Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That "zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet, and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?

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JoeSpareBedroom 写�：

Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That "zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet, and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?

It's actually a good candidate for diy.
A good substrate for ceramic tile would be 3/4 plywood and 1/4" cement
backer board correctly installed.
Were you planning to remove the hardwood?
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That "zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet, and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?

wrote in message
ups.com...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort
of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That
"zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that
the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet,
and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?


It's actually a good candidate for diy.
A good substrate for ceramic tile would be 3/4 plywood and 1/4" cement
backer board correctly installed.
Were you planning to remove the hardwood?

Based on what two other rooms look like, the hardwood's in nice shape, at
least structurally. I'd rather leave it in place because if I sell the
house, it's a big selling point for some people.

Either way, you're talking about an inch of extra height, PLUS the thickness
of the tile. How do I avoid a ridge where the carpet meets? Put the backing
of the same thickness under the new carpet? 1/4 inch luan under 3/4 plywood
or some such thing?

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
wrote in message
ups.com...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some
sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That
"zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that
the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet,
and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under
tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?


It's actually a good candidate for diy.
A good substrate for ceramic tile would be 3/4 plywood and 1/4" cement
backer board correctly installed.
Were you planning to remove the hardwood?

Based on what two other rooms look like, the hardwood's in nice shape, at
least structurally. I'd rather leave it in place because if I sell the
house, it's a big selling point for some people.

Either way, you're talking about an inch of extra height, PLUS the
thickness of the tile. How do I avoid a ridge where the carpet meets? Put
the backing of the same thickness under the new carpet? 1/4 inch luan
under 3/4 plywood or some such thing?
Common route is to cut out a 'pocket' in the hardwood near the front door,
if there isn't already one down there hidden under the carpet. From late
fifties to early 70s, even cookie-cutter houses had a 3x3 square of slate by
the front door, so they could say 'slate entryway.' Harwood floor by weather
doors, at least ones used in winter (ie, not the deck sliders), is a BAD
idea. Fancy houses, they notched the joists for the foyer, and put them on
12" centers to make up for the smaller size, to make a well big enough for a
proper mudbed slate job. Cheaper houses used double subfloor and mastic.
With w/w hardwood being standard issue back then, and slate being thin, the
heights came out close enough for avoiding a trip hazard.

aem sends...

wrote in message
...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
wrote in message
ups.com...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood
floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired
of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some
sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That
"zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick
that the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet,
and
people will trip.

2) How do I detect a lame installer for the tile? In other words, if an
installer says "You can use {fill in name of wrong material} under
tile",
which answer should make me say "no thanks"?


It's actually a good candidate for diy.
A good substrate for ceramic tile would be 3/4 plywood and 1/4" cement
backer board correctly installed.
Were you planning to remove the hardwood?

Based on what two other rooms look like, the hardwood's in nice shape, at
least structurally. I'd rather leave it in place because if I sell the
house, it's a big selling point for some people.

Either way, you're talking about an inch of extra height, PLUS the
thickness of the tile. How do I avoid a ridge where the carpet meets? Put
the backing of the same thickness under the new carpet? 1/4 inch luan
under 3/4 plywood or some such thing?
Common route is to cut out a 'pocket' in the hardwood near the front door,
if there isn't already one down there hidden under the carpet. From late
fifties to early 70s, even cookie-cutter houses had a 3x3 square of slate
by the front door, so they could say 'slate entryway.' Harwood floor by
weather doors, at least ones used in winter (ie, not the deck sliders), is
a BAD idea. Fancy houses, they notched the joists for the foyer, and put
them on 12" centers to make up for the smaller size, to make a well big
enough for a proper mudbed slate job. Cheaper houses used double subfloor
and mastic. With w/w hardwood being standard issue back then, and slate
being thin, the heights came out close enough for avoiding a trip hazard.

aem sends...

That all sounds logical. Unfortunately, the original owner modified the
layout of this house. The area in question used to be a small dining area,
not an entryway. What used to be the entryway / breezeway is now the kitchen
dining area. Hmm.

Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That "zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet, and
people will trip.

Why not just carpet (or not) the entire room, and put
some sort of removable mat in the doorway area?
Then you can take the mat out to the porch area
to clean it.

"Goedjn" wrote in message
...

Under the disgusting carpet in my living room, I've got hardwood floors.
Since part of the room serves as the "lose the shoes" zone, I'm tired of
trying to keep the carpet clean. So, I'm thinking of installing some sort
of
tile or slate in that area - something easy to just mop clean. That "zone"
will meet new carpet at some point. Two questions:

1) Whatever backing belongs under tile, does it have to be so thick that
the
area will be slightly higher than the adjacent carpet? I'm wondering if
that'll cause height difference problems where the two materials meet, and
people will trip.

Why not just carpet (or not) the entire room, and put
some sort of removable mat in the doorway area?
Then you can take the mat out to the porch area
to clean it.



I've already done that. Not practical for a number of reasons.

1) I've got a pine tree whose needles blow wherever people need to walk.
They cling to shoes, and weave themselves into foot mats & carpet, and
cannot be vacuumed out. They need to be removed by hand. A smooth surface is
the best place for them to land.

2) In the winter, there's no such thing as cleaning anything outside, if the
item to be cleaned requires water to do the job.

3) Due to the number (and size) of shoes, the current foot mat needs to
cover half of this entry area. It's an annoyance and it breaks up the lines
of the room.

I want a hard surface that can be swept and mopped.

Why not just carpet (or not) the entire room, and put
some sort of removable mat in the doorway area?
Then you can take the mat out to the porch area
to clean it.



I've already done that. Not practical for a number of reasons.

1) I've got a pine tree whose needles blow wherever people need to walk.
They cling to shoes, and weave themselves into foot mats & carpet, and
cannot be vacuumed out. They need to be removed by hand. A smooth surface is
the best place for them to land.

2) In the winter, there's no such thing as cleaning anything outside, if the
item to be cleaned requires water to do the job.

3) Due to the number (and size) of shoes, the current foot mat needs to
cover half of this entry area. It's an annoyance and it breaks up the lines
of the room.

I want a hard surface that can be swept and mopped.

Don't they make vinyl mats big enough?
Hmm.. maybe not.

"Goedjn" wrote in message
...

Why not just carpet (or not) the entire room, and put
some sort of removable mat in the doorway area?
Then you can take the mat out to the porch area
to clean it.



I've already done that. Not practical for a number of reasons.

1) I've got a pine tree whose needles blow wherever people need to walk.
They cling to shoes, and weave themselves into foot mats & carpet, and
cannot be vacuumed out. They need to be removed by hand. A smooth surface
is
the best place for them to land.

2) In the winter, there's no such thing as cleaning anything outside, if
the
item to be cleaned requires water to do the job.

3) Due to the number (and size) of shoes, the current foot mat needs to
cover half of this entry area. It's an annoyance and it breaks up the
lines
of the room.

I want a hard surface that can be swept and mopped.

Don't they make vinyl mats big enough?
Hmm.. maybe not.

Even if they did, they'd take away from the clean lines of the room. And, I
always need to make a big production out of what could otherwise be easy
projects. It's a disease.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

Based on what two other rooms look like, the hardwood's in nice shape, at
least structurally. I'd rather leave it in place because if I sell the
house, it's a big selling point for some people.

Either way, you're talking about an inch of extra height, PLUS the thickness
of the tile. How do I avoid a ridge where the carpet meets? Put the backing
of the same thickness under the new carpet? 1/4 inch luan under 3/4 plywood
or some such thing?

You will want at least a 1/4" backer board attached to the hardwood
with latex fortified thinset (thereby ruining the hardwood anyway) and
deck screws that reach into the joists.
Don't try to mount the tiles directly to wood. Even a minute amount
of movement can throw off the mortar.

Your 1/4" tile on top of that will create a total rise of 1/2" which
can be a toe catcher. I don't really know what the final difference in
rise would be between the carpet and tile, however, since the carpet
and padding also have some thickness. If it were a 1/4" difference
total, a nice maple wood transition could graduate the rise by
splitting the difference on each side.

If you only use 1/4", I wouldn't try to use something fragile like
marble or slate. I'd stick with 12" ceramic floor tiles and mount them
with latex fortified thinset and grout.

Can you get to the joists / sub flooring from underneath in the
basement? If so, you could make the floor a lot more rigid with the
proper use of plywood, bracing, and liquid nails.

When talking to contractors, find out *exactly* what they're planning
on doing for prep work. It should be obvious by their answers who's
willing to do a job that will last. Expect to pay extra for that level
of workmanship, though.