What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?

On 7/29/2017 5:54 PM, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?

I thought bases were appropriate to dissolve organics rather than acids.

On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 20:53:01 -0700, Bob F wrote:

I thought bases were appropriate to dissolve organics rather than acids.

The only bases I have in any concentration are 5-pound bags of baking soda
(sodium bicarbonate). Does that stand a chance of working?

I'd love to try sodium hydroxide but where, in California, locally, can I
pick up a bottle of concentrated sodium hydroxide like I can do with pool
chemicals?

"Danny D." wrote in news
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 20:53:01 -0700, Bob F wrote:

I thought bases were appropriate to dissolve organics rather than acids.

They are.

The only bases I have in any concentration are 5-pound bags of baking soda
(sodium bicarbonate). Does that stand a chance of working?

Nope, but it won't eat your pans, either.

I'd love to try sodium hydroxide but where, in California, locally, can I
pick up a bottle of concentrated sodium hydroxide like I can do with pool
chemicals?

Probably nowhere. Try washing soda instead. You should be able to find it on the laundry
aisle of your local supermarket -- box of Arm & Hammer brand looks pretty much like the
A&H baking soda box except a lot bigger. Note: washing soda will leave a dark gray layer
on your aluminum pans, but that's a heck of a lot better than eating the metal away.

What in the world ever possessed you to use muriatic acid to clean your cookware,
anyway? That stuff's for cleaning concrete and porcelain, not metal.

On 7/29/2017 8:54 PM, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing


What the heck is in the pot? Did something overcook and burn? I've
cleaned a couple of burnt pots by putting dishwasher detergent and
boiling few minutes, then soak overnight. They are 50 years old and
still look like new.

Worst case scenario, five minutes with an SOS pad

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 00:02:08 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

What the heck is in the pot? Did something overcook and burn? I've
cleaned a couple of burnt pots by putting dishwasher detergent and
boiling few minutes, then soak overnight. They are 50 years old and
still look like new.

Worst case scenario, five minutes with an SOS pad

The pots were basically "abused" by me (according to my wife) because I
used them to make potato wedges for the grandkids, who love my potato
wedges!

I would parboil the potatoes, cut them into wedges, soak the wedges in cold
water, whip up a mix of flavored flour, tamp down the wedges a bit with a
towel, and then put the wedges and flavored flour in a baggie to shake
shake shake.

Then I'd freeze them (dunno why freezing works, but it does), and then when
ready, I'd pop them into 400 degree F boiling oil in those pots.

Invariably there'd be splashes, fires, and spills, where the end result was
those pots.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 12:19:11 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 00:02:08 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

What the heck is in the pot? Did something overcook and burn? I've
cleaned a couple of burnt pots by putting dishwasher detergent and
boiling few minutes, then soak overnight. They are 50 years old and
still look like new.

Worst case scenario, five minutes with an SOS pad

The pots were basically "abused" by me (according to my wife) because I
used them to make potato wedges for the grandkids, who love my potato
wedges!

I would parboil the potatoes, cut them into wedges, soak the wedges in cold
water, whip up a mix of flavored flour, tamp down the wedges a bit with a
towel, and then put the wedges and flavored flour in a baggie to shake
shake shake.

Then I'd freeze them (dunno why freezing works, but it does), and then when
ready, I'd pop them into 400 degree F boiling oil in those pots.

Invariably there'd be splashes, fires, and spills, where the end result was
those pots.

Oh Danny,

The wife is correct. The pics looked like burnt on oil/grease to me.
Try an oil with a much higher smoke point. Oven cleaner would have
been my go to first option. Spray heavily and enclose in a plastic
bag overnight - repeat a time or two.

You could likely put the pot in a self-cleaning oven to get the mess
off as long as the pot is oven safe (no plastic handles).

What am I gonna do with you son :-)

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:27:25 -0700, Oren wrote:

The wife is correct.

She accuses me of abusing things all the time.
She just doesn't understand men.

The pics looked like burnt on oil/grease to me.

Yup. The kids loved the flames!
And the CO2 fire extinguisher whooosh! Whoosh! Whoosh!

I ruined the vent to the stove in fact, because the flames burned the wires
even though the (asbestos?) wire-mesh shield (that's a project to fix for
later).

Try an oil with a much higher smoke point.

Ummmmm.... er ... how do I say this without offending the (very very very
Italian wife) ... but um ... there is only ONE type of oil in the kitchen.

Yes. One. Only one.
It comes from Costco and not in a two-pack either.

Oven cleaner would have
been my go to first option. Spray heavily and enclose in a plastic
bag overnight - repeat a time or two.

OK. But isn't oven cleaner just extensively diluted perfumed sodium
hydroxide? I'm not the guy for sissy stuff that supermarkets sell!

Besides, Frank said that concentrated sodium hydroxide won't work.

You could likely put the pot in a self-cleaning oven to get the mess
off as long as the pot is oven safe (no plastic handles).

That's an idea! Heat alone might work.
Of course, heat is what caused the problem in the first place...
So ... um... dunno. But something makes self-cleaning ovens work.

I suspect they bake the fats to a crumbly crust.

I think my next step will be the pressure washer though.
Or the goopy laundry detergent bath.

I was hoping for a magic chemical but Frank said NaOH isn't it.
Certainly HCl isn't it.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 15:35:29 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:27:25 -0700, Oren wrote:

The wife is correct.

She accuses me of abusing things all the time.
She just doesn't understand men.

The pics looked like burnt on oil/grease to me.

Yup. The kids loved the flames!
And the CO2 fire extinguisher whooosh! Whoosh! Whoosh!

I ruined the vent to the stove in fact, because the flames burned the wires
even though the (asbestos?) wire-mesh shield (that's a project to fix for
later).

Try an oil with a much higher smoke point.

Ummmmm.... er ... how do I say this without offending the (very very very
Italian wife) ... but um ... there is only ONE type of oil in the kitchen.

Yes. One. Only one.
It comes from Costco and not in a two-pack either.

Oven cleaner would have
been my go to first option. Spray heavily and enclose in a plastic
bag overnight - repeat a time or two.

OK. But isn't oven cleaner just extensively diluted perfumed sodium
hydroxide? I'm not the guy for sissy stuff that supermarkets sell!

Besides, Frank said that concentrated sodium hydroxide won't work.

You could likely put the pot in a self-cleaning oven to get the mess
off as long as the pot is oven safe (no plastic handles).

That's an idea! Heat alone might work.
Of course, heat is what caused the problem in the first place...
So ... um... dunno. But something makes self-cleaning ovens work.

A catalyst impregnated into the enamel or ceramic coating - - -
I suspect they bake the fats to a crumbly crust.

I think my next step will be the pressure washer though.
Or the goopy laundry detergent bath.

I was hoping for a magic chemical but Frank said NaOH isn't it.
Certainly HCl isn't it.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 15:35:29 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

I was hoping for a magic chemical but Frank said NaOH isn't it.
Certainly HCl isn't it.

Make a ball of aluminum foil, rub, and see it takes the burnt cooties
off. That is how I clean my grill (s) grates.

On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 7:59:08 PM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?


I believe Frank is a chemist. You might try pinging him with your chemistry questions. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[8~{} Uncle Dissolving Monster

On 7/30/2017 2:16 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:
On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 7:59:08 PM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?


I believe Frank is a chemist. You might try pinging him with your chemistry questions. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[8~{} Uncle Dissolving Monster


HCl reacts with aluminum to form hydrogen gas and aluminum chloride.
You want to clean the pot, not dissolve it.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:43:40 -0400, Frank wrote:

HCl reacts with aluminum to form hydrogen gas and aluminum chloride.
You want to clean the pot, not dissolve it.

The pots appear to be a mix of metals but I agree that the HCl was a
failure as what happened, as Frank said, is that the metal *underneath* the
crud dissolved, such that the crud flaked off.

I could try the pressure washer but I was hoping to find a chemical that
would do the trick.

I know about sodium hydroxide. Frank - do you think concentrated NaOH would
work?

The problem even if it would work, is that I don't know where to get a
gallon of concentrated NaOH locally.

On 7/30/2017 8:19 AM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:43:40 -0400, Frank wrote:

HCl reacts with aluminum to form hydrogen gas and aluminum chloride.
You want to clean the pot, not dissolve it.

The pots appear to be a mix of metals but I agree that the HCl was a
failure as what happened, as Frank said, is that the metal *underneath* the
crud dissolved, such that the crud flaked off.

I could try the pressure washer but I was hoping to find a chemical that
would do the trick.

I know about sodium hydroxide. Frank - do you think concentrated NaOH would
work?
The problem even if it would work, is that I don't know where to get a
gallon of concentrated NaOH locally.

Don't do that either. You will get the same result.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 08:59:04 -0400, Frank wrote:

The problem even if it would work, is that I don't know where to get a
gallon of concentrated NaOH locally.

Don't do that either. You will get the same result.

Thanks. I'm determined to expend the appreciable effort to find the easiest
way to just "dissolve" the baked-on crud with zero final effort.

What I'll try next, I guess, is either a sloppy bath of
just-wet-enough-to-be-sticky gloopy gloppy laundry detergent (which seems
to be mostly weak metal chelators and basic sodium sulfate fat
polarizers)... or ...

I'll get out the pressure washer!

We never fail ... but we often try a few things that don't work before
succeeding.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 08:59:04 -0400, Frank wrote:

The problem even if it would work, is that I don't know where to get a
gallon of concentrated NaOH locally.

Don't do that either. You will get the same result.

BTW, Frank, do you think the rich unmistakable emerald green hue of the
resulting HCl was due to the Fe in the pot metal?

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 12:19:10 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:43:40 -0400, Frank wrote:

HCl reacts with aluminum to form hydrogen gas and aluminum chloride.
You want to clean the pot, not dissolve it.

The pots appear to be a mix of metals but I agree that the HCl was a
failure as what happened, as Frank said, is that the metal *underneath* the
crud dissolved, such that the crud flaked off.

I could try the pressure washer but I was hoping to find a chemical that
would do the trick.

I know about sodium hydroxide. Frank - do you think concentrated NaOH would
work?

The problem even if it would work, is that I don't know where to get a
gallon of concentrated NaOH locally.
Make your own from red devil crystals

On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 23:16:42 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote:

I believe Frank is a chemist.
You might try pinging him with your chemistry questions. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


The main chemistry questions for Frank are
Why is the froth green?

And
Where can I get a gallon of concentrated NaOH locally?

And,
Would baking soda (of which I have five pounds of) stand a chance?

On 7/30/2017 8:24 AM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 23:16:42 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote:

I believe Frank is a chemist. You might try pinging him with your
chemistry questions. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


The main chemistry questions for Frank are
Why is the froth green?

And
Where can I get a gallon of concentrated NaOH locally?

And, Would baking soda (of which I have five pounds of) stand a chance?

I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react with
aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the foam. The
aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be something in the
stain turning the froth green.

Baking soda is safe to use. You have burned in stains which are
basically carbon that would have to be mechanically removed.

My advice is to ditch the pots and buy new ones and don't abuse them.
Coated cookware with Teflon or other finishes works great until worn
out. Only cookware that lasts forever is stainless steel or cared for
cast iron.

Google is your best source and you will get tons of hits like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdTpp_Z_8Fo

I suspect your pots have been too abused to completely recover them.
Even stainless steel scrubbers will abraid softer aluminum. Things wear
out.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 11:29:29 -0400, Frank wrote:

I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react with
aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the foam. The
aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be something in the
stain turning the froth green.

There's something in the aluminum pots which turns the HCl emerald green.
Maybe Fe?

Baking soda is safe to use. You have burned in stains which are
basically carbon that would have to be mechanically removed.

Everyone says to use Baking Soda for almost everything but nobody knows how
(or if) it works.

Baking soda is just sodium bicarbonate.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_bicarbonate

It always amazes me that most people (not chemists) say to use baking soda
for almost everything but not one of them knows how it works (or even if it
works). I suspect 99% of the time it doesn't work.

Somehow, they think baking soda does something that sodium bicarbonate
can't do.

Wiki says it's just a minor scouring agent, which if the point was to do
physical labor, the pots would have been cleaned by someone else already.


My advice is to ditch the pots and buy new ones and don't abuse them.

Naaaah. That wouldn't be any fun.

I suspect your pots have been too abused to completely recover them.
Even stainless steel scrubbers will abraid softer aluminum. Things wear
out.

I own a sand blaster, but I'm gonna try the more gentle pressure washer
next.

Basically, all I really need though, is a carbon solvent.

On 7/30/2017 1:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 11:29:29 -0400, Frank wrote:

I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react with
aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the foam.
The aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be something in
the stain turning the froth green.

There's something in the aluminum pots which turns the HCl emerald green.
Maybe Fe?

Baking soda is safe to use. You have burned in stains which are
basically carbon that would have to be mechanically removed.

Everyone says to use Baking Soda for almost everything but nobody knows how
(or if) it works.

Baking soda is just sodium bicarbonate.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_bicarbonate

It always amazes me that most people (not chemists) say to use baking soda
for almost everything but not one of them knows how it works (or even if it
works). I suspect 99% of the time it doesn't work.

Somehow, they think baking soda does something that sodium bicarbonate
can't do.

Wiki says it's just a minor scouring agent, which if the point was to do
physical labor, the pots would have been cleaned by someone else already.


My advice is to ditch the pots and buy new ones and don't abuse them.

Naaaah. That wouldn't be any fun.

I suspect your pots have been too abused to completely recover them.
Even stainless steel scrubbers will abraid softer aluminum. Things
wear out.

I own a sand blaster, but I'm gonna try the more gentle pressure washer
next.

Basically, all I really need though, is a carbon solvent.

Baking soda is slightly alkaline. Not enough to attack aluminum but
alkaline enough to help solubilize acidic materials. Oxidation of a lot
of carbon containing materials makes for carboxylic acid groups.
Vinegar is slightly acidic. Not enough to attack most metals but and
remove lime deposits by solubilizing the calcium salts. So both are
used as mild cleaning agents.

"Danny D." writes:

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 11:29:29 -0400, Frank wrote:

I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react
with aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the
foam. The aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be
something in the stain turning the froth green.

There's something in the aluminum pots which turns the HCl emerald green.
Maybe Fe?

Already answered, pay attention.

Green, usually copper.
Iron, typically red.

Just looked up Chromium, it has some green compounds.

--
Dan Espen

Danny D. posted for all of us...



On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 11:29:29 -0400, Frank wrote:

I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react with
aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the foam. The
aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be something in the
stain turning the froth green.

There's something in the aluminum pots which turns the HCl emerald green.
Maybe Fe?

Baking soda is safe to use. You have burned in stains which are
basically carbon that would have to be mechanically removed.

Everyone says to use Baking Soda for almost everything but nobody knows how
(or if) it works.

Baking soda is just sodium bicarbonate.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_bicarbonate

It always amazes me that most people (not chemists) say to use baking soda
for almost everything but not one of them knows how it works (or even if it
works). I suspect 99% of the time it doesn't work.

Somehow, they think baking soda does something that sodium bicarbonate
can't do.

Wiki says it's just a minor scouring agent, which if the point was to do
physical labor, the pots would have been cleaned by someone else already.


My advice is to ditch the pots and buy new ones and don't abuse them.

Naaaah. That wouldn't be any fun.

I suspect your pots have been too abused to completely recover them.
Even stainless steel scrubbers will abraid softer aluminum. Things wear
out.

I own a sand blaster, but I'm gonna try the more gentle pressure washer
next.

Basically, all I really need though, is a carbon solvent.

I recommend: https://www.google.com/search?q=carb...olver&ie=utf-8
&oe=utf-8

--
Tekkie

On 7/30/2017 5:24 AM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 23:16:42 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote:

I believe Frank is a chemist. You might try pinging him with your
chemistry questions. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


The main chemistry questions for Frank are
Why is the froth green?

And
Where can I get a gallon of concentrated NaOH locally?

And, Would baking soda (of which I have five pounds of) stand a chance?

Along time ago, A housemate of mine burned food onto a Caphalon pot.
then boiled it with baking sods for a few hours to get the crud loose.
After that, the anodized aluminum pot had pits all over the bottom.

"Danny D." wrote in message
news
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank,
so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, dadiOH wrote:

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

No doubt about it that concentrated sodium hydroxide would be fun to try.
The question is where to get the concentrate locally.

I'm not the type to buy the tremendously diluted and perfumed household
chemicals in the local supermarket.

I like the raw powerful stuff.

On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 7:23:13 AM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, dadiOH wrote:

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

No doubt about it that concentrated sodium hydroxide would be fun to try.
The question is where to get the concentrate locally.

I'm not the type to buy the tremendously diluted and perfumed household
chemicals in the local supermarket.

I like the raw powerful stuff.


I use lava straight from a volcano. None of that sissy stuff for me! ”Œ( à²*_à²*)”˜

[8~{} Uncle Molten Monster

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 05:49:19 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote:

I use lava straight from a volcano. None of that sissy stuff for me!

You may not know this, but I've been to every volcano I can find in most
countries I've visited.

The one thing that I can say is that some of them literally stink of
sulfurous compounds!

I ruined a Rolex Oyster Perpetual, in fact, in Greece, swimming in the
caldera near Thera. My fault for accidentally leaving the adjuster
unlocked.

"Danny D." wrote in message
news
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 05:49:19 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote:

I use lava straight from a volcano. None of that sissy stuff for me!

You may not know this, but I've been to every volcano I can find in most
countries I've visited.

You would have enjoyed the 1959 eruption of Kilauea Iki. Park rangers
closed off access but I went the long way...across Kilauea caldera to an
area called Byron's Ledge which was only about 1000' from the spouting vent.

Now, 1000' sounds like a fair distance but the vent was shooting up as high
as 2500' and the norm was 1000+. It was hot (and noisy!); I had a Hastings
triplet on a beaded chain around my neck, had to remove it because the chain
got so hot.

On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 8:23:13 AM UTC-4, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, dadiOH wrote:

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

No doubt about it that concentrated sodium hydroxide would be fun to try.
The question is where to get the concentrate locally.

I'm not the type to buy the tremendously diluted and perfumed household
chemicals in the local supermarket.

I like the raw powerful stuff.

Draino was basically sodium hydroxide, with some other minor stuff
mixed in. That should screw up those pots more, especially if they
are aluminum. In fact, I think Draino had/has some aluminum tiny
aluminum chips in it to react, make heat and get it going.

On 7/30/2017 8:36 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 8:23:13 AM UTC-4, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, dadiOH wrote:

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

No doubt about it that concentrated sodium hydroxide would be fun to try.
The question is where to get the concentrate locally.

I'm not the type to buy the tremendously diluted and perfumed household
chemicals in the local supermarket.

I like the raw powerful stuff.

Draino was basically sodium hydroxide, with some other minor stuff
mixed in. That should screw up those pots more, especially if they
are aluminum. In fact, I think Draino had/has some aluminum tiny
aluminum chips in it to react, make heat and get it going.


Which suggests it wouldn't be a good idea in aluminum pots.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 12:19:04 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, dadiOH wrote:

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

No doubt about it that concentrated sodium hydroxide would be fun to try.
The question is where to get the concentrate locally.

I'm not the type to buy the tremendously diluted and perfumed household
chemicals in the local supermarket.

I like the raw powerful stuff.

Gillets lye crystals, oe red devil from local old-tyme hardware store

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:15:42 -0400, "dadiOH" wrote:


"Danny D." wrote in message
news
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank,
so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?

Lye = sodium hydroxide. It will dissolve the crud but not eat the metal
like HCl.

Unless the pots are aluminum - - -

On 7/29/2017 8:54 PM, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?
I'd use spray oven cleaner, but the acid may have already damaged the
surface of the pot.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:34:32 -0400, Art Todesco wrote:

I'd use spray oven cleaner, but the acid may have already damaged the
surface of the pot.

I thought of the oven cleaner foam, but really, I dislike the weak
chemicals that are found in a supermarket, or even nowadays, in California,
the "baby chemicals" that are available in the hardware stores.

I wish I had access to a chem lab which has concentrated sulfuric acid and
sodium hydroxide both of which are like syrup as I recall from my college
days long ago.

So the trick is to find a local industrial supplier where I can buy a
gallon of sodium hydroxide.

What industry uses sodium hydroxide by the gallon?

"Danny D." wrote in message
news
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 07:34:32 -0400, Art Todesco wrote:

I'd use spray oven cleaner, but the acid may have already damaged the
surface of the pot.

I thought of the oven cleaner foam, but really, I dislike the weak
chemicals that are found in a supermarket, or even nowadays, in
California,
the "baby chemicals" that are available in the hardware stores.

I wish I had access to a chem lab which has concentrated sulfuric acid and
sodium hydroxide both of which are like syrup as I recall from my college
days long ago.

So the trick is to find a local industrial supplier where I can buy a
gallon of sodium hydroxide.

What industry uses sodium hydroxide by the gallon?

Soap manufacturers for one. Potassium hydroxide too. Use wood ash and make
your own.

On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 8:59:08 PM UTC-4, Danny D. wrote:
What chemistry is going on here?
http://i.imgur.com/C6hStFB.jpg

Specifically, why green?
http://i.imgur.com/A6zmLJM.jpg

The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry
method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so,
she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
http://i.imgur.com/UOjeomJ.jpg

Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL:
blob:http://imgur.com/f7bf8cd4-3abc-49dd-9b7d-16a5ae9c04a0

This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing
something useful:
http://i.imgur.com/EqJPylY.jpg

But the end result is less than spectacular:
http://i.imgur.com/nmyISVG.jpg

It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the
crud!
http://i.imgur.com/kHCTfCe.jpg

On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
http://i.imgur.com/XYnQF0P.jpg

The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green
"something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
http://i.imgur.com/O5R4g1t.jpg

More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?

A toilet is made of porcelain which does not react to the hydrochloric acid, while the mineral deposits very actively react with it. That's why it doesn't damage the toilet and works. Those pots are made of metal, which will react with the acid, while the burnt on food, while somewhat reactive, is probably not highly reactive, depending on what it is. That's the chemistry of why it didn't work.

If you burn food badly in a pot, put an inch of water in it, more if needed to cover it all, add a few tbsp of dishwasher powder, put it on the stove and let it simmer for an hour.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 04:52:59 -0700 (PDT), trader_4 wrote:

A toilet is made of porcelain which does not react to the hydrochloric acid,
while the mineral deposits very actively react with it. That's why it doesn't
damage the toilet and works.

As we know from my extensive experiments with *every* household chemical
known to mankind, NOTHING (bar none!) you can buy at any hardware store or
supermarket cleans toilets like concentrated pool acid!

Anyone who thinks otherwise has never tried it.

Those pots are made of metal, which will react with the acid, while the
burnt on food, while somewhat reactive, is probably not highly reactive,
depending on what it is. That's the chemistry of why it didn't work.

Thank you for that explanation as to why the baked-on crud didn't bat an
eye when enveloped in HCl.

If you burn food badly in a pot, put an inch of water in it,
more if needed to cover it all, add a few tbsp of dishwasher powder,
put it on the stove and let it simmer for an hour.

Interesting suggestion. I don't have dishwasher powder handy, but laundry
detergent should be the same stuff as shampoo, dish detergent, and laundry
detergent are mostly sodium sulphates (e.g., sodium lauryl sulfate, sodium
dodecyl sulphate, etc.).

Again, I eschew the weakness of common household chemicals, so, I admit I'm
different in that I just love the power of the industrial stuff.

Is a sodium sulphate locally available in concentrated form by the gallon?

On 07/30/2017 08:19 AM, Danny D. wrote:
Again, I eschew the weakness of common household chemicals, so, I
admit I'm
different in that I just love the power of the industrial stuff.

Is a sodium sulphate locally available in concentrated form by the
gallon?

Jesus ****ing Christ! I hope you don't have children living with you.

What the **** is wrong with you?

On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 09:07:12 -0400, Bud Weiser wrote:

Is a sodium sulphate locally available in concentrated form by the
gallon?

Jesus ****ing Christ! I hope you don't have children living with you.

What the **** is wrong with you?

If you only knew the number of related and unrelated children I have living
with me and the wife...

We've had this discussion before, where there are two types of people.

1. Mother who stands on chair in the kitchen with a broom in hand screaming
that a mouse ran across the floor.
2. Father who calmly puts out a mouse trap (and disposes of the result).

The world is filled to the brim with those two types of people.

2. One type uses a cup of pool acid to clean a toilet bowl in seconds.
1. The other type fuels an entire aisle of toilet cleaning products at the
local supermarket.

We had this discussion with winding of garage door torsion springs, for
example where...

1. One type screamed "you're gonna die!"
2. While the other type invested less than $10 in tools using them to
calmly wind his springs which were 70K cycle springs to replace the 10K
cycle springs that the garage-door repair company habitually installs.

There's nothing wrong with you being the first type of person, but you need
to recognize that calmer and less needlessly afraid people do exist in this
world too.

Ask Oren. He knows how to get rid of crud fast!