No, this post is not going to be about the shootings there.

But, when I was listening to the news I decided to sit down at my computer and finally find out something that's perplexed me for years.

What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?

When I Google "District of Columbia", I get a map of a square-ish looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

When I Google "Washington", I get a map of a square-ish looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

There is only one map for both the City of Washington DC and for the District of Columbia.

And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.

I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.

So that just creates more questions for me...
Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside the District of Columbia?

If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be "Washington, DC"?

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.

Does anyone in here live near Washington?

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 01:37:55 +0200, nestork
wrote:


No, this post is not going to be about the shootings there.

But, when I was listening to the news I decided to sit down at my
computer and finally find out something that's perplexed me for years.

What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of
Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?

When I Google "District of Columbia", I get a map of a square-ish
looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

When I Google "Washington", I get a map of a square-ish looking chunk of
ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

There is only one map for both the City of Washington DC and for the
District of Columbia.

And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the
entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.

I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city
of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much
larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be
the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.

So that just creates more questions for me...
Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of
Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland
and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside
the District of Columbia?

If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders
of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be
"Washington, DC"?

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.

Does anyone in here live near Washington?

You ask a lot of good questions. Unfortunately I don't know the
answers but I, as well as all U.S. citizens, should.

As we all know that is but one of the many mysteries of that city,
district, area, locale or whatever. The last five years have
certainly seen an increasing frequency of the mysteries emanating from
that region.

nestork wrote in news:nestork.c7d54f8
@diybanter.com:



I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia,



Because they are one and the same, but with two "existences".

"DC" is the federal existence. The "City" is the municipal existence. The
"City" is responsible for such things as painting lines on the roads, the
sewers, the water, etc. All the feds do is ride into town on the Metro,
tell you how to run your life, then eat fancy and excellent meals at the
Capital Grill (charged to the taxpayer, of course).

DC's license plates say "Taxation Without Representation". That's an open
municipal protest agains the fact that DC can't vote federally, meaning
that DC has no representation in Congress and thus has no say in the
federal taxes that are levied on DC residents.



and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.



Whoo. You've never been down there, have you? Very little farmland around
DC.



--
Tegger

Tegger wrote in
:

The "City" is responsible for such things as painting lines on the
roads, the sewers, the water, etc.



Boy, I really should have paid more attention to my sentence structure in
that past reply.

Obviously the City is NOT painting lines on the sewers and the water, but
is instead responsible for the upkeep of those two things; and in addition
is reponsible for painting lines on the roads, among many other mundane
municipal matters.


--
Tegger

No, I totally get the part that the city of Washington has both a municipal government (presumably it has a mayor and a city hall and city councillors) as well as a federal government (with the White House as the "head office" of the Federal Government). I was always just hung up on the geography.

OK, so if I understand this correctly, the following statements are all true:

1. Originally, the city of Washington was a urban center much smaller than the District of Columbia, but over the 200 years or whatever since the District of Columbia was established, the city of Washington has grown to cover the entire District of Columbia. This is why the map of the city of Washington is the same as the map of the District of Columbia.

2. The city of "Washington" exists only inside the perimeter of the District of Columbia border.

3. All urban development outside the perimeter of the District of Columbia are suburbs of the city of Washington either in Maryland or Virginia; such as Bethesda, Maryland where the famous military hospital is, or Arlington, Virginia where the famous military cemetary is.

That makes sense to me now.

I've never been further East than Toronto, Ontario, and I can count the number of major US cities I've been in on the fingers of one hand. (I'm not counting Grand Forks, North Dakota as a major city.) But, Washington and the District of Columbia were always confusing to me because maps would label the same chunk of land as being both Washington, D.C. and the District of Columbia, and the only way that could make sense was if the city covered the entire District, but I wasn't sure if it did or not, or that's what the map makers meant or not.

Thanks all.

On 9/16/2013 10:43 PM, nestork wrote:
No, I totally get the part that the city of Washington has both a
municipal government (presumably it has a mayor and a city hall and city
councillors) as well as a federal government (with the White House as
the "head office" of the Federal Government). I was always just hung up
on the geography.

OK, so if I understand this correctly, the following statements are all
true:

1. Originally, the city of Washington was a urban center much smaller
than the District of Columbia, but over the 200 years or whatever since
the District of Columbia was established, the city of Washington has
grown to cover the entire District of Columbia. This is why the map of
the city of Washington is the same as the map of the District of
Columbia.
....

That misconception is probably my fault for sloppy writing...

Sorry I used "founded"; while typing I forgot to make it clear about the
District being established as part of the (then new) Constitution just
presuming that was known when, of course, the whole point is that you
being Canadian don't/didn't necessarily know that otoyh. I just meant
that initially there wasn't enough City to come close to covering the
full 10-mi sq area as there was no settlement there prior to the
establishment of the District--some of the earliest pictures of the
place are pretty entertaining with mud streets and all surrounding the
building going on.

--

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 05:43:07 +0200, nestork
wrote:

Arlington, Virginia where the famous military cemetary is.

Some interesting history about how the land became government land and
the Arlington House.

The Arlington House and the National Cemetery should be on any
visitor's list of things to do. Items belonging to Gen. Robert E. Lee
were still on display when I visited years ago.

http://www.arlingtoncemetery.mil/History/Facts/ArlingtonHouse.aspx

Oren wrote in news:tosg39tpdn3vp12b83uulrs4r4ebbvhtfk@
4ax.com:

Items belonging to Gen. Robert E. Lee
were still on display when I visited years ago.



The Museum of the Confederacy in Richmond, VA, also has many of Lee's
possessions from when he was the South's military commander. The White
House of the Confederacy is right next door. I highly recommend both those
places, if you're as historically-interested as I am.

Not in DC, but very close to it in Fairfax, VA -- a "must see" as far as
I'm concerned -- is the NRA museum; they've done a superb job of presenting
firearms in a historical context; it's easily the equal of any of the
Smithsonian establishments.

--
Tegger

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 00:54:20 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 05:43:07 +0200, nestork
wrote:


No, I totally get the part that the city of Washington has both a
municipal government (presumably it has a mayor and a city hall and city
councillors) as well as a federal government (with the White House as
the "head office" of the Federal Government). I was always just hung up
on the geography.

OK, so if I understand this correctly, the following statements are all
true:

1. Originally, the city of Washington was a urban center much smaller
than the District of Columbia, but over the 200 years or whatever since
the District of Columbia was established, the city of Washington has
grown to cover the entire District of Columbia. This is why the map of
the city of Washington is the same as the map of the District of
Columbia.


No the District was defines in Article 1 section 8 of the Constitution
(as a 10 mile square). The chunk that is missing in Virginia was
separated in the Civil war.

Are you sure? I can't see the federal goverment looking kindly on
Virginia during or soon after the Civil War. I know that Congress
did return that part of DC that was in Virginia, and looking in wikip,
it says that happened in 1846.

Maybe you're thinking of West Virginia, that separated from Virgnia
during the Civil War, because the majority of its people didnt' want
to secede.


When Mayor Schaeffer was governor of Maryland, he said that the
Maryland part of DC should go back to Maryland. This would have given
DC folks a vote for the Md. senators and equal treatment in
Congress**. DC should have jumped on it, because no one else from Md.
is likely to agree to it, because it dilutes the votes of Marylanders
for senators. (but he was a pretty powerful governor, who likely
could have pushed it through the state legislature.) It really is
unfair to DC folk.

**It would have given them votes in the electoral college for
President, but they got that anyhow, by amending the Constitution I
suppose, before or after Schaeffer was governor.


2. The city of "Washington" exists only inside the perimeter of the
District of Columbia border.


True

I should add that DC has no one in the Senate but does have a
"non-voting" elected member of the House of Representatives,, usually
Eleanor Holmes Norton.

When the Democrats control the House, she gets a vote in whatever
committees she belongs to, and the House itself usually sits as a
"committee of the whole", in which she also gets a vote. it's legal
and I think it's fair.

When the Republicans control the House, she gets nothing.

On 9/16/2013 6:37 PM, nestork wrote:
....

What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of
Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?

None.

....

And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the
entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.

I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city
of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much
larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be
the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.

Indeed, it is the latter, not the former, now. Obviously, way back when
it was founded that wasn't so but is now and has been for quite some time.

So that just creates more questions for me...
Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of
Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland
and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside
the District of Columbia?

No, no, and no. Outside of Washington, DC, one is in either the state
of MD or VA (south of the Potomac) and there are a zillion suburban
communities of that many names -- larger ones are heard of like Silver
Spring, College Park, Bethesda, MD or Arlington, or Alexandria, VA, but
most of them nobody outside the area knows what they are any more than
anybody anywhere removed from Montreal or Toronto knows the names of
their suburbs, either.

If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders
of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be
"Washington, DC"?

No, they'll have a mailing address of, say, Bethesda, MD w/ their own
ZIP code, etc., etc., etc, ...

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.
....

It's not (at least much) farmland for miles away in all directions but
metropolitan area but only the DC environs are actually Washington, DC,
in actual fact; the rest are in the DC metro area but are their own
little (or not so little) places.

--

On 9/16/2013 7:54 PM, dpb wrote:
On 9/16/2013 6:37 PM, nestork wrote:
...

What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of
Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?

None.

...

And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the
entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.

I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city
of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much
larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be
the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.

Indeed, it is the latter, not the former, now. Obviously, way back when
it was founded that wasn't so but is now and has been for quite some time.

So that just creates more questions for me...
Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of
Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland
and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside
the District of Columbia?

No, no, and no. Outside of Washington, DC, one is in either the state of
MD or VA (south of the Potomac) and there are a zillion suburban
communities of that many names -- larger ones are heard of like Silver
Spring, College Park, Bethesda, MD or Arlington, or Alexandria, VA, but
most of them nobody outside the area knows what they are any more than
anybody anywhere removed from Montreal or Toronto knows the names of
their suburbs, either.

If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders
of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be
"Washington, DC"?

No, they'll have a mailing address of, say, Bethesda, MD w/ their own
ZIP code, etc., etc., etc, ...

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.
...

It's not (at least much) farmland for miles away in all directions but
metropolitan area but only the DC environs are actually Washington, DC,
in actual fact; the rest are in the DC metro area but are their own
little (or not so little) places.


ADDENDUM

While geographically the two entities of DC, the city and the district,
coincide there are two actual political entities.

And, while there are all these place names around the District, there
are also named neighborhoods/districts within the District itself --
Bellevue, Congress Heights, Brookland, ..., which at one time were more
or less separate themselves before the whole area got covered up and
paved over.

Never fortunately had to live there; in a former life used to have to go
and testify before the Nuclear Regulatory Commission for employer on
licensing issues for commercial power reactors and thereby spent far
more time there than would have otherwise done. Much interesting to
visit but absolute hell to get out of on a Friday afternoon to get home
back in Lynchburg (VA) by anything approaching a decent hour.

--

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 01:37:55 +0200, nestork
wrote:


If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders
of the District of Columbia,

Not possible.

would their mailing address still be
"Washington, DC"?

Georgetown, Maryland existed before the District was created. I
think that was the only town in what is now the District. (Can't say
"incorporated town" because I think there are only 1 or 2 or 3
incorporated towns in the whole state.

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.

If you go north of DC, it's all on the way to being developed for
commuter housing, plus the things that go with that. It's going to be
one long city from DC to Boston along I-95. But if you go west or
east of the district I'd guess 30 miles, there is farmland.

Does anyone in here live near Washington?

I live about 35 miles from the Capitol. North. Just NW of
Baltimore.

There used to be a farm a tenth of a mile from me, when I moved here
30 years ago. They grew corn. Later they grew hay. and later they
died and their kids finally sold their little farm just before the
economy crashed. Supposed to build expensive townhouses for the last
several years, but haven't. The kids gave the barn to a museum and
the house is still there.

On Monday, September 16, 2013 7:37:55 PM UTC-4, nestork wrote:
No, this post is not going to be about the shootings there.



But, when I was listening to the news I decided to sit down at my

computer and finally find out something that's perplexed me for years.



What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of

Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?



When I Google "District of Columbia", I get a map of a square-ish

looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.



When I Google "Washington", I get a map of a square-ish looking chunk of

ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.



There is only one map for both the City of Washington DC and for the

District of Columbia.



And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the

entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.



I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city

of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much

larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be

the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.



So that just creates more questions for me...

Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of

Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland

and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside

the District of Columbia?



If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders

of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be

"Washington, DC"?



I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both

the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit

it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into

farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.



Does anyone in here live near Washington?









--

nestork

Arlington is in VA but I believe the cemetery is part of DC

On 09/16/2013 07:37 PM, nestork wrote:
No, this post is not going to be about the shootings there.

But, when I was listening to the news I decided to sit down at my
computer and finally find out something that's perplexed me for years.

What is the difference, geographically speaking, between the city of
Washington DC, and the District of Columbia?

When I Google "District of Columbia", I get a map of a square-ish
looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

When I Google "Washington", I get a map of a square-ish looking chunk of
ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

There is only one map for both the City of Washington DC and for the
District of Columbia.

And, it occurs to me that the only way that could happen is if the
entire District of Columbia was covered by city of Washington DC.

I always envisioned the District of Columbia to be an area with the city
of Washington inside it, much like Winnipeg is a city inside the much
larger province of Manitoba. In this case, we have what appears to be
the whole District of Columbia covered by the city of Washington, DC.

So that just creates more questions for me...
Does the city of washington extend past the borders of the District of
Columbia, and if so, are there also the Cities of Washington, Maryland
and Washington, Virginia which are part of the same city, but outside
the District of Columbia?

If someone lives in the City of Washington, but outside of the borders
of the District of Columbia, would their mailing address still be
"Washington, DC"?

I was always confused by the fact that you guys have one map for both
the City of Washington, DC and the District of Columbia, and I can't fit
it in my head that the city is going to stop and suddenly turn into
farmland right on the border of the District of Columbia.

Does anyone in here live near Washington?



They're the same (the City of Washington and the District of
Columbia)... and I stay out of it whenever I can.

All of DC is on the MD side of the Potomac River - Arlington, VA used to
be part of DC but was ceded back to VA in the 1800s. If you look at a
map and follow the border of DC to the rest of MD, then cross the river
and follow the border of Arlington County, it forms a square tilted a
little bit.

nate


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 01:37:55 +0200, nestork
wrote:

When I Google "District of Columbia", I get a map of a square-ish
looking chunk of ground on the border between Maryland and Virginia.

... a few historical maps...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/local/historic-washington-DC-maps/images/washington-DC-map-1860.jpg

http://www.dcvote.org/trellis/character/maps/18.jpg

http://dc.lostsoulsgenealogy.com/maps/1800.jpg

On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 14:03:04 -0700, Oren wrote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/local/historic-washington-DC-maps/images/washington-DC-map-1860.jpg


.... includes the U.S. Military Asylum and the U.S. Lunatic Asylum.

Oren wrote:
On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 14:03:04 -0700, Oren
wrote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/local/historic-washington-DC-maps/images/washington-DC-map-1860.jpg


... includes the U.S. Military Asylum and the U.S. Lunatic
Asylum.

pentagon and congress?

On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 01:07:11 -0500, "ChairMan"
wrote:

Oren wrote:
On Tue, 17 Sep 2013 14:03:04 -0700, Oren
wrote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/local/historic-washington-DC-maps/images/washington-DC-map-1860.jpg


... includes the U.S. Military Asylum and the U.S. Lunatic
Asylum.

pentagon and congress?


I'll leave that to those most qualified to decide the merits.