Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted out.
There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I did not
want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep cuts
along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is if
its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this happening
again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and then
carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

"john hamilton" wrote in message
...
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.


This is an interesting scenario. In the US, a group might or might not have
luck litigating this.
Sheeit, people have been awarded millions for coffee that was too hot, for a
bug in a yogurt.

Can you document any psychological trauma?
If you can document any resulting ED or some such, not only can *you* sue,
but your WIFE can sue as well, for loss of "conjugal privilege" or some
****.... No foolin....

I saw a lawsuit for $10 mil for a slip/fall from a 75 y.o. lady who fell,
and $5 mil from her hubby for the above loss....
I said, Wow, dat old lady musta been some piece of......
Which makes you wonder how a judge/jury might ascertain and verify said
conjugal value of a particular spouse..... .hmmmm.....

Related to your issue is how **** is packaged in the US -- objects are
embalmed in thermo-molded plastic, so tough that you need *aviation snips*
or an effing band saw to get the product out of the packaging.
How fragile senior citizens cope with this is beyond me.

The situtation is so bad that this issue even reached our CongressWhores!
Altho clearly not high on their graft-taking agenda.... I can't cite the
exact name of the bill, as I just read this in passing in a NYC newspaper.

I have called up a mfr or two, and told them: Dudes, I can lift 150 lbs
over my head, and run 5 miles.... and *I* can't open your ****ing
packages.... Just WHAT is the purpose to all this??? And at what
expense???

No rational response, of course, and how could there be, as the corporate
policy-makers are so well-shielded from consumers. Venting at a customer
rep just makes their already-miserable lives more miserable. Presumably if
50% of the customer base lodged complaints, the statistics would carry some
weight, but don't hold yer breath..

I believe that this thermoplastic is tough enough, sharp enough to slit
someone's wrist, if they slip in their efforts.

Ultimately, I believe this is just another deliberate slap in the consumer's
face by CorPirate Merka.
**** you, **** me, **** everyone, as long as everyone just pays and pays and
pays....

fwiw.
--
EA

john hamilton wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob
from a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be
lifted out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap
knobs, but I did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three
deep cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how
metal is if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared
edge with a file.
This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and
time again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably
the way everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it
from a U.K. store.
My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity,
since having to pay money might make them actually make them take
notice and then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this
repeatedly happening.
Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

if you were pulling the item out then how did the back of your fingers get
damaged?

"john hamilton" wrote in message
...
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.


I suspect you will have very little luck at all. Undoubtedly somewhere in
the literature it says something about using an experienced qualified
installer.

This is a trend of the last 20 years. Most everything was semi-finished in
the past. In the world today nothing seems to have one. Nothing seems to
come with a rolled or smoothed edge. You can cut yourself on just about
everything.

Not very likely to change back anytime soon since everyone wants to buy it
cheap the seller wants to make it cheap and ....... well you get drift.


Colbyt

On 21 Feb, 15:41, "Colbyt" wrote:
"john hamilton" wrote in message

...





Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request 100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

I suspect you will have very little luck at all. �Undoubtedly somewhere in
the literature it says something about using an experienced qualified
installer.

This is a trend of the last 20 years. �Most everything was semi-finished in
the past. �In the world today nothing seems to have one. �Nothing seems to
come with a rolled or smoothed edge. �You can cut yourself on just about
everything.

Not very likely to change back anytime soon since everyone wants to buy it
cheap the seller wants to make it cheap and ....... well you get drift.

Colbyt- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Lots of stuff these days is made in third world countries with very
low standards. You can also get poisoned with lead, arsenic,
asbestos etc. etc.

On Feb 21, 9:29*am, "john hamilton" wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted out.

On Feb 21, 9:12*am, "Existential Angst"
wrote:
"john hamilton" wrote in message

...





Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

This is an interesting scenario. *In the US, a group might or might not have
luck litigating this.
Sheeit, people have been awarded millions for coffee that was too hot, for a
bug in a yogurt.

Can you document any psychological trauma?
If you can document any resulting ED or some such, not only can *you* sue,
but your WIFE can sue as well, for loss of "conjugal privilege" or some
****.... *No foolin....

I saw a lawsuit for $10 mil for a slip/fall from a 75 y.o. lady who fell,
and $5 mil from her hubby for the above loss....
I said, Wow, dat old lady musta been some piece of......
Which makes you wonder how a judge/jury might ascertain and verify said
conjugal value of a particular spouse..... *.hmmmm.....

Related to your issue is how **** is packaged in the US -- objects are
embalmed in thermo-molded plastic, so tough that you need *aviation snips*
or an effing band saw to get the product out of the packaging.
How fragile senior citizens cope with this is beyond me.

The situtation is so bad that this issue even reached our CongressWhores!
Altho clearly not high on their graft-taking agenda.... *I can't cite the
exact name of the bill, as I just read this in passing in a NYC newspaper..

I have called up a mfr or two, and told them: *Dudes, I can lift 150 lbs
over my head, and run 5 miles.... *and *I* can't open your ****ing
packages.... *Just WHAT is the purpose to all this??? *And at what
expense???

No rational response, of course, and how could there be, as the corporate
policy-makers are so well-shielded from consumers. *Venting at a customer
rep just makes their already-miserable lives more miserable. *Presumably if
50% of the customer base lodged complaints, the statistics would carry some
weight, but don't hold yer breath..

I believe that this thermoplastic is tough enough, sharp enough to slit
someone's wrist, if they slip in their efforts.

Ultimately, I believe this is just another deliberate slap in the consumer's
face by CorPirate Merka.
**** you, **** me, **** everyone, as long as everyone just pays and pays and
pays....

fwiw.
--
EA- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Your reply might make more sense to a non-USA person if you used a
little bit more polite language and regular names instead of swearing
continually.

john hamilton wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted out.
There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I did not
want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep cuts
along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is if
its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this happening
again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and then
carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.


Hmmm,
Laziness, stupidity, common sense, inexperience.

"john hamilton" wrote in message
...
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.


Ever heard of taking responsibility for your own actions? When opening
something like this the sensible way is to cut the corner seam so the box
can be opened rather like a flower. This makes it easy to re-seal if you
need to return the item. That way you can safely examine to goods before you
hurt yourself.Why do you think you can extort money from them to donate to a
charity?

Peter Crosland

On 21 Feb, 18:43, "Rod Speed" wrote:
Toom Tabard wrote

If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards which injure someone
taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are legally liable for the injuries.

Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal system.

Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.

It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box like a flower or just
let the entire contents and its packaging slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.- Hide quoted text -


But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove an item
in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed to injury from
exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.

My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in
response to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own
misfortune.

The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person would in unpacking an
item and trying not to damage it. His main concern is that similar
injuries will happen to others. That's why I've advised him to report
it to Trading Standards and to the suppliers. Trading Standards have a
responsibility if an item is faulty or dangerous. In this case, there
is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or dangerous in operation, but
it might be hoped they'd also take action where the supply and
handling of the item presents a clear and present danger (or refer the
OP to whoever has any responsibility). Similarly, it is important the
OP report the problem to the supplier. There is some evidence of
negligence (his actual injuries) in the supply of the goods. It
becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if, after
having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.

Toom

On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:32:38 GMT, Doug Miller wrote:

In article , "john hamilton" wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted out.
There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I did not
want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep cuts
along the back of three fingers.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that sheet metal
objects sometimes have sharp edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that one should wear
gloves -- or at least use caution -- when handling objects with sharp edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that it's unwise to
stick your unprotected fingers (see point 2 above) into places you can't see,
and wrap them around the edges of a sheet metal object that may have sharp
edges (see point 1 above).

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning the proper way to
open a carton to remove its contents.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that you -- not
someone else -- are responsible for your own foolishness.

Your argument is invalid if there were no warnings stamped on the packing
box. Without warnings, a reasonable person (a legal term) would expect to
unpack an appliance in his own home without sustaining injuries.

--
"Friendship is born at that moment when one person says to another, 'What!
You too? I thought I was the only one!'"
-- C.S. Lewis


2/21/2010 3:22:46 PM

On 21 Feb, 20:11, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Feb 21, 1:01*pm, Toom Tabard wrote:





On 21 Feb, 17:50, "Rod Speed" wrote:

Toom Tabard wrote:
On 21 Feb, 17:14, "Rod Speed" wrote:
john hamilton wrote

Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas
hob from a well known national department store. After taking the
top of the packaging off it, it then had to be
lifted out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap
knobs, but I did not want to pull it out using these.
So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three
deep cuts along the back of three fingers.
Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how
metal is if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared
edge with a file.
This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time
and time again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is
probably the way everybody else would try to lift it out.
How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again.

You cant. Even buying only the most expensive products wont ensure
that.

The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a U.K. store.

And it was made in china.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity,

And they will file the request in the round filing cabinet under
their desk.

since having to pay money

You cant make them do that.

might make them actually make them take notice and then carry out
the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly happening.

Unlikely. Even if you can force them to pay that money, and you
cant, its unlikey that enough would do that to make it worth their
while to fix the problem.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

You could try setting fire to yourself outside the Italian HQ.

Your only real option is to wear gloves when getting it
out of the box in that situation and file the edges yourself.

Total nonsense

Your sig is sposed to be last, with a line with just -- on it in front of it.

- in an item supplied to a consumer, there should be no hidden
hazard in any *reasonable action to remove it from the packaging

Then theres the real world...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And the law in the real world supports what I said. If you dispatch
something with hidden and unexpected hazards which injure someone
taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are legally liable
for the injuries.

Toom

How would you deal with this situation:

A friend was moving a recliner. As they turned the chair around a
corner, it "reclined" trapping his hand within the mechanism and
severely cutting his hand. There was nothing in the paperwork for the
chair that said to "Secure the chair to prevent reclination while
moving".

Whose responsible for his injury?- Hide quoted text -


Negligence and liability cases are amongst the most variable and
varied legal issues. There are general principles but each case
depends on the individual circumstances. It might depend, eg on
whether there was an inherent design fault or specific mechanical
fault in the mechanism, or whether your friend was just careless of
his own safety. Nor does someone always have to be 'responsible'.
There may be no negligence as such. But in the case at issue, it would
normally be expected that you should be able reach into a package to
remove an item such as a hob in a reasonable manner without being cut
by unprotected 'razor sharp' edges. You would most likely be doing
what a reasonable person should be able to expect to do without
injury.

Toom

Toom Tabard wrote:
On 21 Feb, 17:26, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In , Toom wrote:

The supplier (UK national store) is responsible.

Horse****. The OP is solely responsible. It's not exactly an arcane secret
that objects made of sheet metal sometimes have sharp edges. Only a fool would
uncrate something by wrapping his fingers around an edge that he couldn't see,
and several others have already described how he *should* have uncrated it.

Total nonsesnse in terms of the law of negligence and legal liability.
There would have to be clear warning of the hazard of unpacking.

Toom
Hmmm,
Negligent? Start with OP and you are same kind?

Toom Tabard wrote:

On 21 Feb, 17:32, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , "john hamilton" wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted out.
There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I did not
want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep cuts
along the back of three fingers.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that sheet metal
objects sometimes have sharp edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that one should wear
gloves -- or at least use caution -- when handling objects with sharp edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that it's unwise to
stick your unprotected fingers (see point 2 above) into places you can't see,
and wrap them around the edges of a sheet metal object that may have sharp
edges (see point 1 above).

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning the proper way to
open a carton to remove its contents.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that you -- not
someone else -- are responsible for your own foolishness.

Total twaddle and nonsense in terms of the law of negligence and legal
liability.
For an item supplied to a consumer, there would have, at least, to be
clear warning of any hazard of unpacking.

Toom

Yeah, as when I received my Phillips widescreen LCD monitor in the box. It was
locked to the vertical spring loaded support column with a pin. Appropriate
warning only to remove the pin when the monitor was placed upright on the table.
Just removing the pin when unpacking could cause a big surprise as the column
would expand in your face.

DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Feb 21, 1:01 pm, Toom Tabard wrote:
On 21 Feb, 17:50, "Rod Speed" wrote:



Toom Tabard wrote:
On 21 Feb, 17:14, "Rod Speed" wrote:
john hamilton wrote

Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas
hob from a well known national department store. After taking the
top of the packaging off it, it then had to be
lifted out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas
tap knobs, but I did not want to pull it out using these.
So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received
three deep cuts along the back of three fingers.
Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how
metal is if its been stamped and not finished off along the
sheared edge with a file.
This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time
and time again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is
probably the way everybody else would try to lift it out.
How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop
this happening again.

You cant. Even buying only the most expensive products wont ensure
that.

The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a U.K.
store.

And it was made in china.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a
charity,

And they will file the request in the round filing cabinet under
their desk.

since having to pay money

You cant make them do that.

might make them actually make them take notice and then carry out
the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly happening.

Unlikely. Even if you can force them to pay that money, and you
cant, its unlikey that enough would do that to make it worth their
while to fix the problem.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a
charitable contribution.

You could try setting fire to yourself outside the Italian HQ.

Your only real option is to wear gloves when getting it
out of the box in that situation and file the edges yourself.

Total nonsense

Your sig is sposed to be last, with a line with just -- on it in
front of it.

- in an item supplied to a consumer, there should be no hidden
hazard in any reasonable action to remove it from the packaging

Then theres the real world...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And the law in the real world supports what I said. If you dispatch
something with hidden and unexpected hazards which injure someone
taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are legally liable
for the injuries.

Toom

How would you deal with this situation:

A friend was moving a recliner. As they turned the chair around a
corner, it "reclined" trapping his hand within the mechanism and
severely cutting his hand. There was nothing in the paperwork for the
chair that said to "Secure the chair to prevent reclination while
moving".

Whose responsible for his injury?

The stupid that was too stupid to move it properly.

Same with the one that cuts itself when using a knife or a box cutter etc.

Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote

If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards which
injure someone taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are
legally liable for the injuries.

Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal system.

Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.

It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box like a flower or just
let the entire contents and its packaging slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.

But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove
an item in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed
to injury from exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.

And anyone with even half a clue realises that metal edges can be
sharp, particularly when the edges wont be exposed in normal use.

My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in response
to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own misfortune.

And as other pointed out, you dont see big warnings on
razor blades, box cutters and knives that they can cut you.

The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person
would in unpacking an item and trying not to damage it.

No reasonable person shoves his hand into some place he cant see
with a component that is meant be be installed before it is used.

His main concern is that similar injuries will happen to others.

And that mentality sees fools demand big danger signs
on razor blades, box cutters and knives etc etc etc.

That's why I've advised him to report it to
Trading Standards and to the suppliers.

And that wont have any effect what so ever, you watch.

Trading Standards have a responsibility if an item is faulty or dangerous.

It isnt either. A cut finger is not life threatening, which is why you
can buy razor blades, box cutters and knives any time you like.

In this case, there is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or dangerous
in operation, but it might be hoped they'd also take action where the
supply and handling of the item presents a clear and present danger

Of a minor cut finger at worst.

(or refer the OP to whoever has any responsibility).

Who will file any complaint he makes in the round filing cabinet under their desk where it belongs.

Similarly, it is important the OP report the problem to the supplier.

Like hell it is.

There is some evidence of negligence (his actual injuries) in the supply of the goods.

No more than with a razor blade or box cutter or knife that cuts someone.

It becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if,
after having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.

Liability for a cut finger. Wow, talk about the end of civilisation as we know it.

Or, slit two seams and slide the item out.
Probably better to cut all four, and then you are
closer to having the cardboard in smaller pieces
to put in the rubbish.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"DerbyDad03" wrote in
message
...

Ever heard of a box cutter?

Slit the corner seams of the box vertically so
that it opens like
flower.

If you need to repackage the item, use strapping
tape to put the box
back together.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Or, slit two seams and slide the item out.
Probably better to cut all four, and then you are
closer to having the cardboard in smaller pieces
to put in the rubbish.

Hmm,
Not rubbish. Into the blue recycle bin!

On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 10:01:35 -0800 (PST), Toom Tabard
wrote:

And the law in the real world supports what I said. If you dispatch
something with hidden and unexpected hazards which injure someone
taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are legally liable
for the injuries.

Toom

Who do I go after, since I've had "paper cuts" using a ream of paper?

My guess is those in the UK want sharp pointy sticks and sharp
instruments to have a BIG ASS label on them (pencils/scissors).

I must have had 20 paper cuts over the years.

The UK has the fourth (?) largest employer in the world (Health Care
system). I figure they could fix cuts on a finger ... no wait....

Oh, I was so gauche! I'm sure I've scarred people
for life, the thought. I don't know how anyone
will ever associate with me ever again.....

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Or, slit two seams and slide the item out.
Probably better to cut all four, and then you
are
closer to having the cardboard in smaller pieces
to put in the rubbish.

Hmm,
Not rubbish. Into the blue recycle bin!

Tony Hwang wrote
Stormin Mormon wrote

Or, slit two seams and slide the item out.
Probably better to cut all four, and then you are
closer to having the cardboard in smaller pieces
to put in the rubbish.

Hmm,
Not rubbish. Into the blue recycle bin!

Mine isnt blue. Should I slash my wrists or just spree ?

Oren wrote
Toom Tabard wrote

And the law in the real world supports what I said. If you
dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards
which injure someone taking reasonable action as a
consumer, then you are legally liable for the injuries.

Who do I go after, since I've had "paper cuts" using a ream of paper?

That brown fella of course.

My guess is those in the UK want sharp pointy sticks and sharp
instruments to have a BIG ASS label on them (pencils/scissors).

They have ARSES not ASSES.

I must have had 20 paper cuts over the years.

Obviously way past your useby date.

The UK has the fourth (?) largest employer in the world (Health
Care system). I figure they could fix cuts on a finger ... no wait....

On 21 Feb, 22:44, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 10:01:35 -0800 (PST), Toom Tabard

wrote:
And the law in the real world supports what I said. If you dispatch
something with hidden and unexpected hazards which injure someone
taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are legally liable
for the injuries.

Toom

Who do I go after, since I've had "paper cuts" using a ream of paper?

My guess is those in the UK want sharp pointy sticks and sharp
instruments to have a BIG ASS label on them (pencils/scissors).

I must have had 20 paper cuts over the years.


You're a slow learner, then. Whatever you do, don't start ordering gas
hobs ;-)

toom
..

On 21 Feb, 21:15, "Rod Speed" wrote:
Toom Tabard wrote

Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards which
injure someone taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you are
legally liable for the injuries.
Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal system.
Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.
It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box like a flower or just
let the entire contents and its packaging slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.
But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove
an item in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed
to injury from exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.

And anyone with even half a clue realises that metal edges can be
sharp, particularly when the edges wont be exposed in normal use.

My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in response
to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own misfortune.

And as other pointed out, you dont see big warnings on
razor blades, box cutters and knives that they can cut you.

The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person
would in unpacking an item and trying not to damage it.

No reasonable person shoves his hand into some place he cant see
with a component that is meant be be installed before it is used.

His main concern is that similar injuries will happen to others.

And that mentality sees fools demand big danger signs
on *razor blades, box cutters and knives etc etc etc.

That's why I've advised him to report it to
Trading Standards and to the suppliers.

And that wont have any effect what so ever, you watch.

Trading Standards have a responsibility if an item is faulty or dangerous.

It isnt either. A cut finger is not life threatening, which is why you
can buy razor blades, box cutters and knives any time you like.

In this case, there is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or dangerous
in operation, but it might be hoped they'd also take action where the
supply and handling of the item presents a clear and present danger

Of a minor cut finger at worst.

(or refer the OP to whoever has any responsibility).

Who will file any complaint he makes in the round filing cabinet under their desk where it belongs.

Similarly, it is important the OP report the problem to the supplier.

Like hell it is.

There is some evidence of negligence (his actual injuries) in the supply of the goods.

No more than with a razor blade or box cutter or knife that cuts someone.

It becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if,
after having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.

Liability for a cut finger. Wow, talk about the end of civilisation as we know it.

The OP asked for advice. I've given him advice and stated how the law
normally operates in terms of negligence and liability in such
circumstances. It's informed and expert consumer and legal advice.
Your illogical ranting remains irrelevant.

Toom

Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote

If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards which
injure someone taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you
are legally liable for the injuries.

Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal system.
Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.

It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box
like a flower or just let the entire contents and its packaging
slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.

But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove
an item in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed
to injury from exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.

And anyone with even half a clue realises that metal edges can be
sharp, particularly when the edges wont be exposed in normal use.

My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in response
to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own misfortune.

And as other pointed out, you dont see big warnings on
razor blades, box cutters and knives that they can cut you.

The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person
would in unpacking an item and trying not to damage it.

No reasonable person shoves his hand into some place he cant see
with a component that is meant be be installed before it is used.

His main concern is that similar injuries will happen to others.

And that mentality sees fools demand big danger signs
on razor blades, box cutters and knives etc etc etc.

That's why I've advised him to report it to
Trading Standards and to the suppliers.

And that wont have any effect what so ever, you watch.

Trading Standards have a responsibility if an item is faulty or dangerous.

It isnt either. A cut finger is not life threatening, which is why you
can buy razor blades, box cutters and knives any time you like.

In this case, there is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or dangerous
in operation, but it might be hoped they'd also take action where the
supply and handling of the item presents a clear and present danger

Of a minor cut finger at worst.

(or refer the OP to whoever has any responsibility).

Who will file any complaint he makes in the round
filing cabinet under their desk where it belongs.

Similarly, it is important the OP report the problem to the supplier.

Like hell it is.

There is some evidence of negligence (his actual injuries) in the supply of the goods.

No more than with a razor blade or box cutter or knife that cuts someone.

It becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if,
after having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.

Liability for a cut finger. Wow, talk about the end of civilisation as we know it.

The OP asked for advice.

And got it.

I've given him advice

Which was completely worthless.

and stated how the law normally operates in terms
of negligence and liability in such circumstances.

Like hell you ever did.

It's informed and expert consumer and legal advice.

Everyone can see for themselves that it is nothing of the kind.

Well first of all you need to inform trading standards, and also inform the
retailer, as they could be liable as well of course. Between them they ought
to be able to sort it. I suspect what will happen is that a nice printed
note will be put into the top of all packages telling the customer not to do
as you did!

Normally I've found that there is a kind of heavy duty plastic sheet of some
sort going down and under and up the other side capable of lifting the
item.
On very heavy items you are it appears encouraged by a little diagram to
dismantle the packaging in a certain way to avoid damage, though it does not
say whether the damage may occur to the item or to the customer!!


Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"john hamilton" wrote in message
...
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out. There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I
did not want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts along the back of three fingers.

Being pressed steel the edges were razor sharp because thats how metal is
if its been stamped and not finished off along the sheared edge with a
file.

This is annoying because this situation is likely to happen time and time
again to other people. Because how I lifted it out is probably the way
everybody else would try to lift it out.

How can I be sure of getting the manufacturers to act to stop this
happening again. The company is an Italian one, but I purchased it from a
U.K. store.

My collegue suggests I should request £100 to be sent to a charity, since
having to pay money might make them actually make them take notice and
then carry out the extra work on these units to stop this repeatedly
happening.

Thanks for any advice on how best to get them to make a charitable
contribution.

On 22 Feb, 09:10, "Rod Speed" wrote:
Toom Tabard wrote





Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards which
injure someone taking reasonable action as a consumer, then you
are legally liable for the injuries.
Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal system.
Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.
It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box
like a flower or just let the entire contents and its packaging
slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.
But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove
an item in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed
to injury from exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.
And anyone with even half a clue realises that metal edges can be
sharp, particularly when the edges wont be exposed in normal use.
My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in response
to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own misfortune.
And as other pointed out, you dont see big warnings on
razor blades, box cutters and knives that they can cut you.
The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person
would in unpacking an item and trying not to damage it.
No reasonable person shoves his hand into some place he cant see
with a component that is meant be be installed before it is used.
His main concern is that similar injuries will happen to others.
And that mentality sees fools demand big danger signs
on razor blades, box cutters and knives etc etc etc.
That's why I've advised him to report it to
Trading Standards and to the suppliers.
And that wont have any effect what so ever, you watch.
Trading Standards have a responsibility if an item is faulty or dangerous.
It isnt either. A cut finger is not life threatening, which is why you
can buy razor blades, box cutters and knives any time you like.
In this case, there is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or dangerous
in operation, but it might be hoped they'd also take action where the
supply and handling of the item presents a clear and present danger
Of a minor cut finger at worst.
(or refer the OP to whoever has any responsibility).
Who will file any complaint he makes in the round
filing cabinet under their desk where it belongs.
Similarly, it is important the OP report the problem to the supplier.
Like hell it is.
There is some evidence of negligence (his actual injuries) in the supply of the goods.
No more than with a razor blade or box cutter or knife that cuts someone.
It becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if,
after having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.
Liability for a cut finger. Wow, talk about the end of civilisation as we know it.
The OP asked for advice.

And got it.

I've given him advice

Which was completely worthless.

and stated how the law normally operates in terms
of negligence and liability in such circumstances.

Like hell you ever did.

It's informed and expert consumer and legal advice.

Everyone can see for themselves that it is nothing of the kind.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'm, as usual, happy to leave 'everyone' to judge the merits of my
contributions against those of the feeble-minded ;-)

Toom

Must immediatey write, email, and fax every
elected official in the nation and protest your
discrimination. Start a foundation called
Worldwide Home for Individuals Needing Equality in
Recycling. Then, we can all join, and become a
united nation of W.H.I.N.E.R.s.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Rod Speed" wrote in
message ...

Hmm,
Not rubbish. Into the blue recycle bin!

Mine isnt blue. Should I slash my wrists or just
spree ?

"Rocinante" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:32:38 GMT, Doug Miller wrote:

In article , "john hamilton"
wrote:
Last friday I took delivery at home of pressed steel kitchen gas hob from
a
well known national department store.

After taking the top of the packaging off it, it then had to be lifted
out.
There was nothing to get hold of apart from the gas tap knobs, but I did
not
want to pull it out using these.

So I put my fingers underneath and lifted, but then received three deep
cuts
along the back of three fingers.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that sheet metal
objects sometimes have sharp edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that one should
wear
gloves -- or at least use caution -- when handling objects with sharp
edges.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that it's unwise
to
stick your unprotected fingers (see point 2 above) into places you can't
see,
and wrap them around the edges of a sheet metal object that may have
sharp
edges (see point 1 above).

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning the proper way
to
open a carton to remove its contents.

Somehow, you managed to reach adulthood without learning that you -- not
someone else -- are responsible for your own foolishness.

Your argument is invalid if there were no warnings stamped on the packing
box. Without warnings, a reasonable person (a legal term) would expect to
unpack an appliance in his own home without sustaining injuries.

I agree 100%, it is just about this simple.
Our main simpleton here not only just doesn't get it, but he *refuses* to
get it.
--
EA


--
"Friendship is born at that moment when one person says to another, 'What!
You too? I thought I was the only one!'"
-- C.S. Lewis


2/21/2010 3:22:46 PM

On Feb 21, 2:20*pm, "Existential Angst"
wrote:

[100,000 lines of drivel snipped]

Spare us. *goodgawd....

And for the love of said God, everyone, learn to trim your posts.

--Eric Smith

On 22 Feb, 15:01, "Eric S. Smith: Left-Field Marshal"
wrote:
On Feb 21, 2:20*pm, "Existential Angst"
wrote:

[100,000 lines of drivel snipped]

Spare us. *goodgawd....

And for the love of said God, everyone, learn to trim your posts.

--Eric Smith

We have no idea what you are complaining about. Perhaps that's because
you were over-zealous in trimming your post.

Toom

On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 19:36:08 +0000, johannes
wrote:



Doug Miller wrote:

In article , Toom Tabard wrote:

The supplier (UK national store) is responsible.

Horse****. The OP is solely responsible. It's not exactly an arcane secret
that objects made of sheet metal sometimes have sharp edges. Only a fool would
uncrate something by wrapping his fingers around an edge that he couldn't see,
and several others have already described how he *should* have uncrated it.

Agree 100%. Any idiot who sues over their stupidity should lose, and
pay the defendants lawyer, *big* time. It's time for Darwin to go to
work.

I don't agree with you. Sheet metal edges should at least have been smoothed
out. OP could not have known that the unpacking needed to be done in a
particular sequence. OP obviously didn't cut his fingers voluntarily.

Perhaps not voluntarily, but being stupid was enough.

This is a serious issue IMO.

Hogwash. The idiot cut his precious little finners. Too bad.

Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Toom Tabard wrote
If you dispatch something with hidden and unexpected hazards
which injure someone taking reasonable action as a consumer,
then you are legally liable for the injuries.
Have fun getting damages in other than the stupid US legal
system. Its been completely off the rails for centurys now.
It makes a hell of a lot more sense to use gloves or open the box
like a flower or just let the entire contents and its packaging
slide out of the box onto the floor gently etc.
But a customer can reasonably expect to open a box and remove
an item in any way that seems reasonable without being exposed
to injury from exposed but not obvious 'razor sharp' edges.
And anyone with even half a clue realises that metal edges can be
sharp, particularly when the edges wont be exposed in normal use.
My remarks regarding the suppliers liability for injuries are in
response
to the claim by others that the OP is the author of his own
misfortune.
And as other pointed out, you dont see big warnings on
razor blades, box cutters and knives that they can cut you.
The OP seems to have acted as reasonable person
would in unpacking an item and trying not to damage it.
No reasonable person shoves his hand into some place he cant see
with a component that is meant be be installed before it is used.
His main concern is that similar injuries will happen to others.
And that mentality sees fools demand big danger signs
on razor blades, box cutters and knives etc etc etc.
That's why I've advised him to report it to
Trading Standards and to the suppliers.
And that wont have any effect what so ever, you watch.
Trading Standards have a responsibility if an item is faulty or
dangerous.
It isnt either. A cut finger is not life threatening, which is why
you
can buy razor blades, box cutters and knives any time you like.
In this case, there is no suggestion that the hob is faulty or
dangerous
in operation, but it might be hoped they'd also take action where
the
supply and handling of the item presents a clear and present
danger
Of a minor cut finger at worst.
(or refer the OP to whoever has any responsibility).
Who will file any complaint he makes in the round
filing cabinet under their desk where it belongs.
Similarly, it is important the OP report the problem to the
supplier.
Like hell it is.
There is some evidence of negligence (his actual injuries) in the
supply of the goods.
No more than with a razor blade or box cutter or knife that cuts
someone.
It becomes a much clearer issue of negligence and liability if,
after having drawn the issue to their attention, they fail to take
reasonable and immediate action to prevent injury to others.
Liability for a cut finger. Wow, talk about the end of
civilisation as we know it.
The OP asked for advice.

And got it.

I've given him advice

Which was completely worthless.

and stated how the law normally operates in terms
of negligence and liability in such circumstances.

Like hell you ever did.

It's informed and expert consumer and legal advice.

Everyone can see for themselves that it is nothing of the kind.-

I'm, as usual, happy to leave 'everyone' to judge the merits of my contributions

They all did, and ****ed on your **** from a great height.

Eric S. Smith: Left-Field Marshal wrote:
On Feb 21, 2:20 pm, "Existential Angst"
wrote:

[100,000 lines of drivel snipped]

Spare us. goodgawd....

And for the love of said God, everyone, learn to trim your posts.

--Eric Smith

Go and **** yourself.

And you need to learn how to do a sig.

The -- needs to be on a line by itself.

Rod Speed wrote:

And you need to learn how to do a sig.
The -- needs to be on a line by itself.

There should be a space after the --.

"Toom Tabard" wrote in message
...

Total nonsense - in an item supplied to a consumer,

Regardless of who its supplied to, consumers don't ever get to
handle gas hobs because. they normally give the job to a fitter
or similar professional.

An experienced fitter wouldn't have cut his hand in this way.
But then an experienced fitter would have cost money.

The OP can't have it both ways. Either he's a consumer in which
case he gives the job to someone who can handle it, or he's a
fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut his hand.

Had this been a saucepan being talked about then that would
be an entirely different thing.



michael adams

....

On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 12:22:36 -0000, "michael adams"
wrote:


"Toom Tabard" wrote in message
...

Total nonsense - in an item supplied to a consumer,

Regardless of who its supplied to, consumers don't ever get to
handle gas hobs because. they normally give the job to a fitter
or similar professional.

An experienced fitter wouldn't have cut his hand in this way.
But then an experienced fitter would have cost money.

Perhaps, perhaps not. But if cutting edges were commonly on a
product, he would no doubt recommend against using it.

The OP can't have it both ways. Either he's a consumer in which
case he gives the job to someone who can handle it, or he's a
fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut his hand.

Had this been a saucepan being talked about then that would
be an entirely different thing.


Those who have never worked in manufacturing seem to think that
cutting edges and burrs are normal if hidden from the consumer.
They are not, and are routinely removed as part of the manufacturing
process,
Not just for the consumer or tradesman, but for the workers in the
plant who perform other processes on the piece after stamping/cutting.
Beyond injury, deburring and removing cutting edges is cheaper than
replacing sliced gloves.
Most likely the edges that injured the OP was an oversight and a
one-off. If not, it's a crappy product and most likely deficient in
other ways too.

--Vic

On Feb 23, 7:22*am, "michael adams" wrote:
"Toom Tabard" wrote in message

...

Total nonsense - in an item supplied to a consumer,

Regardless of who its supplied to, consumers don't ever get to
handle gas hobs because. they normally give the job to a fitter
or similar professional.

An experienced fitter wouldn't have cut his hand in this way.
But then an experienced fitter would have cost money.

The OP can't have it both ways. Either he's a consumer in which
case he gives the job to someone who can handle it, or he's a
fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut his hand.

Had this been a saucepan being talked about then that would
be an entirely different thing.

michael adams

...

Either he's a consumer in which case he gives the job to someone
who can handle it, or he's a fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut
his hand."

What?

You don't truly believe that a "consumer" can't be a "fitter" do you?

I guess I shouldn't have put in my own windows or doors or bath
fixtures or water heater or stove or deck or any of the other things
I've "fitted" into my house.

After all, I'm just a consumer and "can't handle it".

I'm not defending the OP...I'm not even talking about the OP. I'm only
responding to your claim that a consumer can't also be the fitter.

On Feb 21, 9:33*am, Toom Tabard wrote:
On 21 Feb, 17:26, (Doug Miller) wrote:

In article , Toom Tabard wrote:

The supplier (UK national store) is responsible.

Horse****. The OP is solely responsible. It's not exactly an arcane secret
that objects made of sheet metal sometimes have sharp edges. Only a fool would
uncrate something by wrapping his fingers around an edge that he couldn't see,
and several others have already described how he *should* have uncrated it.

Total nonsesnse in terms of the law of negligence and legal liability.
There would have to be clear warning of the hazard of unpacking.

Toom

Yes, one can always find a sleaze ball lawyer to sue over something
that is the complainers fault.

Harry K

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Feb 23, 7:22 am, "michael adams" wrote:
"Toom Tabard" wrote in message

...

Total nonsense - in an item supplied to a consumer,

Regardless of who its supplied to, consumers don't ever get to
handle gas hobs because. they normally give the job to a fitter
or similar professional.

An experienced fitter wouldn't have cut his hand in this way.
But then an experienced fitter would have cost money.

The OP can't have it both ways. Either he's a consumer in which
case he gives the job to someone who can handle it, or he's a
fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut his hand.

Had this been a saucepan being talked about then that would
be an entirely different thing.

michael adams

...

Either he's a consumer in which case he gives the job to someone
who can handle it, or he's a fitter in which case he wouldn't have cut
his hand."

What?

....

In the UK at least a "fitter" is a name given to professional installers
of all sorts of things. Kitchen fitter, motor fitter, electrical fitter
etc etc.

Not just simply to someone who "fits" things.

A professional fitter might reasonably be expected to have the experience to
forstall such problems.

The packaging being complained of is intended for opening by professional
tradesmen. Not unskilled amateurs.

"Unskilled" if only in the sense that when they cut their little "handies" as
a result of not using a box-cutter, the correct tool for the job, they then
start to blub like little children. And start demanding that the "naughty man"
should be made to pay money to Charity "cos they hurted demselves"

Yeah right! Like that's gonna happen !

HTH

michael adams

posting on uk.people.consumers

.....



You don't truly believe that a "consumer" can't be a "fitter" do you?

I guess I shouldn't have put in my own windows or doors or bath
fixtures or water heater or stove or deck or any of the other things
I've "fitted" into my house.

After all, I'm just a consumer and "can't handle it".

I'm not defending the OP...I'm not even talking about the OP. I'm only
responding to your claim that a consumer can't also be the fitter.