Hi everyone,

I need your advice if possible.

We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor
repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm).
He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and
told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he
left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that
weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to
be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the pictu

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg

The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the
dents that I noticed.

Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from
inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg

There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he
needed to reposition his ladder a few times.

I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that
they need to be replaced?
Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have
he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused
or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a
stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly
on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times
to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing
shingles all in the same place)?

What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free
estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's
all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more



What woud you do in our place?


Your input is greatly appreciated.

My question would be, what kind of roofer would set a ladder on a comp.
roof. There should be Tar paper under the shingles, that should stop water
from penetrating. I'll bet he went up there and spread wet patch around.
Well I guess you figured out by now your roofer is incompetent. On the down
side I would not be surprised if you receive some kind of bill. If you think
your going to get him to pay for the damaged shingles, good luck with that.
What I would suggest is call a couple roofers Check there contractors
license. It sound like a small job but you might check for liability
insurance and Workmen's comp insurance. Like I say it's a small job but if
done wrong it will be costly.



wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi everyone,

I need your advice if possible.

We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor
repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm).
He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and
told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he
left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that
weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to
be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the pictu

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg

The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the
dents that I noticed.

Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from
inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg

There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he
needed to reposition his ladder a few times.

I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that
they need to be replaced?
Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have
he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused
or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a
stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly
on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times
to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing
shingles all in the same place)?

What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free
estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's
all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more



What woud you do in our place?


Your input is greatly appreciated.

wrote in news:1165619064.919627.100500
@j44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

Hi everyone,

I need your advice if possible.

We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor
repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm).
He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and
told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he
left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that
weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to
be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the pictu

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg

The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the
dents that I noticed.

Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from
inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg

There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he
needed to reposition his ladder a few times.

I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that
they need to be replaced?
Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have
he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused
or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a
stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly
on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times
to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing
shingles all in the same place)?

What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free
estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's
all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more



What woud you do in our place?


Your input is greatly appreciated.



Yes, Hackers-r-Us f*ed up your roof. Now there are entry points for water
to get under the shingles and/or paper. The damaged shingles should be
popped out and replaced. IF you could get Hackmaster back out there he
would probably just slop some roof cement over it. Would that work?
Probably. Will it look like ****? Definitely.

On 8 Dec 2006 15:04:24 -0800, wrote:

Hi everyone,

I need your advice if possible.

I don't have much experience, but I think maybe after the damage has
been there for a while, it will weather and not be as visible. Right
now that part of the roof is freshly scuffed. Also, if the material
is compressed, can't tell from the picture, it may spring back after a
while. (I had a coiled electric razor cord that a psycho used when I
was out of town, and then tightly wrapped the cord around the razor,
and it took 2 years to get back to normal.)

In addition, you won't notice it much after a while. I have a streak
of red paint on my driver's side side mirror, where I scraped the
thick post at a drive-through, and I've only noticed it 3 times in the
last year, and one of those I went looking on purpose, wondering if it
was still there. No matter how bad it is, you won't notice it as much
as time goes on, and this doesn't seem so bad to me.

I would get the real roofer to give you a two-part estimate, and
inform the first guy how he damaged your roof and what it is going to
cost to repair it, and ask him to send a check. But don't get too
exorcised if he doesn't, because he won't. But also explain to him
why you won't be hiring him or recommending him to anyone else. If
this is going to upset you or get you angry, just put it in a letter.
Maybe this will stop him from damaging other houses.

He seems like an eager beaver, so include a warning that he is not to
fix it himself and you will consider it trespassing if he comes on
your property again. Maybe you should just write.


We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor
repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm).
He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and
told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he
left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that
weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to
be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the pictu

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg

The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the
dents that I noticed.

Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from
inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg

There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he
needed to reposition his ladder a few times.

I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that
they need to be replaced?
Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have
he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused
or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a
stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly
on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times
to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing
shingles all in the same place)?

What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free
estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's
all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more



What woud you do in our place?


Your input is greatly appreciated.

mm wrote:
On 8 Dec 2006 15:04:24 -0800, wrote:

Hi everyone,

I need your advice if possible.

I don't have much experience, but I think maybe after the damage has
been there for a while, it will weather and not be as visible. Right
now that part of the roof is freshly scuffed. Also, if the material
is compressed, can't tell from the picture, it may spring back after a
while. (I had a coiled electric razor cord that a psycho used when I
was out of town, and then tightly wrapped the cord around the razor,
and it took 2 years to get back to normal.)

In addition, you won't notice it much after a while. I have a streak
of red paint on my driver's side side mirror, where I scraped the
thick post at a drive-through, and I've only noticed it 3 times in the
last year, and one of those I went looking on purpose, wondering if it
was still there. No matter how bad it is, you won't notice it as much
as time goes on, and this doesn't seem so bad to me.

I would get the real roofer to give you a two-part estimate, and
inform the first guy how he damaged your roof and what it is going to
cost to repair it, and ask him to send a check. But don't get too
exorcised if he doesn't, because he won't. But also explain to him
why you won't be hiring him or recommending him to anyone else. If
this is going to upset you or get you angry, just put it in a letter.
Maybe this will stop him from damaging other houses.


Good advice. Clearly this guy was a hack and I'd be ****ed too. With
either the estimate to repair his damage, or better yet, the actual
repair bill, plus your excellent photos, if he doesn't pay up, which is
likely, you could take him to small claims court. The amount probably
isn't worth your time, but often people wind up there not for the
money, but for the principle. I'd say you will win, he might not even
show up. But the bigger problem is then actually collecting, as many
of these type guys do a good job of making themselves judgement proof.
Still, if you get a judgement against him, it could prevent him at some
point from getting a loan for a new truck or buying a house, at which
point he might choose to pay you.






He seems like an eager beaver, so include a warning that he is not to
fix it himself and you will consider it trespassing if he comes on
your property again. Maybe you should just write.


We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor
repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm).
He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and
told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he
left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that
weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to
be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the pictu

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg

The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the
dents that I noticed.

Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from
inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg

There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he
needed to reposition his ladder a few times.

I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that
they need to be replaced?
Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have
he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused
or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a
stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly
on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times
to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing
shingles all in the same place)?

What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free
estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's
all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more



What woud you do in our place?


Your input is greatly appreciated.

Thank you all good people for your replies. You will probably be
shocked to find out that this guy IS a professional roofer or/and
represented a roofing company. I checked their website. A locally owned
family business since 1939! Licensed. Bonded. Insured. A registered
BBB member with one resolved complaint. Well sort of resolved -- the
customer still wasn't satisfied. Also, the company was renamed (why?)
three years ago, so the BBB doesn't have much info on them.

Several of you noted that it would be difficult for me to make him pay
for the damage. Based on the info above, I believe it will be a lot
easier for me to deal with him, will it not?... Unless he says "I
didn't do it"... Is there a way to prove it is a recent damage?

Could someone please explain the "bonded" part? How does this work? We
haven't even signed a contract. He came over for a free estimate, did
the damage and off he went.

Thanks.

In article .com,
wrote:

Could someone please explain the "bonded" part? How does this work? We
haven't even signed a contract. He came over for a free estimate, did
the damage and off he went.

Bonded means that he has a performance bond arrangement set up.
That means that if he does some damage and has to pay a bill,
the bonding company will pay it in the event that the contractor
is unable to do so. The contractor pays a fee for this service.
For example, to get a $50,000 bond, he may have to put $1,500.

Where this is important for you is if the contractor tears up
your house, and then never comes back to finish the job. The
bond would be used to pay another contractor to finish the work.

-john-

--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================

John A. Weeks III wrote:
In article .com,
wrote:

Could someone please explain the "bonded" part? How does this work? We
haven't even signed a contract. He came over for a free estimate, did
the damage and off he went.

Bonded means that he has a performance bond arrangement set up.
That means that if he does some damage and has to pay a bill,
the bonding company will pay it in the event that the contractor
is unable to do so. The contractor pays a fee for this service.
For example, to get a $50,000 bond, he may have to put $1,500.

Where this is important for you is if the contractor tears up
your house, and then never comes back to finish the job. The
bond would be used to pay another contractor to finish the work.

-john-

never heard of bonding applying to small residential jobs. the only
bonding i have ever had is when i have contracted work for the
state--they required you go out and buy a performance bond for each
individual job. contractors like road builders and excavators have to
get bonds when they tear up a public street or sidewalk. it's
basically insurance that if the contractor goes bankrupt or whatever,
the work will still get done.



--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================

On 9 Dec 2006 07:17:09 -0800, wrote:


mm wrote:
I would get the real roofer to give you a two-part estimate, and
inform the first guy how he damaged your roof and what it is going to
cost to repair it, and ask him to send a check. But don't get too
exorcised if he doesn't, because he won't. But also explain to him

I think I meant to say "exercised".

why you won't be hiring him or recommending him to anyone else. If
this is going to upset you or get you angry, just put it in a letter.
Maybe this will stop him from damaging other houses.


Good advice. Clearly this guy was a hack and I'd be ****ed too. With
either the estimate to repair his damage, or better yet, the actual
repair bill, plus your excellent photos, if he doesn't pay up, which is
likely, you could take him to small claims court. The amount probably
isn't worth your time, but often people wind up there not for the
money, but for the principle.

There is a popular expression, "When people say it's not the money but
the the principle, it's the money", but Marilyn Milyan, the judge on
the People's Court says it is usually the principle that gets people
to small claims court. I think she's right, and I'm sure the first
sentence is overly cynical.

I'd say you will win, he might not even
show up. But the bigger problem is then actually collecting, as many
of these type guys do a good job of making themselves judgement proof.

Not if the company owns the truck. I don't know what it means if he
owns his truck personally.

Still, if you get a judgement against him, it could prevent him at some
point from getting a loan for a new truck or buying a house, at which
point he might choose to pay you.

mm wrote:
On 9 Dec 2006 07:17:09 -0800, wrote:


mm wrote:
I would get the real roofer to give you a two-part estimate, and
inform the first guy how he damaged your roof and what it is going to
cost to repair it, and ask him to send a check. But don't get too
exorcised if he doesn't, because he won't. But also explain to him

I think I meant to say "exercised".

why you won't be hiring him or recommending him to anyone else. If
this is going to upset you or get you angry, just put it in a letter.
Maybe this will stop him from damaging other houses.


Good advice. Clearly this guy was a hack and I'd be ****ed too. With
either the estimate to repair his damage, or better yet, the actual
repair bill, plus your excellent photos, if he doesn't pay up, which is
likely, you could take him to small claims court. The amount probably
isn't worth your time, but often people wind up there not for the
money, but for the principle.

There is a popular expression, "When people say it's not the money but
the the principle, it's the money", but Marilyn Milyan, the judge on
the People's Court says it is usually the principle that gets people
to small claims court. I think she's right, and I'm sure the first
sentence is overly cynical.

I'd say you will win, he might not even
show up. But the bigger problem is then actually collecting, as many
of these type guys do a good job of making themselves judgement proof.


Still, if you get a judgement against him, it could prevent him at some
point from getting a loan for a new truck or buying a house, at which
point he might choose to pay you.


Not if the company owns the truck. I don't know what it means if he
owns his truck personally.

I was thinking along the lines that this hack owns the company and is
not incorporated, which is frequently the case. If it's a sole
proprietorship and he gets a judgement, he can go after any of the
assets of the business, as well as his personal assets. Also, if he
goes to buy a new truck and wants to finance it, or take out a
mortgage, etc, they will check his personal credit history and an
outstanding judgement will then be a problem for him. Even if he's
incorporated, while you couldn't go after the company's assets
directly, an unpaid judgement would still present a problem for him in
the above circumstances. For a small fry company like this, any lender
is going to look at his personal credit history. In fact, I know guys
that own incorporated, successful businesses doing several million a
year, been in business for 30 years, where the bank wants them to
personally guarantee loans to the corp.