My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There
are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours. Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button? Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on? I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?

It sounds like the fan-light may be wired incorrectly at the switch. The
breaker with the light is probably an AFCI breaker, which by current code
wouldn't be protecting your living room, and would certainly not be turning
the power on with the breaker off. My guess is the tripping of that breaker
causes a loose connection in the panel to make. I don't know what
obligations the electrical contractor may have, but I would call some
electrical contractor to look at it before it becomes a bigger problem



wrote in message
oups.com...
My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There
are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours. Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button? Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on? I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?

In article .com,
wrote:

My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There
are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours. Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button? Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on? I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?

This sounds to me like 1 of 3 things:

1) The problem was there from Day 1, but you either did not notice
anything wrong or did not bother to complain about it until after the
warranty expired.

If the problem was caused by the builders and is a kind of problem that
can be a non-problem until after the warranty expires, tell it to the
judge. Beware of statutes of limitations - you may have 2 years or
whatever time limit after time of wrongdoing to sue (varies by state and
maybe type of lawsuit and what is being sued over).

You should also tell your municipal/county politicians what kind of
work the building inspectors signed off on - if your county or
municipality has such things.

2) Things broke down from working properly due to quality of breakers
and/or connections. If this occurs after the warranty expires, what I
think the usual course is:

a) Hire an independent electrician to get things straightened out.

b) If the independent electrician determines that the builder used
substandard or flawed parts or did substandard work, check into recourse
under your state's consumer protection laws, and tell BBB what kind of
work your builder did according to your independent electrician.
Also say so on relevant message boards, but limit your statements to
facts that you can support, such as written findings by an independent
licensed electrician and photos that electricians on all sides would have
a hard time disagreeing over, better still photos of matter mentioned in a
report by your electrician if pictures can add support. I have heard
horror stories about lawsuits by developers. I might even plunk down a
hundred or two if necessary to ask a local lawyer knowledgeable in such
matters as to what would be good to say where and how (or for that matter
if and how you can get the builder to fix the problem if the builder is
responsible).

3) Someone did some bad work or some bad "helpful improvements" after the
house was built. That is not the builder's fault, unless the problem was
caused by shoddy warranty work or shoddy followup work by the builder or
contractor thereof.

- Don Klipstein )

Don Klipstein wrote:

In article .com,
wrote:

My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There
are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours. Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button? Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on? I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?

This sounds to me like 1 of 3 things:

1) The problem was there from Day 1, but you either did not notice
anything wrong or did not bother to complain about it until after the
warranty expired.

If the problem was caused by the builders and is a kind of problem that
can be a non-problem until after the warranty expires, tell it to the
judge. Beware of statutes of limitations - you may have 2 years or
whatever time limit after time of wrongdoing to sue (varies by state and
maybe type of lawsuit and what is being sued over).

You should also tell your municipal/county politicians what kind of
work the building inspectors signed off on - if your county or
municipality has such things.

2) Things broke down from working properly due to quality of breakers
and/or connections. If this occurs after the warranty expires, what I
think the usual course is:

a) Hire an independent electrician to get things straightened out.

b) If the independent electrician determines that the builder used
substandard or flawed parts or did substandard work, check into recourse
under your state's consumer protection laws, and tell BBB what kind of
work your builder did according to your independent electrician.
Also say so on relevant message boards, but limit your statements to
facts that you can support, such as written findings by an independent
licensed electrician and photos that electricians on all sides would have
a hard time disagreeing over, better still photos of matter mentioned in a
report by your electrician if pictures can add support. I have heard
horror stories about lawsuits by developers. I might even plunk down a
hundred or two if necessary to ask a local lawyer knowledgeable in such
matters as to what would be good to say where and how (or for that matter
if and how you can get the builder to fix the problem if the builder is
responsible).

3) Someone did some bad work or some bad "helpful improvements" after the
house was built. That is not the builder's fault, unless the problem was
caused by shoddy warranty work or shoddy followup work by the builder or
contractor thereof.

- Don Klipstein )

You don't think it's possible that the OP put a new
lamp/tv/stereo/whatever in the living room and it has a ground fault or
perhaps a bad connection tripping an AFCI? Heck, even a loose light bulb
might produce slight in socket arcing and trip an AFCI at some random
time based on vibrations of foot traffic near it.

Do you think it's not possible that the builder built with quality
components and good workmanship and a "normal" problem has appeared? If
the OP can tell us what brand of panel it is that will give a good
indication of quality.

I'd recommend the OP try disconnecting all devices plugged in in the
affected area and check the tightness of all lights and then reset the
breaker. It's also possible if it is a GFCI or AFCI that the breaker has
failed, even if it's a good brand, nothing is immune from some level of
failures.

Pete C.

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:31:39 -0700, wrote:

My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There

You should probably turn them off and then on again. People here say
that is necessary sometimes.

are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours.

Bad connection somewhere, I suppose. Probably in a box. Are you
handy? Do you understand electricity? (not electronics, just
lightbulbs and switches and wires?) Do you have a volt-ohmmeter, or
are you willing to buy one and learn to use it?

Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

VERy strange. Did it work this way a year ago?

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button?

It's either a GFI breaker, or maybe one of the new AFCI breakers, that
are supposed to trip when there is a bad ground for the first one, or
arcing for the second (and I guess the second also trips on a bad
ground.) The button is there to test if it trips when it should.

Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on?

Very strange, except maybe you're checking the power at a place not
controlled by that breaker.

I didn't think a living room fan had to be on one of these special
circuits (I thought maybe a bedroom had to be.)

I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?

Read your warranty closely, and also maybe you can get some special
favor from them, although it sounds like you called already and
they're not going to give you any favors.

You won't like half of this story, but in August of 1963, they
finished construction of my high school. It was either a million, or
two, a very high price compared to anything they had built in previous
years. Everything was fine until spring, when a bus hit an electric
pole about a block from the school and the power went out. The
building had AC which meant that there were interior rooms with no
windows, plus the auditorium and the gymnasium, and there were
suppposed to be emergency lights that would come on automatically in a
power failure, via a generator, I'm sure. Many of those rooms were
totally dark and otoh, some rooms with windows had lights that came
on, or stayed on. The electrician had made many mistakes, others as
well that I can't remember, and the school made him fix them for free.

But the thing is, the school also had only a year to find those
mistakes, and they should have started looking already. Apparently if
the bus hadn't hit the pole, they weren't going to check at all, and
the school district would have had to pay for all the changes.

Now this was the wealthiest township in Indiana (which isn't really
saying much). I don't think there were many who were rich, but there
weren't many who were poor either, and all in all, the school had more
money than any other township to hire someone competent. But they
didn't get this part, the self-inspection part, right either.

Sounds like there could be a loose connection somewhere. Maybe in panel.
Also sounds like something was wired wrong.

Probably easy for electrician to fix, however not a typical do-it-yourself
thing.

I would suggest hiring a different electrician.

wrote in message
My house is less than 2 years old. But the 1 year warranty is over.
Living room lights / fan do not have power most of the time. I double
checked the circuit breakers. They are all in the ON position. There
are a couple of switches in the circuit breaker. They have a green
TEST button. If I hit the TEST button, sometimes power comes in living
room on even if the switch is left in the off position or middle
position. The power is on for a variable time. Sometimes, it goes off
quickly. Other times, it stays for a few hours. Also, the fan and
light switch or not independent. If I turn off the light switch it
also turns off the fan. If I turn the light switch back on, the fan
turns on. For fan to work both fan and light switches must be on. For
light to work, only the light switch needs to be on.

What is the purpose of the circuit breaker switch with green "TEST"
button? Why does hitting the TEST button and leaving it in "OFF" state
bring the power on? I thought that the opposite would have happened,
meaning power will go off. What could be problem with my electrical
connections?

The electrical company that my builder used is asking for $75/hour to
come and look into this problem. They will also charge $150 for travel
on top of this. Should I have to pay them, even though it seems that
they did not do the connections correctly in the first place?