The saga continues.

Okay, so we pulled up the toilet in preparation to start the process of
laying down a new tile floor and discovered water damage severe enough to
have to replace the sewer pipe and a new flange. The damage was also enough
that we pulled up the old 1/2" particle board underlayment that was under
the vinyl (it was swelled pretty badly). Here's the problem - when we
replaced that 1/2" underlayment with 1/2" plywood that we know is the same
thickness (laid it next to some of the good stuff that wasn't damaged) the
flange no longer sits on the floor. We've got about a 1/4" gap.

One idea is to put down 1/4" plywood over the whole floor. However, by the
time we do that, we'll be raising the overall height of the new floor 3/4"
intead of 1/2" (we've got an adapter that will raise the flange connector
that much). However, if we just put a 1/4" ring under the flange so that it
sits correctly on the underflooring, then lay the new floor, will that
spacer then make the flange assembly too high and cause the toilet to sit
too high off the floor? Or if we leave the adapter out will we have trouble
with the top of the flange not sitting flush on the bottom of the toilet?

We're in a bit of a dilemna here. Do they make 1/4" flange adapters? The
sewer pipe cannot be pushed down - it sits on another water pipe (don't
ask - we didn't build the house, and the basement ceiling is finished).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions, we'd be very grateful to hear them.
This has turned into the project from hell. Completely redid the whole
bathroom - walls, tub (refinished, not replaced), cabinets (repainted),
sink, and walls. The floor was the last piece, and it's turned into a major
undertaking.

Thanks to all in advance.

LB

Actually, flange height is not all that fussy, but if it is 1/4" off the
floor, and is 1/2" thick, then you are kind of high for the toilet (total of
3/4" above the floor). When the toilet is sitting on the finished floor,
you would like at least 1/4" clearance between the horn and the flange to
leave room for the wax ring to seal. You can check how high your
particular toilet horn sits above the flange. I suspect that it is possible
that the leaking which damaged the original floor may possibly have been
caused by the flange being too high and making a thin seal. If you can't
lower the flange, then you should probably just make the floor 1/4" higher.

You say "tile floor". Is this ceramic? Because if so, then the tile itself
is going to give you at least an extra 1/4" more than, say, vinyl (the
toilet rests on top of the finished floor). But if by "tile" you just
mean vinyl tile, then raise the floor 1/4" with plywood, and deal with
whatever problems this causes (mainly at the doorway, I would think).

"L Beck" wrote in message
...
The saga continues.

Okay, so we pulled up the toilet in preparation to start the process of
laying down a new tile floor and discovered water damage severe enough to
have to replace the sewer pipe and a new flange. The damage was also
enough
that we pulled up the old 1/2" particle board underlayment that was under
the vinyl (it was swelled pretty badly). Here's the problem - when we
replaced that 1/2" underlayment with 1/2" plywood that we know is the same
thickness (laid it next to some of the good stuff that wasn't damaged) the
flange no longer sits on the floor. We've got about a 1/4" gap.

One idea is to put down 1/4" plywood over the whole floor. However, by
the
time we do that, we'll be raising the overall height of the new floor 3/4"
intead of 1/2" (we've got an adapter that will raise the flange connector
that much). However, if we just put a 1/4" ring under the flange so that
it
sits correctly on the underflooring, then lay the new floor, will that
spacer then make the flange assembly too high and cause the toilet to sit
too high off the floor? Or if we leave the adapter out will we have
trouble
with the top of the flange not sitting flush on the bottom of the toilet?

We're in a bit of a dilemna here. Do they make 1/4" flange adapters? The
sewer pipe cannot be pushed down - it sits on another water pipe (don't
ask - we didn't build the house, and the basement ceiling is finished).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions, we'd be very grateful to hear
them.
This has turned into the project from hell. Completely redid the whole
bathroom - walls, tub (refinished, not replaced), cabinets (repainted),
sink, and walls. The floor was the last piece, and it's turned into a
major
undertaking.

Thanks to all in advance.

LB

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, it's ceramic, and we will be putting down also a 1/4" hardibacker
board, set in mortar, then the 1/4" tile, also set in mortar. If we don't
use the 1/2" adapter on the flange, we'll have *maybe* 1/4" or less of
flange above the level of the finished floor. So, I guess one other
question is - just how much of the flange needs to be above the level that
the toilet will set on?

And the major leaking that damaged the most of the floor came under the wall
at the head of the toilet from another bathroom shower drain. However, the
old flange (metal) was completely rusted away - thus all the other work.


"donald girod" wrote in message
...
Actually, flange height is not all that fussy, but if it is 1/4" off the
floor, and is 1/2" thick, then you are kind of high for the toilet (total
of
3/4" above the floor). When the toilet is sitting on the finished floor,
you would like at least 1/4" clearance between the horn and the flange to
leave room for the wax ring to seal. You can check how high your
particular toilet horn sits above the flange. I suspect that it is
possible
that the leaking which damaged the original floor may possibly have been
caused by the flange being too high and making a thin seal. If you can't
lower the flange, then you should probably just make the floor 1/4"
higher.

You say "tile floor". Is this ceramic? Because if so, then the tile
itself
is going to give you at least an extra 1/4" more than, say, vinyl (the
toilet rests on top of the finished floor). But if by "tile" you just
mean vinyl tile, then raise the floor 1/4" with plywood, and deal with
whatever problems this causes (mainly at the doorway, I would think).

"L Beck" wrote in message
...
The saga continues.

Okay, so we pulled up the toilet in preparation to start the process of
laying down a new tile floor and discovered water damage severe enough
to
have to replace the sewer pipe and a new flange. The damage was also
enough
that we pulled up the old 1/2" particle board underlayment that was
under
the vinyl (it was swelled pretty badly). Here's the problem - when we
replaced that 1/2" underlayment with 1/2" plywood that we know is the
same
thickness (laid it next to some of the good stuff that wasn't damaged)
the
flange no longer sits on the floor. We've got about a 1/4" gap.

One idea is to put down 1/4" plywood over the whole floor. However, by
the
time we do that, we'll be raising the overall height of the new floor
3/4"
intead of 1/2" (we've got an adapter that will raise the flange
connector
that much). However, if we just put a 1/4" ring under the flange so
that
it
sits correctly on the underflooring, then lay the new floor, will that
spacer then make the flange assembly too high and cause the toilet to
sit
too high off the floor? Or if we leave the adapter out will we have
trouble
with the top of the flange not sitting flush on the bottom of the
toilet?

We're in a bit of a dilemna here. Do they make 1/4" flange adapters?
The
sewer pipe cannot be pushed down - it sits on another water pipe (don't
ask - we didn't build the house, and the basement ceiling is finished).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions, we'd be very grateful to hear
them.
This has turned into the project from hell. Completely redid the whole
bathroom - walls, tub (refinished, not replaced), cabinets (repainted),
sink, and walls. The floor was the last piece, and it's turned into a
major
undertaking.

Thanks to all in advance.

LB

L Beck wrote:

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, it's ceramic, and we will be putting down also a 1/4" hardibacker
board, set in mortar, then the 1/4" tile, also set in mortar. If we don't
use the 1/2" adapter on the flange, we'll have *maybe* 1/4" or less of
flange above the level of the finished floor. So, I guess one other
question is - just how much of the flange needs to be above the level that
the toilet will set on?

And the major leaking that damaged the most of the floor came under the wall
at the head of the toilet from another bathroom shower drain. However, the
old flange (metal) was completely rusted away - thus all the other work.

"donald girod" wrote in message
...
Actually, flange height is not all that fussy, but if it is 1/4" off the
floor, and is 1/2" thick, then you are kind of high for the toilet (total
of
3/4" above the floor). When the toilet is sitting on the finished floor,
you would like at least 1/4" clearance between the horn and the flange to
leave room for the wax ring to seal. You can check how high your
particular toilet horn sits above the flange. I suspect that it is
possible
that the leaking which damaged the original floor may possibly have been
caused by the flange being too high and making a thin seal. If you can't
lower the flange, then you should probably just make the floor 1/4"
higher.

You say "tile floor". Is this ceramic? Because if so, then the tile
itself
is going to give you at least an extra 1/4" more than, say, vinyl (the
toilet rests on top of the finished floor). But if by "tile" you just
mean vinyl tile, then raise the floor 1/4" with plywood, and deal with
whatever problems this causes (mainly at the doorway, I would think).

"L Beck" wrote in message
...
The saga continues.

Okay, so we pulled up the toilet in preparation to start the process of
laying down a new tile floor and discovered water damage severe enough
to
have to replace the sewer pipe and a new flange. The damage was also
enough
that we pulled up the old 1/2" particle board underlayment that was
under
the vinyl (it was swelled pretty badly). Here's the problem - when we
replaced that 1/2" underlayment with 1/2" plywood that we know is the
same
thickness (laid it next to some of the good stuff that wasn't damaged)
the
flange no longer sits on the floor. We've got about a 1/4" gap.

One idea is to put down 1/4" plywood over the whole floor. However, by
the
time we do that, we'll be raising the overall height of the new floor
3/4"
intead of 1/2" (we've got an adapter that will raise the flange
connector
that much). However, if we just put a 1/4" ring under the flange so
that
it
sits correctly on the underflooring, then lay the new floor, will that
spacer then make the flange assembly too high and cause the toilet to
sit
too high off the floor? Or if we leave the adapter out will we have
trouble
with the top of the flange not sitting flush on the bottom of the
toilet?

We're in a bit of a dilemna here. Do they make 1/4" flange adapters?
The
sewer pipe cannot be pushed down - it sits on another water pipe (don't
ask - we didn't build the house, and the basement ceiling is finished).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions, we'd be very grateful to hear
them.
This has turned into the project from hell. Completely redid the whole
bathroom - walls, tub (refinished, not replaced), cabinets (repainted),
sink, and walls. The floor was the last piece, and it's turned into a
major
undertaking.

Thanks to all in advance.

LB



when i replaced the toilet in my home the original was down to code.. it
was a concrete floor with ceramic time on it... the flange was level
with the ceramic tile... the toilet then went onto the ceramic tile and
the wax ring took care of the seal job.. i guess this is what was done
to code as the home was built by a general contractor and each job had
to be inspected by the county and the homestead to make sure it was up
to code.....
hope this helps.

Thanks to both of you for your replys. I think we know how to proceed.
Thanks again.


"jim" wrote in message ...
L Beck wrote:

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, it's ceramic, and we will be putting down also a 1/4" hardibacker
board, set in mortar, then the 1/4" tile, also set in mortar. If we
don't
use the 1/2" adapter on the flange, we'll have *maybe* 1/4" or less of
flange above the level of the finished floor. So, I guess one other
question is - just how much of the flange needs to be above the level
that
the toilet will set on?

And the major leaking that damaged the most of the floor came under the
wall
at the head of the toilet from another bathroom shower drain. However,
the
old flange (metal) was completely rusted away - thus all the other work.

"donald girod" wrote in message
...
Actually, flange height is not all that fussy, but if it is 1/4" off
the
floor, and is 1/2" thick, then you are kind of high for the toilet
(total
of
3/4" above the floor). When the toilet is sitting on the finished
floor,
you would like at least 1/4" clearance between the horn and the flange
to
leave room for the wax ring to seal. You can check how high your
particular toilet horn sits above the flange. I suspect that it is
possible
that the leaking which damaged the original floor may possibly have
been
caused by the flange being too high and making a thin seal. If you
can't
lower the flange, then you should probably just make the floor 1/4"
higher.

You say "tile floor". Is this ceramic? Because if so, then the tile
itself
is going to give you at least an extra 1/4" more than, say, vinyl
(the
toilet rests on top of the finished floor). But if by "tile" you
just
mean vinyl tile, then raise the floor 1/4" with plywood, and deal with
whatever problems this causes (mainly at the doorway, I would think).

"L Beck" wrote in message
...
The saga continues.

Okay, so we pulled up the toilet in preparation to start the process
of
laying down a new tile floor and discovered water damage severe
enough
to
have to replace the sewer pipe and a new flange. The damage was
also
enough
that we pulled up the old 1/2" particle board underlayment that was
under
the vinyl (it was swelled pretty badly). Here's the problem - when
we
replaced that 1/2" underlayment with 1/2" plywood that we know is
the
same
thickness (laid it next to some of the good stuff that wasn't
damaged)
the
flange no longer sits on the floor. We've got about a 1/4" gap.

One idea is to put down 1/4" plywood over the whole floor. However,
by
the
time we do that, we'll be raising the overall height of the new
floor
3/4"
intead of 1/2" (we've got an adapter that will raise the flange
connector
that much). However, if we just put a 1/4" ring under the flange so
that
it
sits correctly on the underflooring, then lay the new floor, will
that
spacer then make the flange assembly too high and cause the toilet
to
sit
too high off the floor? Or if we leave the adapter out will we have
trouble
with the top of the flange not sitting flush on the bottom of the
toilet?

We're in a bit of a dilemna here. Do they make 1/4" flange
adapters?
The
sewer pipe cannot be pushed down - it sits on another water pipe
(don't
ask - we didn't build the house, and the basement ceiling is
finished).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions, we'd be very grateful to
hear
them.
This has turned into the project from hell. Completely redid the
whole
bathroom - walls, tub (refinished, not replaced), cabinets
(repainted),
sink, and walls. The floor was the last piece, and it's turned into
a
major
undertaking.

Thanks to all in advance.

LB



when i replaced the toilet in my home the original was down to code.. it
was a concrete floor with ceramic time on it... the flange was level
with the ceramic tile... the toilet then went onto the ceramic tile and
the wax ring took care of the seal job.. i guess this is what was done
to code as the home was built by a general contractor and each job had
to be inspected by the county and the homestead to make sure it was up
to code.....
hope this helps.