On Wed, 04 Nov 2015 15:58:42 -0600, wrote:

On Wed, 04 Nov 2015 05:55:37 -0600, "Dean Hoffman"
wrote:

I've read of livestock not drinking because they get shocked from
the waterers. Dairy cows have supposedly held milk due to the shock from
the milkers. Both of those were from bad or inadequate neutrals. The
modern
code has all sort of neat stuff to prevent that. It must cost a bunch for
a modern barn.

What you said is a fact. Just google for "Stray Voltage". My power
company checked for this (at no cost to me), because I had a horse quit
drinking water, who became ill due to it. Fortunately I caught this in
time, and he guzzled a 5 gallon pail of water when I carried it out to
him, even though there was a filled 100 gal. stock tank in there.

It was winter, there was a stock tank heater in that tank which was
plugged into a GFCI outlet. The GFCI (should) have tripped, but didn't.
I took a multimeter and tested between the tank and a metal fence post,
and saw a very slight voltage. I then touched the tank and felt a very
slight "tickle". That's when I called the power company. They have
special meters for testing, and said they saw a voltage at that tank,
but got no stray voltage readings anywhere else on the farm.

I replaced the tank heater with a brand new one, and STILL had that
slight voltage at the tank. This even puzzled the guys from the power
company, who said that I must have a defective *NEW* heater too. I had
one more NEW heater on hand. I installed that one and still nothing
changed. I got an extension cord and plugged that heater into another
outlet. Problem GONE!

The power company said they can not work on "MY" electrical system and
said to call an electrician. After they left, I carefully checked that
entire circuit and everything was tight, the box had a good ground and
so on. That's when I found the reset button on that GFCI would not trip.
I replaced that GFCI and everything was fixed. Somehow, that defective
GFCI was actually causing the voltage leakage.

---

Another incident was when I had a neighbor feed my livestock when I was
away for a weekend. The guy left a garden hose in a stock tank, which
was touching an electric fence. The animals quit drinking and I could
see they were not doing well during hot weather. I quickly found they
drank from a 5 gal. pail. The hose was a black rubber, and somehow it
conducts electricity, because I touched it and felt a tingle.

The problem is when animals get shocked by their water, it takes weeks
for them to trust that water tank again. They dont forget! The solution
is to get a different looking tank (color, shape, size, etc). and MOVE
IT to a different location. Even then, I've watched them be very
suspicions and just sort of touch the water ever so slightly, before
actually drinking it. Once they find it "safe" they are ok with it. In
this incident, I eventually replaced that original tank in the original
location (after a few months), and they were fine with it.

* I told that neighbor to NEVER leave a hose laying in a stock tank and
never allow a hose to touch the electric fence.
Besides that, if a hose is left in a stock tank, it will siphon all the
water out of the tank.

Just a wrap of bright coloured duct tape around the top of the rank,
about 4 inched from the top can be enough to convince livestock that
it is a "different "tank, but you will likely need to move it a few
feet- and do it while they are not looking.

It's a real bugger when the staunchions get "live" in an old-style
dairy barn - or as I've seen, the stable cleaner chain. The "live"
staunchions resulted from a short from the "hump-stoppers" we
installed to keep the cattle from humping up theit backs to take a
leak or a crap, resulting in a mess in the stall instead of in the
gutter. Just a galvanizsef steel angle hung from a couple of chains
over the center of the stall and connected to an electric fence
charger. Worked great - only installed on the stalls where cattle had
the problem - and only needed to be connected to the fencer
sporadically - dumb as cattlebeasts are, they DO remember pain. We
found it also worked for "kickers" if adjusted properly. When a cow
gets ready to kick, their back goes up - when it hits the shocker, it
comes down ral fast - before they get a chance to let fly with a hoof.
Since they usually kicked when you were putting on the milker, or
taking it off, you had to be carefull not to contact the shocker
yourself when milking. It worked a bit better than holding the cow's
tail in one hand and giving it a twist when she shifted her weight to
"cock the trigger" for a kick, or tying a twine to the tail , up over
a hook in the ceiling so you could keep the tail up..
I can't remember how the electric fence got connected to the
staunchions - but I do remember the cows wouldn't go into their
stalls without a lot of coaxing for about a week. I never felt
anything while tying them.

On 11/4/2015 10:00 AM, dpb wrote:
A newer, larger operation, particularly dairy is indeed a
capital-intensive proposition. We run a stocker/feeder operation with a
small (400 head max) feedlot capability depending on the year market
outlook and availability of feed, grain, etc., while primarily a dryland
farming operation. With the high input cost of calves and the drought
we've experienced the last several years haven't had any winter wheat
sufficiently far along to pasture and hence no cattle...


I've heard that farming is a really rough
business. Not much markup, and always the
threat of losing every thing to the bank. Is
it the same with cows? Is that why you are
doing your own electrical, instead of hiring
an electrician company?

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On Thu, 05 Nov 2015 05:54:45 -0600, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 11/4/2015 10:00 AM, dpb wrote:
A newer, larger operation, particularly dairy is indeed a
capital-intensive proposition. We run a stocker/feeder operation with a
small (400 head max) feedlot capability depending on the year market
outlook and availability of feed, grain, etc., while primarily a dryland
farming operation. With the high input cost of calves and the drought
we've experienced the last several years haven't had any winter wheat
sufficiently far along to pasture and hence no cattle...


I've heard that farming is a really rough
business. Not much markup, and always the
threat of losing every thing to the bank. Is
it the same with cows? Is that why you are
doing your own electrical, instead of hiring
an electrician company?

Farming, and I presume ranching, is a bit like royalty.
One has to be born one or marry one to be one.
It would take a huge amount of money to get started. Farmers
are usually looking to expand. The cost of equipment can be spread
over a larger area. Good luck to someone who just wants to start from
scratch.
That doesn't apply to the Ted Turner types. He was into
raising bison but I have no idea if that's still true. He bought
a 26,000 acre ranch at auction in north central Nebraska a few years ago
for just under ten million dollars.

--
Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

On Thu, 05 Nov 2015 06:33:54 -0600, "Dean Hoffman"
wrote:

On Thu, 05 Nov 2015 05:54:45 -0600, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 11/4/2015 10:00 AM, dpb wrote:
A newer, larger operation, particularly dairy is indeed a
capital-intensive proposition. We run a stocker/feeder operation with a
small (400 head max) feedlot capability depending on the year market
outlook and availability of feed, grain, etc., while primarily a dryland
farming operation. With the high input cost of calves and the drought
we've experienced the last several years haven't had any winter wheat
sufficiently far along to pasture and hence no cattle...


I've heard that farming is a really rough
business. Not much markup, and always the
threat of losing every thing to the bank. Is
it the same with cows? Is that why you are
doing your own electrical, instead of hiring
an electrician company?

Farming, and I presume ranching, is a bit like royalty.
One has to be born one or marry one to be one.
It would take a huge amount of money to get started. Farmers
are usually looking to expand. The cost of equipment can be spread
over a larger area. Good luck to someone who just wants to start from
scratch.
That doesn't apply to the Ted Turner types. He was into
raising bison but I have no idea if that's still true. He bought
a 26,000 acre ranch at auction in north central Nebraska a few years ago
for just under ten million dollars.
To get started from scratch in Dairy in Ontario would be pretty close
to 10 million today if you want to run over 50 head of cattle and do
all your own field work with new equipment on 240 acres of good
farmland.

When a dairy farm goes up for sale around here (Region of Waterloo and
Oxford County area) they are very often purchased by Dutch or German
farmers who have sold their very expensive land over thare and come to
Canada to farm with a few million dollars of cash in their pockets. A
15 or 20 acre farm in the Netherlands will yeild enough money from
it's sale to purchace a running 240 acre set-up over here.

DerbyDad03 posted for all of us...



On Wednesday, November 4, 2015 at 3:59:52 PM UTC-5, wrote:


The problem is when animals get shocked by their water, it takes weeks
for them to trust that water tank again. They dont forget! The solution
is to get a different looking tank (color, shape, size, etc). and MOVE
IT to a different location. Even then, I've watched them be very
suspicions and just sort of touch the water ever so slightly, before
actually drinking it. Once they find it "safe" they are ok with it. In
this incident, I eventually replaced that original tank in the original
location (after a few months), and they were fine with it.

You can lead a horse to water....zzzaaaaappppp!

A horse is a a horse of course, of course.~~~~~~ Mr. Ed

--
Tekkie