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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Two drilling questions
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're
cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave |
#2
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Two drilling questions
"Dave D" wrote in message ... We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave I too have a bunch of cheapies. I think we have replaced bearings in all of them. And, the bearings don't always fit into a good bore and the shafts aren't great fits either. I won't buy them anymore, there are too many used good ones out there. |
#3
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Two drilling questions
On Aug 24, 2:14*am, Dave D wrote:
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave You might have better luck with single flute step-drill bits in sheet metal. They are less likely to make oblong holes in thin stock. http://www.mcmaster.com/#step-drills/=3br6fp |
#4
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Two drilling questions
On Sun, 23 Aug 2009 23:14:51 -0700 (PDT), Dave D
wrote: We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave for sheet metal use a unibit, they will cut a round hole. http://www.mcmaster.com/#unibit-drill-bits/=3brf6o above is just one size, they make 2 or three others. Thank You, Randy Remove 333 from email address to reply. |
#5
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Two drilling questions
On Sun, 23 Aug 2009 23:14:51 -0700, Dave D wrote:
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave So find some _decent_ drill presses, and expect to pay at least 10x for one instead of 4x -- but expect to never mess with it again. Alternately, as 'Buerste' suggests, get an older good drill press, rebuild it, and use it forever. Getting a cheap Chinese tool is kind of like getting a comprehensively clapped-out tool -- you can't rebuild it, because every part is just _wrong_; by the time you got all the problems fixed you'd have a scratch- built tool with the original power cord. -- www.wescottdesign.com |
#6
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Two drilling questions
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 10:46:38 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote: On Sun, 23 Aug 2009 23:14:51 -0700, Dave D wrote: We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave So find some _decent_ drill presses, and expect to pay at least 10x for one instead of 4x -- but expect to never mess with it again. Alternately, as 'Buerste' suggests, get an older good drill press, rebuild it, and use it forever. Getting a cheap Chinese tool is kind of like getting a comprehensively clapped-out tool -- you can't rebuild it, because every part is just _wrong_; by the time you got all the problems fixed you'd have a scratch- built tool with the original power cord. I have one with a bad (intermitttent) power cord. |
#7
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Two drilling questions
Solid carbide drills are great for drilling hard to drill materials.
Just yesterday I used one to drill a bearing ball made from bearing ball steel. Even with the carbide drill, it generated a tremendous amount of heat. I drilled it with a 3/16" carbide drill, and then enlarged the hole with a 3/8" carbide endmill. This is a stupid thing to put a ball at the end of a formerly ugly key for a Jacobs 18N chuck. In any case, aluminum is not a hard to drill material, but I think that what your application lacks is tool rigidity. Assuming that your drill spindle has no runout, I would try very short drill bits that do not flex much when coming out of the drilled hole. McMaster has plenty of those. Use of carbide drills in cheap drill presses is questionable, as they do not like to flex much and can be broken by excessive runout or just flexing of the drill press. If I were you, I would try short drill bits first. i |
#8
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Two drilling questions
On Aug 24, 12:14*am, Dave D wrote:
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave Have you tried the "bullet-point" drills? These were made for thin stock, I have a set I use for just that. B&D I think is the one that owns the trademark but there are other makers. If you haven't seen them, they're like a two-step step drill, the small nib acts like a spotter. No wandering. I've used them on 4140 thinwall tube, worked fine. If you need accuracy, go with bushings and a drill jig. Heinrich makes a number of different ones for drilling on the centerlines of round stock, for a price. Strictly production-level stuff. MSC has them. Stan |
#9
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Two drilling questions
"Dave D" wrote in message ... Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave For small diameter holes I like brad point bits for aluminum or soft copper. For larger holes the uni-bit works well. You might also get good results drilling close to size with a center drill and then finish with an end mill. You can also try punching the hole. the technique I would try would depend on how many holes I needed, and how accurate I needed to be. As to your inquiry about spade bits I find these to be virtually useless. -- Roger Shoaf If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent. |
#10
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Two drilling questions
Dave D wrote:
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. Thanks for any help, Dave There's an old boy on ebay that has a lot of drill bits--he calls them "Piloted" they have an undersized 3/8 to 1/2 start which gives you your 3 lobed hole in thin metal, but then the remainder is full size and seems to ream the hole true round. |
#11
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Two drilling questions
On 2009-08-24, Dave D wrote:
We use a number of the small bench-top drill presses. Yes they're cheap, but it seems like the ones that are 4 times more are just the same models with more fancy colors, so I go with the cheap ones. Lately I've noticed a number of them have started making a chattering sound somewhere in the head. They still drill fine. Whatever it is doesn't seem to affect anything, but it sounds like it will eventually. I just thought I'd throw it out there and see if anybody has noticed a certain part that starts going, just to save myself the trouble of taking them apart and figuring it out. Hmm ... try squirting some lubricant into the spline in the center of the spindle pulley. Probably something fairly thick, like Vactra No. 2 waylube will do well. Also -- try running it (carefully, of course) with the belt guard open. Sometimes, especially if it is the three pulley kind and depending on belt length, you can have the center pulley swing over to where it is rubbing against the guard. If you have this -- either get a belt one size shorter, or drill or punch new holes for the screws holding it onto the top of the head casting so you can shift it so it does not rub. The latter approach is what I took with my floor-standing 16-speed version. Second... I've always had difficulty drilling through thin metals... Anything less than 1/8" aluminum... say 1/16" aluminum mainly. The problem seems to be that the point runs out the other side and doesn't guide the bit enough, which leads to a less than round hole. On flat stock I can put scrap behind it, but that won't work with tube. I've tried numerous bits, but I noticed these on Mc Master's http://www.mcmaster.com/#8769a27/=3bmsl6 Just wondering if anybody has used something like that for that purpose and what they think. I would try a Unibit, personally. How big are your holes? I think that you can get some which start at 1/8" and then go up in steps of 1/32" to 1/2". Others are larger, or go in larger steps. The larger and fewer the steps, the thicker the metal they will drill to a specific size. You even have an advantage on anything but the largest step that you also can deburr the top side of the hole with the chamfer to the next step. If you are sticking with Mcmaster-Carr, then enter the following into their search field: ================================================== ==================== Multidiameter Step Drill Bits ================================================== ==================== and you'll hit a page with a bunch of them at the bottom. If you are drilling fairly small ID tubing, you may need to select one with a larger starting diameter or fewer steps, so the point does not hit the far wall (assuming that you don't want to drill through both sides). Enjoy, DoN. -- Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- |
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