B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?

"john hamilton" wrote:

B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?


A furnace probably runs 100k BTU/h. A water heater 60K BTU/H.
A ventless heater is more likely 30K or less. [some are 5K] Less
BTU=less combustion=less CO.

That said--- you can still kill yourself with CO if you put one in a
space too small for it. A 30K in a small bedroom should kill you
the first night.


Jim

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...
"john hamilton" wrote:

B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?


A furnace probably runs 100k BTU/h. A water heater 60K BTU/H.
A ventless heater is more likely 30K or less. [some are 5K] Less
BTU=less combustion=less CO.

That said--- you can still kill yourself with CO if you put one in a
space too small for it. A 30K in a small bedroom should kill you
the first night.


Jim

Where do you get your information from? Or are you just guessing?

On 2/24/2010 6:39 AM, john hamilton wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?


These heaters have shut off sensors if oxygen gets too low or carbon
monoxide is generated in excess. You can live with the carbon dioxide
and water that complete combustion generates. Personally these heaters
make me nervous as who wants to be sleeping if the safety overrides fail?

On Feb 24, 5:39*am, "john hamilton" wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?

You breathe them, You hope the Oxygen Depletion and your Co sensors
all work, you hope your house is loose enough to breath out the
poisons induced into your home, or you don`t worry or think and call
it the Flue if it affects you. But if you only run it a few hours a
day in a non super sealed house it should be ok. Like running the gas
oven or having all the stove burners on. I would not want one, there
is to much indoor pollution anyway in winter, in a garage for short
periods it would be ok, but Ng contains alot of water that will raise
the humidity where these are used.

On Feb 24, 7:52*am, ransley wrote:
On Feb 24, 5:39*am, "john hamilton" wrote:

B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?

You breathe them, You hope the Oxygen Depletion and your Co sensors
all work, you hope your house is loose enough to breath out the
poisons induced into your home, or you don`t worry or think and call
it the Flue if it affects you. But if you only run it a few hours a
day in a non super sealed house it should be ok. Like running the gas
oven or having all the stove burners on. I would not want one, there
is to much indoor pollution anyway in winter, in a garage for short
periods it would be ok, but Ng contains alot of water that will raise
the humidity where these are used.


Also, it depends on what you mean by gas fires. There are ventless
gas fireplaces that are not designed to provide heat, but mainly for
visual appeal. Consequently, I would think they would use less gas,
be less of a potential hazard and more common. Other units are
designed to actually provide heat. Some states do not allow them
because of safety concerns.

You need to do your own due diligence and figure out how comfortable
you are with whatever gas fire you are talking about.

On Feb 24, 7:49*am, wrote:
On Feb 24, 7:52*am, ransley wrote:





On Feb 24, 5:39*am, "john hamilton" wrote:

B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire was if
the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing sufficent
ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is flueless?

You breathe them, You hope the Oxygen Depletion and your Co sensors
all work, you hope your house is loose enough to breath out the
poisons induced into your home, or you don`t worry or think and call
it the Flue if it affects you. But if you only run it a few hours a
day in a non super sealed house it should be ok. Like running the gas
oven or having all the stove burners on. I would not want one, there
is to much indoor pollution anyway in winter, in a garage for short
periods it would be ok, but Ng contains alot of water that will raise
the humidity where these are used.

Also, it depends on what you mean by gas fires. * There are ventless
gas fireplaces that are not designed to provide heat, but mainly for
visual appeal. *Consequently, I would think they would use less gas,
be less of a potential hazard and more common. * Other units are
designed to actually provide heat. * Some states do not allow them
because of safety concerns.

You need to do your own due diligence and figure out how comfortable
you are with whatever gas fire you are talking about.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Isnt ventless outlawed in some or most of Canada?

"ransley" wrote in message
...

Ng contains alot of water

Is that the opposite of alittle water?

CO will quickly combine with oxygen in the air to produce carbon dioxide.
The CO problem occurs when all the oxygen in the room is used up and
the CO builds to dangerous levels. Therefore, small amounts of CO in a
vented room should not, theoretically, be a problem.

I wouldn't want one though!

TonyB

john hamilton wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire
was if the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing
sufficent ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is
flueless?

There are no noxious fumes from a properly-operating gas flame.

That there COULD be something dangerous is what gets some Chicken-Little
types all exercised.

In the years before central heating was common, millions of families got
along quite well, without mishap, by using gas space heaters. There were gas
outlets in every room, much like electrical outlets today.

Before that, when gas lighting was the norm, the flames were actually
DESIGNED to generate Carbon monoxide. That is, gas lights depended on
incomplete combustion to generate a yellow flame rather than the
complete-combustion blue flame like you see on today's gas ranges.

On Feb 24, 9:09*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
john hamilton wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire
was if the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing
sufficent ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is
flueless?

There are no noxious fumes from a properly-operating gas flame.

That there COULD be something dangerous is what gets some Chicken-Little
types all exercised.

In the years before central heating was common, millions of families got
along quite well, without mishap, by using gas space heaters. There were gas
outlets in every room, much like electrical outlets today.

Before that, when gas lighting was the norm, the flames were actually
DESIGNED to generate Carbon monoxide. That is, gas lights depended on
incomplete combustion to generate a yellow flame rather than the
complete-combustion blue flame like you see on today's gas ranges.

Probably one of the reasons life expectancy was far less in the old
days

"Frank" wrote in message
...
On Feb 24, 9:09 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
john hamilton wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire
was if the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing
sufficent ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is
flueless?

There are no noxious fumes from a properly-operating gas flame.

That there COULD be something dangerous is what gets some Chicken-Little
types all exercised.

In the years before central heating was common, millions of families got
along quite well, without mishap, by using gas space heaters. There were
gas
outlets in every room, much like electrical outlets today.

Before that, when gas lighting was the norm, the flames were actually
DESIGNED to generate Carbon monoxide. That is, gas lights depended on
incomplete combustion to generate a yellow flame rather than the
complete-combustion blue flame like you see on today's gas ranges.

Probably one of the reasons life expectancy was far less in the old
days



These fires have a catalytic converter which converts all harmfull gases
into carbon dioxide and water vapour and they are said to be 100% efficient.
How much water vapour it produces into the room they dont say.

Bill.1

"BILL" wrote:

-snip-


Probably one of the reasons life expectancy was far less in the old
days

Actually infant mortality is what made it *appear* that folks died
young 'in the old days'.


These fires have a catalytic converter which converts all harmfull gases
into carbon dioxide and water vapour and they are said to be 100% efficient.
How much water vapour it produces into the room they dont say.

My 20K ventless does not steam up the windows in the room where it
resides. If it is below 0F it runs most of the time. A shower in
the adjacent bathroom -- or boiling a pot of pasta on the stove in the
other adjacent room will steam up the windows.

Jim

On Feb 24, 11:54*am, "BILL" wrote:
"Frank" wrote in message

...
On Feb 24, 9:09 am, "HeyBub" wrote:





john hamilton wrote:
B and Q are doing a selection of wall hung *flueless* gas fires.

We had those tv ads a while ago saying how dangerous your gas fire
was if the chimney was blocked. We are also warned about providing
sufficent ventilation for gas fires.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is
flueless?

There are no noxious fumes from a properly-operating gas flame.

That there COULD be something dangerous is what gets some Chicken-Little
types all exercised.

In the years before central heating was common, millions of families got
along quite well, without mishap, by using gas space heaters. There were
gas
outlets in every room, much like electrical outlets today.

Before that, when gas lighting was the norm, the flames were actually
DESIGNED to generate Carbon monoxide. That is, gas lights depended on
incomplete combustion to generate a yellow flame rather than the
complete-combustion blue flame like you see on today's gas ranges.

Probably one of the reasons life expectancy was far less in the old
days

These fires have a catalytic converter which converts all harmfull gases
into carbon dioxide and water vapour and they are said to be 100% efficient.

Would someone be able to explain to a novice what is happening to the
noxious fumes that we are warned about, when the gas fires is
flueless?

they'll be going out the 3 or 4 foot square vents the BG service bod put in
when he came round for the anual service call wont they.

prolly as good at warming a room up as those open fronted fake coal gas
fires with a fan to suck the gasses out a horizontal flue, mum's got one of
them, looks nice but im sure room gets colder with it on due to the fan, and
not very realistic with the sound of a small turbine whining away behind the
grate.

How much water vapour it produces into the room they dont say.


From memory it is roughly that 22.4 litres - which is a bit under a
cubic foot - of methane (natural gas) gives 36g of water which is about
an ounce and a bit. So a fair bit of water. I would look at my gas
bill and tell you how many kWh per cubic metre methane is, but I've lost it.