So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 06:55:23 -0500, deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

The devil is in the details, Deke. The ground was too wet to use a
ladder, and the guy was high in a tree that wasn't otherwise easily
accessible.

Luke

In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.

Tree in the way? Chain saw.....

Incompetence seems to be rampant.

In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.

"deke" wrote in message
...

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200.


???????????????????

I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.

Tree in the way? Chain saw.....

Incompetence seems to be rampant.

In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.

In article ,
deke wrote:

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Why? Most responses are to houses, etc. and the two story ladder
would work. Even largest percentage of non-residential responses are
probably one or two story strip malls, warehouses, etc. In most of the
times when you need higher ladders you will be able to use the ladder
trucks or quints.



Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.
Again why? You want to take a piece of apparatus out of service
for an extended period of time or risk damage to it when the main
situation is stablized and there is no immediate danger. That makes a
hell of a lot of sense.



Tree in the way? Chain saw.....
Yep, take down some trees for no apparent reason when there are
other options available and the situation is not immediately
threatening. Lawsuit waiting to happen there .


Incompetence seems to be rampant.
You woudl probably be wrong.


In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

Okay the real reason comes out. You don't like FF for some reason.


My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.

Yep. They should just barge in and get their own selves possibly shot
up so you can feel better about their response.

On Apr 5, 9:16 am, deke wrote:
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:





In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.

Tree in the way? Chain saw.....

Incompetence seems to be rampant.

In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Umm, I sure hope your house doesn't catch on fire anytime soon or a
loved one doesn't end up in a hostage situation Your ignorance of the
fire service only makes you look like an idiot. Why would they have a
ladder that is taller than any building in town? Come on! There is a
huge difference between a ladder from the hardware store and a piece
of fire equipment. If you can show me the city or town that would
approve the purchase of a ladder truck just in case someone climbs up
a tree after a bird, I'll give you credit for your statement. Until
then, quit commenting in ignorance.

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 08:16:27 -0500, deke wrote:

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200.

No, you can't.

Luke

In article ,
Luke Howett Fitzhugh wrote:

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 08:16:27 -0500, deke wrote:

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200.

No, you can't.

Luke

Best I could find at Home Depot or Lowes was 40 foot for $350.00 and
that was only rated for 250 lbs. Don't know what the fire ladders are
rated for, but that would seem low by the time you get a FF, gear and a
rescuee on the ladder.

The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

Luke

On Apr 5, 4:55 am, deke wrote:
So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

You seem to know what you are talking about. Why don't you join your
local FD and give them the benefit of your expertise? Could it be
that you are chicken or just like to blow off in the 'net to show your
ignorance?

Harry K

Kurt Ullman wrote:
Best I could find at Home Depot or Lowes was 40 foot for $350.00 and
that was only rated for 250 lbs. Don't know what the fire ladders are
rated for, but that would seem low by the time you get a FF, gear and a
rescuee on the ladder.

http://www.duosafety.com/

They claim to be the oldest supplier of fire ladders in North America. They
further state that all their extension and roof ladders are rated for 750lbs
with a 4:1 safety factor. I don't think you'll be buying one of these at the
borg.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

In article ,
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:

http://www.duosafety.com

True. But the original suggestion was that one could bop down locally
and grab a 40 footer for $350 or so. These guys you have to special
order and the cheapest 40 footer is over $1600. Not really within the
OP's stated parameters.

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 15:18:21 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:

http://www.duosafety.com

True. But the original suggestion was that one could bop down locally
and grab a 40 footer for $350 or so. These guys you have to special
order and the cheapest 40 footer is over $1600. Not really within the
OP's stated parameters.

The OP claimed that he could buy a 60-footer for under $200.

Luke

In article ,
Luke Howett Fitzhugh wrote:

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 15:18:21 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:

http://www.duosafety.com

True. But the original suggestion was that one could bop down locally
and grab a 40 footer for $350 or so. These guys you have to special
order and the cheapest 40 footer is over $1600. Not really within the
OP's stated parameters.

The OP claimed that he could buy a 60-footer for under $200.

Luke

Well I ws giving him the benefit of the doubt (g). I did not find a
60 footer even at duosafety.com. The other consideration is how many
people would it take hump something that big from the truck to the
scene. That has to be heeaavvvvyyyy.

On 5 Apr 2007 06:59:24 -0700, wrote:

On Apr 5, 9:16 am, deke wrote:
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:





In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.

Tree in the way? Chain saw.....

Incompetence seems to be rampant.

In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Umm, I sure hope your house doesn't catch on fire anytime soon or a
loved one doesn't end up in a hostage situation Your ignorance of the
fire service only makes you look like an idiot. Why would they have a
ladder that is taller than any building in town? Come on! There is a
huge difference between a ladder from the hardware store and a piece
of fire equipment. If you can show me the city or town that would
approve the purchase of a ladder truck just in case someone climbs up
a tree after a bird, I'll give you credit for your statement. Until
then, quit commenting in ignorance.


What I don't get is, the shmuck with the parrot managed to get
into the the tree. (I assume the parrot flew). Therefore,
the chances are good that a Rescue team member could, to.
After that, you don't need a ladder, you need a rope.

I expect they called out the helo because it was a good
opportunity to get some relatively safe training time in,
With the money not having to come from the training budget.
But I suppose it could have been a case of, when you've got
a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
...
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

People have a whole different set of judgments when it comes to their pets.
Some of the whacko-s will take more care of Fluffy than their kids. Some
even think the pets are their kids. Agree, they should send him the bill
for the rescue. Same with mountain climbers that put themselves at risk.

In article ,
Goedjn wrote:


What I don't get is, the shmuck with the parrot managed to get
into the the tree. (I assume the parrot flew). Therefore,
the chances are good that a Rescue team member could, to.
After that, you don't need a ladder, you need a rope.

Would depend a lot on where he ended up I would suppose. First and
probably foremost, the FD (unlike the civilian) has to answer to OSHA
and various other people on safety issues. If the person got too high up
in tree, there could be concerns about getting too much weight from
other people in the area causing branches to break. Could be similar
concerns about looping ropes around, etc. The FF would have to have some
sort of safety apparatus to keep them safe from falling that might mess
up the ability to get to the guy.
As has been noted on numerous occassions, I have yet to see a
cat's skeleton in the tree. I am thinking that if the guy had gotten
hungry enough, he would have found a way down (g).

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 11:41:31 -0400, Goedjn wrote:

What I don't get is, the shmuck with the parrot managed to get
into the the tree. (I assume the parrot flew). Therefore,
the chances are good that a Rescue team member could, to.
After that, you don't need a ladder, you need a rope.

A rescue team member could probably climb up there, but it would be
very dangerous for him. People who are stupid enough to get themselves
into such situations can behave unpredictably and endanger their
rescuers. Plus, the hazards of the climb and physical effort required
also makes it more hazardous.

Luke

In article ,
deke wrote:
...snipped...
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.
...snipped...


Please post the source for the $200 sixty foot ladders.

--
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation
with the average voter. (Winston Churchill)

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 16:36:20 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:
...snipped...
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.
...snipped...


Please post the source for the $200 sixty foot ladders.


What for? I couldn't even LIFT a 60 foot 1A ladder,
much less position the damn thing. I have enough trouble
managing the 28 footer I've got, with a stabalizer on the end.

Kurt Ullman wrote:
The OP claimed that he could buy a 60-footer for under $200.

Well I ws giving him the benefit of the doubt (g). I did not find a
60 footer even at duosafety.com. The other consideration is how many
people would it take hump something that big from the truck to the
scene. That has to be heeaavvvvyyyy.


My point was that he was wrong... it couldn't be done. As for what you *could*
buy locally, I borrowed a ladder from across the street when I was running
satellite cable all over the outside of my father's house... including up to the
third floor. The ladder I borrowed was almost too heavy for me and my old man
to carry, and once we stood it up and leverage raised its ugly head, it really
became almost impossible to reposition.

That was a heavy duty ladder to be sure; but it wasn't anywhere near what the
fire department uses.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

Larry W wrote:
I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times. ...snipped...


Please post the source for the $200 sixty foot ladders.


I know a guy in Nigeria who'd sell you one for that. He's the lawyer for the
late, tragically departed fire chief and he needs an American to help him get
the assets of the department out of the country before the government
confiscates it. Send me your email address if you can help.




--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 16:36:20 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:
...snipped...
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.
...snipped...


Please post the source for the $200 sixty foot ladders.

Here you go.

http://www.nationwideladder.com/exterior.html

You may have to bargain with them a bit to get the price.

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com writes:

I know a guy in Nigeria who'd sell you one for that. He's the lawyer for the
late, tragically departed fire chief and he needs an American to help him get
the assets of the department out of the country before the government
confiscates it. Send me your email address if you can help.

Don't forget to mention that the recipient will have to advance the money
needed to ship the ladder from Nigeria, plus bribe a government
department to issue the necessary ladder export permit.

Dave

I agree that the SWAT teams in Columbine blew it- There is a lunch
truck in the video!!!!! Those idiots need some b@LLs. Even cops
think that in that type of situation the officers need to barge in and
get the perps startled and lives will be saved.



On Apr 5, 9:37 am, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,





deke wrote:
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

How high up? Last I looked the NFPA standard was only about two
stories worth. Even with the trucks, a lot depends on the placement. Was
it close enough to the drive way to get to? Was the ground too soft to
get the truck there? Was there enough room between the tree and other
obstructions to maneuve the ladder on the truck?
Location is everything. For example, the City-County Building in
Ft. Wayne, IN was built in such a manner that the ladder trucks couldn't
get too close to it. Even with the 70 foot ladder, the best they could
do was the third floor. Anyone care to guess where the FWFD offices were
located??

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.

Why? Most responses are to houses, etc. and the two story ladder
would work. Even largest percentage of non-residential responses are
probably one or two story strip malls, warehouses, etc. In most of the
times when you need higher ladders you will be able to use the ladder
trucks or quints.



Soil too soft? So grab some pads from the station and make a path.
And get a tow truck and pull it out later. That takes all of 10
minutes to get one of those vultures out to help you.

Again why? You want to take a piece of apparatus out of service
for an extended period of time or risk damage to it when the main
situation is stablized and there is no immediate danger. That makes a
hell of a lot of sense.



Tree in the way? Chain saw.....

Yep, take down some trees for no apparent reason when there are
other options available and the situation is not immediately
threatening. Lawsuit waiting to happen there .



Incompetence seems to be rampant.

You woudl probably be wrong.



In my state, every time a fire fighter breaks a fingernail, all the
firefighters abandon their designated posts and attend his visit to
the doctor. It is completely out of hand and something needs to be
done.

Okay the real reason comes out. You don't like FF for some reason.



My other pet peeve is swat teams. They spend months in training to
determine how long it takes high school kids to lay there and bleed to
death from gun shot wounds, then add 4 hours to that and then they
cowardly ease their way into the building.

Yep. They should just barge in and get their own selves possibly shot
up so you can feel better about their response.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

In article .com,
wrote:

I agree that the SWAT teams in Columbine blew it- There is a lunch
truck in the video!!!!! Those idiots need some b@LLs. Even cops
think that in that type of situation the officers need to barge in and
get the perps startled and lives will be saved.


You are really brave with other people's lives...

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 15:52:56 GMT, "Edwin Pawlowski"
wrote:


"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
.. .
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

That's the way they figure it, but it might be a lot less. The real
costs are the costs of the gasoline it burns and a proportional charge
of the cost of overhauling the engine and other repairs.

But they normally, I believe, quote costs including a proportional
cost of the crew's time, and the initional cost and interst on the
price of the helicopter, and the costs of running the whole
department. Must of these are fixed costs that don't actually go up
when they do a specific thing.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

People have a whole different set of judgments when it comes to their pets.

That's for sure. Lately there has been a change in rescue rules, at
the Louisiana or federal level, that means pets will be rescued to if
possible. Because of Katrina, when, even though they could have taken
many of the pets just by doing so, they had a policy against it.

Another example is an article on tv news about concern for the pets of
aliens being deported, especially I guess the ones left at home when
no one comes back.

And of course the enormous amounts spent on medical care for pets.
There was an episode of According to Jim where spent 1000 to fix up a
hamster, that sell for 10 dollars and barely have a personality (or
even a hamsterality), This was a comedy, but I think it could happen.

It might well be a measure of prosperity that people are willing to do
all this. Used to be, I think, most dogs were working dogs,
shepherds, etc., although maybe I'm wrong about that.

Some of the whacko-s will take more care of Fluffy than their kids. Some
even think the pets are their kids. Agree, they should send him the bill
for the rescue. Same with mountain climbers that put themselves at risk.

If my kid was in that school they'd have needed to chain me up or I'd
have been in there taking care of business. Those cowards dont
deserve a badge. Letting the killers have all the time they wanted is
not good policy. Too many died because of that delay. This is why
criminals in America are so brazen. They know cops and citizens are
impotent to put them out.

On Apr 5, 4:34 pm, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article .com,

wrote:
I agree that the SWAT teams in Columbine blew it- There is a lunch
truck in the video!!!!! Those idiots need some b@LLs. Even cops
think that in that type of situation the officers need to barge in and
get the perps startled and lives will be saved.

You are really brave with other people's lives...

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 16:51:38 -0400, mm
wrote:

That's the way they figure it, but it might be a lot less. The real
costs are the costs of the gasoline it burns and a proportional charge
of the cost of overhauling the engine and other repairs.

You're ignoring the missed opportunity costs. You seem to think these
guys and choppers are sitting around all the time. Whatever else they
had to do at that time still has to be done. For that reason, crew
costs are completely reasonable to include.

But they normally, I believe, quote costs including a proportional
cost of the crew's time, and the initional cost and interst on the
price of the helicopter, and the costs of running the whole
department. Must of these are fixed costs that don't actually go up
when they do a specific thing.

Hmm... "initional cost and interst"? What language is that? No, the
cost of running the whole department is not included in those
estimates. The Coast Guard isn't even organized into departments. $10K
certainly doesn't pay the cost of the entire PD or FD for that length
of time.

Luke

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 16:51:38 -0400, mm
wrote:

hamsterality

Will always be imprinted on my brain, henceforth.

Funny!
--
Oren

"My doctor says I have a malformed public-duty gland
and a natural deficiency in moral fiber, and that I am therefore
excused from saving Universes."

"Goedjn" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 16:36:20 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
deke wrote:
...snipped...
On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:48:35 GMT, Kurt Ullman

I don't understand. I can go down to the store and buy a 60 foot
ladder for less than $200. I'd expect the fire department to have
ladders that are at least twice as long and maybe 3 times.
...snipped...


Please post the source for the $200 sixty foot ladders.


What for? I couldn't even LIFT a 60 foot 1A ladder,
much less position the damn thing. I have enough trouble
managing the 28 footer I've got, with a stabalizer on the end.

I agree- my 24 foot fiberglass 1A makes me feel old, pretty quick. (I only
needed a 20 foot, but the 24 foot was 50 bucks cheaper, across the street.)

aem sends...

"deke" wrote in message
...

So a guy gets stuck in a tree while chasing his parrot and can't get
down. No problem. The fire department have ladders on all their
fire trucks, right?

Evidently not. They had to try police helicopters and then a coast
guard helicopter to get him down.

Where the hell are the ladders?

Somebody needs to check this out and hurry before we actually need a
ladder to save a life.

I can see you know nothing about ladders. IIRC, the story said the guy was
quite a way up a tree. Ever try manhandling just a 16" ladder? Know what
it takes to get a multiton fire ladder truck near enough to a given point to
use a ladder? I didn't think so, either. That's why they are usually used
on solid asphalt or concrete. WITH outriggers extended.

How would you have done it? Maybe you ought to start a service. With your
intelligence, you could make millions.

Or not.

Steve

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:sX8Rh.1775$yL1.467@trndny04...

"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
...
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

People have a whole different set of judgments when it comes to their
pets. Some of the whacko-s will take more care of Fluffy than their kids.
Some even think the pets are their kids. Agree, they should send him the
bill for the rescue. Same with mountain climbers that put themselves at
risk.


Did you see the guy during the interview talking about potty training the
bird? He looked like a Moonie on 'shrooms.

Steve

On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 17:00:54 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:

Steve

(Good luck and prayers tomorrow with the procedure)

--
Oren

"My doctor says I have a malformed public-duty gland
and a natural deficiency in moral fiber, and that I am therefore
excused from saving Universes."

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 17:00:54 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:

Steve

(Good luck and prayers tomorrow with the procedure)

--
Oren

Thanks. Due to the multi-tentacled insurance company, I found out yesterday
that I did not send them the notification in time, and I am therefore bound
to their policy for thirty more days, moving my procedure (the one I should
have had last July) to May 3rd. I have made some calls to some old friends
here in Las Vegas. (It's nice when you live somewhere for fifty years)
They may be able to have the insurance company do an "annulment". And that
would allow me to have the procedure immediately. I have actually had to go
to the federal level of Medicare coverage and Insurance Regulations.

In the meantime, my meds dosages have been increase from 2x to 8x normal
dosages, and I am barred from going to my Utah cabin until at least the end
of May. I take nitro, and am afraid of falling off a ladder and going boom.

So, I'll just sit back for thirty days and try not to do what they want me
to do .................... die in the meantime and go away because of their
incompetence and ass dragging.

Sheesh, talk about fire department ladders sucking.

Thanks for the good wishes.

Steve

"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
...
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

Luke

No offense but if that's the criteria then does that mean we should be
pointing our shotguns at all the lazy people on welfare or those with fake
disability claims?

"Jim Tiberio" wrote in message
...

"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
...
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

Luke

No offense but if that's the criteria then does that mean we should be
pointing our shotguns at all the lazy people on welfare or those with fake
disability claims?


Only pointing? Why not make a bounty on them? Anyone bringing in proof
(such as the videos investigators take) should be able to claim a reward.
There are rewards for information leading to arrest and conviction in all
sorts of crimes. Why not this?

(I know why, but this is just for the sake of discussion.)

Steve

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"Jim Tiberio" wrote in message
...

"Luke Howett Fitzhugh" wrote in message
...
The bizarre thing about this fiasco is the total cost of the rescue:
$10,000. The guy risked his own life, and the lives of the rescuers,
trying to save a parrot that cost him $2000. He used some seriously
poor judgment.

The taxpayers should be loading their shotguns right about now...

Luke

No offense but if that's the criteria then does that mean we should be
pointing our shotguns at all the lazy people on welfare or those with
fake disability claims?


Only pointing? Why not make a bounty on them? Anyone bringing in proof
(such as the videos investigators take) should be able to claim a reward.
There are rewards for information leading to arrest and conviction in all
sorts of crimes. Why not this?

(I know why, but this is just for the sake of discussion.)

Steve

Keep in mind, I never said whether or not I want to point my guns at them,
just curious why this is so bad but the true slackers and drags on society
aren't.

"Jim Tiberio" wrote

Keep in mind, I never said whether or not I want to point my guns at them,
just curious why this is so bad but the true slackers and drags on society
aren't.

I definitely would not point guns at them. Cameras are a different thing.
And rewards for those who point them.

Steve