I want to redo the lawn in the backyard because it had too much weed, moss,
and the ground does not slope away from the foundation enough (my crawspace
gets wet).

The plan is to till the soil, add compost, add a french drain, regrade the
slope and then reseed the lawn.

After killing off the existing lawn, I found that under the surface it is
crisscrossed with tree roots up to 2-inch in diameter. They appear to come
from a birch tree in the corner. I yanked out some of those roots and have
some more to go. Other than cutting down the tree, is there a way to prevent
the roots from invading the lawn in the future?

Also, the soil seems very clay-like. In fact, when it rains some puddles
would form and drain away very slowly. Should I do something about this,
like add sand?

Some books suggest the french drain be put near the foundation wall. I fear
that losening the soil near the foundation would weaken the support of the
foundation, so I'm inclined to put the french drain on the perimeter of the
lawn, i.e. the lowest point after it is regraded. Would this work?

-peter

I think you're stuck with the roots, I had a tree like that once and
they were just all over the place. However on that issue and on the
issue of clay soil, the real question is whether you can grow grass or
not. Clay soil is a drag to deal with, grass eventually did take hold
in my case but it took a few years to look like a lawn at all. I have
seen on tv where they'll put organic matter back into the soil as you
are probably contemplating. Not sure about sand; sand does not absorb
water and if you have clay down 3 feet, it might turn out to be the
same situation. Sand or granular matter in a houseplant's pot works
because there's holes at the bottom and the water can run out, but does
the rain water have any place to go ?

I think the french drain really does go by the foundation. That is SO
much work though it may be worth paying someone to do it, or pay them
for their advice. For example, does a french drain function the way
you want it to in clay soil ? I have no idea. I cannot imagine
shoveling a trench in clay soil but if your crawl is wet it's gotta be
done.

"peter" wrote in message
news:K0h9e.21198$H_5.14634@trnddc01...
I want to redo the lawn in the backyard because it had too much weed, moss,
and the ground does not slope away from the foundation enough (my crawspace
gets wet).

The plan is to till the soil, add compost, add a french drain, regrade the
slope and then reseed the lawn.

After killing off the existing lawn, I found that under the surface it is
crisscrossed with tree roots up to 2-inch in diameter. They appear to come
from a birch tree in the corner. I yanked out some of those roots and have
some more to go. Other than cutting down the tree, is there a way to
prevent the roots from invading the lawn in the future?

Also, the soil seems very clay-like. In fact, when it rains some puddles
would form and drain away very slowly. Should I do something about this,
like add sand?

Some books suggest the french drain be put near the foundation wall. I
fear that losening the soil near the foundation would weaken the support
of the foundation, so I'm inclined to put the french drain on the
perimeter of the lawn, i.e. the lowest point after it is regraded. Would
this work?

Shallow tree roots may be a sign of too frequent watering or standing water,
or very shallow water table. Trees shoot out surface roots when they are
drowning, or lack oxygen due to impervious clay soils. Before trying
anything drastic, I would water the lawn infrequently, but deeply. That
tends to grow grass better than weeds. It also causes grass and tree roots
to grow deeper, making them more resistant to drought. If you are already
in the process of regrading, the drain and resloping will help, but not
without changing watering frequency as well. Sand does not help drainage in
clay soils, it turns it into concrete like stuff. Organics break down clay
quite nicely. You should consult a lawn and garden book for your area, and
pay special attention to watering and soil conditioning practices. Your
local ag extension office and nurseries will also provide brochures on how
to improve clay soils.

I think the french drain really does go by the foundation. That is
SO
much work though it may be worth paying someone to do it, or pay them
for their advice. For example, does a french drain function the way
you want it to in clay soil ? I have no idea. I cannot imagine
shoveling a trench in clay soil but if your crawl is wet it's gotta
be
done.

If you install the french drain by the foundation, don't forget to have
termite treatment reapplied. Disturbing the soil near the foundation
breaks the termite barrier and it will need to be reestablished.

Bob S.

Throw down sheets of plywood over the entire yard.

I'm no lawn expert, be that known. My soil is also heavy clay. As far as not
mixing sand in the clay, I'd have to disagree. I have used top soil in 75%
of my yard. 25% was clay that I just picked and broke up and mixed with
sand. Get a course bank run sand and mix it in. I feel it does help the
texture. The worst part of clay is it compacts and lets no air into the
roots of the grass. Clay holds moisture more so than any soil so water or
should I say lack of is not a problem for the grass. For the last 5 years,
every spring and fall I spread gypsum pellets. They work into the
established lawn and over time help improve the aeration of the clay. As
far as the french drain? My opinion is bite the bullet. Dig a shallow trench
around the foundation, sloping it so the water runs off. You can put drain
tile in it covered with gravel or just fill with gravel and cover with vapor
barrier. A french drain will not disperse the water effectively in a clay
soil. Just my opinion for what it's worth.
"peter" wrote in message
news:K0h9e.21198$H_5.14634@trnddc01...
I want to redo the lawn in the backyard because it had too much weed, moss,
and the ground does not slope away from the foundation enough (my crawspace
gets wet).

The plan is to till the soil, add compost, add a french drain, regrade the
slope and then reseed the lawn.

After killing off the existing lawn, I found that under the surface it is
crisscrossed with tree roots up to 2-inch in diameter. They appear to come
from a birch tree in the corner. I yanked out some of those roots and have
some more to go. Other than cutting down the tree, is there a way to
prevent the roots from invading the lawn in the future?

Also, the soil seems very clay-like. In fact, when it rains some puddles
would form and drain away very slowly. Should I do something about this,
like add sand?

Some books suggest the french drain be put near the foundation wall. I
fear that losening the soil near the foundation would weaken the support
of the foundation, so I'm inclined to put the french drain on the
perimeter of the lawn, i.e. the lowest point after it is regraded. Would
this work?

-peter

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 00:04:58 GMT, "peter" wrote:

I want to redo the lawn in the backyard because it had too much weed, moss,
and the ground does not slope away from the foundation enough (my crawspace
gets wet).

The plan is to till the soil, add compost, add a french drain, regrade the
slope and then reseed the lawn.

After killing off the existing lawn, I found that under the surface it is
crisscrossed with tree roots up to 2-inch in diameter. They appear to come
from a birch tree in the corner. I yanked out some of those roots and have
some more to go. Other than cutting down the tree, is there a way to prevent
the roots from invading the lawn in the future?

Also, the soil seems very clay-like. In fact, when it rains some puddles
would form and drain away very slowly. Should I do something about this,
like add sand?

Some books suggest the french drain be put near the foundation wall. I fear
that losening the soil near the foundation would weaken the support of the
foundation, so I'm inclined to put the french drain on the perimeter of the
lawn, i.e. the lowest point after it is regraded. Would this work?

-peter

My pecan trees have virtually no shallow roots. My pine and willow
trees have shallow roots that are pervasive. Deep and infrequent
watering helps.

The sand will help and now is the time to apply it liberally.

peter wrote:

Also, the soil seems very clay-like. In fact, when it rains some
puddles would form and drain away very slowly. Should I do something
about this, like add sand?

Ix-nay on the sand. Use Gypsum. Use a LOT of Gypsum.

Gypsum turns clay into a cross between peat, compost, and bottom-land.