Standing at sink waiting for hot for 15 seconds give or take. Basement heater is 35 feet away. Is it worth my Time to move it under the kitchen sink? An hour? Save any cash? Maybe move it between (thinking as i go) shower and kitchen? Layout = wh.....ten feet.....shower.....25 ft....kitchen sink.

I understand small cost for copper but i have room and ask how bored am I?

On 9/14/2017 7:05 PM, Thomas wrote:
Standing at sink waiting for hot for 15 seconds give or take. Basement heater is 35 feet away. Is it worth my Time to move it under the kitchen sink? An hour? Save any cash? Maybe move it between (thinking as i go) shower and kitchen? Layout = wh.....ten feet.....shower.....25 ft....kitchen sink.

I understand small cost for copper but i have room and ask how bored am I?

How much does water cost? Mine from a well is free but I have a friend
who pays and puts a bucket under his shower to collect until hot comes
on then waters his plants from the bucket.

On Thursday, September 14, 2017 at 7:05:20 PM UTC-4, Thomas wrote:
Standing at sink waiting for hot for 15 seconds give or take. Basement heater is 35 feet away. Is it worth my Time to move it under the kitchen sink? An hour? Save any cash? Maybe move it between (thinking as i go) shower and kitchen? Layout = wh.....ten feet.....shower.....25 ft....kitchen sink.

I understand small cost for copper but i have room and ask how bored am I?

Between the shower and kitchen would certainly improve it. I assume
it's electric, otherwise it gets more complicated. How old is it?
You'd certainly save some money on energy, not running as much to get
hot water, but it's probably not going to make a substantial difference.
It depends on your water usage model. If you tend to turn it on for
a quart of hot water many times a day, then moving it will save more
than if you tend to pull hot water, then continue to use it on and off
for 30 mins or an hour, then don't use it again for a long time.

There are other solutions, eg circulation pumps, but they have issues
too. Me, I'd probably leave it or move it, no pump.

On 9/14/2017 7:35 PM, Frank wrote:
On 9/14/2017 7:05 PM, Thomas wrote:
Standing at sink waiting for hot for 15 seconds give or take. Basement
heater is 35 feet away. Is it worth my Time to move it under the
kitchen sink? An hour? Save any cash? Maybe move it between (thinking
as i go) shower and kitchen?Â* Layout = wh.....ten
feet.....shower.....25 ft....kitchen sink.

I understand small cost for copper but i have room and ask how bored
am I?

How much does water cost?Â* Mine from a well is free but I have a friend
who pays and puts a bucket under his shower to collect until hot comes
on then waters his plants from the bucket.

I have town water and sewer. Works out to about 2 cents a gallon. I'd
guess less than a gallon runs to get hot enough to step in. If I shower
5X a week I'd save about a dime a week or save $5 a year on plant
watering.

On Thursday, September 14, 2017 at 7:47:42 PM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:
Between the shower and kitchen would certainly improve it. I assume
it's electric, otherwise it gets more complicated. How old is it?
You'd certainly save some money on energy, not running as much to get
hot water, but it's probably not going to make a substantial difference.
It depends on your water usage model. If you tend to turn it on for
a quart of hot water many times a day, then moving it will save more
than if you tend to pull hot water, then continue to use it on and off
for 30 mins or an hour, then don't use it again for a long time.

I'll leave it. Here is what happens...I hand wash dishes (no dishwasher) during tv commercials so I might wash 5 times instead of one shot.

I know...turn off the tv. But after a day at work I need a quick geography lesson.
I get that by seeing where we(USA)bombed something on the planet.

On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 11:05:01 AM UTC-4, Thomas wrote:
On Thursday, September 14, 2017 at 7:47:42 PM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:
Between the shower and kitchen would certainly improve it. I assume
it's electric, otherwise it gets more complicated. How old is it?
You'd certainly save some money on energy, not running as much to get
hot water, but it's probably not going to make a substantial difference.
It depends on your water usage model. If you tend to turn it on for
a quart of hot water many times a day, then moving it will save more
than if you tend to pull hot water, then continue to use it on and off
for 30 mins or an hour, then don't use it again for a long time.

I'll leave it. Here is what happens...I hand wash dishes (no dishwasher) during tv commercials so I might wash 5 times instead of one shot.

I know...turn off the tv. But after a day at work I need a quick geography lesson.
I get that by seeing where we(USA)bombed something on the planet.

Putting some of that tube type insulation over the pipe would help
reduce the heat loss between commercials. Might do that if it's easy
to do and you intend on being there years.

On 9/15/2017 8:04 AM, Thomas wrote:
On Thursday, September 14, 2017 at 7:47:42 PM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:
Between the shower and kitchen would certainly improve it. I assume
it's electric, otherwise it gets more complicated. How old is it?
You'd certainly save some money on energy, not running as much to get
hot water, but it's probably not going to make a substantial difference.
It depends on your water usage model. If you tend to turn it on for
a quart of hot water many times a day, then moving it will save more
than if you tend to pull hot water, then continue to use it on and off
for 30 mins or an hour, then don't use it again for a long time.

I'll leave it. Here is what happens...I hand wash dishes (no dishwasher) during tv commercials so I might wash 5 times instead of one shot.

I know...turn off the tv. But after a day at work I need a quick geography lesson.
I get that by seeing where we(USA)bombed something on the planet.


Insulating the pipe might help in that case.

On 9/15/2017 10:01 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 9/14/2017 7:35 PM, Frank wrote:
On 9/14/2017 7:05 PM, Thomas wrote:
Standing at sink waiting for hot for 15 seconds give or take.
Basement heater is 35 feet away. Is it worth my Time to move it under
the kitchen sink? An hour? Save any cash? Maybe move it between
(thinking as i go) shower and kitchen?Â* Layout = wh.....ten
feet.....shower.....25 ft....kitchen sink.

I understand small cost for copper but i have room and ask how bored
am I?

How much does water cost?Â* Mine from a well is free but I have a
friend who pays and puts a bucket under his shower to collect until
hot comes on then waters his plants from the bucket.

I have town water and sewer.Â* Works out to about 2 cents a gallon.Â* I'd
guess less than a gallon runs to get hot enough to step in.Â* If I shower
5X a week I'd save about a dime a week or save $5 a year on plant watering.

Probably makes it not worth the effort. I like to be frugal and not
even waste water though it is practically free except for electrical
cost of pumping.

replying to Thomas, Iggy wrote:
I think you'd be best off with a Hot Water Recirculator (
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Hot-Water...5800/100426993
). The one linked hooks up to your Water Heater and would present instant hot
water to both the kitchen and bath. See Instructions and Manual on the right
side of the Home Depot page to decide for yourself. They also have an
under-sink unit for just that sink (
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Undersink...T-E1/100037011
).

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

On Wednesday, September 27, 2017 at 12:14:08 PM UTC-4, Iggy wrote:
replying to Thomas, Iggy wrote:
I think you'd be best off with a Hot Water Recirculator (
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Hot-Water...5800/100426993
). The one linked hooks up to your Water Heater and would present instant hot
water to both the kitchen and bath. See Instructions and Manual on the right
side of the Home Depot page to decide for yourself. They also have an
under-sink unit for just that sink (
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Undersink...T-E1/100037011
).

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

The downside is that unless you install a return line, it pumps tepid
water into the cold water line. And I sure would not want that in
the kitchen. Faster hot water, stale, tepid cold.

replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
I've never had, needed nor installed one, but a literal few people I know with
them say the cold's slightly warm (warmer than dead-cold) flushes right out in
a second. It's not at all "stale" or old water, it's just very slightly
heated. When summer comes around my cold water gets warm, I actually start out
cold until the warm flushes it. I don't know what it is or why it remains and
I've never had it before in any other place.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

On Wednesday, September 27, 2017 at 4:44:10 PM UTC-4, Iggy wrote:
replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
I've never had, needed nor installed one, but a literal few people I know with
them say the cold's slightly warm (warmer than dead-cold) flushes right out in
a second.


OK, let's figure this out. It takes so long for hot water to get there
that you need to install a pump to keep the hot water circulating so
it's always available hot at the faucet. To do that, either requires
running a separate return line or else using the existing cold water
line at the sink as a return line. That pipe is going to be as long
as the hot water line. There may be exceptions, it could be shorter,
it could be longer, but generally they run together and it's going to
be similar in length. The pump runs so that there is always hot water
there. Therefore the cold water pipe near the sink is always going to have
full temp hot water in it. The rest of the line will be filled with
lukewarm water, the exact temp profile depends on the length of the pipe.
So, explain to us how while the delay in waiting for hot water is so
long that it's unacceptable, you're only going to get a couple seconds
of hot or tepid water out of the cold when it's first turned on?
In fact, you're going to get a whole pipe length of hot or tepid water,
and if I was filling a glass for drinking, making tea, using it for
cooking I would not want water that's been in a tank full of sediment
and that never tastes right. But whatever you think of the quality of
water from the hot tank, the fact is the cold water pipe winds up
full of hot or tepid water, unless you run a separate return line.




It's not at all "stale" or old water, it's just very slightly
heated.

I've never liked the taste of water from a hot water heater. Have
you seen what's inside them? And it's not just slightly heated,
the first water coming out of the cold line is going to be just
as hot as the hot water coming out the hot side when you turn it on.

replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
Well, you have to understand that the Recirculator is thermostatically
controlled, it doesn't Recirculate constantly. It pumps and then shuts off,
hot side cools a bit and the cold side does as well. Depending on when you use
the faucet since its last cycle, you may not even notice cold being warm or
that the hot is not boiling hot.

FYI, your city or well water is much older than you like AND the city stuff is
recycled. Containing pharmaceuticals, fluoride, chlorines, lead, urine, animal
waste, etc. Otherwise, you just need to flush your water heater and replace
its anode rod more often. After 7-years mine still looks brand new inside. I
got a Bradford White water heater with their Hydro-Jet and I don't get
anything of sediment anymore, I used to get a full cup of what looks like
kitty litter in 7-years.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

On Wednesday, September 27, 2017 at 5:44:05 PM UTC-4, Iggy wrote:
replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
Well, you have to understand that the Recirculator is thermostatically
controlled, it doesn't Recirculate constantly. It pumps and then shuts off,
hot side cools a bit and the cold side does as well. Depending on when you use
the faucet since its last cycle, you may not even notice cold being warm or
that the hot is not boiling hot.

It doesn't have to run all the time, Whatever temp the water is set to
be at the hot side at the faucet, water of that same temp is being
pushed into the cold water pipe. Say it's set to be 110F. As soon as
it drops to ~105F the pump goes on, pushing 105F water into the cold
pipe. When the water reached 110F it shuts off, and at that point you
have 110F water in the cold pipe near the faucet, 105 water some feet
down, 100F water further down, etc. So, again, if the objection is
that it takes a long time to get hot water, then you're going to have
a long cold pipe full of hot to tepid water. So now you're waiting
for cold, fresh water instead of hot water. If that's acceptable,
by all means install one. But don't tell us that there is only 2 secs
of tepid water in the cold line. And if other sinks share that line,
you have the same cold water line issue there.





FYI, your city or well water is much older than you like AND the city stuff is
recycled. Containing pharmaceuticals, fluoride, chlorines, lead, urine, animal
waste, etc.

Maybe your water has urine and animal waste in it, mine doesn't. And it
tastes good. Hot water from a hot water tank typically doesn't taste
very good, it has an off taste to it. But since you drink urine, I
guess you wouldn't notice.


Otherwise, you just need to flush your water heater and replace
its anode rod more often. After 7-years mine still looks brand new inside.

Yeah, sure I believe that.


I
got a Bradford White water heater with their Hydro-Jet and I don't get
anything of sediment anymore, I used to get a full cup of what looks like
kitty litter in 7-years.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

A typical water heater winds up with a lot more than a cup of crud in it
in 7 years.

BTW, I see you're still refusing to follow some basic newsgroup etiquette
and quote what you're replying to so it's easy to follow. Others have
suggested it, you just refuse.

replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
Oh well and shucks. I thought this time you might be able to manage your
festering A-holery. Nope.

What people tell me is a lie and the millions upon millions over decade and
decade are liars.

What I've personally experienced is a lie and I simply can't see the buckets
of pixie-dust sediment.

Your city water's special or your well or spring water doesn't percolate from
septic leach fields nor have anything to do with toxic rivers or streams.
Dream, dream, dream.

And, though I've made it clear I'm not using Abusenet (regardless of what you
imagine I'm looking at and typing through), I'm still suppose to sink to
Obtusenet's level of TOTAL CRAP.

Thanks for playing, you lose idiot loser and no consolation prizes.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

replying to Iggy, Iggy wrote:
~

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

Iggy posted for all of us...



replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
Well, you have to understand that the Recirculator is thermostatically
controlled, it doesn't Recirculate constantly. It pumps and then shuts off,
hot side cools a bit and the cold side does as well. Depending on when you use
the faucet since its last cycle, you may not even notice cold being warm or
that the hot is not boiling hot.

FYI, your city or well water is much older than you like AND the city stuff is
recycled. Containing pharmaceuticals, fluoride, chlorines, lead, urine, animal
waste, etc. Otherwise, you just need to flush your water heater and replace
its anode rod more often. After 7-years mine still looks brand new inside. I
got a Bradford White water heater with their Hydro-Jet and I don't get
anything of sediment anymore, I used to get a full cup of what looks like
kitty litter in 7-years.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

Hey Iggy, FYI ALL water has been recycled since the beginning of earth.

--
Tekkie

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 4:37:51 PM UTC-4, Tekkie® wrote:
Iggy posted for all of us...



replying to trader_4, Iggy wrote:
Well, you have to understand that the Recirculator is thermostatically
controlled, it doesn't Recirculate constantly. It pumps and then shuts off,
hot side cools a bit and the cold side does as well. Depending on when you use
the faucet since its last cycle, you may not even notice cold being warm or
that the hot is not boiling hot.

FYI, your city or well water is much older than you like AND the city stuff is
recycled. Containing pharmaceuticals, fluoride, chlorines, lead, urine, animal
waste, etc. Otherwise, you just need to flush your water heater and replace
its anode rod more often. After 7-years mine still looks brand new inside. I
got a Bradford White water heater with their Hydro-Jet and I don't get
anything of sediment anymore, I used to get a full cup of what looks like
kitty litter in 7-years.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...h-1144150-.htm

Hey Iggy, FYI ALL water has been recycled since the beginning of earth.

--
Tekkie


Iggy still doesn't understand that this is a Usenet newsgroup.
I guess he actually thinks all the people on these threads are over
there at HomeMoanersHub and it's their website forum.
Probably drinking all that animal waste and urine has affected
his brain.