Colonel wrote:
Sorry, pal, I think you're mistaken. HF is some NASTY stuff...
it eats through GLASS.
Sure you're not thinking of HCl?

============

You are thinking logically, and not all marketers and consumers
do the same.

I can remember somebody giving me some household rust &
lime remover. This was 25-30 years ago and it was in a small
brown plastic bottle. It contained a rather non-trivial concentration
of HF, which shocked the crap out of me. And the warning on
the label was very casual.

I don't know if it is still marketed, but I do remember seeing it
marketed long after I received that bottle. I believe than solutions
greater than 1% HF have been outlawed about 5 years now for
household use. Personally, I feel that 1% HF shouldn't be
marketed for household use. HF is extremely dangerous and
few people read or heed warning labels.

Also, hasn't something just as nasty as HF been used in the acid
core for household aluminum solders? I've got some old aluminum
solders (20 years old) which have no warnings of any sort on them
and I feel very positive that they have a nasty florine compound in
their core.

I did a google and the sites I found that said bleach didn't kill
wanted were sites that for just a few $$$ would tell you what would
kill mold.
I work in a microbiology lab and we use a bleach solution to clean and
kill everything.
But I think the problem is of a different nature. Take a nice fertile
garden and you kill all the plants. They are all dead. But the
garden is fertile. Other plants will grow back. So while bleach is
very effective at killing the mold, it is not effective in preventing
its return.
The borax might be good for preventing it from coming back. It will
also make the wood fire resistant.

Ronin

On Fri, 09 Dec 2005 14:28:43 GMT, – Colonel –
wrote:

On 2005-11-30 16:58:09 -0500, "Jack" said:

I am planning an attic mold cleanup-- Conventional wisdom is to use
bleach and water, but when I google it... I get a lot of hits saying
that it is a myth that Bleach kills mold.

The EPA brochure does little to clear it up.

Anyone with any real-world experience or other good info.

I would use borates/borax and/or ethylene glycol (anti-freeze) before I
used bleach. Anti-freeze kills pretty much every living thing, and it
has an afinity for water, which means it'll soak into wet/damp wood
really well.

Ronald Cliborn wrote:
I did a google and the sites I found that said bleach didn't kill
wanted were sites that for just a few $$$ would tell you what would
kill mold.
I work in a microbiology lab and we use a bleach solution to clean and
kill everything.
But I think the problem is of a different nature. Take a nice fertile
garden and you kill all the plants. They are all dead. But the
garden is fertile. Other plants will grow back. So while bleach is
very effective at killing the mold, it is not effective in preventing
its return.
The borax might be good for preventing it from coming back. It will
also make the wood fire resistant.

Ronin

On Fri, 09 Dec 2005 14:28:43 GMT, – Colonel –
wrote:


On 2005-11-30 16:58:09 -0500, "Jack" said:


I am planning an attic mold cleanup-- Conventional wisdom is to use
bleach and water, but when I google it... I get a lot of hits saying
that it is a myth that Bleach kills mold.

The EPA brochure does little to clear it up.

Anyone with any real-world experience or other good info.

I would use borates/borax and/or ethylene glycol (anti-freeze) before I
used bleach. Anti-freeze kills pretty much every living thing, and it
has an afinity for water, which means it'll soak into wet/damp wood
really well.


Bleach is inappropriate for an attic cleanup due to the extreme
respiratory hazards involved. You are talking about large areas
and large volumes of solution producing chlorine vapors.
Unless great care is taken in using a respirator, you can set
yourself up for lung damage. GOOGLE that.

http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1641.html
is one supplier of a borax/glycol mix. Diluted, it is
sprayable with a garden sprayer and easy to use in an attic.
A respirator is still a good idea.

If there is extensive active mold growth, you may need to kill
that first.

Some helpful sites on attic mold and attic ventilation:
http://www.ronhungarter.com/ventilation_repairs.html
http://www.hardyservices.com/remediation_2.dws
http://www.allergybuyersclub.com/faqs/moldy-attic.shtml
http://www.findingthemold.com/photos.html

Its MOST important to fix the roof!

If you dry the area completely eventually the mold will die, without
having to kill it directly.

although clean up is a good idea, but use care working with bleach.

I used that in a basement once with glass block windows, even with fans
running I got sick afterward

Mold isn't the problem. The problem is having or creating the conditions
where mold can grow.

I live in Las Vegas. Until the last decade, mold was unknown here. Houses
were simple framed houses with stucco. Very breathable. Very dry, and
mostly drafty. Energy costs were low enough that being airtight wasn't
required. We even used evaporative cooling which boosts the humidity quite
a bit.

Enter, the era of new construction. Vapor barriers. Better insulation.
Better taping and mudding. Really enclosing things in. I think that was
where it changed, because this isn't NEW mold.

Yesterday, I woke up to a leaky hot water heater. They had installed it
five years ago with no pan. So it died, and water came into my walk in
closet and bedroom. I changed the heater, putting it up on blocks, and in a
pan. We got out the wet/dry vacuums, and went to town. We vacuumed and
vacuumed and vacuumed. Then put several fans. We will run the fans for a
few days, and leave doors open during the day.

Point is, mold is like rust on a car. Not much you can do once it is in
there except cut out the moldy/rusty part and toss.

It is far easier to prevent.

Steve

Speedy Jim writes:
http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1641.html
is one supplier of a borax/glycol mix. Diluted, it is

doh... $135/gal is expensive.

Make the equivalent for much less:
http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/homemade.html


--
May no harm befall you,
flip
Ich habe keine Ahnung was das bedeutet, oder vielleicht doch?
Remove origin of the word spam from address to reply (leave "+")

Philip Lewis wrote:

Speedy Jim writes:

http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1641.html
is one supplier of a borax/glycol mix. Diluted, it is


doh... $135/gal is expensive.

Make the equivalent for much less:
http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/homemade.html


Yes, I have done that. It's a good suggestion,
but for me it turned out to be tedious, not wanting
to cook the stuff on the kitchen stove. If it can work
for you, go for it.
Jim

On 11 Feb 2006 14:17:24 -0500, Philip Lewis
wrote:

Speedy Jim writes:
http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1641.html
is one supplier of a borax/glycol mix. Diluted, it is

doh... $135/gal is expensive.

Make the equivalent for much less:
http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/homemade.html



Bora-care I bought from this web site a year ago..Not diluted 1
gallon $90.. (free shipping back then.. don't know about now..)

http://store.doyourownpestcontrol.co...N/product/I065
Chuck (in SC)
Powder post beetles .. worse than termites!..

Chuck wrote:

On 11 Feb 2006 14:17:24 -0500, Philip Lewis
wrote:


Speedy Jim writes:

http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1641.html
is one supplier of a borax/glycol mix. Diluted, it is

doh... $135/gal is expensive.

Make the equivalent for much less:
http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/homemade.html




Bora-care I bought from this web site a year ago..Not diluted 1
gallon $90.. (free shipping back then.. don't know about now..)

http://store.doyourownpestcontrol.co...N/product/I065
Chuck (in SC)
Powder post beetles .. worse than termites!..




Excellent!! Site says shipping is still FREE.

Bookmarked...
Jim