On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:

60% have never read even one book.
Only about 6% read a book a year.
63% think man & the dinosaurs were living together.
70% believe in the existence of angels.
40% of American adults did not know that Germany was our enemy in
World War II.
50% of seventeen year olds could not express 9/100 as a percentage.
53% said the earth revolves around the sun in either a day or a month.
21% believed the sun revolved around the earth (don't ask them to
add 21 & 53).
91% were unable to state what a molecule was.
12% of Amercians, asked who the wife of the biblical Noah was, said
"Joan of Arc".
Motorola Corporation reported that 80 percent of all applicants screened
nationally failed a test of seventh-grade English and fifth-grade math.
56% said electrons were larger than atoms.
Almost half the population reads at a fifth-grade level or less.
42% of Americans can’t locate Japan on a world map.

Of the 158 countries in the United Nations, the United States ranks
forty-ninth in literacy.

The republican answer?
Tax cuts for the already wealthy, cuts in education.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs...19new_prod.asp

Educators can only offer education and try to motivate. Parents,
regardless of political affiliation, aid and abet their children's
attempts to "get a break" by reduced standards for performance.

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting. There have been effective
leaders from both parties in the past, and damned few if any from
either party in recent years.

Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:

60% have never read even one book.
Only about 6% read a book a year.
63% think man & the dinosaurs were living together.
70% believe in the existence of angels.
40% of American adults did not know that Germany was our enemy in
World War II.
50% of seventeen year olds could not express 9/100 as a percentage.
53% said the earth revolves around the sun in either a day or a month.
21% believed the sun revolved around the earth (don't ask them to
add 21 & 53).
91% were unable to state what a molecule was.
12% of Amercians, asked who the wife of the biblical Noah was, said
"Joan of Arc".
Motorola Corporation reported that 80 percent of all applicants screened
nationally failed a test of seventh-grade English and fifth-grade math.
56% said electrons were larger than atoms.
Almost half the population reads at a fifth-grade level or less.
42% of Americans can,t locate Japan on a world map.

Of the 158 countries in the United Nations, the United States ranks
forty-ninth in literacy.

The republican answer?
Tax cuts for the already wealthy, cuts in education.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs...19new_prod.asp

Educators can only offer education and try to motivate. Parents,
regardless of political affiliation, aid and abet their children's
attempts to "get a break" by reduced standards for performance.

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal. Wasting school dollars on
crap like football uniforms, basketball jerseys, and similar is equally
criminal. Kids are in school to LEARN, not to play sports. ONce they've
actually learned enough to be functional adults, *THEN* they can play
sports. Until then, nail their asses to the seat and teach 'em until it
sinks in, whether they enjoy it or not. It isn't about enjoyment, it's
about learning.

There have been effective
leaders from both parties in the past, and damned few if any from
either party in recent years.

Agreed, on both scores.

Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is, indeed, a
big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of the problem
being addressed?

--
Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd for more info

Don Bruder wrote:
In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:
Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is,
indeed, a big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of
the problem being addressed?

Don,
There isn't a political party on the planet that can influence a child, for
better or worse, the way a parent can.
Blaming schools for poor product is a parental cop out.

--
John R. Carroll
Machining Solution Software, Inc.
Los Angeles San Francisco
www.machiningsolution.com

"Don Bruder" wrote in message
...

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal.

You may want to find out what the NCLB act is about before getting excited,
Don. Basically, it's the exact opposite of what you're suggesting.

It's 814 federal requirements for schools to receive federal tax money.
Think of it as a Procrustean bed: every child, everywhere in America, is
required to pass the same tests in math and English at a high level of
proficiency. If they don't, the school (or the district, I forget which)
loses some federal funding.

"Social metriculation" is not part of the picture. Forcing teachers to
"teach to the test" is the picture.

Essentially, as most experienced educators will tell you, it's a bunch of
empty rhetoric compiled by conservative theorists and shoved down the
throats of school districts -- which is ironic, because these are the same
people who are so opposed to more federal intrusion into areas that are
traditionally state prerogatives. It's also one of Dubya's primary hobby
horses.

--
Ed Huntress

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 13:28:28 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:

60% have never read even one book.
Only about 6% read a book a year.
63% think man & the dinosaurs were living together.
70% believe in the existence of angels.
40% of American adults did not know that Germany was our enemy in
World War II.
50% of seventeen year olds could not express 9/100 as a percentage.
53% said the earth revolves around the sun in either a day or a month.
21% believed the sun revolved around the earth (don't ask them to
add 21 & 53).
91% were unable to state what a molecule was.
12% of Amercians, asked who the wife of the biblical Noah was, said
"Joan of Arc".
Motorola Corporation reported that 80 percent of all applicants screened
nationally failed a test of seventh-grade English and fifth-grade math.
56% said electrons were larger than atoms.
Almost half the population reads at a fifth-grade level or less.
42% of Americans can,t locate Japan on a world map.

Of the 158 countries in the United Nations, the United States ranks
forty-ninth in literacy.

The republican answer?
Tax cuts for the already wealthy, cuts in education.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs...19new_prod.asp

Educators can only offer education and try to motivate. Parents,
regardless of political affiliation, aid and abet their children's
attempts to "get a break" by reduced standards for performance.

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal. Wasting school dollars on
crap like football uniforms, basketball jerseys, and similar is equally
criminal. Kids are in school to LEARN, not to play sports. ONce they've
actually learned enough to be functional adults, *THEN* they can play
sports. Until then, nail their asses to the seat and teach 'em until it
sinks in, whether they enjoy it or not. It isn't about enjoyment, it's
about learning.

There have been effective
leaders from both parties in the past, and damned few if any from
either party in recent years.

Agreed, on both scores.

Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is, indeed, a
big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of the problem
being addressed?

Yes, because without a proposed agenda for improvement or change
(other than put a different party in power) it accomplishes nothing
but blame assignment. It uses inflammatory rhetoric to advance an
unstated but obvioius political agenda, rather than accomplish or
even address any resolution of the problem or situation cited.

If/when a different party is in office, the yowling and bleating
continues though from different sources. If ya really want to fix
the problem, then address the goddamned problem with proposed
solutions. God forbid that the problem might be us because someone
else isn't doing our job of setting standards for and motivating our
kids. Geez, if they learn critical thinking and logic, they might
even disagree with us!

In article ,
says...
In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:



The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal.

While I don't disagree with your opinion of NCLB, it seems your opinion
is based on a misunderstanding of the act. NCLB requires that objective
standards be met by schools, to be measured by testing. Thus all the
cliched (but legitimate, in my opinion) complaints about time wasted
"teaching to the test."

This might help...
http://www.ed.gov/nclb/accountabilit...orresults.html

Ned Simmons

In article ,
says...
God forbid that the problem might be us because someone
else isn't doing our job of setting standards for and motivating our
kids. Geez, if they learn critical thinking and logic, they might
even disagree with us!


There's nothing that pleases me more than when one of my kids is able to
get what they want by means of a sound argument, even if it means I need
to reverse a decision I've made.

Ned Simmons

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 13:28:28 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:

60% have never read even one book.
Only about 6% read a book a year.
63% think man & the dinosaurs were living together.
70% believe in the existence of angels.
40% of American adults did not know that Germany was our enemy in
World War II.
50% of seventeen year olds could not express 9/100 as a percentage.
53% said the earth revolves around the sun in either a day or a month.
21% believed the sun revolved around the earth (don't ask them to
add 21 & 53).
91% were unable to state what a molecule was.
12% of Amercians, asked who the wife of the biblical Noah was, said
"Joan of Arc".
Motorola Corporation reported that 80 percent of all applicants screened
nationally failed a test of seventh-grade English and fifth-grade math.
56% said electrons were larger than atoms.
Almost half the population reads at a fifth-grade level or less.
42% of Americans can,t locate Japan on a world map.

Of the 158 countries in the United Nations, the United States ranks
forty-ninth in literacy.

The republican answer?
Tax cuts for the already wealthy, cuts in education.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs...19new_prod.asp

Educators can only offer education and try to motivate. Parents,
regardless of political affiliation, aid and abet their children's
attempts to "get a break" by reduced standards for performance.

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal. Wasting school dollars on
crap like football uniforms, basketball jerseys, and similar is equally
criminal. Kids are in school to LEARN, not to play sports. ONce they've
actually learned enough to be functional adults, *THEN* they can play
sports. Until then, nail their asses to the seat and teach 'em until it
sinks in, whether they enjoy it or not. It isn't about enjoyment, it's
about learning.

There have been effective
leaders from both parties in the past, and damned few if any from
either party in recent years.

Agreed, on both scores.

Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is, indeed, a
big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of the problem
being addressed?

Yes, because without a proposed agenda for improvement or change
(other than put a different party in power) it accomplishes nothing
but blame assignment. It uses inflammatory rhetoric to advance an
unstated but obvioius political agenda, rather than accomplish or
even address any resolution of the problem or situation cited.

If/when a different party is in office, the yowling and bleating
continues though from different sources. If ya really want to fix
the problem, then address the goddamned problem with proposed
solutions. God forbid that the problem might be us because someone
else isn't doing our job of setting standards for and motivating our
kids. Geez, if they learn critical thinking and logic, they might
even disagree with us!

Point 1: I'm childfree, and unless I have a *MASSIVE* change in attitude
on that topic - about as likely as seeing pigs on the wing - will remain
so.

Point 2: You do raise a valid point: Namely, the lack of anything that
even remotely resembles parenting by the vast majority of "parents" in
this country.

Point 3: Quite bluntly, I don't give a damn who the party in power is -
They all suck pretty much equally. So don't "put an agenda in my mouth",
please... The only one I've got is keeping the current "powers that be",
regardless of what name they're operating under this week/month/year,
*OUT* of my life to the greatest extent possible. Which brings us to the
fact that if anything, I'd be counted as a libertarian, if not an
outright anarchist. (in the pure "little or no government" sense, not
the "blow things up for amusement" sense)

Borrowing from the wiccans, "'An it harm none, do as thou will' shall be
the whole of the law" sums up my outlook quite nicely.

--
Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd for more info

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 14:42:03 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 13:28:28 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:

60% have never read even one book.
Only about 6% read a book a year.
63% think man & the dinosaurs were living together.
70% believe in the existence of angels.
40% of American adults did not know that Germany was our enemy in
World War II.
50% of seventeen year olds could not express 9/100 as a percentage.
53% said the earth revolves around the sun in either a day or a month.
21% believed the sun revolved around the earth (don't ask them to
add 21 & 53).
91% were unable to state what a molecule was.
12% of Amercians, asked who the wife of the biblical Noah was, said
"Joan of Arc".
Motorola Corporation reported that 80 percent of all applicants screened
nationally failed a test of seventh-grade English and fifth-grade math.
56% said electrons were larger than atoms.
Almost half the population reads at a fifth-grade level or less.
42% of Americans can,t locate Japan on a world map.

Of the 158 countries in the United Nations, the United States ranks
forty-ninth in literacy.

The republican answer?
Tax cuts for the already wealthy, cuts in education.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs...19new_prod.asp

Educators can only offer education and try to motivate. Parents,
regardless of political affiliation, aid and abet their children's
attempts to "get a break" by reduced standards for performance.

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal. Wasting school dollars on
crap like football uniforms, basketball jerseys, and similar is equally
criminal. Kids are in school to LEARN, not to play sports. ONce they've
actually learned enough to be functional adults, *THEN* they can play
sports. Until then, nail their asses to the seat and teach 'em until it
sinks in, whether they enjoy it or not. It isn't about enjoyment, it's
about learning.

There have been effective
leaders from both parties in the past, and damned few if any from
either party in recent years.

Agreed, on both scores.

Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is, indeed, a
big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of the problem
being addressed?

Yes, because without a proposed agenda for improvement or change
(other than put a different party in power) it accomplishes nothing
but blame assignment. It uses inflammatory rhetoric to advance an
unstated but obvioius political agenda, rather than accomplish or
even address any resolution of the problem or situation cited.

If/when a different party is in office, the yowling and bleating
continues though from different sources. If ya really want to fix
the problem, then address the goddamned problem with proposed
solutions. God forbid that the problem might be us because someone
else isn't doing our job of setting standards for and motivating our
kids. Geez, if they learn critical thinking and logic, they might
even disagree with us!

Point 1: I'm childfree, and unless I have a *MASSIVE* change in attitude
on that topic - about as likely as seeing pigs on the wing - will remain
so.

Point 2: You do raise a valid point: Namely, the lack of anything that
even remotely resembles parenting by the vast majority of "parents" in
this country.

Point 3: Quite bluntly, I don't give a damn who the party in power is -
They all suck pretty much equally. So don't "put an agenda in my mouth",
please...

I certainly did not intend to, Don. I think we all know who has the agenda.

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 13:28:28 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal.


Blink blink..Ah..Don? " No child left behind" was instituted to remedy
pass alongs. Standardized testing and so forth.


http://www.ed.gov/nclb/landing.jhtml

Now for a glimps of what the Leftists themselves think about having
their feet held to the fire and being forced to actually Teach....

http://nochildleft.com/

I suggest not eating before reading.....

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Sun, 2 Apr 2006 16:56:18 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:

"Don Bruder" wrote in message
.. .

The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal.

You may want to find out what the NCLB act is about before getting excited,
Don. Basically, it's the exact opposite of what you're suggesting.

It's 814 federal requirements for schools to receive federal tax money.
Think of it as a Procrustean bed: every child, everywhere in America, is
required to pass the same tests in math and English at a high level of
proficiency. If they don't, the school (or the district, I forget which)
loses some federal funding.

"Social metriculation" is not part of the picture. Forcing teachers to
"teach to the test" is the picture.

Essentially, as most experienced educators will tell you, it's a bunch of
empty rhetoric compiled by conservative theorists and shoved down the
throats of school districts -- which is ironic, because these are the same
people who are so opposed to more federal intrusion into areas that are
traditionally state prerogatives. It's also one of Dubya's primary hobby
horses.


Ayup..ol Ed is in favor of pass alongs and children graduationg who
cant read their diplomas, balance a checkbook or read the back of a
cereal box..and immediately get knocked up, go on welfare and provide
even more jobs for beaurocrats.

Leftists are like that.
As I recall..isnt his wife a teacher???
Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Sun, 2 Apr 2006 17:16:09 -0400, Ned Simmons
wrote:

In article ,
says...
In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:



The answer is not political nor does it lie in politics; it lies in
leadership and responsible parenting.

Amen to that... The whole "no child left behind" bull**** is just that:
bull****. Passing little Johnny despite the fact tha he can't read so
that he doesn't get "left behind" is criminal.

While I don't disagree with your opinion of NCLB, it seems your opinion
is based on a misunderstanding of the act. NCLB requires that objective
standards be met by schools, to be measured by testing. Thus all the
cliched (but legitimate, in my opinion) complaints about time wasted
"teaching to the test."

This might help...
http://www.ed.gov/nclb/accountabilit...orresults.html

Ned Simmons


as opposed to the alternative before NCLB? Utter morons being turned
out upon graduating.

Im fascinated by the scores that are showing up where NCLB is active.

Like the High school Senior..with a 3.8 GPA..who couldnot pass the
standardized testing for graduation..in either math, english or
history. Not even after his third attempt. The tests btw..for
graduation? Are set up to be at a 10th grade level

So how the **** did he get a 3.8 GPA?
Pass alongs, dumbing down educational standards and buffoonery on the
part of not only the teachers..but their administrators.

Im really glad that even if they Teach to the Test..they are finally
teaching something.

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 14:34:24 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
"John R. Carroll" wrote:

Don Bruder wrote:
In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:
Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is,
indeed, a big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of
the problem being addressed?

Don,
There isn't a political party on the planet that can influence a child, for
better or worse, the way a parent can.
Blaming schools for poor product is a parental cop out.

To a point, true. However, when the party, whoever it happens to be,
cuts funding in such a way that teaching the child *CAN'T* be done due
to lack of insert one or more of a regular laundry list of items that
are, if not absolutely essential for teaching, at least make the task
much easier, that does count as a pretty significant negative influence
- At least by my standards...

When was the last time any administration CUT any funding for
education?

Never

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

"Don Foreman" wrote:

... If ya really want to fix the problem,
then address the goddamned problem
with proposed solutions.


Here's a proposed solution: pay for performance. No, not the teachers.
The students.

Imagine a nation-wide chain of quiz parlors, something like pinball arcades
of old. Kids can come in and take quizzes, for money prizes. No pass-fail
criteria, just so many dollars for each correct answer.

Who would fund such a project? Well, maybe some quirky philanthropist who
might otherwise have spent his money setting up a college scholarship fund.
After all, if you give kids the chance to _earn_ money for college, one
correct answer at a time, isn't that even better than promising them a
scholarship in a lump sum sometime in the distant future?

Just think of the implications: in schools all across America (but
especially in the poorer neighborhoods) geeks and nerds would suddenly be
the cool kids in class, because even children are impressed by money. The
jocks and clowns would have a hard time holding on to the girls. The whole
pecking order of high-school would be overthrown. It would be a revolution,
I tells ya :-)

-- TP

On Mon, 03 Apr 2006 02:39:27 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 14:34:24 -0700, Don Bruder
wrote:

In article ,
"John R. Carroll" wrote:

Don Bruder wrote:
In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 05:37:25 -0400, Cliff wrote:
Citing statistics indicating a problem and immediately blaming a
political party for the problem is an excellent example of
unwillingness to address a problem and deal with it effectively.

Even when, as in this case, the political party in questin is,
indeed, a big chunk of (No, not the root cause, just a big chunk) of
the problem being addressed?

Don,
There isn't a political party on the planet that can influence a child, for
better or worse, the way a parent can.
Blaming schools for poor product is a parental cop out.

To a point, true. However, when the party, whoever it happens to be,
cuts funding in such a way that teaching the child *CAN'T* be done due
to lack of insert one or more of a regular laundry list of items that
are, if not absolutely essential for teaching, at least make the task
much easier, that does count as a pretty significant negative influence
- At least by my standards...

When was the last time any administration CUT any funding for
education?

Never

Gunner

Does a school board count as an administration?

http://www.abcnewspapers.com/2002/bl.../28budget.html

I think these folks do a heroically good job with what they have to
work with. The deficits spoken of weren't due to mismanagement, but
due to State cuts that couldn't be adjusted to instantly.

My several kids got decent educations in District 16 schools. Not
"preppy", but they were all able to continue their educations post
highschool as far as they wanted to, to levels varying from
business school (as in office worker) to PhD.

It is not an "upscale" area by any means. The typical residence in
district 16 is a 3-bedroom rambler 30 to 50 years old.
There are two (pretty nice) trailer parks, no palaces. Just regular
folks having a rather diverse range of occupations: hourly workers,
skilled trades, engineers, small businessmen, teachers of course,
health care workers, a first chair in the Mn Orchestra, and so on.

The people of this district don't do any yowling and soapbox squalling
of labels like "neocon", "liberal", yada yada. They express
themselves quietly but effectively at the ballotbox.

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 2 Apr 2006 16:56:18 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:

Essentially, as most experienced educators will tell you, it's a bunch of
empty rhetoric compiled by conservative theorists and shoved down the
throats of school districts -- which is ironic, because these are the
same
people who are so opposed to more federal intrusion into areas that are
traditionally state prerogatives. It's also one of Dubya's primary hobby
horses.


Ayup..ol Ed is in favor of pass alongs and children graduationg who
cant read their diplomas, balance a checkbook or read the back of a
cereal box..and immediately get knocked up, go on welfare and provide
even more jobs for beaurocrats.

When you get serious about education, Gunner, look up "false dichotomy."
Your entire philosophy is based upon it. g

And when did you start supporting the federalizing of education? Have you
decided that conservatism isn't such a good idea after all?

--
Ed Huntress

On Mon, 3 Apr 2006 07:21:43 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:

"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 2 Apr 2006 16:56:18 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:

Essentially, as most experienced educators will tell you, it's a bunch of
empty rhetoric compiled by conservative theorists and shoved down the
throats of school districts -- which is ironic, because these are the
same
people who are so opposed to more federal intrusion into areas that are
traditionally state prerogatives. It's also one of Dubya's primary hobby
horses.


Ayup..ol Ed is in favor of pass alongs and children graduationg who
cant read their diplomas, balance a checkbook or read the back of a
cereal box..and immediately get knocked up, go on welfare and provide
even more jobs for beaurocrats.

When you get serious about education, Gunner, look up "false dichotomy."
Your entire philosophy is based upon it. g

Your opinion is noted.

And when did you start supporting the federalizing of education? Have you
decided that conservatism isn't such a good idea after all?

I dont support it. Its a states issue. But as long as the Feebs have
control over it..Id damned sure like to see our tax dollars spent
wisely and not have to spend even more tax dollars when the ignorant
warm bodies some schools turn out go on welfare or into the prison
system

Look up ragmatic" in your funk and wagnells

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3