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#1
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What length screw to use?
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2"
drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks |
#2
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 8:51*am, "Joe J" wrote:
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. *Finished with 1/2" drywall. *Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? *The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. *Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks It's not the length, it's how you use them :-) |
#3
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What length screw to use?
Joe J wrote:
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- |
#4
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 9:18*am, dpb wrote:
Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. *Finished with 1/2" drywall. *Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? *The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. * Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- He didn't say he had drywall screws. He's saying that he has to go through a 2x4 and drywall to reach the stud. With three inch screws he's going to get about an inch into the stud. With 3 1/2 it will be a bit more. If I had the 3" laying around I might just use a few more of them and consider it to be good enough. |
#5
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What length screw to use?
On 6/8/2010 8:18 AM, dpb wrote:
Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- he never said anything about 'drywall' screws. And i don't think drywall screws come 3 or 3 1/2 inches long anyway. -- Steve Barker remove the "not" from my address to email |
#6
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 3:51*pm, Steve Barker wrote:
On 6/8/2010 8:18 AM, dpb wrote: Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- he never said anything about 'drywall' screws. *And i don't think drywall screws come 3 or 3 1/2 inches long anyway. Of course you don't think (they indeed do). |
#7
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What length screw to use?
On 6/8/2010 3:58 PM, keith wrote:
On Jun 8, 3:51 pm, Steve wrote: On 6/8/2010 8:18 AM, dpb wrote: Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- he never said anything about 'drywall' screws. And i don't think drywall screws come 3 or 3 1/2 inches long anyway. Of course you don't think (they indeed do). Nice. Insult me, when it was YOU that made the mistake. -- Steve Barker remove the "not" from my address to email |
#8
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What length screw to use?
On Tue, 08 Jun 2010 16:05:11 -0500, Steve Barker
wrote: On 6/8/2010 3:58 PM, keith wrote: On Jun 8, 3:51 pm, Steve wrote: On 6/8/2010 8:18 AM, dpb wrote: Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Ditch the drywall screws for the purpose entirely. -- he never said anything about 'drywall' screws. And i don't think drywall screws come 3 or 3 1/2 inches long anyway. Of course you don't think (they indeed do). Nice. Insult me, when it was YOU that made the mistake. Wrong again, dope. |
#9
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What length screw to use?
On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 07:51:30 -0500, "Joe J" wrote:
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks When choosing length, try to have about 1/3 of the screw in the piece being fastened and the remaining 2/3 of the screw threaded into the piece being fastened to. As the thickness of the lumber increases though, this ratio can be reduced to 1/2 if absolutely necessary. That's why only 2/3 of the shank is typically threaded on our 1" and longer wood screws. In your example the preferred screw length would be ~4-1/2" to 5" Gordon Shumway A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own. |
#10
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 10:04*am, Gordon Shumway wrote:
On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 07:51:30 -0500, "Joe J" wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. *Finished with 1/2" drywall. *Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? *The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves.. *Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks When choosing length, try to have about 1/3 of the screw in the piece being fastened and the remaining 2/3 of the screw threaded into the piece being fastened to. As the thickness of the lumber increases though, this ratio can be reduced to 1/2 if absolutely necessary. That's why only 2/3 of the shank is typically threaded on our 1" and longer wood screws. In your example the preferred screw length would be ~4-1/2" to 5" Gordon Shumway A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own. Since he suggested using a 3" I believe he is going through the narrow dimension of a 2x4. Which is around 1 1/2" plus 1/2" of wall board. |
#11
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What length screw to use?
"jamesgangnc" wrote in message ... On Jun 8, 10:04 am, Gordon Shumway wrote: On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 07:51:30 -0500, "Joe J" wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks When choosing length, try to have about 1/3 of the screw in the piece being fastened and the remaining 2/3 of the screw threaded into the piece being fastened to. As the thickness of the lumber increases though, this ratio can be reduced to 1/2 if absolutely necessary. That's why only 2/3 of the shank is typically threaded on our 1" and longer wood screws. In your example the preferred screw length would be ~4-1/2" to 5" Gordon Shumway A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own. Since he suggested using a 3" I believe he is going through the narrow dimension of a 2x4. Which is around 1 1/2" plus 1/2" of wall board. Correct, 1 5/8 to be exact, plus the drywall at 1/2". So, 2 1/8" total. If I drive them through the 2x4 hard, they'll countersink about an 1/8, so I would have about 1" into the stud. |
#12
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 9:16*am, "Joe J" wrote:
snip Since he suggested using a 3" I believe he is going through the narrow dimension of a 2x4. *Which is around 1 1/2" plus 1/2" of wall board. Correct, 1 5/8 to be exact, snip 1 1/2" has been the standard stud thickness now for many decades. Google 'lumber thickness standards for more info. Joe |
#13
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What length screw to use?
Gordon Shumway wrote:
On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 07:51:30 -0500, "Joe J" wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks When choosing length, try to have about 1/3 of the screw in the piece being fastened and the remaining 2/3 of the screw threaded into the piece being fastened to. As the thickness of the lumber increases though, this ratio can be reduced to 1/2 if absolutely necessary. That's why only 2/3 of the shank is typically threaded on our 1" and longer wood screws. No, the shank of a wood screw is smooth so that the screw will slip through the material being held and snug it up to the base material. In your example the preferred screw length would be ~4-1/2" to 5" Adequate screw length depends on the load. If screwing to a wall and the load is straight down, you can get away with a MUCH shorter screw than if the load is horizontal, or nearly so, to the wall. It's the difference between hanging a picture and an L-bracket for a shelf. A thumb-tack may hold a 30# picture but not a shelf bracket. |
#14
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What length screw to use?
On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 15:32:35 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote: When choosing length, try to have about 1/3 of the screw in the piece being fastened and the remaining 2/3 of the screw threaded into the piece being fastened to. As the thickness of the lumber increases though, this ratio can be reduced to 1/2 if absolutely necessary. That's why only 2/3 of the shank is typically threaded on our 1" and longer wood screws. No, the shank of a wood screw is smooth so that the screw will slip through the material being held and snug it up to the base material. Yes, 1/3 of the shank is smooth and the other 2/3 of the shank is threaded. In your example the preferred screw length would be ~4-1/2" to 5" Adequate screw length depends on the load. If screwing to a wall and the load is straight down, you can get away with a MUCH shorter screw than if the load is horizontal, or nearly so, to the wall. It's the difference between hanging a picture and an L-bracket for a shelf. A thumb-tack may hold a 30# picture but not a shelf bracket. Yes again, but if he NEEDS to use a 2x4 then he NEEDS screws with similar holding power. Gordon Shumway A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own. |
#15
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What length screw to use?
On 2010-06-08, Joe J wrote:
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? Here's what the National Design Specifications for Wood has to say on the matter: For laterally loaded wood screws, the minimum embedment is 4 times the shank diameter, and to develop the full lateral strength, you need an embedment of 7 times the shank diameter. You also need to drill a pilot hole at around 90% of the root diameter. Withdrawal capacity is linear in embedment, so the more the merrier. This becomes an issue if you are applying an eccentric lateral load, e.g. your 2x4s are going to be support shelves, where the weight is some distance from the wall. Then the top set of screws is loaded in tension. As an example a #10 screw has a shank diameter of 0.190" and a root diameter of 0.130". So to develop the full lateral capacity, you'd want an embedment of 1.33" and a 7/64" or 1/8" pilot hole. With a 3" screw, you could achieve the necessary embedment in your situation by counterboring the 2x4s by 1/2". Cheers, Wayne |
#16
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What length screw to use?
If you want to use your 3" screws, you're going to need to drill
shanks in your 2x4's (shanks are holes that are wide enough so that your screw can slide through without the thread catching -- you don't want the thread catching both the 2x4 and the wall), so if you use a counter-sync/shank combo, you should be be able to embed the 3" screws a 1/2" into the wood easily enough. If you don't have one of those, you might want to consider buying some 3 1/2 - 4" screws that have no thread the top 1 1/2". That way you won't have to do any shanking, and the shelves go up faster. John |
#17
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What length screw to use?
"John" wrote in message ... If you want to use your 3" screws, you're going to need to drill shanks in your 2x4's (shanks are holes that are wide enough so that your screw can slide through without the thread catching -- you don't want the thread catching both the 2x4 and the wall), so if you use a counter-sync/shank combo, you should be be able to embed the 3" screws a 1/2" into the wood easily enough. If you don't have one of those, you might want to consider buying some 3 1/2 - 4" screws that have no thread the top 1 1/2". That way you won't have to do any shanking, and the shelves go up faster. John Why wouldn't I want the screw to catch both the 2x4 and the wall stud? Seems to me that would make a nice tight fit. -- Joe J. |
#18
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 2:31*pm, "Joe J" wrote:
"John" wrote in message ... If you want to use your 3" screws, you're going to need to drill shanks in your 2x4's (shanks are holes that are wide enough so that your screw can slide through without the thread catching -- you don't want the thread catching both the 2x4 and the wall), so if you use a counter-sync/shank combo, you should be be able to embed the 3" screws a 1/2" into the wood easily enough. *If you don't have one of those, you might want to consider buying some 3 1/2 - 4" screws that have no thread the top 1 1/2". *That way you won't have to do any shanking, and the shelves go up faster. John Why wouldn't I want the screw to catch both the 2x4 and the wall stud? Seems to me that would make a nice tight fit. When you snug the 2x up to the wall there is no gap. If the threads are sunk into both boards, one or the other has to strip out to close the gap. You don't want that force stripping the threads out of the hole in wall stud. |
#19
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What length screw to use?
On Jun 8, 3:43*pm, keith wrote:
On Jun 8, 2:31*pm, "Joe J" wrote: "John" wrote in message ... If you want to use your 3" screws, you're going to need to drill shanks in your 2x4's (shanks are holes that are wide enough so that your screw can slide through without the thread catching -- you don't want the thread catching both the 2x4 and the wall), so if you use a counter-sync/shank combo, you should be be able to embed the 3" screws a 1/2" into the wood easily enough. *If you don't have one of those, you might want to consider buying some 3 1/2 - 4" screws that have no thread the top 1 1/2". *That way you won't have to do any shanking, and the shelves go up faster. John Why wouldn't I want the screw to catch both the 2x4 and the wall stud? Seems to me that would make a nice tight fit. When you snug the 2x up to the wall there is no gap. *If the threads are sunk into both boards, one or the other has to strip out to close the gap. *You don't want that force stripping the threads out of the hole in wall stud. Sometimes you get worse, and you can't strip out the threads from either the wall, or the board, and that's worse. Lets say you were putting a screw through your 2x4 to the wall, and that the screw thread caught tightly on both. Also, lets say when you were doing this, there was a 1mm gap between your board and the wall, because you weren't holding it just right. You screw the screw in as far as it goes, but there's still 1mm gap. Picture that you manage to do one last turn of the screw, the screw moves 1mm further into the wall -- well, it also moved 1mm further into the board, but because of this, the board does not get tighter to the wall). If, on the other hand for some reason the screw thread does not catch on the board, because you either drilled a shank hole, or because the screw has no thread for the depth of the board, then turning that screw an extra turn pulls the board 1mm closer into the wall. This creates tension and friction between the wall and the board, and that is where you get your real strength. If you're having trouble picturing it, fasten two boards to the wall -- one with a shank, and one without, and hit the top of both boards with a sledge hammer. The screws will likely break in the one without the shank holes, but you'll likely just dent the board/wall in the other. John |
#20
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What length screw to use?
On 6/8/2010 8:31 AM John spake thus:
If you want to use your 3" screws, you're going to need to drill shanks in your 2x4's (shanks are holes that are wide enough so that your screw can slide through without the thread catching -- you don't want the thread catching both the 2x4 and the wall), so if you use a counter-sync/shank combo, you should be be able to embed the 3" screws a 1/2" into the wood easily enough. If you don't have one of those, you might want to consider buying some 3 1/2 - 4" screws that have no thread the top 1 1/2". That way you won't have to do any shanking, and the shelves go up faster. Right concept, but the correct term is "clearance hole" for the screw, or counterboring it into the piece being held. -- The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring, with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags. - Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com) |
#21
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What length screw to use?
On 6/8/2010 7:51 AM, Joe J wrote:
I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks Some of these later replies are hy****inglarrious!! you HAD to ask, didn't ya? -- Steve Barker remove the "not" from my address to email |
#22
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What length screw to use?
On Tue, 08 Jun 2010 15:54:40 -0500, Steve Barker
wrote: On 6/8/2010 7:51 AM, Joe J wrote: I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks Some of these later replies are hy****inglarrious!! It's only funny because you're too stupid to understand simple mechanics. you HAD to ask, didn't ya? Because you can't answer, doesn't mean the question is stupid. |
#23
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What length screw to use?
"Joe J" wrote in message ... I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks I'd use them. I'd also put a dab of construction adhesive in four or five spots too on the ones hanging the shelves. . |
#24
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What length screw to use?
Ed Pawlowski wrote:
"Joe J" wrote in message ... I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks I'd use them. I'd also put a dab of construction adhesive in four or five spots too on the ones hanging the shelves. . I have not been paying attention- these are horizontal 2x4s, right? To act as a ledger for the shelves? Or vertical 2x4s to hold brackets? On a horizontal 2x4, you may wanna go with a wider board, to reduce the lever action that will dig into the drywall. Back in the stone age, for closets and utility rooms and such, I always had good luck with a pretty 1x8 band screwed into the studs, and metal brackets screwed into that wherever needed. Held a 12" shelf, supported by the brackets and the top edge of the 1x8, heavily loaded, with no problem. -- aem sends.... |
#25
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What length screw to use?
On Tue, 08 Jun 2010 23:37:21 -0400, aemeijers wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote: "Joe J" wrote in message ... I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks I'd use them. I'd also put a dab of construction adhesive in four or five spots too on the ones hanging the shelves. . I have not been paying attention- these are horizontal 2x4s, right? To act as a ledger for the shelves? Or vertical 2x4s to hold brackets? On a horizontal 2x4, you may wanna go with a wider board, to reduce the lever action that will dig into the drywall. Back in the stone age, for closets and utility rooms and such, I always had good luck with a pretty 1x8 band screwed into the studs, and metal brackets screwed into that wherever needed. Held a 12" shelf, supported by the brackets and the top edge of the 1x8, heavily loaded, with no problem. For closets, just run boards around the three sides and put a shelf on top. I despise those metal brackets. |
#26
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What length screw to use?
"Joe J" wrote in message ... I'm attaching 2 x 4s to the studs in a finished garage. Finished with 1/2" drywall. Are 3" screws long enough, I have a bunch leftover from a different project? The 2 x 4s will be holding 5/8 plywood for shelves. Or, should I just bite the bullet and go with 3 1/2? Thanks Let's do the math. 2 x 4's are actually 1 1/2" thick some 1 5/8". Drywall 1/2", less an eighth or so for recess. That gives you about an inch of penetration into the stud that will hold it all. I'd use them. Steve visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com A fool shows his annoyance at once, but a prudent man overlooks an insult. |
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