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Chainsaw chain sharpening
Hello all.
After reading the numerous posts as to the best chainsaw to have, I was wondering. This being a metalworking group, where many are machinists, welders etc. who, for the most part, seem fairly self sufficient, why is it that no-one seems to want to suggest that the OP sharpen his/her own chain(s) manually? If a person uses a saw for any amount of time at all it *will* need to be sharpened. I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. Chain sharpening is the least labor intensive part of sawing IMO and can save you lots of time,gas,and money. A few pointers I might add: Always tighten your chain, if needed, before sharpening and use the proper sized round file. Secure the saw by the bar in a vice if possible, so that the chain turns freely and mark the chain so you can tell when you have filed all the links. File all the links on one side of the bar then turn the saw around and do the other side. Always use the same number of strokes on both sides of the chain, at the proper angle and depth in each tooth, if you don't, your saw will eventually try to cut a circle, as one side of the chain has more "meat" than the other. IIRC the correct angle is around 35º for most chains. Don't force the file, it will take off quite a bit of metal if it's a good file, if it ain't get a new one. Hope this short spurt helps someone out there. granpaw "Cutting wood warms three times..cutting it...splitting it...and burning it." |
I agree. I just use the correct size file and touch up the chain every
two or three times I have to fill it. Dan |
Yep. I always touch it up before doing any big logs (to save time) and
before doing anything fussy like pruning. I use a file on the bigger saw, a stone mounted in the Dremel tool for the smaller saws. I check the depth of cut teeth every other sharpening. My newest saw has handy guide marks on each tooth to keep the angle from going astray. granpaw wrote: Hello all. After reading the numerous posts as to the best chainsaw to have, I was wondering. This being a metalworking group, where many are machinists, welders etc. who, for the most part, seem fairly self sufficient, why is it that no-one seems to want to suggest that the OP sharpen his/her own chain(s) manually? If a person uses a saw for any amount of time at all it *will* need to be sharpened. I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. Chain sharpening is the least labor intensive part of sawing IMO and can save you lots of time,gas,and money. A few pointers I might add: Always tighten your chain, if needed, before sharpening and use the proper sized round file. Secure the saw by the bar in a vice if possible, so that the chain turns freely and mark the chain so you can tell when you have filed all the links. File all the links on one side of the bar then turn the saw around and do the other side. Always use the same number of strokes on both sides of the chain, at the proper angle and depth in each tooth, if you don't, your saw will eventually try to cut a circle, as one side of the chain has more "meat" than the other. IIRC the correct angle is around 35º for most chains. Don't force the file, it will take off quite a bit of metal if it's a good file, if it ain't get a new one. Hope this short spurt helps someone out there. granpaw "Cutting wood warms three times..cutting it...splitting it...and burning it." |
I only costs 5-6 bucks per chain at the local mower shop here. Why
bother doing it yourself? JR Dweller in the cellar granpaw wrote: Hello all. After reading the numerous posts as to the best chainsaw to have, I was wondering. This being a metalworking group, where many are machinists, welders etc. who, for the most part, seem fairly self sufficient, why is it that no-one seems to want to suggest that the OP sharpen his/her own chain(s) manually? If a person uses a saw for any amount of time at all it *will* need to be sharpened. I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. Chain sharpening is the least labor intensive part of sawing IMO and can save you lots of time,gas,and money. A few pointers I might add: Always tighten your chain, if needed, before sharpening and use the proper sized round file. Secure the saw by the bar in a vice if possible, so that the chain turns freely and mark the chain so you can tell when you have filed all the links. File all the links on one side of the bar then turn the saw around and do the other side. Always use the same number of strokes on both sides of the chain, at the proper angle and depth in each tooth, if you don't, your saw will eventually try to cut a circle, as one side of the chain has more "meat" than the other. IIRC the correct angle is around 35º for most chains. Don't force the file, it will take off quite a bit of metal if it's a good file, if it ain't get a new one. Hope this short spurt helps someone out there. granpaw "Cutting wood warms three times..cutting it...splitting it...and burning it." -- -------------------------------------------------------------- Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses -------------------------------------------------------------- Dependence is Vulnerability: -------------------------------------------------------------- "Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal" "I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.." |
JR North wrote: I only costs 5-6 bucks per chain at the local mower shop here. Why bother doing it yourself? JR Dweller in the cellar snip *If* you have a local shop, *and* you're not in the boonies when you need it/them sharpened, *and* you can afford to take it in every time you hit dirt, a rock, a nail, etc. then that might possibly be a viable option. OTOH: Using that rationale, why bother with doing/learning if you can have someone else do it for you. |
In the woods, I'd rather file the chain than swap to a sharp one
because the saw is likely to leak bar oil badly if a chip gets caught under the bar near the oil hole. There is a paintbrush in the toolbox to clean around the gas and oil caps before refilling but it doesn't work well if soaked with sticky bar oil. I am NOT about to clean a hot saw with gasoline while standing in dry leaves next to my tractor. Besides, touching up the chain gives the saw time to cool a little before refueling. At home I'll swap chains after blowing out the sprocket area with compressed air. jw |
I run with a bunch of woodturners, who use chainsaws a LOT. We have found
the electric chainsaw sharpener sold at Harbor Freight for around $60 on sale, (Nick the Grinder) is a wonderful tool. Common practice is to carry one or more spare chains when you go to the boonies, and do the sharpening at home. |
"granpaw" wrote in message ... JR North wrote: I only costs 5-6 bucks per chain at the local mower shop here. Why bother doing it yourself? JR Dweller in the cellar snip *If* you have a local shop, *and* you're not in the boonies when you need it/them sharpened, *and* you can afford to take it in every time you hit dirt, a rock, a nail, etc. then that might possibly be a viable option. OTOH: Using that rationale, why bother with doing/learning if you can have someone else do it for you. Shucks. Why own a chainsaw at all? Just hire someone to cut the wood, too. Heck, you might break a nail. ;-) Steve |
Point well taken. I actually learn/do everything I can, and
implement/integrate that knowledge. Saw chains just don't happen to drop neatly into that. JR Dweller in the cellar granpaw wrote: Using that rationale, why bother with doing/learning if you can have someone else do it for you. -- -------------------------------------------------------------- Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses -------------------------------------------------------------- Dependence is Vulnerability: -------------------------------------------------------------- "Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal" "I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.." |
"SteveB" wrote: (clip) Just hire someone to cut the wood, too. (clip) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Ha Ha. I once suggested to my boss that he could pay someone else to play solitaire for him, but he didn't see the humor in it. Maybe that's why I don't work there any more. |
I think it is easier to touch up the chain than to remove and replace
the chain. The first time or two you may screw up, but after a little while it is pretty quick and easy. Two or three strokes with the file per cutter. I do have another chain. I just have never used it. If you want to see the tree I cut down and the progress I have made toward splitting it, go to http://photos.yahoo.com/dlcaster57 click on the thumbnail photo to see the rest of the pictures. I have just been splitting a couple of rounds per day. Dan |
JR North wrote:
Point well taken. I actually learn/do everything I can, and implement/integrate that knowledge. Saw chains just don't happen to drop neatly into that. I'm just an amateur, but have cut and split (hydraulic) maybe 30 cords over the years, and learned a bit about how the saw and chains behave in that time. So it is around $20 for a new chain, $6 for machine sharpening at a shop, and $0 to hand-sharpen with a file. If you use the grinder every time, you might get only a few machine sharpenings before the teeth are used up. Of course it depends on the situation. Did you hit a rock, or just wear down the edges evenly. Either way, if you cut a lot of wood, you'll come out ahead by learning to sharpen with a file. I tried a file jig, and tried sharpening on the saw, and didn't like either way. I do take the chain off, and lay it in a bench vise with jaws open just wide enough to hold the drive teeth rigidly. Filing by hand, the chains I use (Stihl and Oregon) have angle marks, that are good enough to get the angle right. Sometimes there is a hard edge on teeth and it takes an extra oophm or a first cut at a different angle to get through the hard surface, after which the teeth cut more easily. So it is a good thing to be able to move the file at any angle, not constrained by a guide. Took a few tries but now it feels natural. Now, when a chain looks half used up, I'll take it in for a machine sharpening to get everything even again, and then use it up the rest of the way by hand. I also learned it's worth to be really careful about what you're cutting through, and cutting on, planning cuts to avoid dirt and rocks wherever they may be. |
Fir. And it does split easily except for the bits with a limb. I
usually have to use a wedge or two to split a round in two. Then I can often split a wedge off with a single blow of a splitting maul. Unfortunately a wedge is too big to get thru the wood stove door and a limb makes it near impossible to split the tip off the wedge. I weigh less than 160 lbs so a 8 lb wedge is about as much as I can use effectively. Dan granpaw wrote: Dan, is that a pine? sure looks like it splits easy! |
HOLY CRAP!
Does everyone realize that we are talking on topic almost nearly as much as the blogs and ranters are talking about off topic items? Does a heart good. Information and knowledge vs. politics, misinformation, rumor, and bias. Which one to choose. Wait, wait. I know the answer to this.................... Steve |
I've seen those sharpeners and am curious.
How do you use them? Do you have to mount the chain for each cutting bit then move something, or ...? How automatic or manual is it? Thanks, Wayne D. On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 16:50:21 GMT, Leo Lichtman wrote: I run with a bunch of woodturners, who use chainsaws a LOT. We have found the electric chainsaw sharpener sold at Harbor Freight for around $60 on sale, (Nick the Grinder) is a wonderful tool. Common practice is to carry one or more spare chains when you go to the boonies, and do the sharpening at home. |
....Unfortunately a wedge is too big to get thru the wood stove door and
a limb makes it near impossible to split the tip off the wedge.... -- Dan I cut up those messy hard-to-split chunks with the chain saw. It cuts pretty well with the bar parallel to the trunk, like cutting a slab off the side or slicing a big log in half lengthwise. I saw big wet heavy sections in half sometimes rather than getting hurt lifting them into the trailer. The long chips jam in the sprocket area unless the bar is angled slightly up or down relative to the log, or the saw body is a few inches clear of the end of the log for the first pass down. jw |
I plan on doing something like that, but not right now.
Dan |
On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 14:14:25 -0700, "SteveB" wrote:
HOLY CRAP! Does everyone realize that we are talking on topic almost nearly as much as the blogs and ranters are talking about off topic items? Does a heart good. Information and knowledge vs. politics, misinformation, rumor, and bias. Which one to choose. Wait, wait. I know the answer to this.................... Steve Taking it little further. Has anybody had the joy of splitting Dutch Elm?. I swear that the grain is braided and bonded to itself with some kind of resin. Some varieties (Ontario) are incredibly tough to split even when notched with chainsaw. Taking it back to metal content, is there a good method for toughening up a splitting wedge when it starts to mushroom? Few months ago a steel chip broke of with such a ferocity the it sliced through my pants and imbedded itself in the side of my knee. I sustained some minor nerve damage and would not want to repeat the experience. I have a TIG/STICK welder. As far a sharpening goes I am back to file. I tried various rotary bits but as they wear, the diameter of bit changes and you do not get the proper cut. Regards, Boris Mohar Got Knock? - see: Viatrack Printed Circuit Designs (among other things) http://www.viatrack.ca void _-void-_ in the obvious place |
As good as a chain filer as you can be, its still impossible to get
all the teeth on the loop the same size as some will ber filed more than others due to damages etc..........So about all I do is use a file to keep them touched up, and file that chain probably no more than 3 times if it really needs a good sharpening, and not just a touch up.......After that it gets thrown in the pile and eventually carried to the saw shop where they use a machine grinder and once set it will make all the teeth uniform again (uniform that is in that it will grind away wifer or longer teeth and make them all the same as the smallest one since thats what the grinder is set on. I buy Woodsman brand chain by the rolls from Baileys, and its pretty cheap. Woodsman chain is actually Carlton Brand chain, which is of very good quality........I try to sytay away for the chain with all the anti kickback features on it as I want to cut wood, and have experieince, and what a difference between backyard saw chain and pro or commercial chain......The chrome edged or plated chain sucks big time and will wear a file out quicker, and is more of a pain to sharpen or touch up than good high quality carbon steel chain is.......Same with files, Pferd makes the best longest lasting files for chain sharpening..........Husky brand files are actually Pferd files.......Its important to hold the right angle, so the rake is proper, and the tooth does not get whats called a beak or hook on it from too much undercut, and its also important to keep the rakers filed to the correct limits below the top of the chains teeth. The amount is different for a lot of saws, but its genberally .025 to ..030" on most saws....Too much and the chain grabs and stalls more than it cuts, too little and your making to fine of chips and working harder than you should be to cut the same amount of wood with a properly adjusted raker on the chain. There certainoy is nothing wrong with sharpening a chain by hand, but do it wrong and the saw will not perform properly, and its possible to ruin a bar and chain with improper sharpening.......Get ahold of whats called a File-O-Plate made by carlton until you get used to what angle the cutters need to be filed to and also the rakers adjusted to. Much easier than a Oregon file guide...... On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 09:21:47 -0500, granpaw wrote: ===Hello all. ===After reading the numerous posts as to the best chainsaw to have, I was ===wondering. ===This being a metalworking group, where many are machinists, welders etc. ===who, for the most part, seem fairly self sufficient, why is it that ===no-one seems to want to suggest that the OP sharpen his/her own chain(s) ===manually? ===If a person uses a saw for any amount of time at all it *will* need to ===be sharpened. ===I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used ===them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is ===near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. === ===Chain sharpening is the least labor intensive part of sawing IMO and can ===save you lots of time,gas,and money. ===A few pointers I might add: ===Always tighten your chain, if needed, before sharpening and use the ===proper sized round file. ===Secure the saw by the bar in a vice if possible, so that the chain ===turns freely and mark the chain so you can tell when you have filed all ===the links. ===File all the links on one side of the bar then turn the saw around and ===do the other side. ===Always use the same number of strokes on both sides of the chain, at the === proper angle and depth in each tooth, if you don't, your saw will ===eventually try to cut a circle, as one side of the chain has more "meat" ===than the other. IIRC the correct angle is around 35º for most chains. ===Don't force the file, it will take off quite a bit of metal if it's a ===good file, if it ain't get a new one. === ===Hope this short spurt helps someone out there. ===granpaw ==="Cutting wood warms three times..cutting it...splitting it...and burning ===it." === === === === === === ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
Dunno what kind of saw or bar you run but I have swapped many a chain
in the field and there is no reason in the world it hsould leak bar oil if its doone properly. If a chip is in the oil port remove it. Chains and bars are swapped every day in the logging and pulpwood industry.......It doe snot pay to set down and sharpen a chain or do much other than a quick touch up of a couple of nicked teeth if your usuing your saw to earn money. Its cheaper and faster to have a couple of spare loops on hand to swap out when needed......Of ocurse most here is not out earing a extra buck and need to eliminate down time with sharpening, but having a spare chain is a good idea..... On 28 Sep 2005 09:41:46 -0700, wrote: ===In the woods, I'd rather file the chain than swap to a sharp one ===because the saw is likely to leak bar oil badly if a chip gets caught ===under the bar near the oil hole. There is a paintbrush in the toolbox ===to clean around the gas and oil caps before refilling but it doesn't ===work well if soaked with sticky bar oil. I am NOT about to clean a hot ===saw with gasoline while standing in dry leaves next to my tractor. ===Besides, touching up the chain gives the saw time to cool a little ===before refueling. === ===At home I'll swap chains after blowing out the sprocket area with ===compressed air. === ===jw ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
Exactly, save the filing for on the bench where its comfortable and
your not being rushed to finish up a job...... ..On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 16:50:21 GMT, "Leo Lichtman" wrote: ===I run with a bunch of woodturners, who use chainsaws a LOT. We have found ===the electric chainsaw sharpener sold at Harbor Freight for around $60 on ===sale, (Nick the Grinder) is a wonderful tool. Common practice is to carry ===one or more spare chains when you go to the boonies, and do the sharpening ===at home. === ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
Boris
The top of the wedge should be dressed the same as you dress your cold chisels, you do dress your chisels don't you? Anyway grind the mushroomed metal from the edges of the top and then bevel the top at ~30 to 45 degrees all around the top to side intersection. The flat on the bevel for a wedge should be about 1/4" wide. This will prevent splintering and knocking chunks off the wedge. lg no neat sig line "Boris Mohar" wrote in message ... Taking it back to metal content, is there a good method for toughening up a splitting wedge when it starts to mushroom? Few months ago a steel chip broke of with such a ferocity the it sliced through my pants and imbedded itself in the side of my knee. I sustained some minor nerve damage and would not want to repeat the experience. I have a TIG/STICK welder. As far a sharpening goes I am back to file. I tried various rotary bits but as they wear, the diameter of bit changes and you do not get the proper cut. Regards, Boris Mohar Got Knock? - see: Viatrack Printed Circuit Designs (among other things) http://www.viatrack.ca void _-void-_ in the obvious place |
Toolbert wrote:
JR North wrote: Point well taken. I actually learn/do everything I can, and implement/integrate that knowledge. Saw chains just don't happen to drop neatly into that. I'm just an amateur, but have cut and split (hydraulic) maybe 30 cords over the years, and learned a bit about how the saw and chains behave in that time. So it is around $20 for a new chain, $6 for machine sharpening at a shop, and $0 to hand-sharpen with a file. Your time to sharpen the chain is worth more than $0. If you don't do it frequently, you'll be a lot slower at it as well. Sharpening the occasional chain myself would likely take up $20 worth of my time and not produce as good a result as the $6 sharpening from my local shop. For the average person who does not use the saw on at least a weekly basis it's unlikely to be practical to sharpen the chains themselves. Pete C. If you use the grinder every time, you might get only a few machine sharpenings before the teeth are used up. Of course it depends on the situation. Did you hit a rock, or just wear down the edges evenly. Either way, if you cut a lot of wood, you'll come out ahead by learning to sharpen with a file. I tried a file jig, and tried sharpening on the saw, and didn't like either way. I do take the chain off, and lay it in a bench vise with jaws open just wide enough to hold the drive teeth rigidly. Filing by hand, the chains I use (Stihl and Oregon) have angle marks, that are good enough to get the angle right. Sometimes there is a hard edge on teeth and it takes an extra oophm or a first cut at a different angle to get through the hard surface, after which the teeth cut more easily. So it is a good thing to be able to move the file at any angle, not constrained by a guide. Took a few tries but now it feels natural. Now, when a chain looks half used up, I'll take it in for a machine sharpening to get everything even again, and then use it up the rest of the way by hand. I also learned it's worth to be really careful about what you're cutting through, and cutting on, planning cuts to avoid dirt and rocks wherever they may be. |
You are right, sharpening a chain does take some time. But not a lot
of time to touch it up. And it takes time to remove and replace the chain too plus driving to where ever one gets chains sharpened plus money for gas. For me the time to sharpen a chain is less than the time I would spend at the counter of the saw shop when picking up the sharpened chain. And it is kind of like grinding a lathe tool bit. I don't think one has to do it a lot to remember how. I will say I probably cut the life of the first chain I sharpened in half, so it cost me $10 to learn based on a $20 new chain ( and that does not count the time ). Dan |
"~Roy" wrote in message ... As good as a chain filer as you can be, its still impossible to get all the teeth on the loop the same size as some will ber filed more than others due to damages etc..........So about all I do is use a file to keep them touched up, and file that chain probably no more than 3 times if it really needs a good sharpening, and not just a touch up.......After that it gets thrown in the pile and eventually carried to the saw shop where they use a machine grinder and once set it will make all the teeth uniform again (uniform that is in that it will grind away wifer or longer teeth and make them all the same as the smallest one since thats what the grinder is set on. I buy Woodsman brand chain by the rolls from Baileys, and its pretty cheap. Woodsman chain is actually Carlton Brand chain, which is of very good quality........I try to sytay away for the chain with all the anti kickback features on it as I want to cut wood, and have experieince, and what a difference between backyard saw chain and pro or commercial chain......The chrome edged or plated chain sucks big time and will wear a file out quicker, and is more of a pain to sharpen or touch up than good high quality carbon steel chain is.......Same with files, Pferd makes the best longest lasting files for chain sharpening..........Husky brand files are actually Pferd files.......Its important to hold the right angle, so the rake is proper, and the tooth does not get whats called a beak or hook on it from too much undercut, and its also important to keep the rakers filed to the correct limits below the top of the chains teeth. The amount is different for a lot of saws, but its genberally .025 to .030" on most saws....Too much and the chain grabs and stalls more than it cuts, too little and your making to fine of chips and working harder than you should be to cut the same amount of wood with a properly adjusted raker on the chain. There certainoy is nothing wrong with sharpening a chain by hand, but do it wrong and the saw will not perform properly, and its possible to ruin a bar and chain with improper sharpening.......Get ahold of whats called a File-O-Plate made by carlton until you get used to what angle the cutters need to be filed to and also the rakers adjusted to. Much easier than a Oregon file guide...... On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 09:21:47 -0500, granpaw wrote: Sounds like the chains I run. Very aggressive and dangerous to run IF you don't know what your doing. I do all my own sharpening. I have three different methods. On a new chain that has low hours I'll use a hand file with a guide and touch up the teeth. For field use I also have a hand sharpener that can be set to cut the raker depth and set to cut the teeth back equally as well. It is an old Granberg file-n-joint unit that clamps to the bar and has a guide rail system with a lock that stops the teeth. http://www.right-tool.com/filenjoint.html Then I also have an old Belsaw wheel sharpener that I use to fix damaged chains. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
granpaw wrote:
Hello all. After reading the numerous posts as to the best chainsaw to have, I was wondering. This being a metalworking group, where many are machinists, welders etc. who, for the most part, seem fairly self sufficient, why is it that no-one seems to want to suggest that the OP sharpen his/her own chain(s) manually? If a person uses a saw for any amount of time at all it *will* need to be sharpened. I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. Chain sharpening is the least labor intensive part of sawing IMO and can save you lots of time,gas,and money. A few pointers I might add: Always tighten your chain, if needed, before sharpening and use the proper sized round file. Secure the saw by the bar in a vice if possible, so that the chain turns freely and mark the chain so you can tell when you have filed all the links. File all the links on one side of the bar then turn the saw around and do the other side. Always use the same number of strokes on both sides of the chain, at the proper angle and depth in each tooth, if you don't, your saw will eventually try to cut a circle, as one side of the chain has more "meat" than the other. IIRC the correct angle is around 35º for most chains. Don't force the file, it will take off quite a bit of metal if it's a good file, if it ain't get a new one. Hope this short spurt helps someone out there. granpaw "Cutting wood warms three times..cutting it...splitting it...and burning it." I hand sharpen all my chains on the saw . I also own a commercial chain grinder . About the only time it ever gets used is when a competition guy asks me to do some chains for him . Lots of misconceptions to what is the right angle . For competition saws we ran lots of tests . Simply put the difference between the angles was not significant . It is not really the angle that determines how fast a saw cuts . Brand new chains are not as close tolerance as people might think . Every tooth might be the exact same size but they end up at slightly different heights once assembled . One high tooth makes the bar jump a small amount and the next few teeth get a free ride so to speak . Rakers or depth gages determine how much each tooth can cut . To high means your saw is not working at maximum efficiency , too low and it increases kickbacks . Lots of west coast fallers take them off completely but their saws have more then enough horsepower to get away with this . On smaller saws it will bog them down . With the added risk of eating a spinning chain it is not a risk worth taking . For the average person it is enough to get the teeth as close to the same angle and same length when hand filing . Keeping too pronounced a hook from developing . As the tooth gets filed back it gets shorter . One size smaller file should then be used to prevent sloping the tooth back . The real key is the tips of the teeth should be needle sharp when done . If you look at the end of a tip and see a tiny shiny spot give it another stroke . That shiny spot is a flat on the tip . Some people file one side then turn the saw to file the other . This is fine , in fact it's the way I do it . Some people have the knack of filing one side right handed and the opposite side left handed . I can't but works well for lots of people . Just try get both sides roughly the same length . No need to get it all at one sharpening .. If it is off by much just add a few extra strokes to the long side each time you file until you get it close again . Very often a saw that is cutting crooked it blamed on the chain . Yep some times it is but very often it is the bar . Bars should be serviced every 25 hours . Taken off the saw and a flat file run along the long edges to remove groove the chain naturally produces . Then the file laid flat on the bar and the burr removed. watch out these can be razor sharp . The groove should then be cleaned out , going from tip to base so as not to push the sludge into the roller tip . The oil holes cleaned out . Then the bar reinstalled upside down , unless it is some kind of specialty bar they sell for anti whatever is popular this week . Bars should be rolled regularly to get maximum lifespan out of them . When I was younger I did dangerous snag falling and falling on wild fires . Then I carried an extra bar and chain . Now I only carry falling wedges . I am not sure how many people get pinched in trees but pretty much never happens to me so I avoid packing the added weight . Ken Cutt |
In article ,
"Pete C." wrote: Your time to sharpen the chain is worth more than $0. If you don't do it frequently, you'll be a lot slower at it as well. Sharpening the occasional chain myself would likely take up $20 worth of my time and not produce as good a result as the $6 sharpening from my local shop. The last time I took a chain in for 'professional' sharpening, they ground half the teeth off and left it completely dull, far worse than when I brought it in. I threw that chain away and bought another, and have been sharpening my chains ever since with a diamond electric sharpener and am happy with it. -- Free men own guns, slaves don't www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/ |
I'll grab all those knurly pieces especially on an oak the butress roots, and crotch sections that most folks let lay as they are hard to split. They brun great and last a lot onger than straight split pieces do........Harder to stack and also to place in stove, but the results IMHO are worth the hassles... On 28 Sep 2005 15:03:44 -0700, wrote: ===...Unfortunately a wedge is too big to get thru the wood stove door and ===a ===limb makes it near impossible to split the tip off the wedge.... === -- ===Dan === ===I cut up those messy hard-to-split chunks with the chain saw. It cuts ===pretty well with the bar parallel to the trunk, like cutting a slab off ===the side or slicing a big log in half lengthwise. I saw big wet heavy ===sections in half sometimes rather than getting hurt lifting them into ===the trailer. === ===The long chips jam in the sprocket area unless the bar is angled ===slightly up or down relative to the log, or the saw body is a few ===inches clear of the end of the log for the first pass down. === ===jw ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
~Roy wrote:
I'll grab all those knurly pieces especially on an oak the butress roots, and crotch sections that most folks let lay as they are hard to split. They brun great and last a lot onger than straight split pieces do........Harder to stack and also to place in stove, but the results IMHO are worth the hassles... Unless I find them first! michael |
In article ,
granpaw wrote: I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. Clearly, opinions differ. Grinding setups may differ - sounds like you have used something with no jig or stop mechanism. With a proper chain grinding setup, it's quite trivial (in my experience) to do all the teeth essentially the same, and that is why I have that done after several cycles of filing, or hitting something that makes filing a major chore. My chains develop a "handedness" drift over time (it's difficult to file each tooth the same when half of them point the other direction - the left and right hands do not file the same, nor does the right hand when asked to go backwards - same strokes and trying to use the same pressure notwithstanding). A jigged grind job clears this right up, which means it's more consistent than I can manage with a file. -- Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by |
In article ,
Wayne wrote: I've seen those sharpeners and am curious. How do you use them? It's a Chinese knockoff of the Oregon (which is either made in Italy, or made in China and stamped made in Italy...). You set the chain in the vise, looking for the worst/shortest tooth, setting vise to angle for that side. You move the setting jig up until that tooth gets fully ground, clamping with each grind cycle. Then you leave the setting jig in place and unclamp, move, clamp, grind, repeat. All manual, gets faster the more you do it. Swing the angle for the other side, do the other side. Swap grinding wheels, swing angle to 0, file one raker with the usual raker guide, use that raker to set the grinder wheel used for rakers, grind all the other rakers. -- Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by |
Ecnerwal wrote: snip My chains develop a "handedness" drift over time (it's difficult to file each tooth the same when half of them point the other direction - the left and right hands do not file the same, nor does the right hand when asked to go backwards - same strokes and trying to use the same pressure notwithstanding). A jigged grind job clears this right up, which means it's more consistent than I can manage with a file. In my case I file from the side of the bar with the handle of the saw towards me, my chain(s) has 15 cutters on a side so when I have done 15 teeth on one side I change sides and do the other 15 teeth...the same number of strokes. Having done that, I still at times need to take a lot off due to hitting a rock etc. and it is better to hold it by the bar in a vice, I even have a removable vice I mount on the truck for times like that. But when I'm with the skidder say 40 acres back in the woods it is nice to have an extra loop along too. On a related subject: I'm getting old and a little worn out from traipsin through the brush so I don't wear chaps, head gear, and definately no ear protection. I need to hear the cracking sound things make when they fall unexpected or someone trying to get my attention, and chaps for me just make it harder to get around, and unsafe. But that's just me....;0) granpaw |
so I don't wear chaps, head gear, and definately no ear protection. I
need to hear the cracking sound things make when they fall unexpected or I am surprised that you have any hearing left. I can't stand to be around a chain saw at all without hearing protection. I did it as a kid but not now. |
On 29 Sep 2005 20:32:28 GMT, Chuck Sherwood wrote:
so I don't wear chaps, head gear, and definately no ear protection. I need to hear the cracking sound things make when they fall unexpected or I am surprised that you have any hearing left. I can't stand to be around a chain saw at all without hearing protection. I did it as a kid but not now. I have a Stihl helmet with the built in face screen and earmuffs. I find myself much more comfortable cutting, and less distracted, when the chips aren't flying in my face. Far as I'm concerned, it's as much a safety feature for keeping stuff out of my eyes, as it is a safety feature for keeping me from flinching or being distracted by a chunk of whatever hitting my face. Daev Hinz |
"Dave Hinz" wrote in message ... On 29 Sep 2005 20:32:28 GMT, Chuck Sherwood wrote: so I don't wear chaps, head gear, and definately no ear protection. I need to hear the cracking sound things make when they fall unexpected or I am surprised that you have any hearing left. I can't stand to be around a chain saw at all without hearing protection. I did it as a kid but not now. I have a Stihl helmet with the built in face screen and earmuffs. I find myself much more comfortable cutting, and less distracted, when the chips aren't flying in my face. Far as I'm concerned, it's as much a safety feature for keeping stuff out of my eyes, as it is a safety feature for keeping me from flinching or being distracted by a chunk of whatever hitting my face. Daev Hinz Absolutely. I do a lot of grinding in my welding work. If I have a face protector on, I don't squint. I don't flinch. I can concentrate more on the exact point I am working on. As an aside, I have gone to the doctor two times to have metal slivers removed from my eyes. Both times, I had safety glasses on, but no face shield. Then, another time, I was walking in to work, and a blast of wind on the back dock sent something into my eye that had to be removed by the doctor. Protect your eyes and ears, kids. I wear hearing aids now because of exposure to industrial noise and rock and roll bands. They are great, but it would be nice to hear things just as they are supposed to sound. It happens gradually, and it happens to everyone. My chainsaw is rated at 112db. Ear protection is "suggested" over 85db. Steve Steve |
granpaw wrote:
Ecnerwal wrote: snip My chains develop a "handedness" drift over time (it's difficult to file each tooth the same when half of them point the other direction - the left and right hands do not file the same, nor does the right hand when asked to go backwards - same strokes and trying to use the same pressure notwithstanding). A jigged grind job clears this right up, which means it's more consistent than I can manage with a file. In my case I file from the side of the bar with the handle of the saw towards me, my chain(s) has 15 cutters on a side so when I have done 15 teeth on one side I change sides and do the other 15 teeth...the same number of strokes. Having done that, I still at times need to take a lot off due to hitting a rock etc. and it is better to hold it by the bar in a vice, I even have a removable vice I mount on the truck for times like that. But when I'm with the skidder say 40 acres back in the woods it is nice to have an extra loop along too. Unless you have a need for an ultra perfect chain (competition bucking?) there is no need to file everything down to meet the 'worst tooth'. Pick an average and determine how many strokes of the file it takes to get that one sharp. Give all the others the same number of strokes. Go cut wood. Ken. |
On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:53:27 -0700, Ken Davey wrote:
Unless you have a need for an ultra perfect chain (competition bucking?) there is no need to file everything down to meet the 'worst tooth'. Pick an average and determine how many strokes of the file it takes to get that one sharp. Give all the others the same number of strokes. Go cut wood. Where's the "cut in a semicircle because you didn't keep the angle consistant between the left and right teeth" step? |
The grinders that are used in sharpening shops are fine, but those held in a dremel tool suck big time, as when the diameter of that small round stone wears the cutters do not get ground properly.........not the case with theones that are used for commercial sharpening though as the wheel is sort of cocked on an angle and a wheel of a specified width is used, it just gets smaller in diameter not width, like the little round stones do. On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:30:21 GMT, Ecnerwal wrote: ===In article , === granpaw wrote: === === I do not advocate the use of electric sharpening stones, I have used === them and found them IMHO to do more harm to a chain than good, as it is === near impossible to reliably do each tooth exactly the same. === ===Clearly, opinions differ. Grinding setups may differ - sounds like you ===have used something with no jig or stop mechanism. With a proper chain ===grinding setup, it's quite trivial (in my experience) to do all the ===teeth essentially the same, and that is why I have that done after ===several cycles of filing, or hitting something that makes filing a major ===chore. My chains develop a "handedness" drift over time (it's difficult ===to file each tooth the same when half of them point the other direction ===- the left and right hands do not file the same, nor does the right hand ===when asked to go backwards - same strokes and trying to use the same ===pressure notwithstanding). A jigged grind job clears this right up, ===which means it's more consistent than I can manage with a file. ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
Huh, whats that you say...........I used to be like that, but now even
though I have a 60% hearing loss I wear a hard hat, with mesh face protectin flip up shield, and hearing protectors. Its all one unit and is quite confortable. Thje only time I do not use them is if I am felling a tree, but will wear it up until the point I make the finala cut, then the muffs get moved out of the way, but face shield and cap is still worn..I do not use chaps unless I am in brush cutting. Out in the open I go chapless........and they are a real pain to wear if up in a tree.... On 29 Sep 2005 20:32:28 GMT, (Chuck Sherwood) wrote: ===so I don't wear chaps, head gear, and definately no ear protection. I ===need to hear the cracking sound things make when they fall unexpected or === ===I am surprised that you have any hearing left. I can't stand to be ===around a chain saw at all without hearing protection. I did it as ===a kid but not now. ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
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