This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

Others may have better ideas, but I don't think you'll be happy with any of
your three choices. I'm afraid that anchoring the post only where the two
pieces meet will not only be very weak but also not look very good. Posts
should support the fence, but with your plan the fence panels would be
supporting the post. I'm assuming your posts are 4x4 pt lumber, not round
fence posts.

It seems to me that your posts only have to be tall enough to support the
topmost rail, so you may not have to have the post go all the way to 6'.
I'd suggest that you cut the extension to the added length you'll need, then
use 2 x 4s on either side of the existing post plus the extension, securing
through the 2x4s and 4x4 posts with carriage bolts. This ought to be
something you can do in short order and should be strong enough for a stable
fence. It may look a little cobbled-up, so you may want to put a 1 x 8
facing (trimmed to 6 1/2" width)over the inside of the posts to hide the
built-up post, then put a cap on the new post to protect the endgrain from
rain.

p.s. -- I saw your post in both fora. --

"ianjones" wrote in message
oups.com...
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

All great suggestions. I like your idea with the 2x4 and the finish
1x8. The only issue is that with 45 fence posts I would looking at a
significant additional cost. I am going to price it out anyways and if
it doesn't prove too expensive I may go that route.

One other question - what is the optimal clearance between the fence
and ground? I want to keep small animals (cats) from going under it but
it is somewhat moist and I want to avoid rot as much as possible.

Thanks again.

JimR wrote:
Others may have better ideas, but I don't think you'll be happy with any of
your three choices. I'm afraid that anchoring the post only where the two
pieces meet will not only be very weak but also not look very good. Posts
should support the fence, but with your plan the fence panels would be
supporting the post. I'm assuming your posts are 4x4 pt lumber, not round
fence posts.

It seems to me that your posts only have to be tall enough to support the
topmost rail, so you may not have to have the post go all the way to 6'.
I'd suggest that you cut the extension to the added length you'll need, then
use 2 x 4s on either side of the existing post plus the extension, securing
through the 2x4s and 4x4 posts with carriage bolts. This ought to be
something you can do in short order and should be strong enough for a stable
fence. It may look a little cobbled-up, so you may want to put a 1 x 8
facing (trimmed to 6 1/2" width)over the inside of the posts to hide the
built-up post, then put a cap on the new post to protect the endgrain from
rain.

p.s. -- I saw your post in both fora. --

"ianjones" wrote in message
oups.com...
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

ianjones wrote:
All great suggestions. I like your idea with the 2x4 and the finish
1x8. The only issue is that with 45 fence posts I would looking at a
significant additional cost. I am going to price it out anyways and if
it doesn't prove too expensive I may go that route.

One other question - what is the optimal clearance between the fence
and ground? I want to keep small animals (cats) from going under it
but
it is somewhat moist and I want to avoid rot as much as possible.


Forget the clearance issue - cats will go OVER the fence. I see 'em all the
time go up a six foot fence and jump from there to the garage roof (another
seven feet). With cats, you have to think in three dimensions.

As to rot, stack one or more pickets horizontally at the bottom. When one
rots, you replace only one board instead of ten.

On 11 Oct 2006 19:15:38 -0700, "ianjones" wrote:

All great suggestions. I like your idea with the 2x4 and the finish
1x8. The only issue is that with 45 fence posts I would looking at a
significant additional cost. I am going to price it out anyways and if
it doesn't prove too expensive I may go that route.

One other question - what is the optimal clearance between the fence
and ground? I want to keep small animals (cats) from going under it but
it is somewhat moist and I want to avoid rot as much as possible.

Dream on. Attach hardware cloth to the inside of the fence,
and bury the trailing edge at least 6".

In article .com,
ianjones wrote:
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian


You'll have to be the judge of the aesthetics, but by far the easiest
and and one of the most stable ways would be to simply nail a 6 ft 2X4
to each post.


--
No dumb questions, just dumb answers.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore, Maryland -

"ianjones" wrote in message
oups.com...
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Check local metal supply house for square-section steel tube (like apartment
carports are framed with) the correct size to fit tightly over the post, and
go up another 2 feet. 30" ought to work. You will need a rain cap (stock
item at fence or deck aisle), and you'll have to paint them the same general
color as the wood, but they won't look funny. A couple of through bolts with
a 6" overlap will be plenty strong. For just 2 feet, the square plastic
tubular fence posts would likely be strong enough, as long as the panels
were securely bolted lower down onto the real post.

aem sends....

wrote:
"ianjones" wrote in message
oups.com...
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Check local metal supply house for square-section steel tube (like apartment
carports are framed with) the correct size to fit tightly over the post, and
go up another 2 feet. 30" ought to work. You will need a rain cap (stock
item at fence or deck aisle), and you'll have to paint them the same general
color as the wood, but they won't look funny. A couple of through bolts with
a 6" overlap will be plenty strong. For just 2 feet, the square plastic
tubular fence posts would likely be strong enough, as long as the panels
were securely bolted lower down onto the real post.

aem sends....

This will be by far the best looking and easiest scheme for post
extensions.
But first price all the pieces you need, figure you can cut 4
extensions out of a 10' post or 3 out of an 8'. Price the same number
of new posts with concrete if needed. Make a reasonable estimate of the
time to yank out the old posts amd replace.The square extensions will
likely be four times faster. Sit back, pop the top on a cold one as you
decide what matters most, money or your time and then go for it.

Joe

also soil and climate affects answer to this, try:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...=Google+Search

ianjones wrote:
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

ianjones wrote:
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

Another way would be to join the existing post and the extension piece
with a lap joint. Like so:

| |
| |
| _|
|_|
_
_| |
| |
| |
| |

Using glue and screws or bolts. Might be better looking than the
mending plates.. -- H

ianjones wrote:
This is a duplicate from alt.home.lawn.garden - I did not know the best
place to post it.

I am replacing the panels on my fence because of rot and lack of
integrity (1 x 3 cross pieces). It is currently 4' tall and I am
installing 6' panels. The posts are cemented in and in good shape - I
would like to keep them. They are on 8' centers. What would be the best
method for adding 2'+ to the posts? I was thinking I could toe nail
(least desirable) but I could also use some square metal brackets on 2
sides (not bad) or several wood dowels (time consuming - there are 45
posts). I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post. The panels have 3 cross pieces and since 1
would fall on the extended piece it should keep it from ever twisting.

My question is what would be the best option as far as stability, ease
of installation and aesthetics (in that order I think). If my screw
option is the best - do those exist and what would they be called? Does
anyone have a online resource for that stuff? Are they made big enough?

Thanks!
Ian

Another way would be to join the existing post and the extension piece
with a lap joint. Like so:

| |
| |
| _|
|_|
_
_| |
| |
| |
| |

Using glue and screws or bolts. Might be better looking than the
mending plates.. -- H

ianjones spake thus:

... I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post.

Such things do exist; they're called dowel screws, basically a
double-headed wood screw.

But keep in mind that this would be the weakest possible way to do it,
since screws don't hold well in end grain, which is where they'd go in
this case. Dowels would be better, but, as you point out, a pain in the
butt if you have 45 posts to extend. Plus they'd have to go pretty deep
into both ends.


--
Save the Planet
Kill Yourself

- motto of the Church of Euthanasia (http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/)

On Fri, 13 Oct 2006 11:17:35 -0700, David Nebenzahl
wrote:

ianjones spake thus:

... I think the best and cleanest install would be to use (if it
exists) a screw that is threaded on both ends. With a couple pilot
holes I could screw into the extension and then twist the whole unit
onto the existing post.

Such things do exist; they're called dowel screws, basically a
double-headed wood screw.

But keep in mind that this would be the weakest possible way to do it,
since screws don't hold well in end grain, which is where they'd go in
this case. Dowels would be better, but, as you point out, a pain in the
butt if you have 45 posts to extend. Plus they'd have to go pretty deep
into both ends.


If you're going to extend a stick, you use the joints that are
designed for extending sticks. Generally, you'd use
a half-lap, a finger-joint, or a variant of a scarf joint.
Of those, a half-lap would be easiest, and if you set it
perpendicular rather than parallel to the fenceline,
the weakness will be in a direction that shouldn't
get much stress.

Alternatively, you could use decorative (or plain)
metal straps or collars, but that can get expensive
fast.