Buddy of mine runs a nice automotive shop and a month or so ago, he
calls and says his Tig welder died (ancient Miller 300 rebadged as
AIRCO) and could I check it? Since he does a lot of A/C adapters and
so forth, I loaded up one of my spare TIG machines on the trailer and
took it along. We trade machining and electrical work for mechanic
work...so we really work at keeping each other happy..G

Found a bad breaker..really marginal wiring...old shop, poorly wired
in the first place. Since he had a couple hot jobs, I disconnected his
old welder and installed my Airco 250 Squarewave (Esab) and showed him
what does what...and turned him loose. He loved it and has been using
it daily.

His hired help (who Ill refer to as "nose picker" on the other
hand...liked the old Miller and decided on his own, to hook it back
up......chuckle

SOW cord, 8/3..with red/white/green conductors. 240vt 1ph welder.

My buddy says there was a really bright flash..and all the power goes
out in the shop..and he runs out to find the shaken nose picker
standing there in the dark..with bits of smoke wafting in the
breeze...

So he calls me up and asks me to come over and check everything out.
They pulled the entire breaker out of the panel to make sure its
safe...lol

I get there..and find the green and red wires attached to the breaker.
which made a .nice Christmasy effect..but not exactly as intended by
the maker or Code.....with the white wire going to the neutral lug in
the breaker box..just like all the white wires in the 110
breakers....chuckle


So I swap the wires around and turn on the breaker then try the
welder...no fan. Check the fuses..all ok...hum...

Kinda cramped on the acess side of the welder..so I asked the nose
picker to clean me some space and go off to pee.

As Im standing there, making splashy splashy...

Bright flash..all the lights go out...

The guy is standing there...with a stricken look on his face...and
smoke wafting in the air....

Seems when he tried to move the big B bottle of argon, he hit the side
of the welder and the muffler tube rack...big melted spot on the
rack....

WTF? Measured case of welder to ground..hot as hell. ****..shorted
transformer......hummmm...lesseee here..

Killed power, pulled the wireing access hatch...and found in years
gone by, some dick head had hooked L1-L2 to green and white..with red
to case ground.. And all the insulation was gone in the SOW cord
between conductors as a result of the first miss hookup.
2 way hot right to the old case. The welder was on 2x4s, and we were
all weaing rubber soles..so no one got bit when touching the case of
the welder.

Replaced the power cable (took it off my welder), wired both ends
PROPERLY..and after chanting a mantra of supplication to Ready
Kilowatt..(and checking for power from case to ground)...fired it up.
Ran nicely,good arc.

Hard to kill a good old transformer machine. Gotta love em. Its gonna
be good for another 30 years.

Gunner

I used to assume that there was only ONE mess to fix when I got called
out. After getting bitten (financially or electrically!) a few too many
times, I don't even expect that much respect.

Pete C. wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

Buddy of mine runs a nice automotive shop and a month or so ago, he
calls and says his Tig welder died (ancient Miller 300 rebadged as
AIRCO) and could I check it? Since he does a lot of A/C adapters and
so forth, I loaded up one of my spare TIG machines on the trailer and
took it along. We trade machining and electrical work for mechanic
work...so we really work at keeping each other happy..G

Found a bad breaker..really marginal wiring...old shop, poorly wired
in the first place. Since he had a couple hot jobs, I disconnected his
old welder and installed my Airco 250 Squarewave (Esab) and showed him
what does what...and turned him loose. He loved it and has been using
it daily.

His hired help (who Ill refer to as "nose picker" on the other
hand...liked the old Miller and decided on his own, to hook it back
up......chuckle

SOW cord, 8/3..with red/white/green conductors. 240vt 1ph welder.

My buddy says there was a really bright flash..and all the power goes
out in the shop..and he runs out to find the shaken nose picker
standing there in the dark..with bits of smoke wafting in the
breeze...

So he calls me up and asks me to come over and check everything out.
They pulled the entire breaker out of the panel to make sure its
safe...lol

I get there..and find the green and red wires attached to the breaker.
which made a .nice Christmasy effect..but not exactly as intended by
the maker or Code.....with the white wire going to the neutral lug in
the breaker box..just like all the white wires in the 110
breakers....chuckle

So I swap the wires around and turn on the breaker then try the
welder...no fan. Check the fuses..all ok...hum...

Kinda cramped on the acess side of the welder..so I asked the nose
picker to clean me some space and go off to pee.

As Im standing there, making splashy splashy...

Bright flash..all the lights go out...

The guy is standing there...with a stricken look on his face...and
smoke wafting in the air....

Seems when he tried to move the big B bottle of argon, he hit the side
of the welder and the muffler tube rack...big melted spot on the
rack....

WTF? Measured case of welder to ground..hot as hell. ****..shorted
transformer......hummmm...lesseee here..

Killed power, pulled the wireing access hatch...and found in years
gone by, some dick head had hooked L1-L2 to green and white..with red
to case ground.. And all the insulation was gone in the SOW cord
between conductors as a result of the first miss hookup.
2 way hot right to the old case. The welder was on 2x4s, and we were
all weaing rubber soles..so no one got bit when touching the case of
the welder.

Replaced the power cable (took it off my welder), wired both ends
PROPERLY..and after chanting a mantra of supplication to Ready
Kilowatt..(and checking for power from case to ground)...fired it up.
Ran nicely,good arc.

Hard to kill a good old transformer machine. Gotta love em. Its gonna
be good for another 30 years.

Gunner


Always assume until proven otherwise, that whatever was done prior to
your arrival was all f'd up and needs to be fixed.

Pete C.

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 08:03:03 GMT, Gunner Asch
wrote:



WTF? Measured case of welder to ground..hot as hell. ****..shorted
transformer......hummmm...lesseee here..

Yow! Some seem to think I'm an old wuss because I always check
"dead" or "safe" circuits with a meter. Same guys don't seem to have
a problem when I check a handgun handed me to be sure it's clear. Go
figure!

On Jul 26, 11:20 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Gunner Asch wrote:

Buddy of mine runs a nice automotive shop and a month or so ago, he
calls and says his Tig welder died (ancient Miller 300 rebadged as
AIRCO) and could I check it? Since he does a lot of A/C adapters and
so forth, I loaded up one of my spare TIG machines on the trailer and
took it along. We trade machining and electrical work for mechanic
work...so we really work at keeping each other happy..G

Found a bad breaker..really marginal wiring...old shop, poorly wired
in the first place. Since he had a couple hot jobs, I disconnected his
old welder and installed my Airco 250 Squarewave (Esab) and showed him
what does what...and turned him loose. He loved it and has been using
it daily.

His hired help (who Ill refer to as "nose picker" on the other
hand...liked the old Miller and decided on his own, to hook it back
up......chuckle

SOW cord, 8/3..with red/white/green conductors. 240vt 1ph welder.

My buddy says there was a really bright flash..and all the power goes
out in the shop..and he runs out to find the shaken nose picker
standing there in the dark..with bits of smoke wafting in the
breeze...

So he calls me up and asks me to come over and check everything out.
They pulled the entire breaker out of the panel to make sure its
safe...lol

I get there..and find the green and red wires attached to the breaker.
which made a .nice Christmasy effect..but not exactly as intended by
the maker or Code.....with the white wire going to the neutral lug in
the breaker box..just like all the white wires in the 110
breakers....chuckle

So I swap the wires around and turn on the breaker then try the
welder...no fan. Check the fuses..all ok...hum...

Kinda cramped on the acess side of the welder..so I asked the nose
picker to clean me some space and go off to pee.

As Im standing there, making splashy splashy...

Bright flash..all the lights go out...

The guy is standing there...with a stricken look on his face...and
smoke wafting in the air....

Seems when he tried to move the big B bottle of argon, he hit the side
of the welder and the muffler tube rack...big melted spot on the
rack....

WTF? Measured case of welder to ground..hot as hell. ****..shorted
transformer......hummmm...lesseee here..

Killed power, pulled the wireing access hatch...and found in years
gone by, some dick head had hooked L1-L2 to green and white..with red
to case ground.. And all the insulation was gone in the SOW cord
between conductors as a result of the first miss hookup.
2 way hot right to the old case. The welder was on 2x4s, and we were
all weaing rubber soles..so no one got bit when touching the case of
the welder.

Replaced the power cable (took it off my welder), wired both ends
PROPERLY..and after chanting a mantra of supplication to Ready
Kilowatt..(and checking for power from case to ground)...fired it up.
Ran nicely,good arc.

Hard to kill a good old transformer machine. Gotta love em. Its gonna
be good for another 30 years.

Gunner

Always assume until proven otherwise, that whatever was done prior to
your arrival was all f'd up and needs to be fixed.

Pete C.

I dont think anyone EVER gets used to the sound of Spark Farming

Lucky it wasnt the argon bottle making unplanned contact with earted
metal.

I remember the first time i melted the teeth off an alligator clip and
it was a goood lesson learned but as far as i'm concerned event he
once was too many.

RoyJ wrote:

I used to assume that there was only ONE mess to fix when I got called
out. After getting bitten (financially or electrically!) a few too many
times, I don't even expect that much respect.

I've been fixing things for a living long enough now that I don't *often*
get side tracked by a double issue problem. The triple issue ones catch me
from time to time but I'm still learning

Wes

Don Foreman wrote:

Yow! Some seem to think I'm an old wuss because I always check
"dead" or "safe" circuits with a meter. Same guys don't seem to have
a problem when I check a handgun handed me to be sure it's clear. Go
figure!

I learned a long time ago to check a live circuit with my meter or wiggy
before testing an assumed dead circuit.

Wes

Wes wrote:

Don Foreman wrote:


Yow! Some seem to think I'm an old wuss because I always check
"dead" or "safe" circuits with a meter. Same guys don't seem to have
a problem when I check a handgun handed me to be sure it's clear. Go
figure!


I learned a long time ago to check a live circuit with my meter or wiggy
before testing an assumed dead circuit.

Wes




Bottom fed circuit safety disconnects will do you in if you try to
change a fuse on one of them. I have seen a couple of them in my days.
I always check a machine for grounding before I will work on it,
especially if its in a shop where the wiring is not that well done. I
even check it if I have done it. Its so easy to run an ohm meter to
ground on the machine and to the conduit or frame of the building.


John

"john" wrote: (clip) Its so easy to run an ohm meter to ground on the
machine and to the conduit or frame of the building.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
And if it doesn't have a good ground, run out and grab one of your jumper
cables.

Gunner Asch wrote:

Hard to kill a good old transformer machine. Gotta love em. Its gonna
be good for another 30 years.

Unlike nosepicker's shorts.... lol


Jon

Leo Lichtman wrote:

"john" wrote: (clip) Its so easy to run an ohm meter to ground on the
machine and to the conduit or frame of the building.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
And if it doesn't have a good ground, run out and grab one of your jumper
cables.




what? and burn a good jumper cable to a crip Get one of the
customers cables and burn up his.

John

"john" wrote: what? and burn a good jumper cable to a crip Get one of
the customers cables and burn up his.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Taking that point to heart, I think you should also use the customer's ohm
meter.