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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken
too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. - = - Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm ---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}--- [Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards] [Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos] |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y
wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. -- Stumpy Strumpet the bimbus for dogcatcher |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 23:32:05 +0000 (UTC),
wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/s...pade%20Lug.jpg I am not exactly sure I understand your question, but if I understand correctly the wire broke off near the terminal screw at a switch. If that is true, the weakness could be caused by someone using strippers incorrectly. If they used the wrong size hole in wire stripers this can cause a weakness. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 09/04/2015 08:11 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. Unless you use a connector or paste, specifically designed to connect copper to aluminum you have a fire risk. If copper is connected directly to aluminum there will be galvanic corrosion which can arc. I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 23:32:05 +0000 (UTC),
wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Use a good brand of butt connector for the size wire you have. Be sure the crimper you use is the right type for the connector. -- Mr.E |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Friday, September 4, 2015 at 10:41:12 PM UTC-4, Seymore4Head wrote:
On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 23:32:05 +0000 (UTC), wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/s...pade%20Lug.jpg I am not exactly sure I understand your question, but if I understand correctly the wire broke off near the terminal screw at a switch. If that is true, the weakness could be caused by someone using strippers incorrectly. If they used the wrong size hole in wire stripers this can cause a weakness. And if that's the problem, then you can just strip more of the insulation off the end. If the wire is too short to have enough to properly reach the switch, then add another 6" piece and use a wire nut to secure it to the existing wire. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 05:52:09 -0500, philo wrote:
On 09/04/2015 08:11 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. Unless you use a connector or paste, specifically designed to connect copper to aluminum you have a fire risk. If copper is connected directly to aluminum there will be galvanic corrosion which can arc. I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. Although pigtailing copper to aluminum without the proper connector or paste is not a good idea, it is far less dangerous than using aluminum wire in "backstab" receptacles. That practice has NEVER been approved, and is one of the worst things you can do with aluminum wiring, safety and reliability-wise. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 07:16:13 -0400, Mr.E wrote:
On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 23:32:05 +0000 (UTC), wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Use a good brand of butt connector for the size wire you have. Be sure the crimper you use is the right type for the connector. There is only one "butt" connector approved for joining solid copper to solid aluminum wiring and it requires a special tool that can only be rented or leased from the manufacturer by operators trained and certified in it's use. Can't remember the name at the moment. Ah-yes. It's Copalum The"ideal" wire-nut designed for joining copper and aluminum is also falling out of favor as the failure rate of connections using the product is higher than anticipated - and higher than acceptable. The only good and simple way to use aluminum wiring is with devices specifically designed for use with aluminum wiring and designated as CO-ALR devices. Installed according to the included directions, particularly on second generation Al wire, they are as safe and reliable as using copper wire. If you need to connect aluminum to copper the new Alumiconn connectors also work very well but they take up a lot of box space and are not cheap. I have replaced all devices in my home with CO-ALR devices (about 5 or 6 times the price of standard "big box" copper only devices - and in the process found NO connections that showed ANY sign of overheating or poor connections (other than a few outlets that had obviously lost the tension in the place receptors, causing poor connection between plug and outlet - which is not wiring related) My house was wired in 1974 with the "second generation" aluminum wire. (aa8800) by a master electrician I knew very well, without the help of an apprentice.. I bought the house when it was 8 years old and there have been no modifications/additions made since I bought it - and the basement was professionally wired with copper by the first owner. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
wrote in message ...
Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Stay in school, kids. LOL |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
philo wrote:
On 09/04/2015 08:11 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections Wow! push in connection with Al. wire? At least it better be Al. specific parts. on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. Unless you use a connector or paste, specifically designed to connect copper to aluminum you have a fire risk. If copper is connected directly to aluminum there will be galvanic corrosion which can arc. I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. Maybe nicks in the wire when stripper is used improperly. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 05:52:09 -0500, philo wrote:
On 09/04/2015 08:11 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. Unless you use a connector or paste, specifically designed to connect copper to aluminum you have a fire risk. If copper is connected directly to aluminum there will be galvanic corrosion which can arc. I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. I agree with you that what you say is what's always said and may well be true in the overall sense. However, I didn't know about it years ago when these squish terminals started causing these problems. The squish area would get loose enough that arcing would occur there and the receptacle would "Fry". So I fixed them as I mentioned. Some of those technically incorrect repairs are now 20 + years old, as old as the system was when the first squish problems popped up. Yet none of those repaired and pigtailed receptacles has ever had a recurrence of the problem, they have all been fine for their 20+ years. Also, I have occasionally had to pull these and replace them if, for example, the receptacle was painted over too many times, or the plastic cracked from a tenant twisting a plug, etc. On a couple of them I have looked to see if there is any evidence of galvanic corrosion where I've pigtailed copper to aluminum and there has not been any evidence of it. In the 40+ years I've owned the place the only problem that's ever come up from the aluminum wires is that they squish, both under the spring push in gizmos as well as under screws (I have to retighten all the fuse panel screws that hold the wires on to the neutral buss and the breakers about every 15 years. And for the places where the aluminum was twisted around a screw, if that gets redone more then once the brittleness of the AL often results in it breaking and I'll have to strip back the wire to get a fresh start... which is why I also went to pig tailing those so I wouldn't run out of wire. I'm not disagreeing at all with what "good practice" would be, just saying that the corrosion issue and need for special connectors and anti-corrosion pastes, which I never used, has not shown up as a problem in these many many years. Perhaps it's due to AZ's very low humidity. Last time I worked on the wires to add some GFI's I was going to use the special connectors and paste but couldn't find any at the usual retail outlets so just did it the same as in the past. If anyone is still reading and is "in the biz", have you ever worked with aluminum and actually seen problems from not using the special connectors and anti-corrosion paste? |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 10:25:02 -0500, philo wrote:
On 09/05/2015 08:23 AM, wrote: snip I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. Although pigtailing copper to aluminum without the proper connector or paste is not a good idea, it is far less dangerous than using aluminum wire in "backstab" receptacles. That practice has NEVER been approved, and is one of the worst things you can do with aluminum wiring, safety and reliability-wise. Agreed and for that matter I don't use the "backstab" at all... I take the few extra seconds it takes to use the screw connection and make sure it's tight. The new "back feed" devices are pretty good. They don't use a springtab - they use a screw but do not require bending the wire to fit around the screw, and the co-alr devices have a set pressure due to usre of a bellview type spring washer. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 10:38:40 -0600, Tony Hwang
wrote: philo wrote: On 09/04/2015 08:11 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:30:19 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 04 Sep 2015 17:03:39 -0700, Don Y wrote: On 9/4/2015 4:32 PM, wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months. Why are the wires breaking? There should be no mechanical stresses transfered to the wires from the user's operation of the switch. Good question. Is someone bending them back and forth until they break. How old is the house? I've never had one break. I've got aluminum wire in one house. Very few have broken but some have been squished by 40 years of pressure of the push in connections Wow! push in connection with Al. wire? At least it better be Al. specific parts. No such part exists. on the switches and receptacles that they no longer have enough pressure to maintain solid contact. I often pigtail a copper wire to them to avoid a repeat. Unless you use a connector or paste, specifically designed to connect copper to aluminum you have a fire risk. If copper is connected directly to aluminum there will be galvanic corrosion which can arc. I would totally get rid of the aluminum wire even though it's obviously going to be a big job. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 9/5/2015 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 10:25:02 -0500, philo wrote: The new "back feed" devices are pretty good. They don't use a springtab - they use a screw but do not require bending the wire to fit around the screw, and the co-alr devices have a set pressure due to usre of a bellview type spring washer. Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - .. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .. www.lds.org .. .. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
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Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 09/05/2015 01:01 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote:
snip I'm not disagreeing at all with what "good practice" would be, just saying that the corrosion issue and need for special connectors and anti-corrosion pastes, which I never used, has not shown up as a problem in these many many years. Perhaps it's due to AZ's very low humidity. Last time I worked on the wires to add some GFI's I was going to use the special connectors and paste but couldn't find any at the usual retail outlets so just did it the same as in the past. If anyone is still reading and is "in the biz", have you ever worked with aluminum and actually seen problems from not using the special connectors and anti-corrosion paste? The low humidity may have helped. My only experience was with a high-powered transformer when one of the terminals burned off. I cut back into good aluminum and crimped a copped lug onto it. It eventually burned off...however even if I used an approved lug my guess is that it would have burned off too...so that's not much to go on |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 10:35:19 -0500, philo wrote:
On 09/05/2015 01:01 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote: snip I'm not disagreeing at all with what "good practice" would be, just saying that the corrosion issue and need for special connectors and anti-corrosion pastes, which I never used, has not shown up as a problem in these many many years. Perhaps it's due to AZ's very low humidity. Last time I worked on the wires to add some GFI's I was going to use the special connectors and paste but couldn't find any at the usual retail outlets so just did it the same as in the past. If anyone is still reading and is "in the biz", have you ever worked with aluminum and actually seen problems from not using the special connectors and anti-corrosion paste? The low humidity may have helped. My only experience was with a high-powered transformer when one of the terminals burned off. I cut back into good aluminum and crimped a copped lug onto it. It eventually burned off...however even if I used an approved lug my guess is that it would have burned off too...so that's not much to go on High humidity here in the "interlaken" region of Southern Ontario hasn.t seemed to cause any problems. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
Many thanks. DIdn't realise there wasn an al-cu issue, tho we have only
1965 copper. (In 1980, I dropped electrochem to take stat thermo instead!) Basically it is the two places I have replaced switches most often. One in th ebathroom, I put a series of timers and humidity detectors. THe timer is acting up but is ok if I don't set it to max. (BTW after trying a series of humidity detectors, th eone from Broan works great - 55% winter 75% summer for bath fan). THe othe ris my study where i have replaced over five dimmers in the past twenty years. THe last time, a few years go, the tips of the wire broke off. I imagine I can just extend the wire the traditional way, splice another piece of wire, but I'm afraid it is too "fragile". I could solder it and tape it. Of course the "code" rule would be to run the wire new from the fuse box. (I co-own the hosue with two uncles who are electrical engineers and they can be very obsessive.) I have come across some boxes in the house where it seems the builder extended the wire because it was too short? - = - Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm ---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}--- [Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards] [Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos] |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Saturday, September 5, 2015 at 4:29:53 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 9/5/2015 4:02 PM, wrote: On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 10:25:02 -0500, philo wrote: The new "back feed" devices are pretty good. They don't use a springtab - they use a screw but do not require bending the wire to fit around the screw, and the co-alr devices have a set pressure due to usre of a bellview type spring washer. Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - . Are you referring to the type where you must tighten the screw after sticking the stripped end of the wire through the hole in the back of the wiring device? If it's what I'm thinking, it's a commercial grade device that I've used with stranded wire. You can also side wire them. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wire Monster |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 17:38:37 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster
wrote: On Saturday, September 5, 2015 at 4:29:53 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: On 9/5/2015 4:02 PM, wrote: On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 10:25:02 -0500, philo wrote: The new "back feed" devices are pretty good. They don't use a springtab - they use a screw but do not require bending the wire to fit around the screw, and the co-alr devices have a set pressure due to usre of a bellview type spring washer. Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - . Are you referring to the type where you must tighten the screw after sticking the stripped end of the wire through the hole in the back of the wiring device? If it's what I'm thinking, it's a commercial grade device that I've used with stranded wire. You can also side wire them. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wire Monster That's the animal. great for a DIY install because it is pretty hard to screw up the installation. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Sunday, September 6, 2015 at 11:08:25 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 17:38:37 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster wrote: On Saturday, September 5, 2015 at 4:29:53 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: On 9/5/2015 4:02 PM, wrote: On Sat, 5 Sep 2015 10:25:02 -0500, philo wrote: The new "back feed" devices are pretty good. They don't use a springtab - they use a screw but do not require bending the wire to fit around the screw, and the co-alr devices have a set pressure due to usre of a bellview type spring washer. Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - Are you referring to the type where you must tighten the screw after sticking the stripped end of the wire through the hole in the back of the wiring device? If it's what I'm thinking, it's a commercial grade device that I've used with stranded wire. You can also side wire them. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wire Monster That's the animal. great for a DIY install because it is pretty hard to screw up the installation. I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing the $0..59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. If you're wondering what a hospital grade outlet is, it's one designed so that the power cord of a floor polisher can be yanked out of the outlet sideways so the outlet isn't damaged. The outlets are usually made out of nylon and can be whacked with a hammer without sustaining damage. I'd install them around my shop and workbench, especially if I'd be plugging and unplugging power cords frequently. I'd also spring for the unbreakable, flexible nylon faceplates. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wiring Monster |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 9/6/2015 8:38 PM, Uncle Monster wrote:
On Saturday, September 5, 2015 at 4:29:53 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - . Are you referring to the type where you must tighten the screw after sticking the stripped end of the wire through the hole in the back of the wiring device? If it's what I'm thinking, it's a commercial grade device that I've used with stranded wire. You can also side wire them. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wire Monster Agree, it has two square pieces of metal which come together when you tighten the screw. I can imagine you can loop the wire around the screw and tighten, though with more work. For us old traditionalists. - .. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .. www.lds.org .. .. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 9/7/2015 6:27 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:
I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing the $0.59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. If you're wondering what a hospital grade outlet is, it's one designed so that the power cord of a floor polisher can be yanked out of the outlet sideways so the outlet isn't damaged. The outlets are usually made out of nylon and can be whacked with a hammer without sustaining damage. I'd install them around my shop and workbench, especially if I'd be plugging and unplugging power cords frequently. I'd also spring for the unbreakable, flexible nylon faceplates. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wiring Monster Of course, the usage cycle and type of use is a factor. For hall sockets at church, need a better grade of socket. Frequent vacuum cleaner plug, remove, yank, and people who can't figure out they are at the end of the cord. For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. - .. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .. www.lds.org .. .. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 5:36:19 AM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 9/7/2015 6:27 AM, Uncle Monster wrote: I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing the $0.59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. If you're wondering what a hospital grade outlet is, it's one designed so that the power cord of a floor polisher can be yanked out of the outlet sideways so the outlet isn't damaged. The outlets are usually made out of nylon and can be whacked with a hammer without sustaining damage. I'd install them around my shop and workbench, especially if I'd be plugging and unplugging power cords frequently. I'd also spring for the unbreakable, flexible nylon faceplates. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wiring Monster Of course, the usage cycle and type of use is a factor. For hall sockets at church, need a better grade of socket. Frequent vacuum cleaner plug, remove, yank, and people who can't figure out they are at the end of the cord. For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. - In a kitchen, I'd always install a commercial grade because they'll keep a better connection under load and last longer. The internal contacts are tighter and will grip a plug better. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Grip Monster |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 9/7/2015 7:22 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:
On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 5:36:19 AM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. - In a kitchen, I'd always install a commercial grade because they'll keep a better connection under load and last longer. The internal contacts are tighter and will grip a plug better. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Grip Monster I guess you and I can't agree on that. No worries, I'm okay until it catches fire.... - .. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .. www.lds.org .. .. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Friday, September 4, 2015 at 10:41:12 PM UTC-4, Seymore4Head wrote:
On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 23:32:05 +0000 (UTC), wrote: Are there special kits and procedures when the wires for a switch have broken too often at the tips? I fixe dtwo switched two years ago like that and although the need isn't urgent, I could seeit arising in a few months http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/s...pade%20Lug.jpg Are lugs of that type allowed by code to be used inside a switch or receptacle box? I am not exactly sure I understand your question, but if I understand correctly the wire broke off near the terminal screw at a switch. If that is true, the weakness could be caused by someone using strippers incorrectly. If they used the wrong size hole in wire stripers this can cause a weakness. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
I am not exactly sure I understand your question, but if I understand correctly the wire broke off near the terminal screw at a switch. If that is true, the weakness could be caused by someone using strippers incorrectly. If they used the wrong size hole in wire stripers this can cause a weakness. i have a 100% solution for broken wires where the box is too small and the wires too short. install new wiring and abandon the original box, thats what blank covers are for:) sometimes its just easier. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Mon, 7 Sep 2015 06:33:08 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote: On 9/6/2015 8:38 PM, Uncle Monster wrote: On Saturday, September 5, 2015 at 4:29:53 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: Some I've seen, I call em back clamp. Which is fine with me. - . Are you referring to the type where you must tighten the screw after sticking the stripped end of the wire through the hole in the back of the wiring device? If it's what I'm thinking, it's a commercial grade device that I've used with stranded wire. You can also side wire them. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wire Monster Agree, it has two square pieces of metal which come together when you tighten the screw. I can imagine you can loop the wire around the screw and tighten, though with more work. For us old traditionalists. - . On the "side terminal" you can, but not in the back feed (or side clamp)- On some it is a small round hole, just like the old spring-tab type, that only allows a 1/2" long sstraight strippec condictor to be inserted, and the the screw is tightened to hold it firmly. On others you use the same side screw and either use the bent wire between the plate and the screw, or the straigt wire beweeen the plate and the terminal body.. I sure prefer the side clamp type backwire installation - both to install and to remove later. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus . www.lds.org . . |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Mon, 7 Sep 2015 06:36:16 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote: On 9/7/2015 6:27 AM, Uncle Monster wrote: I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing the $0.59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. If you're wondering what a hospital grade outlet is, it's one designed so that the power cord of a floor polisher can be yanked out of the outlet sideways so the outlet isn't damaged. The outlets are usually made out of nylon and can be whacked with a hammer without sustaining damage. I'd install them around my shop and workbench, especially if I'd be plugging and unplugging power cords frequently. I'd also spring for the unbreakable, flexible nylon faceplates. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Wiring Monster Of course, the usage cycle and type of use is a factor. For hall sockets at church, need a better grade of socket. Frequent vacuum cleaner plug, remove, yank, and people who can't figure out they are at the end of the cord. For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. - . Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus . www.lds.org . . How many watts is the toaster? Countertop kitchen outlets are one place I WANT the high quality devices because they often get high-wattage loads, like coffeemakers, electric frypans, toasters, and heavy duty mixers etc. Then again, some peoples kitchens get used as kitchens - and others just as snack-bars. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On 9/7/2015 12:17 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 7 Sep 2015 06:36:16 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote: For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. How many watts is the toaster? Countertop kitchen outlets are one place I WANT the high quality devices because they often get high-wattage loads, like coffeemakers, electric frypans, toasters, and heavy duty mixers etc. Then again, some peoples kitchens get used as kitchens - and others just as snack-bars. I'd have to go look. Probably 750, just a SWAG. If the socket got frequent plug and remove, I'd go with better quality. - .. Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .. www.lds.org .. .. |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 6:53:52 AM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 9/7/2015 7:22 AM, Uncle Monster wrote: On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 5:36:19 AM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote: For my kitchen socket (toaster unplugged couple times a year to shake the dried wheat out of the toaster) a 59 center is fine for me. - In a kitchen, I'd always install a commercial grade because they'll keep a better connection under load and last longer. The internal contacts are tighter and will grip a plug better. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Grip Monster I guess you and I can't agree on that. No worries, I'm okay until it catches fire.... - . The tighter the connection the lower the contact resistance and the less chance that the contacts will heat up and increase the resistance causing more heat then become hotter and hotter until it finally burns up. I doubt the house will burn down if the outlet in in an approved metal or plastic box. Besides, if you burn up, I can't argue with you anymore. o_O [8~{} Uncle Outlet Monster |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing
the $0.59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. I installed commercial grade receptacles in our kitchen when we built our house. Like you, I figured they would be a better choice for outlets that would have things plugged and unplugged frequently. However, after a couple months of living in the house, I replaced them with the cheap 59 cent versions. The insertion and withdrawal pressure needed with the commercial receptacles was just too excessive. It was very difficult to plug anything in, and it seemed like the plug would be damaged trying to unplug the device. Either that or we would end up getting shocked wrestling with the plug. The cheap receptacles are easier to insert plugs into. If they start to wear out, it's easy to replace the outlet with another cheap socket. Replacing a broken appliance cord is often a lot more work and expense. The one situation I can see the commercial sockets working better is for outlets where appliances are always plugged in, like a microwave or something. For what it's worth, we've lived in our house 11 years now and the cheap sockets still work like the day I installed them. Just my experience... Anthony Watson www.watsondiy.com www.mountainsoftware.com |
Extend old worn in-wall wiring
On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 11:31:00 PM UTC-5, HerHusband wrote:
I'd always spend extra money on wiring devices instead of purchasing the $0.59 receptacles. I'd go with at least commercial grade then up to hospital grade depending on the application. I installed commercial grade receptacles in our kitchen when we built our house. Like you, I figured they would be a better choice for outlets that would have things plugged and unplugged frequently. However, after a couple months of living in the house, I replaced them with the cheap 59 cent versions. The insertion and withdrawal pressure needed with the commercial receptacles was just too excessive. It was very difficult to plug anything in, and it seemed like the plug would be damaged trying to unplug the device. Either that or we would end up getting shocked wrestling with the plug. The cheap receptacles are easier to insert plugs into. If they start to wear out, it's easy to replace the outlet with another cheap socket. Replacing a broken appliance cord is often a lot more work and expense. The one situation I can see the commercial sockets working better is for outlets where appliances are always plugged in, like a microwave or something. For what it's worth, we've lived in our house 11 years now and the cheap sockets still work like the day I installed them. Just my experience... Anthony Watson I don't know what brand commercial outlets you were using but I've never had one that required excessive force to insert or remove. Even the tighter hospital grade outlets have never seemed to take excessive force to me but that's just me. Me and my brother completely wired a beauty shop with the high end commercial grade outlets because of the loads from all the hair dryers. The handheld dryers were plugged in and removed often at the operator stations and none of the outlets ever failed. ^_^ [8~{} Uncle Plug Monster |
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