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?


Mom has before. She normally makes round ones though.

I've decided that apple turnovers (humongous babies) are much easier
than making apple pies. That said, I need to go pick some apples. My
Golden Delicious are ready now. I picked/halved/froze about 20 lbs of
Santa Rosa plums last week. Plum Bisquick coffee cake is ta die for.

--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Ed Huntress wrote:
"Ignoramus16938" wrote in message
...

On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:

WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.

Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it exlpodes
for almost no reason.

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

I have news for you, these dishes are used to hold hot things and cold
things and to be put in hot ovens.

i


Larry misread the article. He should look around for more info on tempered
glass.

Tempered glass shatters because of a sudden release of stress in the glass,
not from thermal shock. It doesn't matter if the tipping-point stress comes
from a mechanical load or heat. Neither one causes the "explosion."

Tempered glass is compressed in the middle, and under tension on both sides.
It's the release of the INTERNAL stress, not some stress imposed from
outside, that produces the explosive results.


Ed,

I know you've contributed other comments to this thread with the
correct stress orientation but thought I'd just correct this one. IIRC
the whole basis of many processes which help prevent cracking is to
impart a compressive surface stress as cracks don't propagate in a
compressive stress field, only tensile.

BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone I
know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal stress in
the stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by dropping on a
hard kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not shattered like
toughened glass.

"David Billington" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"Ignoramus16938" wrote in message
...

On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:

WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.

Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it exlpodes
for almost no reason.

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

I have news for you, these dishes are used to hold hot things and cold
things and to be put in hot ovens.

i


Larry misread the article. He should look around for more info on
tempered glass.

Tempered glass shatters because of a sudden release of stress in the
glass, not from thermal shock. It doesn't matter if the tipping-point
stress comes from a mechanical load or heat. Neither one causes the
"explosion."

Tempered glass is compressed in the middle, and under tension on both
sides. It's the release of the INTERNAL stress, not some stress imposed
from outside, that produces the explosive results.


Ed,

I know you've contributed other comments to this thread with the
correct stress orientation but thought I'd just correct this one. IIRC the
whole basis of many processes which help prevent cracking is to impart a
compressive surface stress as cracks don't propagate in a compressive
stress field, only tensile.

Thank you. I caught it mentally as I was driving to the grocery store. Too
late. g

IOW, I got it backwards: Compression on the outside, chewy on the
inside...er, tension on the inside.


BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone I
know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal stress in the
stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by dropping on a hard
kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not shattered like toughened
glass.

I have no idea. Wikipedia has a good section on it, I see, but I haven't had
a chance to read it. You might check there.

FWIW, my only experience at abusing Pyrex was when I made a 6" telescope
mirror out of the stuff, over 40 years ago. That piece, I'm sure, wasn't
tempered or toughened. It would have wrecked the shape.

However, that was a blank made expressly for the purpose.

--
Ed Huntress

"John R. Carroll" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"David Billington" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"Ignoramus16938" wrote in
message ...

On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:

WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.

Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it
exlpodes for almost no reason.

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin:
lines at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any
more) "Such explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

I have news for you, these dishes are used to hold hot things and
cold things and to be put in hot ovens.

i


Larry misread the article. He should look around for more info on
tempered glass.

Tempered glass shatters because of a sudden release of stress in the
glass, not from thermal shock. It doesn't matter if the
tipping-point stress comes from a mechanical load or heat. Neither
one causes the "explosion."

Tempered glass is compressed in the middle, and under tension on
both sides. It's the release of the INTERNAL stress, not some
stress imposed from outside, that produces the explosive results.


Ed,

I know you've contributed other comments to this thread with the
correct stress orientation but thought I'd just correct this one.
IIRC the whole basis of many processes which help prevent cracking
is to impart a compressive surface stress as cracks don't propagate
in a compressive stress field, only tensile.

Thank you. I caught it mentally as I was driving to the grocery
store. Too late. g

IOW, I got it backwards: Compression on the outside, chewy on the
inside...er, tension on the inside.


BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone
I know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal
stress in the stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by
dropping on a hard kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not
shattered like toughened glass.

I have no idea. Wikipedia has a good section on it, I see, but I
haven't had a chance to read it. You might check there.

FWIW, my only experience at abusing Pyrex was when I made a 6"
telescope mirror out of the stuff, over 40 years ago. That piece, I'm
sure, wasn't tempered or toughened. It would have wrecked the shape.

However, that was a blank made expressly for the purpose.

It was indeed Ed and having gound the glass for an eight inch Newtonian, I
can tell you that is was annealed.

That sounds right. I was working on that mirror right at the time we moved,
then I put it aside and packed it up when I got really busy. I still haven't
parabolized it. Maybe another decade or two -- if I can still find it. I
have to do it before my eyes go. g

--
Ed Huntress

Ed Huntress wrote:
"David Billington" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"Ignoramus16938" wrote in
message ...

On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:

WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.

Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it
exlpodes for almost no reason.

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin:
lines at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any
more) "Such explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

I have news for you, these dishes are used to hold hot things and
cold things and to be put in hot ovens.

i


Larry misread the article. He should look around for more info on
tempered glass.

Tempered glass shatters because of a sudden release of stress in the
glass, not from thermal shock. It doesn't matter if the
tipping-point stress comes from a mechanical load or heat. Neither
one causes the "explosion."

Tempered glass is compressed in the middle, and under tension on
both sides. It's the release of the INTERNAL stress, not some
stress imposed from outside, that produces the explosive results.


Ed,

I know you've contributed other comments to this thread with the
correct stress orientation but thought I'd just correct this one.
IIRC the whole basis of many processes which help prevent cracking
is to impart a compressive surface stress as cracks don't propagate
in a compressive stress field, only tensile.

Thank you. I caught it mentally as I was driving to the grocery
store. Too late. g

IOW, I got it backwards: Compression on the outside, chewy on the
inside...er, tension on the inside.


BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone
I know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal
stress in the stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by
dropping on a hard kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not
shattered like toughened glass.

I have no idea. Wikipedia has a good section on it, I see, but I
haven't had a chance to read it. You might check there.

FWIW, my only experience at abusing Pyrex was when I made a 6"
telescope mirror out of the stuff, over 40 years ago. That piece, I'm
sure, wasn't tempered or toughened. It would have wrecked the shape.

However, that was a blank made expressly for the purpose.

It was indeed Ed and having gound the glass for an eight inch Newtonian, I
can tell you that is was annealed.


--
John R. Carroll

On Oct 4, 8:17*pm, David Billington
wrote:

BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone I
know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal stress in
the stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by dropping on a
hard kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not shattered like
toughened glass.

Since Borosilicate glass has a very low coef of expansion, I think it
would be impossible to temper it by using temperature. And since it
is about 97% quartz, I think chemical tempering as also out.

Dan

Larry Jaques wrote:

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."



Hey Larry,

Turn off javascript for a moment. It defeats their childish trick.

Wes



Such explosions have to do with the nature of glass, which is the material used in the
manufacture of this type of bakeware. When glass changes temperature rapidly, it
experiences
thermal shock, a process wherein different parts of the material expand by different
amounts. Sometimes glass vessels are unable to take the stress of that uneven expansion
and shatter.

Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on
or about Sun, 04 Oct 2009 10:28:02 -0700 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?

Blasphemey!!!!!!!

Au contraire, mon ami! That was a larger dish than a simple pie
plate. Doesn't the concept "Mo fo me!" work for ya?


But...but...but...thats like serving a very very expensive 1951
Rothschild wine, hot and in a A&W rootbeer mug!!!

How about a cheap 1951 Rothschild wine?

Its simply against the law!!! Or at the least..common decency.

Like putting ketchup on your eggs.


tschus
pyotr

-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 13:49:22 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus16938
scrawled the following:

On 2009-10-04, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
WARNING: Glass can shatter. Use care around it!
'Nuff said? I think so.
Larry, read that snopes webpage. It does not just shatter, it exlpodes
for almost no reason.
Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

I have news for you, these dishes are used to hold hot things and cold
things and to be put in hot ovens.

Not news. The site goes on to say (and I already knew) that thermal
shock results when the hot item is set on an ice cold countertop. Well
DUH! You won't take an item in a Pyrex container directly from the
freezer and put it in a preheated oven or onto a preheated stovetop
burner, either, if you're sane.

C'mon, Ig. 66 complaints out of how many tens of millions of lime
glass Pyrex dishes put out and used in 3 decades here in the USA? Get
real! It's a very, very slim percentage which shatters like this. In
35 years of cooking, all the Pyrex I've broken has been from dropping
on the hard floor, or dropping the lid onto the glass casserole dish.
IOW, _my_ fault, not the Pyrex'.

--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?

Blasphemey!!!!!!!

--------------
Oh, NO! Have you never tasted "Mom's Apple Cobbler" by Dixie Lily Flour
Company?

It MUST be done in a glass baking pan, and it MUST be the best
apple/flour/sugar ANYTHING anyone has ever tasted!

LLoyd

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?

Blasphemey!!!!!!!

--------------
Oh, NO! Have you never tasted "Mom's Apple Cobbler" by Dixie Lily Flour
Company?

It MUST be done in a glass baking pan, and it MUST be the best
apple/flour/sugar ANYTHING anyone has ever tasted!

LLoyd

Wal--I remember the first auto matick washin mashine we had--It wuz a
Bendix with a PIEREX pie plate in the front loading door, so the cat
could watch the clothes tumblin.

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 18:26:56 -0400, Wes wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has become.
They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines at Snopes,
eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such explosions
have to do with the nature of the glass..."
....
Turn off javascript for a moment. It defeats their childish trick.

[snip example of text pasted in]

Yes, I see that javascript function disableselect() in the html.
Two other methods in firefox to bypass that are to press either
ctrl-A (which selects all text, which you then copy/paste into an
editing window and then select the bit you want) or ctrl-U (which
opens an html source window where you can select what you want).

--
jiw

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 18:26:56 -0400, Wes wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."



Hey Larry,

Turn off javascript for a moment. It defeats their childish trick.

I'm assuming you use Firefox... Will that trick work with modern versions of
IE? Years ago you had to close and re-open IE for this change to take affect.
Thus creating a paradox on sites which would not display the content to those
with Java script turned off.

Vaguely remember an ugly work around for this one as well. Switched to Linux
seven years ago, and appreciate these little reminders of just why
--
William

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 18:26:56 -0400, the infamous Wes
scrawled the following:

Larry Jaques wrote:

Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."

Hey Larry,

Turn off javascript for a moment. It defeats their childish trick.

Hey, good trick, Wes. JS abort measures usually come with a warning.
Theirs didn't and I didn't look.

--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:30:50 -0700, the infamous pyotr filipivich
scrawled the following:

Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on
or about Sun, 04 Oct 2009 10:28:02 -0700 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?

Blasphemey!!!!!!!

Au contraire, mon ami! That was a larger dish than a simple pie
plate. Doesn't the concept "Mo fo me!" work for ya?


But...but...but...thats like serving a very very expensive 1951
Rothschild wine, hot and in a A&W rootbeer mug!!!

How about a cheap 1951 Rothschild wine?

Its simply against the law!!! Or at the least..common decency.

Like putting ketchup on your eggs.

Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!

Listen up, boys: _Any_ dish, if large enough, is OK for apple
pie/betty/cobbler/streudel/tarts/fritters/crisp, GOT IT?

Good!

--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
On 2009-10-04, Michael Koblic wrote:

"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
This glass baking tray (with a pie in it) exploded, when a electric
oven burner was turned on under it by accident (not by me). What is
interesting is that it exploded (shattered violently) all at once.

Utensils next to it were thrown to the floor by the force of the
explosion.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Glass-Baking-Tray-Explosion/

What this story underscores, besides interesting physics implications,
is that trouble often comes very unexpected.


When I was a kid my mother served strawberries and cream in a glass bowl.
Just as the spoon lightly touched the bowl the bowl exploded with the
shards
travelling across *two* rooms and (apparently round the corner) onto the
balcony. Interestingly no-one was injured.

Took a while to clean the strawberies off the walls...


I bet it took some time to clean the underwear too. Scary stuff.

So, in your case, it was basically existing stresses in the glass,
right?


I have not better explanation.

Jerry Wass wrote:
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?

Blasphemey!!!!!!!

--------------
Oh, NO! Have you never tasted "Mom's Apple Cobbler" by Dixie Lily
Flour Company?

It MUST be done in a glass baking pan, and it MUST be the best
apple/flour/sugar ANYTHING anyone has ever tasted!

LLoyd

Wal--I remember the first auto matick washin mashine we had--It wuz a
Bendix with a PIEREX pie plate in the front loading door, so the cat
could watch the clothes tumblin.


You mean like this?

http://blog.lib.umn.edu/carls064/fre...ide-CatFud.gif

In article ,
"ian field" wrote:

"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
This glass baking tray (with a pie in it) exploded, when a electric
oven burner was turned on under it by accident (not by me). What is
interesting is that it exploded (shattered violently) all at once.

Utensils next to it were thrown to the floor by the force of the
explosion.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Glass-Baking-Tray-Explosion/

What this story underscores, besides interesting physics implications,
is that trouble often comes very unexpected.


An amusing science experiment is using a blowtorch to melt drips of molten
glass from a glass rod and allow the drips to fall in a bucket of water.

The glass drips are quenched in such a way that the glass 'skin' is highly
stressed, if you break one of these glass droplets it explodes.

They were called "Czar's Tears", if memory serves.

Joe Gwinn

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 07:52:39 -0400, the infamous Wes
scrawled the following:

Gunner Asch wrote:

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?


Mom has before. She normally makes round ones though.

I've decided that apple turnovers (humongous babies) are much easier
than making apple pies. That said, I need to go pick some apples. My
Golden Delicious are ready now. I picked/halved/froze about 20 lbs of
Santa Rosa plums last week. Plum Bisquick coffee cake is ta die for.


Damn you, I'm going to be craving fruit pastries all damn day now!

On Oct 4, 11:16*pm, " wrote:
On Oct 4, 8:17*pm, David Billington

wrote:
BTW any idea if boro Pyrex is toughened, I may have to see if anyone I
know has any polarising filters and have a look for internal stress in
the stuff I have. The odd Pyrex piece I have broken, by dropping on a
hard kitchen floor, has broken into shards and not shattered like
toughened glass.

Since Borosilicate glass has a very low coef of expansion, I think it
would be impossible to temper it by using temperature. *And since it
is about 97% quartz, I think chemical tempering as also out.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Dan

I misremembered. Borosilicate glass is more like 80% quartz. Vycor
is the one that is about 97 % quartz. But I do not think that
Borosilicate glass could be tempered chemically in the way that sodium
glass is tempered.

Vycor is Borosilicate glass that has been chemically modified to make
it have a lower coef of expansion. So you could say that Borosilicate
glass can be made more resistant to breaking from heating and cooling.

On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:05:21 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 07:52:39 -0400, the infamous Wes
scrawled the following:

Gunner Asch wrote:

Who the hell bakes apple pies in casserol trays?


Mom has before. She normally makes round ones though.

I've decided that apple turnovers (humongous babies) are much easier
than making apple pies. That said, I need to go pick some apples. My
Golden Delicious are ready now. I picked/halved/froze about 20 lbs of
Santa Rosa plums last week. Plum Bisquick coffee cake is ta die for.


Damn you, I'm going to be craving fruit pastries all damn day now!

Bwahahahaha! So, John, didja go out and buy one today? I still have
some banana bread I made so I won't be making another plum coffee cake
for a few more days.

--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

"Doug White" wrote in message
. ..
"ian field" wrote in
:


"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
This glass baking tray (with a pie in it) exploded, when a electric
oven burner was turned on under it by accident (not by me). What is
interesting is that it exploded (shattered violently) all at once.

Utensils next to it were thrown to the floor by the force of the
explosion.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Glass-Baking-Tray-Explosion/

What this story underscores, besides interesting physics
implications, is that trouble often comes very unexpected.


An amusing science experiment is using a blowtorch to melt drips of
molten glass from a glass rod and allow the drips to fall in a bucket
of water.

The glass drips are quenched in such a way that the glass 'skin' is
highly stressed, if you break one of these glass droplets it explodes.

A neat little booby trap - drop a handful in someone's toolbox.

Ah yes. Prince Rupert's Drops. Lots of fun. We used to make them in
the high school chem lab. A lot of them would explode in the water after
zipping around a bit, but the ones that didn't were fished out &
cherished. They had long thin tails, and they were amazingly tough. If
you snap off the tail or crush it with pliers, kablooey!

A friend of mine had a small box with a bunch stored in it. He forgot
about them & found the box several years later. Most of them had
exploded spontaneously at soem point in the past.

There was probably only one or two went spontaneously, the rest would have
been a chain reaction.

Years ago I read somewhere about chain reactions at CRT manufacturing plant,
one tube in the line would spontaneously implode and the flying chunks of
glass knocked off the tube either side, sometimes the effect would shoot
along the line in both directions like falling dominoes.

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:05:21 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

Damn you, I'm going to be craving fruit pastries all damn day now!

Bwahahahaha! So, John, didja go out and buy one today? I still have
some banana bread I made so I won't be making another plum coffee cake
for a few more days.


Nah, dammit, I managed to control myself and keep to my weight-loss
program. Trying to keep from getting too heavy to handle my wheelchair
easily. It's great upper body exercise, until your shoulders give out.

Power chair's nice, but doesn't do a damn thing for your muscle tone.

However: Sometimes self-discipline SUCKS!

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 10:44:01 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:05:21 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

Damn you, I'm going to be craving fruit pastries all damn day now!

Bwahahahaha! So, John, didja go out and buy one today? I still have
some banana bread I made so I won't be making another plum coffee cake
for a few more days.


Nah, dammit, I managed to control myself and keep to my weight-loss
program. Trying to keep from getting too heavy to handle my wheelchair
easily. It's great upper body exercise, until your shoulders give out.

Power chair's nice, but doesn't do a damn thing for your muscle tone.

Sure they do. Simply do your pullups and chinups with the chair
strapped to your waist. Talk about wonderful upper body exercise...


However: Sometimes self-discipline SUCKS!

Just _sometimes_?

--
Reading well is one of the great pleasures that solitude can afford you.
-- Harold Bloom, O Magazine, April 2003

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 10:44:01 -0400, John Husvar
wrote:

snip
Nah, dammit, I managed to control myself and keep to my weight-loss
program. Trying to keep from getting too heavy to handle my wheelchair
easily. It's great upper body exercise, until your shoulders give out.

This article was geared more towards runners, but it should
also apply to you:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...ryId=112556135

Unless you have a bad genetic trait or some old injury, odds
are good that you won't be wearing out those shoulders. I
ran down some other articles too after hearing/reading that
one. They pretty much agreed with it.

I sympathize with your situation, I run and walk a lot to
keep my weight inline. Still enjoy eating, not much else...
hard enough to do with my legs intact.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 15:11:43 +0100, "ian field"
wrote:


"Doug White" wrote in message
...
"ian field" wrote in
:


"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
This glass baking tray (with a pie in it) exploded, when a electric
oven burner was turned on under it by accident (not by me). What is
interesting is that it exploded (shattered violently) all at once.

Utensils next to it were thrown to the floor by the force of the
explosion.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Glass-Baking-Tray-Explosion/

What this story underscores, besides interesting physics
implications, is that trouble often comes very unexpected.


An amusing science experiment is using a blowtorch to melt drips of
molten glass from a glass rod and allow the drips to fall in a bucket
of water.

The glass drips are quenched in such a way that the glass 'skin' is
highly stressed, if you break one of these glass droplets it explodes.

A neat little booby trap - drop a handful in someone's toolbox.

Ah yes. Prince Rupert's Drops. Lots of fun. We used to make them in
the high school chem lab. A lot of them would explode in the water after
zipping around a bit, but the ones that didn't were fished out &
cherished. They had long thin tails, and they were amazingly tough. If
you snap off the tail or crush it with pliers, kablooey!

A friend of mine had a small box with a bunch stored in it. He forgot
about them & found the box several years later. Most of them had
exploded spontaneously at soem point in the past.

There was probably only one or two went spontaneously, the rest would have
been a chain reaction.

Years ago I read somewhere about chain reactions at CRT manufacturing plant,
one tube in the line would spontaneously implode and the flying chunks of
glass knocked off the tube either side, sometimes the effect would shoot
along the line in both directions like falling dominoes.

Don't know about baking dishes or CRT's but I have seen several
bottles of home brew in a plastic case blow in sequence.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

In article ,
Leon Fisk wrote:

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 10:44:01 -0400, John Husvar
wrote:

snip
Nah, dammit, I managed to control myself and keep to my weight-loss
program. Trying to keep from getting too heavy to handle my wheelchair
easily. It's great upper body exercise, until your shoulders give out.

This article was geared more towards runners, but it should
also apply to you:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...ryId=112556135

Unless you have a bad genetic trait or some old injury, odds
are good that you won't be wearing out those shoulders. I
ran down some other articles too after hearing/reading that
one. They pretty much agreed with it.

Well, I have a fair collection of old injuries, but no major shoulder
ones. Good news maybe? I used to do 5 miles a day in my manual chair, as
an excuse to get out of the house and to meet 'n' greet neighbors. I
suppose I could start those daily "walks" again. Build back the mileage
slowly.

MS has a way of making me feel fatigued whether I do anything strenuous
or not.

Thanks to it and a pre-diagnosis spinal cord injury, it's sometimes too
easy to just vegetate.


I sympathize with your situation, I run and walk a lot to
keep my weight inline. Still enjoy eating, not much else...
hard enough to do with my legs intact.

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 10:44:01 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

Power chair's nice, but doesn't do a damn thing for your muscle tone.

Sure they do. Simply do your pullups and chinups with the chair
strapped to your waist. Talk about wonderful upper body exercise...

If I ever get to where I can do pullups with 300 pounds of power
wheelchair strapped on, I won't need to worry abut overeating fruit
pastries! (or paying for them: Guiness, Ripley's, here I come!

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, Guiness!

However: Sometimes self-discipline SUCKS!

Just _sometimes_?

OK, most of the time.

Speaking of discipline: Off to more dry-firing the SV40E

Has anyone had any experience using Visions cookware as a crucible for
aluminum or pot metal ? I used a cast iron pot to melt aluminum as
described in the Dave Gingery books and wondered if anyone has tried
this.

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 19:44:58 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 10:44:01 -0400, the infamous John Husvar
scrawled the following:

Power chair's nice, but doesn't do a damn thing for your muscle tone.

Sure they do. Simply do your pullups and chinups with the chair
strapped to your waist. Talk about wonderful upper body exercise...

If I ever get to where I can do pullups with 300 pounds of power
wheelchair strapped on, I won't need to worry abut overeating fruit
pastries!

You'd sure be in shape then, right?


(or paying for them: Guiness, Ripley's, here I come!

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, Guiness!

Eek! Having quit long ago, I no longer see how I could have -ever-
stomached beer. It just reeks to me now.


However: Sometimes self-discipline SUCKS!

Just _sometimes_?

OK, most of the time.

Speaking of discipline: Off to more dry-firing the SV40E

La Pistola? I should re-up at the range and go practice with all my
weapons, too. The need for self-defense appears to be skyrocketing
these days.

--
Reading well is one of the great pleasures that solitude can afford you.
-- Harold Bloom, O Magazine, April 2003

axolotl wrote:

Doug Miller wrote:
In article , axolotl wrote:

Jerry Pournell was right.


?
Pournelle is known for revising Sturgeon's Law.

Sturgeon pointed out that "90% of science fiction is crud".

Pournelle expanded it to "90% of everything is crud".


I didn't know that Pournelle wrote 90% of the science fiction books.


--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!

Michael A. Terrell wrote:
axolotl wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article , axolotl wrote:

Jerry Pournell was right.

?
Pournelle is known for revising Sturgeon's Law.

Sturgeon pointed out that "90% of science fiction is crud".

Pournelle expanded it to "90% of everything is crud".


I didn't know that Pournelle wrote 90% of the science fiction books.



Larry Niven wrote the rest...

Larry Jaques wrote:


Aw, pshaw! You're getting as gunshy as that guy from Joisey has
become. They only explode from thermal shock. Read the Origin: lines
at Snopes, eh? (****, we can't cut'n'paste from Snopes any more) "Such
explosions have to do with the nature of the glass..."


Sure you can. Just 'View Page Source' and copy it from there. Here
is a snip from that page:

About 5:30 PM there was a loud bang from the oven. Sylvia opened the
oven door and the Pyrex dish had shattered into a million pieces. The
roast beef (our first in many months) was peppered with small shards of
very sharp glass. Normally, I am quick to inform Sylvia she did
something stupid. However, this time she was nowhere near the stove when
it blew. I shoveled the glass and the now mashed potatoes into a bucket
with two putty knives. I then sucked the remains with the shop vac. I
let everything cool down and then scrubbed the oven with Simple Green
and some hot soapy water. It took over an hour to clean up the goo.
Upon completion I ran the oven empty to see if the temperature
controller was working okay. I suspected the oven got too hot and the
dish simply blew. This was not the case however. The oven came up to
temperature and cycled normally. We threw a disgusting frozen pizza in
the oven and it cooked okay.

What is going on?

I Googled exploding Pyrex dishes and got ten million hits. Exploding
Pyrex is very common.

Here is the story.


--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 19:37:35 -0400, John Husvar
wrote:

snip
Well, I have a fair collection of old injuries, but no major shoulder
ones. Good news maybe? I used to do 5 miles a day in my manual chair, as
an excuse to get out of the house and to meet 'n' greet neighbors. I
suppose I could start those daily "walks" again. Build back the mileage
slowly.

MS has a way of making me feel fatigued whether I do anything strenuous
or not.

Thanks to it and a pre-diagnosis spinal cord injury, it's sometimes too
easy to just vegetate.

Well I feel like crap, tired most of the time too and I
don't have any good reason for it, far as I can tell. I
figured it was just getting old and there really isn't
anything I looking forward to doing (other than eating).

My hats off to you, you're handling the situation a whole
heck of a lot better than myself...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

cavelamb wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:
axolotl wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article , axolotl wrote:

Jerry Pournell was right.

?
Pournelle is known for revising Sturgeon's Law.

Sturgeon pointed out that "90% of science fiction is crud".

Pournelle expanded it to "90% of everything is crud".


I didn't know that Pournelle wrote 90% of the science fiction books.



Larry Niven wrote the rest...




That is why I am reading early Science Fiction, from before they
screwed up the concept.


--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!

On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 13:45:35 -0400, Leon Fisk
wrote:

On Tue, 06 Oct 2009 19:37:35 -0400, John Husvar
wrote:

snip
Well, I have a fair collection of old injuries, but no major shoulder
ones. Good news maybe? I used to do 5 miles a day in my manual chair, as
an excuse to get out of the house and to meet 'n' greet neighbors. I
suppose I could start those daily "walks" again. Build back the mileage
slowly.

MS has a way of making me feel fatigued whether I do anything strenuous
or not.

Thanks to it and a pre-diagnosis spinal cord injury, it's sometimes too
easy to just vegetate.

Well I feel like crap, tired most of the time too and I
don't have any good reason for it, far as I can tell. I
figured it was just getting old and there really isn't
anything I looking forward to doing (other than eating).

My hats off to you, you're handling the situation a whole
heck of a lot better than myself...

I started feeling like that last August. It grew a bit worse through
January.

Then I had a heart attack because all the arteries on the left side of
my heart finally gave full notice they were plugged up.

Im only 55. Im in good conditon..in fact I was in better condition that
guys half my age. Could lift more, run farther, work longer etc etc

Which saved my life by the doctors admissions. If Id not been in such
damned good shape..Id never have made it to the ER, let along walked in
and asked to speak to a doctor.

Get yourself checked out..and get a second opinion.

In November, Bakersfield Heart Hospital told me everything was fine..I
simply had bronchitus and sent me home after billing me $15,000 for 8
hours sitting and 30 minutes with a nurse practicioner.

Gunner

GUNNER'S PRAYER:
"God grant me the serenity to accept the people
that don't need to get shot, the courage to shoot
the people that need shooting and the wisdom to know the difference.
And if need be, the skill to get it done before I have to reload."


0

On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 13:05:29 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 13:45:35 -0400, Leon Fisk
wrote:

snip
Well I feel like crap, tired most of the time too and I
don't have any good reason for it, far as I can tell. I
figured it was just getting old and there really isn't
anything I looking forward to doing (other than eating).

snip
Get yourself checked out..and get a second opinion.

Thanks for the concern/suggestions Gunner, but I'm quite
sure the real problem lies somewhere between my ears.

Do you remember the old movie "Short Circuit" and Number 5
saying "more input, NEED MORE INPUT!". More input is what
turns my screws other than eating. Not just any input, but
something like hiking to a waterfall, champion tree,
learning a new software program, updating an old software
program, learning how to use new (new to me at least)
tools/equipment... just can't afford the budget to do that
all the time.

I'm sure there are plenty of other people with the same
problem, they just seem to deal with it better. And then
there are those who seem to be happy and refreshed to just
wake up every morning ;-)

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

"Ignoramus2624" wrote in message
...
This glass baking tray (with a pie in it) exploded, when a electric
oven burner was turned on under it by accident (not by me). What is
interesting is that it exploded (shattered violently) all at once.

Utensils next to it were thrown to the floor by the force of the
explosion.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Glass-Baking-Tray-Explosion/

What this story underscores, besides interesting physics implications,
is that trouble often comes very unexpected.

i





i just got one of those long forwarded messages on this topic.







Date: Wednesday, October 7, 2009, 10:00 AM

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/homeowners/pyrex..html

Got any new Pyrex dishes in your cooking utensils? This is a must read.

I Checked at Wall Mart and all the warnings are there.

About 5:30 PM there was a loud bang from the oven. Sylvia opened the oven
door and the Pyrex dish had shatt ered into a million pieces. The roast beef
(our first in many months) was peppered with small shards of very sharp
glass . Normally,I am quick to inform Sylvia she did something stupid.
However,this time she was nowhere near the stove when it blew. I shoveled
the glass and the now mashed potatoes into a bucket with two putty knives.
I then sucked the remains with the shop vac. I let everything cool down and
then scrubbed the oven with Simple Green and some hot soapy water. It took
over an hour to clean up the goo. Upon completion I ran the oven empty to
see if the temperature controller was working okay. I suspected the oven
got too hot and the dish simply blew. This was not the case however. The
oven came up to temperature and cycled normally. We threw a disgusting
frozen pizza in the oven and it cooked okay.

What is going on?

I Googled exploding Pyrex dishes and got ten million hits.
Exploding Pyrex is very common.

Here is the story.

A long, long time ago in a country we all know and love was a company named
Corning. They made Pryex dishes. The material they used is called
borosilicate glass. This stuf f is indestructible.
But like everything else, the Bottom Liners had a great idea: sell the
technology to another company. The Chinese discovered that using soda lime
glass was almost as good as borosilicate glass and a lot cheaper. Today,
Wal-Mart is the largest distributor of Pryex products. Corning not only
sold the technology to a company called World Kitchen, they also sold the
rights to the original Pyrex logo. Seamless. The consumer will never know.

Now it seems people are getting hurt using soda lime Pyrex. We were lucky
because the dish broke while the oven was closed and the damage was limited
to the oven cavity. Others have been less fortunate. Some dishes explode
when they are lifted from the heating rack in the oven with devastating
results. Some people are heavily scarred. World Kitchen is in denial.
They say that the dishes are another brand, not theirs . Contrary to their
denials the victims usually have more than one of these dishes and the Pryex
logo is clearly visible.

If you buy a Pryex dish beware. The label on the front says oven safe,
freezer safe, microwave safe. The instructions on the back tell another
story. You cannot move a soda lime Pyrex dish from the freezer to the oven
and expect it to survive. The fine print goes on and on about what you are
not allowed to do with the Pyrex dish. The fine print has prevented World
Kitchen from being sued because they have warned the consumer that their
Pyrex dishes are junk from the get go. And they are the same price as the
original Corning dishes. What a bunch of losers we all are for buying this
crap.

What to do?

If you own borosilicate Pryex dishes no fear. They have to be more than 25
years old to be sure they are indeed Corning dishes. I am not sure if
the20old Pryex dishes have anything stamped in them that indicates they are
made by Corning.. You may continue to use the soda lime dishes for holding
stuff. Just do not attempt to roast or microwave with them as the hazard is
very clear.

The reason the soda lime dishes let go is that over time they develop
micro-cracks. Once a few micro-cracks are present and once some liquid
finds its way into the cracks you have the bomb situation. The liquid is
like shoving a crowbar in the dish and pulling it apar t. Super heated
liquids expand rapidly and it is the super heated liquids that force the
soda lime glass to shatter into tens of thousands of shards.

Since Corning no longer makes Pyrex and Sylvia proudly holds a large
collection of the soda lime Pyrex, we decided that one bomb in the kitchen
is enough. The Pyrex dishes will go bye-bye in this week's trash. I do not
know what we will use for cake and pie dishes going forward . If you have
some suggestions we are listening.

I strongly urge you not to use the s oda lime Pyrex for the oven, stovetop
or microwave. The slightest invisible crack is all it takes to have a mess
and a possible injury.