| Page 1 of 2 | 1 | 2 |
|
|
What do I look for in a high efficiency toilet??
I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple
flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo |
|
Consumer Reports tested about 100 of them, I have a pressure version it
works good but is super noisy, the neighbors can hear it to. |
We replaced two of our toilets by American Standard "Champion" models
(approx. $250 at Lowe's or HD). They flush well, except that I guess they don't swirl the water as well as a larger-volume toilet. The result is that traces -- but only traces -- of really sticky "stuff" sometimes remain on the sides of the bowl; they usually dissolve in the standing water after a short time. AFAIK, the difference between the cheaper ones and the more expensive ones is that the more expensive have larger waterways, both from the tank to the bowl and from the bowl to the drain. BTW, I've seen some at Lowe's that are way more than $300, but I think you're paying for fancy styling then. MB On 08/26/04 08:27 am Al Kondo put fingers to keyboard and launched the following message into cyberspace: I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? |
Also look for a glazed trap - Its smoother internally and less likely to
clog. Kohler Wentworth is what I replace three toilets with. It works great and didn't break the bank (About $100 if I remember correctly) "Al Kondo" wrote in message ... I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo |
Al Kondo wrote:
I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. Frankly, I'd hold onto the old one if I could repair it economically. In this case, newer isn't necessarily better. -- Mortimer Schnerd, RN http://www.mortimerschnerd.com |
Go to www.consumerreports.com and pay the 7 or 8 bucks for a month of
membership. That allows you to read and print their product tests. For toilets, they made artificial turds out of sponges and whatever else, and actually flushed these things. Interesting and worthwhile report. "Al Kondo" wrote in message ... I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo |
Al Kondo wrote:
I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo i had to replace an older toilet as the kids broke the tank.... the new 1.6 gallon toilet does not save water as you have to flush it about 3 to 4 times to do the same job as the older toilets.. keep the old toilet as long as it is still working and can be used.... |
|
Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
Al Kondo wrote: I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. I don't get it. First, water is cheap, $3 per 1000 gallons. Second, there is no shortage of water in the world. Hydrocarbon combustion constantly adds more. Most of the water is in polar ice and the oceans. The Commonwealth of MA licenses each publically owned well for X many gallons of water per day. THAT'S what causes the shortage! |
"William W. Plummer" wrote in message
news:s%qXc.315054$a24.231117@attbi_s03... Second, there is no shortage of water in the world. Everywhere? No shortage ANYWHERE? Why do you suppose many municipalities put restrictions on water usage at certain times? Because there's enough? |
No. For us it was the old high-volume toilets we often had to flush more
than once (with a suitable interval between) because the crap clogged the trap the first time round. (But I suppose it's possible that there were good and not-so-good high-volume ones.) Have never had to flush our AS Champions more than once. MB On 08/26/04 03:06 pm put fingers to keyboard and launched the following message into cyberspace: i had to replace an older toilet as the kids broke the tank.... the new 1.6 gallon toilet does not save water as you have to flush it about 3 to 4 times to do the same job as the older toilets.. keep the old toilet as long as it is still working and can be used.... |
Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
snip I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. snip I agree. But many of the newer toilets actually work like they should. My last apartment had a toilet that has a styrofoam float attached to the flapper. Somehow, this made it so that when you flushed, the flapper would shut when only have the tank had drained. If you wanted more of a flush, you would hold down the handle for the whole flush (not refill) cycle. This kept the flapper from shutting so early. I think this is a great setup, depending on which number you do, you can decide on the water saving feature, or a full flush. The biggest problem I find with clogs is toilet paper. Some brands clog more than others. --Mike |
Al Kondo writes:
What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. You look for a Kohler Wellworth. End of story. |
"Al Kondo" wrote in message ... What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. I'd looked for one that would wipe your *ss when you are done. Now THAT'S efficiency!!! |
On 26-Aug-2004, "William W. Plummer" wrote:
First, water is cheap, $3 per 1000 gallons. Where you live is the whole world? _You_ may think that water is cheap, but if you had to walk 5km each way to the nearest well every day, you'd think that water was pretty expensive. That's reality in some parts of the _real_ world. The Commonwealth of MA licenses each publically owned well for X many gallons of water per day. THAT'S what causes the shortage! What is the marginal cost of the next unit of clean water? If waste increases, you have to come up with _new_ sources and new infrastructure to process it. That is $$$ In parts of the US, there has been a permanent drawdown in the water table. Hence the push to control overuse. What you need to do is wake up and realize what's really happening with water in this world. Canada and Russia have lots of water; most of that is not where people live. Most other countries do not have lots water. Get over it. Mike |
"Michael Daly" wrote Where you live is the whole world? _You_ may think that water is cheap, but if you had to walk 5km each way to the nearest well every day, you'd think that water was pretty expensive. That's reality in some parts of the _real_ world. What is the marginal cost of the next unit of clean water? If waste increases, you have to come up with _new_ sources and new infrastructure to process it. That is $$$ What you need to do is wake up and realize what's really happening with water in this world. Canada and Russia have lots of water; most of that is not where people live. Most other countries do not have lots water. Get over it. There is PLENTY of fresh water! God makes it all the time. If there are people living in areas where there is no water, then you need to TELL THEM TO MOVE!!! I have all my faucets (including my outdoor ones!) running 24/7! I love to hear the gurgling noise it makes as it goes down the drain! Instead of worrying about a water shortage, why don't you just go hug a tree! But don't do it too hard!! You might squeeze some moisture out of it, and that would be wasting it, wouldn't it??? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh! |
Look for a glazed trap, and an oversized trap. I have a toto which
works very well, but is pricey. My son had to replace one of his and got an American Standard Cadet, which cost far less and appears to work just as well. I went with him to Lowe's to buy it, and noticed that the packaging and labels at the store don't give the information you need (size of trap, etc.), so you have to get that elsewhere. Al Kondo wrote: I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo -- SPAMBLOCK NOTICE! To reply to me, delete the h from apkh.net, if it is there. |
"Michael Daly" wrote
Where you live is the whole world? _You_ may think that water is cheap, but if you had to walk 5km each way to the nearest well every day, you'd think that water was pretty expensive. That's reality in some parts of the _real_ world. What is the marginal cost of the next unit of clean water? If waste increases, you have to come up with _new_ sources and new infrastructure to process it. That is $$$ What you need to do is wake up and realize what's really happening with water in this world. Canada and Russia have lots of water; most of that is not where people live. Most other countries do not have lots water. Get over it. There is PLENTY of fresh water! God makes it all the time. If there are people living in areas where there is no water, then you need to TELL THEM TO MOVE!!! I have all my faucets (including my outdoor ones!) running 24/7! I love to hear the gurgling noise it makes as it goes down the drain! Instead of worrying about a water shortage, why don't you just go hug a tree! But don't do it too hard!! You might squeeze some moisture out of it, and that would be wasting it, wouldn't it??? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh! Mike, you're right, and if people won't realize that the water situation is dire, then their children will. Tom Work at your leisure! |
Tom wrote:
"Michael Daly" wrote Where you live is the whole world? _You_ may think that water is cheap, but if you had to walk 5km each way to the nearest well every day, you'd think that water was pretty expensive. That's reality in some parts of the _real_ world. What is the marginal cost of the next unit of clean water? If waste increases, you have to come up with _new_ sources and new infrastructure to process it. That is $$$ What you need to do is wake up and realize what's really happening with water in this world. Canada and Russia have lots of water; most of that is not where people live. Most other countries do not have lots water. Get over it. There is PLENTY of fresh water! God makes it all the time. If there are people living in areas where there is no water, then you need to TELL THEM TO MOVE!!! I have all my faucets (including my outdoor ones!) running 24/7! I love to hear the gurgling noise it makes as it goes down the drain! Instead of worrying about a water shortage, why don't you just go hug a tree! But don't do it too hard!! You might squeeze some moisture out of it, and that would be wasting it, wouldn't it??? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh! Mike, you're right, and if people won't realize that the water situation is dire, then their children will. Tom Work at your leisure! Please note that using water in a toilet does NOT "waste" it (pun!). It is returned to nature where evaporation will separate it again, forming rain, ... In fact withholding water from the environment is how you create deserts! Use water. Enjoy life with out fear. |
Richard J Kinch wrote:
Al Kondo writes: What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. You look for a Kohler Wellworth. End of story. Agreed. I have two of them. They work well inspite of being only 1.2 gpf as required by the People Republic of Mass. |
Michael Daly wrote:
On 26-Aug-2004, "William W. Plummer" wrote: First, water is cheap, $3 per 1000 gallons. Where you live is the whole world? _You_ may think that water is cheap, but if you had to walk 5km each way to the nearest well every day, you'd think that water was pretty expensive. That's reality in some parts of the _real_ world. You say they have low volume toilets but walk 5km for water???? PIPES, dear friends, will move water from here to there. The Commonwealth of MA licenses each publically owned well for X many gallons of water per day. THAT'S what causes the shortage! What is the marginal cost of the next unit of clean water? If waste increases, you have to come up with _new_ sources and new infrastructure to process it. That is $$$ It's not so bad. CA has many solar desalinization plants. I'm familiar with the ones around San Francisco Bay. They've been in use for 30 years and work quite well. In parts of the US, there has been a permanent drawdown in the water table. Hence the push to control overuse. You don't have to control people. Just build pipes and aqueducts. Even the ancient Romans knew that. What you need to do is wake up and realize what's really happening with water in this world. Canada and Russia have lots of water; most of that is not where people live. Most other countries do not have lots water. Get over it. You embarrass yourself. |
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in message ... Al Kondo wrote: I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. Frankly, I'd hold onto the old one if I could repair it economically. In this case, newer isn't necessarily better. I agree. Hang on to that old toilet as they are not available anymore and you can't go back to one when you find how much trouble the new ones are. To address excess water use just use less water for urine by carefully partially flushing manually or get one of those two stage flushers. |
On 26-Aug-2004, "William W. Plummer" wrote:
Please note that using water in a toilet does NOT "waste" it (pun!). It is returned to nature where evaporation will separate it again, forming rain, ... Yeah, right. It always rains in the same place that the water evaporates! According to your fantasies, the US midwest water table should be the same now as it was 100 years ago. It ain't. Guess what - water extracted in one place may end up as rain somewhere else! Duh! Only an idiot would propose cleaning up lots of sewage loaded water when they can save money and time by only having to process a little. Mike |
On 26-Aug-2004, "William W. Plummer" wrote:
You say they have low volume toilets but walk 5km for water???? Where on Earth did I say anything about them having toilets? PIPES, dear friends, will move water from here to there. And _you_ will pay for it, right? It's not so bad. CA has many solar desalinization plants. I'm familiar with the ones around San Francisco Bay. They've been in use for 30 years and work quite well. Desalination is one of, if not the, most expensive way to get fresh water. Maybe you should actually learn something about water treatment and the associated costs before blathering on. Mike |
CA's got solar desal plants?? Please show your sources! Tom
Work at your leisure! |
I mean commercially viable stuff...The kind of thing the greater L.A. area can
use. Tom Work at your leisure! |
On Thu, 26 Aug 2004 11:01:41 -0400, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
wrote: Al Kondo wrote: I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. Flushing three times with a new toilet is a myth. I had one before I moved and wish I had one now. The old (13 years) water waster I have now is a very lazy flusher and often has to be flushed twice. The Kohler Wellworth that I had in my previous house never had to be flushed more than once. I had it for only two years before moving, but am sure it paid for itself in savings on water usage. Here it isn't an issue as I don't pay by usage, but I am considering replacing the old one just to get something that flushes properly. Frankly, I'd hold onto the old one if I could repair it economically. In this case, newer isn't necessarily better. Very wrong. |
"William W. Plummer" wrote in message news:s%qXc.315054 I don't get it. First, water is cheap, $3 per 1000 gallons. Where I live, combined charges for water and sewage, which is based on water usage, add up to $.77 per 100 gallons. Bob |
On 27-Aug-2004, Alan wrote:
I have now is a very lazy flusher and often has to be flushed twice. The Kohler Wellworth that I had in my previous house never had to be flushed more than once. The problem is that some folks have difficulty with a poorly made product and then claim that _all_ of them are no good. There are poor quality old style toilets too, but those are conveniently ignored for the discussion. When I was in Finland a couple of years ago, I found they used dual flush 2/4 liter toilets that worked very well. In North America, folks whine about 6l flush toilets. There are some excellent 6l flush toilets on the market here - you just have to shop wisely. Mike |
It occurs to me to wonder whether some people are trying to use
low-flush tanks with older bowls. I can see that that could be a problem if the older ones relied on brute force (i.e., sheer volume of water) rather than smarter design and full glazing. MB On 08/26/04 11:01 am Mortimer Schnerd, RN put fingers to keyboard and launched the following message into cyberspace: I fail to see any economy when you have to flush it three times to get all the crap to go down. I've had better luck tricking mine to hold more water in the tank. It's amazing how much better it flushes with even just another half a gallon of water. Frankly, I'd hold onto the old one if I could repair it economically. In this case, newer isn't necessarily better. |
Forget high efficiency toilets and get happy with your old toilet. It flushes better than any high efficiency one you are likely to put in its place and is potentially more efficient as well. Just cut the rubber bubble beneath your new non-leaking flapper enough to cause a siphon for urine uses and hold it longer for bowel movements. (the bubble float-holds the flap up until the tank nearly empties.) If you accidently cut the bubble too much - as in removing it alltogether - just hold it longer, enough to start the siphon flush necessary to carry off urine. "Al Kondo" wrote in message ... I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo |
George Wenzel wrote:
In article s%qXc.315054$a24.231117@attbi_s03, says... I don't get it. First, water is cheap, $3 per 1000 gallons. True, but considering the energy required to constantly treat and purify potable water, why waste it? It takes the same amount of effort to purify 1 gallon of water as it does 10 gallons. It what's IN the water that gets treated. Second, there is no shortage of water in the world. Lucky for you to live in an area with a good water treatment system and a plentiful supply of drinkable water. Everybody lives in an area with potable water. Without potable water, they die. Most of the water is in polar ice and the oceans. And, as such, isn't drinkable. You're quite right when you say that there's plenty of water on the planet. Problem is, over 99% of it isn't drinkable. What is drinkable (i.e. fresh water not salt water) requires massive amounts of treatment to remove bacteria and other nasties before it gets piped into homes. No sense wasting it, especially when low-flush toilets are available that do a fine job of removing waste. What makes you think it's wasted? When you burn Hydrogen in the presence of Oxygen, you get fresh water. All other water is used water. |
Al Kondo wrote:
I have recently been working on my toilet because of some simple flapper leakage problems. While working on it, I decided to settle my curiosity about how much water it took per flush. Much to my surprise I found that it took 4 gallons of water to fill it to the usual flush line! I wondered why my family was having such high water usage.... now I know why. Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? I noticed that the price of toilets at Home Depot also ranged from about $75 to $300. That is quite a range. What is the difference?? Thanks, Al Kondo Hmmm. At a difference of 2.4 gallons per flush and $3/1000 gallons, you'll save about seven-tenths of a cent per flush. The cheap toilet, $75, should pay for itself in a little over 10,000 flushes. Assuming 3 flushes per day per person, that's 9 person/years. A family of 3 could save enough water to pay for the new toilet in but three years - for the cheap toilet. For the more expensive toilet, twelve years. Less, of course, the opportunity cost of investing the $75 - $300 in the stock market. The actual difference could be millions. |
On 27-Aug-2004, "JerryMouse" wrote:
It takes the same amount of effort to purify 1 gallon of water as it does 10 gallons. It what's IN the water that gets treated. That'd get an F in the water treatment course I took getting my engineering degree. The water gets treated - unless you know of a magical way to separate the water from what's in it. There's the cost of the pipes that have to be sized for the water, the pumps, the filters... Mike |
Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? Kohler (Wellworth) Highline "Comfort height" toilet. About 2" higher than a standard toilet. Had 3 in the last house and 3 more in this new one. $ 150.00 @ Lowes or HD |
I put one in for my mother, she is very pleased. Especially
with the increased height. But put in a good flapper as you install it. Hers is only about 4 months installed, already 'flushing itself'. Rudy wrote in message news:gOWXc.241396$gE.28081@pd7tw3no... Anyway, I have decided to change the toilet out for a more efficient 1.5 gal model. What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. Also.... are they as efficient in flushing as the one I presently have?? Kohler (Wellworth) Highline "Comfort height" toilet. About 2" higher than a standard toilet. Had 3 in the last house and 3 more in this new one. $ 150.00 @ Lowes or HD |
Richard J Kinch ) writes: Al Kondo writes: What I would like to know is what do you look for when buying one of these things. You look for a Kohler Wellworth. End of story. I have to second this. We have this model and are happy with it. Another low flow we have regularly clogs. Two or 3 people we know have also purchased this model upon our recommendatuions and are also happy. Jonathan |
"Michael Baugh" wrote I put one in for my mother, she is very pleased. I put "one in" for your mother, too. She was VERY pleased!!!! |
Yeah, she mentioned that.
Also asked for me to remind you that you left some "Depends" in the kitchen where you laid them down. She realizes you have a memory problem, too. So she told me to tell you that you had a good time. Red Neckerson wrote in message news:JU7Yc.346$6q.103@trnddc06... "Michael Baugh" wrote I put one in for my mother, she is very pleased. I put "one in" for your mother, too. She was VERY pleased!!!! |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:26 AM. |
|
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 DIYbanter