Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing. The department of education should set
standards. The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and
wonder why education plummeted and crime is high.

"Buerste" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing.

Why? All of the countries that are beating our pants off in education are
national systems. There's plenty of evidence around that our LACK of a
national education system is a big part of our problem. You can find studies
on ERIC.

The department of education should set standards.

Why? If they're setting standards, what advantage is it to then have the
system run at the state level? All you get from that is arguments, unfunded
mandates, and endless political infighting. That's what we have now,
especially with NCLB. It's a completely dysfunctional system.

The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and wonder why
education plummeted and crime is high.

Well, destroying the family unit is not part of their party platform
anymore. According to John McCain, it's now socializing our economy. That
was AFTER he voted to have the federal government take an equity stake in
the country's largest banks. g

Conservatives speak with forked tongues. That must come from constantly
spewing bull****.

--
Ed Huntress

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

Could be that they are achieving their education goals early, and no
longer need to waste time going through to the end.


;-)
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Ed Huntress wrote:
"RB" wrote in message
...

Cliff wrote:

Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.


Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress



Hindsight is a wonderful thing...

--

Richard

(remove the X to email)

"Spehro Pefhany" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

Could be that they are achieving their education goals early, and no
longer need to waste time going through to the end.


;-)
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

Right. g I must admit that I'm impressed with the ability of this group to
find scapegoats, strawmen, and sophistic excuses for nearly every social ill
that befalls us. With no more than two logical steps, nearly everyone finds
that the culprit is a Democrat. It's a good thing that we've had a
Republican administration for the past eight years, and a Republican
Congress for most of the years since 1994, or we could be in big financial
trouble right now.

If I didn't know better, I'd say you're all ideal representatives of the
kind of thinking that's made US manufacturing the dominant international
powerhouse that it is today. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
m...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"RB" wrote in message
...

Cliff wrote:

Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.


Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress

Hindsight is a wonderful thing...

Yes, but if you were married to a teacher, like I am, you would know that
they spotted the trouble with NCLB before it ever went into effect.
Professionals in that field, as in many fields, could have told them what
that they were leading us down the garden path.

--
Ed Huntress

Ed Huntress wrote:
"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
m...

Ed Huntress wrote:

"RB" wrote in message
.. .


Cliff wrote:


Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.


Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress

Hindsight is a wonderful thing...


Yes, but if you were married to a teacher, like I am, you would know that
they spotted the trouble with NCLB before it ever went into effect.
Professionals in that field, as in many fields, could have told them what
that they were leading us down the garden path.

--
Ed Huntress



I was. Chemestry professor.
And you are absolutely right.

That's the trouble with a governing elite.
They simply don't need to listen to anybody elses silly opinions.
They already hve their own...


--

Richard

(remove the X to email)

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.


Ed, I have to agree with him. The "liberal" version of education
where everyone has to be "sensitive" to the students feelings and self
esteem and all that other BS and the fact that there are no
consequences for students actions, or lack thereof, is the reason that
we have the situation we have today. I worked for the last seven
years as a substitute teacher for grades 6 and up and was appalled at
the lack of discipline in our schools today. The kids no longer have
any incentive to do well since they will be "socially" promoted so
they can stay with their friends whether they do the work or not. This
came along long before Bush ever thought about running for President
so it can't be blamed on him. Granted NCLB is a terrible failure and
even the teachers don't like it but that is not the reason for the
drop out rate. The kids feel that they don't need to learn what is
taught because they have a relative that will hire them or they want
to be a drug dealer and make real money or some other such garbage.
Don't think that I'm making this up. I have actually had students
tell me these things while talking to them and trying to encourage
them to learn everything they can about everything they can. I really
don't know what the complete answer is but we have to find some way of
making the kids responsible for their actions.

Jim

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:43:51 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Buerste" wrote in message
.. .

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing.

Why? All of the countries that are beating our pants off in education are
national systems. There's plenty of evidence around that our LACK of a
national education system is a big part of our problem. You can find studies
on ERIC.

The department of education should set standards.

Why? If they're setting standards, what advantage is it to then have the
system run at the state level? All you get from that is arguments, unfunded
mandates, and endless political infighting. That's what we have now,
especially with NCLB. It's a completely dysfunctional system.

The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and wonder why
education plummeted and crime is high.

Well, destroying the family unit is not part of their party platform
anymore. According to John McCain, it's now socializing our economy. That
was AFTER he voted to have the federal government take an equity stake in
the country's largest banks. g

Conservatives speak with forked tongues. That must come from constantly
spewing bull****.


Part of the problem today is that we have no unity of language or
culture. Wew are bending so far over backward to promote "diversity"
that we are failing our students. We have to teach in languages other
than English, have to teach about other cultures, etc. We need to
establish English as the official language (and that is usually
blocked by the Democrats) and stop worrying about the culture of the
immigrants and start worriying about our own. Trying to teach
immigrants in their own language is ridiculous and should be stopped.
Spend the time, energy and money on teaching our own kids in English.
If the immigrants want to come here they should learn OUR language,
not the other way around.

Jim

"Jim Chandler" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.


Ed, I have to agree with him. The "liberal" version of education
where everyone has to be "sensitive" to the students feelings and self
esteem and all that other BS and the fact that there are no
consequences for students actions, or lack thereof, is the reason that
we have the situation we have today. I worked for the last seven
years as a substitute teacher for grades 6 and up and was appalled at
the lack of discipline in our schools today.

I'm in the public schools two or three days a week. When I hear this stuff I
want to drag someone over here and let them see what a school is like when
the kids have responsible parents. There is no discipline problem here.

The kids no longer have
any incentive to do well since they will be "socially" promoted so
they can stay with their friends whether they do the work or not.

If that was true, the graduation rates would be going *up*, not down.

This
came along long before Bush ever thought about running for President
so it can't be blamed on him. Granted NCLB is a terrible failure and
even the teachers don't like it but that is not the reason for the
drop out rate. The kids feel that they don't need to learn what is
taught because they have a relative that will hire them or they want
to be a drug dealer and make real money or some other such garbage.
Don't think that I'm making this up. I have actually had students
tell me these things while talking to them and trying to encourage
them to learn everything they can about everything they can. I really
don't know what the complete answer is but we have to find some way of
making the kids responsible for their actions.

If you've been teaching kids who want to be drug dealers, you're teaching in
a failed neighborhood. I'd get out of there and move to someplace decent.

--
Ed Huntress

"Jim Chandler" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:43:51 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Buerste" wrote in message
. ..

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect
more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's
exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing.

Why? All of the countries that are beating our pants off in education are
national systems. There's plenty of evidence around that our LACK of a
national education system is a big part of our problem. You can find
studies
on ERIC.

The department of education should set standards.

Why? If they're setting standards, what advantage is it to then have the
system run at the state level? All you get from that is arguments,
unfunded
mandates, and endless political infighting. That's what we have now,
especially with NCLB. It's a completely dysfunctional system.

The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and wonder why
education plummeted and crime is high.

Well, destroying the family unit is not part of their party platform
anymore. According to John McCain, it's now socializing our economy. That
was AFTER he voted to have the federal government take an equity stake in
the country's largest banks. g

Conservatives speak with forked tongues. That must come from constantly
spewing bull****.


Part of the problem today is that we have no unity of language or
culture. Wew are bending so far over backward to promote "diversity"
that we are failing our students. We have to teach in languages other
than English, have to teach about other cultures, etc. We need to
establish English as the official language (and that is usually
blocked by the Democrats) and stop worrying about the culture of the
immigrants and start worriying about our own. Trying to teach
immigrants in their own language is ridiculous and should be stopped.
Spend the time, energy and money on teaching our own kids in English.
If the immigrants want to come here they should learn OUR language,
not the other way around.

I've been asking people for years how teaching in another language causes
discipline problems, or how it leads to us "failing" our students. Nobody
has been able to give me an answer. Do you have an answer?

As I said in an earlier message, Jim, everyone has a scapegoat, or a
strawman, on whom to blame all of the problems. Most of them don't make any
sense. The connection between teaching other cultures (they called it
"geography" when I was in school, and they did a stinking job of teaching
it) and problems in schools are nonsense. Where is the connection? How does
it lead to problems?

There are problems with education, but the fundamental ones are problems
that no one likes to hear. The biggest problem is parents who don't teach
their kids the importance of education, or instill in them a sense of
necessary authority. The second problem is that we don't take education
seriously ourselves. Mostly we give it lip service. (It isn't education we
value, it's degrees and diplomas.) The third is that our culture assumes
that teachers are losers -- so we get losers for teachers.

There's enough real trouble to go around without making stuff up.

--
Ed Huntress

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 13:49:12 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Jim Chandler" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:43:51 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Buerste" wrote in message
.. .

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect
more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's
exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing.

Why? All of the countries that are beating our pants off in education are
national systems. There's plenty of evidence around that our LACK of a
national education system is a big part of our problem. You can find
studies
on ERIC.

The department of education should set standards.

Why? If they're setting standards, what advantage is it to then have the
system run at the state level? All you get from that is arguments,
unfunded
mandates, and endless political infighting. That's what we have now,
especially with NCLB. It's a completely dysfunctional system.

The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and wonder why
education plummeted and crime is high.

Well, destroying the family unit is not part of their party platform
anymore. According to John McCain, it's now socializing our economy. That
was AFTER he voted to have the federal government take an equity stake in
the country's largest banks. g

Conservatives speak with forked tongues. That must come from constantly
spewing bull****.


Part of the problem today is that we have no unity of language or
culture. Wew are bending so far over backward to promote "diversity"
that we are failing our students. We have to teach in languages other
than English, have to teach about other cultures, etc. We need to
establish English as the official language (and that is usually
blocked by the Democrats) and stop worrying about the culture of the
immigrants and start worriying about our own. Trying to teach
immigrants in their own language is ridiculous and should be stopped.
Spend the time, energy and money on teaching our own kids in English.
If the immigrants want to come here they should learn OUR language,
not the other way around.

I've been asking people for years how teaching in another language causes
discipline problems, or how it leads to us "failing" our students. Nobody
has been able to give me an answer. Do you have an answer?

As I said in an earlier message, Jim, everyone has a scapegoat, or a
strawman, on whom to blame all of the problems. Most of them don't make any
sense. The connection between teaching other cultures (they called it
"geography" when I was in school, and they did a stinking job of teaching
it) and problems in schools are nonsense. Where is the connection? How does
it lead to problems?

There are problems with education, but the fundamental ones are problems
that no one likes to hear. The biggest problem is parents who don't teach
their kids the importance of education, or instill in them a sense of
necessary authority. The second problem is that we don't take education
seriously ourselves. Mostly we give it lip service. (It isn't education we
value, it's degrees and diplomas.) The third is that our culture assumes
that teachers are losers -- so we get losers for teachers.

There's enough real trouble to go around without making stuff up.


Teaching other cultures is NOT teaching Geography. They teach very
little Geography, if any, these days. The problem with teaching these
kids in Spanish, or whatever, is that the resources are wasted. Those
kids should learn ENGLISH and English should be the official language.
I did not say that teaching in other languages was connected to
discipline problems in the classroom, though it certainly doesn't
help. I've had students try to pull the "I don't speak English" ****
on me. Unfortunately for them it didn't work. The discipline
problems come from the fact that there are no consequences for their
actions. I had one GIRL refuse to stand for the Pledge of Allegiance
one day. I don't care if they say it or not but they WILL stand in my
classrooms. When i told her that she wanted to argue so I proceeded
to write her a referral. One of her little buddies wanted to get her
mouth into the conversation so I wrote her a referral also. Both
walked out of the classroom before the security escort arrived and
when I said to come back, I was given the finger and told, "**** you"
three times. Their punishment? They were "councelled". If I had
done something like that when I was in school, nobody would have
worried about my self esteem, I'd have gotten my ass paddled be the
Principal and then again when my Dad found out. In case you think
that this is an isolated incident and that I provoked it, the girl who
refused to stand had come into class late and has since gone to jail
for doing drugs on the campus. The mouthy one, on a seperate
occassion, physically attacked me and after the third time she struck
me was thrown bodily to the floor and restrained until security and
all the Principals in the world got there. She was charged with
Assault on a School Official. She apparently didn't learn because she
was arrested a couple of months ago for robbery. Seems she beat up a
classmate and stole her cell phone. These are TENTH grade girls.
Nice, huh? I don't miss dealing with **** like that at all.

Jim

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:28:20 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Spehro Pefhany" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
.. .
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

Could be that they are achieving their education goals early, and no
longer need to waste time going through to the end.


;-)
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

Right. g I must admit that I'm impressed with the ability of this group to
find scapegoats, strawmen, and sophistic excuses for nearly every social ill
that befalls us. With no more than two logical steps, nearly everyone finds
that the culprit is a Democrat. It's a good thing that we've had a
Republican administration for the past eight years, and a Republican
Congress for most of the years since 1994, or we could be in big financial
trouble right now.

If I didn't know better, I'd say you're all ideal representatives of the
kind of thinking that's made US manufacturing the dominant international
powerhouse that it is today. d8-)


The problem is not caused by Republicans or Democrats. It's caused by
crooked politicians. Wait a minute, that's redundant isn't it? Term
limits are the answer and the ability to recall poor performers.

Jim

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 13:28:16 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Jim Chandler" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
.. .
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.


Ed, I have to agree with him. The "liberal" version of education
where everyone has to be "sensitive" to the students feelings and self
esteem and all that other BS and the fact that there are no
consequences for students actions, or lack thereof, is the reason that
we have the situation we have today. I worked for the last seven
years as a substitute teacher for grades 6 and up and was appalled at
the lack of discipline in our schools today.

I'm in the public schools two or three days a week. When I hear this stuff I
want to drag someone over here and let them see what a school is like when
the kids have responsible parents. There is no discipline problem here.

The kids no longer have
any incentive to do well since they will be "socially" promoted so
they can stay with their friends whether they do the work or not.

If that was true, the graduation rates would be going *up*, not down.

This
came along long before Bush ever thought about running for President
so it can't be blamed on him. Granted NCLB is a terrible failure and
even the teachers don't like it but that is not the reason for the
drop out rate. The kids feel that they don't need to learn what is
taught because they have a relative that will hire them or they want
to be a drug dealer and make real money or some other such garbage.
Don't think that I'm making this up. I have actually had students
tell me these things while talking to them and trying to encourage
them to learn everything they can about everything they can. I really
don't know what the complete answer is but we have to find some way of
making the kids responsible for their actions.

If you've been teaching kids who want to be drug dealers, you're teaching in
a failed neighborhood. I'd get out of there and move to someplace decent.


Unfortunately, there is nowhere else around here. ALL the school
districts, and California in general, are full of them. The parents,
assuming they have them, don't give a rat's ass for the most part,
therefore the kids have the same attitude. California is the worst
place to be in classroom.

Jim

Jim Chandler wrote:
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
...

Cliff wrote:

Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.



Ed, I have to agree with him. The "liberal" version of education
where everyone has to be "sensitive" to the students feelings and self
esteem and all that other BS and the fact that there are no
consequences for students actions, or lack thereof, is the reason that
we have the situation we have today. I worked for the last seven
years as a substitute teacher for grades 6 and up and was appalled at
the lack of discipline in our schools today. The kids no longer have
any incentive to do well since they will be "socially" promoted so
they can stay with their friends whether they do the work or not. This
came along long before Bush ever thought about running for President
so it can't be blamed on him. Granted NCLB is a terrible failure and
even the teachers don't like it but that is not the reason for the
drop out rate. The kids feel that they don't need to learn what is
taught because they have a relative that will hire them or they want
to be a drug dealer and make real money or some other such garbage.
Don't think that I'm making this up. I have actually had students
tell me these things while talking to them and trying to encourage
them to learn everything they can about everything they can. I really
don't know what the complete answer is but we have to find some way of
making the kids responsible for their actions.

Jim


That's the new culture, folks.
Like it or not.

--

Richard

(remove the X to email)

On Oct 24, 11:28*am, "Ed Huntress" wrote:
"Spehro Pefhany" wrote in message

...





On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
* Happy days for wingers !!!

* The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

* Great education plan !!!
* Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! *Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. *If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.

Could be that they are achieving their education goals early, and no
longer need to waste time going through to the end.

;-)
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

Right. g I must admit that I'm impressed with the ability of this group to
find scapegoats, strawmen, and sophistic excuses for nearly every social ill
that befalls us. With no more than two logical steps, nearly everyone finds
that the culprit is a Democrat. It's a good thing that we've had a
Republican administration for the past eight years, and a Republican
Congress for most of the years since 1994, or we could be in big financial
trouble right now.

If I didn't know better, I'd say you're all ideal representatives of the
kind of thinking that's made US manufacturing the dominant international
powerhouse that it is today. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Darn it Ed...there you go making sense again.

You must have gotten your education...and graduated.....under a
Democrat. ;)

TMT

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:52:54 GMT, Jim Chandler wrote:

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 13:28:16 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Jim Chandler" wrote in message
. ..
On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:47:01 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"RB" wrote in message
. ..
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone should
be graduating.


Ed, I have to agree with him. The "liberal" version of education
where everyone has to be "sensitive" to the students feelings and self
esteem and all that other BS and the fact that there are no
consequences for students actions, or lack thereof, is the reason that
we have the situation we have today. I worked for the last seven
years as a substitute teacher for grades 6 and up and was appalled at
the lack of discipline in our schools today.

I'm in the public schools two or three days a week. When I hear this stuff I
want to drag someone over here and let them see what a school is like when
the kids have responsible parents. There is no discipline problem here.

The kids no longer have
any incentive to do well since they will be "socially" promoted so
they can stay with their friends whether they do the work or not.

If that was true, the graduation rates would be going *up*, not down.

This
came along long before Bush ever thought about running for President
so it can't be blamed on him. Granted NCLB is a terrible failure and
even the teachers don't like it but that is not the reason for the
drop out rate. The kids feel that they don't need to learn what is
taught because they have a relative that will hire them or they want
to be a drug dealer and make real money or some other such garbage.
Don't think that I'm making this up. I have actually had students
tell me these things while talking to them and trying to encourage
them to learn everything they can about everything they can. I really
don't know what the complete answer is but we have to find some way of
making the kids responsible for their actions.

If you've been teaching kids who want to be drug dealers, you're teaching in
a failed neighborhood. I'd get out of there and move to someplace decent.


Unfortunately, there is nowhere else around here. ALL the school
districts, and California in general, are full of them. The parents,
assuming they have them, don't give a rat's ass for the most part,
therefore the kids have the same attitude. California is the worst
place to be in classroom.

Jim


Which is reflected in Californias educational rating....49th out of
50....

And we can indeed blame that on Liberals. Conservatives have little
say in any urban school district.

Gunner

Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
something damned nasty to all three of them.

"Buerste" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"RB" wrote in message
...
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should
be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing. The department of education should set
standards. The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and
wonder why education plummeted and crime is high.


The republicans have destroyed the economy and the financial system and
nearly the country. If you want to know why things are screwed up ask them
because they are the ones who ruined us. But like a good right winger you
can be counted on to blame everything on someone besides the real criminals.
Let me make it easy for you Fido, republicans good, Democrats bad. Everyone
can understand how you think now. If that can be called thinking.

Hawke

Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect
more
of this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone, and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's
exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress


Education should be a State thing.

Why? All of the countries that are beating our pants off in education are
national systems. There's plenty of evidence around that our LACK of a
national education system is a big part of our problem. You can find
studies
on ERIC.

The department of education should set standards.

Why? If they're setting standards, what advantage is it to then have the
system run at the state level? All you get from that is arguments,
unfunded
mandates, and endless political infighting. That's what we have now,
especially with NCLB. It's a completely dysfunctional system.

The democrats systematically destroyed the family unit and wonder why
education plummeted and crime is high.

Well, destroying the family unit is not part of their party platform
anymore. According to John McCain, it's now socializing our economy. That
was AFTER he voted to have the federal government take an equity stake in
the country's largest banks. g

Conservatives speak with forked tongues. That must come from constantly
spewing bull****.

--
Ed Huntress


Not only that they simply refuse to admit when they are wrong and want to
keep plowing ahead with policies that just don't work. Look at the shape the
country is in yet every conservative has the same suggestions how to fix
things; lower taxes on the rich and business, increase free trade, and let
the free market fix the problems without government interference. Those
ideas will add gasoline to the fire but every damn conservative recommends
the same thing. We got here because we listened to them and did what they
said. Hello!, it failed. It's what put is where we are now. But not a one of
them sees their ideology as responsible for where we are now. These guys
just plain have to go. They have no idea how to govern. It's like their idea
of what you should do on a hot, dry, windy, summer day is to start a
controlled burn. They're just plain nuts. Time for all of them to get real
jobs in the private sector and lets see how many of them get rich.

Hawke

.. .
Cliff wrote:
Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame
for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more
of
this.

Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's
exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should
be graduating.

Could be that they are achieving their education goals early, and no
longer need to waste time going through to the end.


;-)
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

Right. g I must admit that I'm impressed with the ability of this group
to
find scapegoats, strawmen, and sophistic excuses for nearly every social
ill
that befalls us. With no more than two logical steps, nearly everyone
finds
that the culprit is a Democrat. It's a good thing that we've had a
Republican administration for the past eight years, and a Republican
Congress for most of the years since 1994, or we could be in big
financial
trouble right now.

If I didn't know better, I'd say you're all ideal representatives of the
kind of thinking that's made US manufacturing the dominant international
powerhouse that it is today. d8-)


The problem is not caused by Republicans or Democrats. It's caused by
crooked politicians. Wait a minute, that's redundant isn't it? Term
limits are the answer and the ability to recall poor performers.

Jim

The problem isn't crooked politicians it's stupid American voters. Case in
point. You hear all the time from conservatives that the congress has an
approval rating in the teens. You hear this whenever someone comments on how
unpopular Bush is. The knee-jerk conservative responsive is to switch to the
even less popular congress. But as unpopular as the congress is wouldn't you
think that the majority of the congressmen would not be reelected to
congress? I mean everyone hates the congress. But do you know that the
reelection rate is in the 90% range? You want to talk stupid? How can people
keep sending the same people back to congress when they say they hate them?
How can they reelect the same people when they say they are crooked and
incompetent? It's because Americans are stupid. If they had any brains they
would not reelect anybody in congress and would send all new people. But
they won't. They will bitch and complain and then vote the same sons of
bitches back into office. So you see, it's the people who are to blame not
the politicians. Voters can change the make up of congress anytime they want
but they don't. They're stupid. The politicians love them for that.

Hawke

Cliff wrote:

Happy days for wingers !!!

The US now has the lowest HS graduation rates of any
industrialized/Western nation in the world !!!

Great education plan !!!
Way to go, Team Winger !!!

You friggin' idiot! Bush is not responsible for everything bad that
happens, unless you also give him credit for all the good.
And that ain't going to happen.

It's liberalized education and welfare programs that get the blame for
our
uneducated masses. If your Obama wet dream comes true, expect more of
this.


Bush's "No Child Left Behind" was going to improve education for
everyone,
and now the graduation rates are *dropping*.

NCLB is a stupid program from a guy who got C's in college. It's exactly
what we should expect from a neocon who claimed that education was one
of
his top two priorities, before the 2000 election. The stupidity on our
part
was in believing he knew what he was talking about.

Tell us, RB, how "liberalized education" has led to reduced graduation
rates. If it's liberalized, the logical conclusion is that everyone
should
be graduating.

--
Ed Huntress



Hindsight is a wonderful thing...

I don't know about that. It doesn't seem to work for conservatives.


Hawke